Longhornmaniac
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Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 4:43 am

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36104206/ns/us_news-environment/

No real surprise to anyone who actually knows what's going on, but I thought I'd pass this info along.

Cheers,
Cameron
Cheers,
Cameron
 
baroque
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:27 am

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Thread starter):
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36104206/ns/us_news-environment/

No real surprise to anyone who actually knows what's going on, but I thought I'd pass this info along.

I was beginning to fear you were missing in action Cameron, but you return with - as it were - a bang!!!

In their report released Wednesday, the committee said that, as far as it was able to ascertain, "the scientific reputation of Professor Jones and CRU remains intact," adding that nothing in the more than 1,000 stolen e-mails, or the controversy kicked up by their publication, challenged scientific consensus that "global warming is happening and that it is induced by human activity."

Well, well, well. So our March has actaully been unusually hot, not just imagination/ incorrect thermometers/ badly sited stations (or should that be badly sighted stations??, what a relief!!!! (That is a joke just before I am told that the NSW March 2010 is weather - unlike the snow in Dallas!)

I will bet however, that this makes absolutely ZERO difference. After all when you have your fingers in your ears and are going "ting a ling a loo" it is difficult to absorb what you don't want.
 
Longhornmaniac
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:36 am

Aha, but you forget, my friend, I'm just up the road a ways from you...well right now, up the road and then a puddle jumper over to Lizard Island. I'm having a blast Down Under!

We got 180 mm of rain last night here at Lizard, global warming must be a myth!!!!

But you are right that for those that don't want to hear it, it won't be heard. Rather sad, actually, but to each his own.

Cheers,
Cameron
Cheers,
Cameron
 
baroque
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:50 am

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 2):
Aha, but you forget, my friend, I'm just up the road a ways from you...well right now, up the road and then a puddle jumper over to Lizard Island. I'm having a blast Down Under!

And most welcome too. And there was me thinking it was EPA001 who brought the rains with his visit. We had an east coast low form about 3 pm yesterday just off Wollongong - I think!!! - and whoosh, a full swimming pool this morning. Were you up there when that cyclone came through? Hope you have been watching the TV pics of the floods in the channel country, that is a once in a generation flood - unless of course, the path of the cyclones has been changed, as well it might be with warming oceans. I certainly cannot remember three in one season tracking over to W Qld, but then until recently we really did not know all that much about where they actually went!!!

I was about to worry at what time you were up in the US posting. But just one hour away instead until next week, when we will be in the same time zone.

Sad thought that scientific data needs a prolonged hot drought to affect a very restricted part of the globe before it can be true. Until then, nothing.   
 
fca767
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:05 am

Where did this word "Gate" Come from? I've started hearing it everywhere, like on big brother uk, spitgate, because someone spitted...and all this...when did this word start beginning
 
Mir
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:06 am

Quoting fca767 (Reply 4):
Where did this word "Gate" Come from? I've started hearing it everywhere, like on big brother uