CaliAtenza
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Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:52 am

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8533952.stm

I for one salute this brave individual and hope there are many more like him who see how bankrupt Hamas' ideology is...

[Edited 2010-02-25 00:53:37]
 
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OA412
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 10:29 am

Quoting CaliAtenza (Thread starter):
I for one salute this brave individual and hope there are many more like him who see how bankrupt Hamas' ideology is...

Most of Israel's actions are similarly bankrupt...
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 10:30 am

Quoting CaliAtenza (Thread starter):
I for one salute this brave individual and hope there are many more like him who see how bankrupt Hamas' ideology is...

And maybe they will steal your identity next time. Then we'll see how brave you think they are when you become a murderer overnight.

I for one want to see Israel taken to the proverbial cleaners and strung up for this. If they must forge identities, use their own ones - don't drag us innocent people into your messy fights.

[Edited 2010-02-25 02:39:43]
 
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OA412
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 10:41 am

Quoting cpd (Reply 3):
And maybe they will steal your identity next time. Then we'll see how brave you think they are when you become a murderer overnight.

Not to mention the fact that you and your family must now live in fear for your lives. Bravery indeed!
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CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:49 am

Quoting cpd (Reply 3):

And maybe they will steal your identity next time. Then we'll see how brave you think they are when you become a murderer overnight.

I for one want to see Israel taken to the proverbial cleaners and strung up for this. If they must forge identities, use their own ones - don't drag us innocent people into your messy fights.

Yeah that was the only sore point of the Mossad hit (well has it even been confirmed that it was Mossad...??). BTW, Israel is smart enough not to repeat the same tactics again. I agree they should have made up names, but i think Dubai is pretty sophisticated for that...they prolly would have caught on really quick. Whats with the hate against Israel on this board? I think if Australia did the same thing you would be applauding them. Israel is just doing what it thinks neccesary to keep itself safe and if assinating Hamas terrorists wherever they can find is what Israel needs to do, then its perfectly fine by me. BTW, hypothetically, if my identity was ever stolen for use in a anti-terrorist operation, i'd be pretty proud...and being a US citizen, the US doesnt recognize Hamas...
 
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 12:04 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 5):
I think if Australia did the same thing you would be applauding them. Israel is just doing what it thinks neccesary to keep itself safe and if assinating Hamas terrorists wherever they can find is what Israel needs to do, then its perfectly fine by me. B

Australia wouldn't be doing it...so that analogy is pointless, but keeping itself safe by endangering innocent people by committing a crime is despicable. I wonder what your view would be if these families are now targeted by Hamas courtesy of Israel's actions.
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 12:09 pm

Quoting qantas077 (Reply 6):
Australia wouldn't be doing it...so that analogy is pointless, but keeping itself safe by endangering innocent people by committing a crime is despicable. I wonder what your view would be if these families are now targeted by Hamas courtesy of Israel's actions.

Im sure the Aussies are being consulted by the US or they are in the know whenever the US goes after someone of interest in Afghanistan and the Aussies are pretty intertwined into the US international defense structure. Yes, it is unfortunate that they used (btw, it still hasnt been proven to be Mossad) real people's names, but those people are prolly in protective custody now.
 
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afterburner
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:01 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Thread starter):
I for one salute this brave individua

I don't believe that he spied for Israel because he opposes what his father and the organization do. I think he was just a spoiled brat who was tempted by some easy money and the possibility of living western way of life.
 
baroque
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:21 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 7):
Yes, it is unfortunate that they used (btw, it still hasnt been proven to be Mossad) real people's names, but those people are prolly in protective custody now.

So can you volunteer who would have had access to passports from what about 20 current residents of Israel and is not Mossad?

As for crazy Israeli stories, how about this one.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1149888.html
A Palestinian arrest so ridiculous even the Israeli judges smiled

It is all a bit like a Gilbert and Sullivan opera where one side is a nuclear armed power.

Bearing in mind that case, and access to passports of persons living in Israel, who else could it be other than Mossad or some other organ of the state?

It may appear ridiculous, but do tell us how the Dubai police would be able to fit up so many Israel residents. I will not hold my breath for a logical alternative explanation.

Quoting qantas077 (Reply 6):
I wonder what your view would be if these families are now targeted by Hamas courtesy of Israel's actions.

Quite so, it appears that the families now fear something similar.

By and large this sort of tactic seems more a method of spreading terrorism than countering it.

Send them all off to Indonesia to learn about Det 88. Perhaps Afterbuner will be good enough to serve them teh manis, especially those who are diabetic.   

It is rather sad to see that many US posters now seem to assume that targeted assassinations are OK. Eventually they too will backfire. I mean just about everything else that has been done in Afghanistan for 30 years has backfired so why not targeted assassinations?
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:29 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 2):

Most of Israel's actions are similarly bankrupt...

Got that right - now they've gone and created another martyr for radical Palestinians and pissed off countries allied with them all the same. Absolutely brilliant   More proof that the foreign ministry under Lieberman has gone absolutely nuts.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:31 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 5):
I think if Australia did the same thing you would be applauding them.

A civilised country like Australia wouldn't do that.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 5):
BTW, hypothetically, if my identity was ever stolen for use in a anti-terrorist operation, i'd be pretty proud...and being a US citizen, the US doesnt recognize Hamas...

But then being a target for the rest of your life would probably be a big bummer and would fairly quickly negate your initial feeling.

It's nt something they haven't tried before, in 2005 New Zealand police caught, convicted and gaoled 2 Mossad agents for trying to illegally obtain NZ passports.
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:47 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 11):

A civilised country like Australia wouldn't do that.

Well who knows what the Aussies have or havent signed onto by being part of the coalition in Afghanistan.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 11):

But then being a target for the rest of your life would probably be a big bummer and would fairly quickly negate your initial feeling.

Well then i would go into protective custody.

Quoting Baroque (Reply 9):

So can you volunteer who would have had access to passports from what about 20 current residents of Israel and is not Mossad?

Who knows what this really was. Could have been an internal dispute between factions of Hamas..could have been Fatah, or Mossad. Point is, a terrorist is dead and the world should be glad about that. You notice how Fatah has been pretty silent on this whole matter. More than likely, Fatah and Mossad cooperated to get rid of this guy. Yes, its tragic their identities were stolen and im sure IF it was a Mossad operation, they prolly exhausted every other option and then decided they had to do this. But what gets me is the fact that there were so many operatives...that doesnt sound like a Mossad job. This makes me believe that even the US or the UK or other friendly intelligence agencies could also have a hand in it.
 
baroque
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:05 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 12):
Who knows what this really was. Could have been an internal dispute between factions of Hamas..could have been Fatah, or Mossad.

Oh wow, so Fatah or a faction of Hamas itself have infiltrated core Israel. This will certainly get them more votes in any future election. Wonder which it is.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 12):
This makes me believe that even the US or the UK or other friendly intelligence agencies could also have a hand in it.

Oh yes, the UK would certainly take part so they could put the Israeli ambassador on the carpet and generally get rather pissed off with Israel.

Gosh the BEEB is in on the act with this
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8521246.stm

Dubai Hamas killing pledge by UK foreign secretary

The use of six fake UK passports by the alleged killers of a Hamas commander is an outrage, David Miliband has said.

The foreign secretary vowed to "get to the bottom" of the case in Dubai, as an inquiry got under way.

Dubai's police chief has said he is 99% sure of the involvement of Israeli agents in Mahmoud al-Mabhouh's death, but Israel says there is no proof.

Its UK ambassador said he was "unable to add additional information" after he met the UK diplomatic service's head.

The international police agency Interpol has issued arrest notices for all 11 suspects, although it admitted their true identities was unclear.


Yep confected outrage. Let us see how the confection cooks up.

And Aus:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8535728.stm
Australia has summoned the Israeli ambassador to explain why three new suspects over the Dubai killing of a Hamas leader used Australian passports.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd said Canberra would "not be silent on the matter".

Dubai police think Israeli agents were involved in Mahmoud al-Mabhouh's death but Israel says there is no proof.

The police say they have identified 15 more suspects - using British, French, Irish and Australian documents - taking the total to 26.

'No minor matter'

Mr Rudd said Canberra would retaliate against any country found to be involved in forging its passports.

He said that Australia would first try to establish the facts, but that this was not "a minor matter".

"It is not something you just push to one side. It is of the deepest concern," he added.


Oh dear more confected outrage. Yep, it was MI6 and ASIS wot dun it. You can see by the way they used their own countries passports. But the Irish, how were the Irish SS involved as "obviously" they must have been.   

And it will be why the BEEB publishes a history of Mossad killings
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8488249.stm
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:31 pm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 13):

Oh wow, so Fatah or a faction of Hamas itself have infiltrated core Israel. This will certainly get them more votes in any future election. Wonder which it is.

Mossad could have given the info to either one of them...no need for infiltration.

Quoting Baroque (Reply 13):
Oh dear more confected outrage. Yep, it was MI6 and ASIS wot dun it. You can see by the way they used their own countries passports. But the Irish, how were the Irish SS involved as "obviously" they must have been.

And it will be why the BEEB publishes a history of Mossad killings

If Israel had informed the UK and Aus secretly before the operation happened, then indeed all of this outraged could just be cover for the respective governments. Indeed there was a story in the press that the operation had the tacit approval of the UK.
 
baroque
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:46 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 14):
Indeed there was a story in the press that the operation had the tacit approval of the UK.

Which press would that be?

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 14):
If Israel had informed the UK and Aus secretly before the operation happened, then indeed all of this outraged could just be cover for the respective governments.

Check back and see how this thesis goes.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 14):
Quoting Baroque (Reply 13):

Oh wow, so Fatah or a faction of Hamas itself have infiltrated core Israel. This will certainly get them more votes in any future election. Wonder which it is.

Mossad could have given the info to either one of them...no need for infiltration.

That is even more astonishing, handing over fake passports to Fatah or Hamas for Israeli residents.

Where is the pic of the guy with the Al foil hat when you need it?
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:34 pm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 15):

Which press would that be?

I think it was the Israeli press some days ago...but i dunno, it might be up on Reuters as well.

Quoting Baroque (Reply 15):

That is even more astonishing, handing over fake passports to Fatah or Hamas for Israeli residents.

Where is the pic of the guy with the Al foil hat when you need it?

the world of counter terrorism and intelligence is pretty murky..i wouldnt be surprised if this happened. Mossad wouldnt have to hand over the actual passports per se..just info.

Quoting Baroque (Reply 15):

Check back and see how this thesis goes.

Its happened before and it prolly will keep on happening.
 
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:56 pm

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 12):
Well who knows what the Aussies have or havent signed onto by being part of the coalition in Afghanistan.

I would like to think the average Aussie is a little more savvy than the average American, Aussies wouldn't stand for half the crap the US govt foists on it's population.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 12):
Well then i would go into protective custody.

Being in protective custody would be a fantastic way to see out the rest of your life  
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:30 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 16):

Being in protective custody would be a fantastic way to see out the rest of your life

Or i would change my name.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 16):

I would like to think the average Aussie is a little more savvy than the average American, Aussies wouldn't stand for half the crap the US govt foists on it's population.

If so, the Aussies would have pulled out from Afghanistan by now...
 
jfk69
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:39 pm

Quoting cpd (Reply 1):
Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 16):
I would like to think the average Aussie is a little more savvy than the average American, Aussies wouldn't stand for half the crap the US govt foists on it's population.

Nope, they just bury their head in the sand and ignore the real issues.
 
 
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OA412
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:02 am

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 4):
BTW, hypothetically, if my identity was ever stolen for use in a anti-terrorist operation, i'd be pretty proud...and being a US citizen, the US doesnt recognize Hamas...

And when your house was bombed and your children were slaughtered in revenge, I'm sure you'd still be ever so proud...

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 4):
I think if Australia did the same thing you would be applauding them.

Civilized countries don't do what Israel did. Period.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 4):
Whats with the hate against Israel on this board?

Point out a country's flaws and hating it are two different things.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 17):
Or i would change my name.

And you think the terrorists aren't smart enough to find you?

Quoting JFK69 (Reply 18):
Nope, they just bury their head in the sand and ignore the real issues.

And what are the real issues?
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Kiwirob
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:09 am

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 17):
Or i would change my name.

Terrorists are smarter than you think.

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 17):
If so, the Aussies would have pulled out from Afghanistan by now...

The Australian public are not in favor of Australian participation in Afghanistan.
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Hamas Man's Son 'was Israeli Spy'

Fri Feb 26, 2010 9:09 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 20):

And when your house was bombed and your children were slaughtered in revenge, I'm sure you'd still be ever so proud...

since i live in the USA, i doubt that will be happening..and i dont have children.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 20):

And you think the terrorists aren't smart enough to find you?

I dont think Hamas or Islamic Jihad is gonna be showing up in any significant numbers in the US anytime soon...

Quoting OA412 (Reply 20):

Point out a country's flaws and hating it are two different things.

It seems to me that its gone far beyond pointing out flaws and now its moving into the hate column pretty quickly.

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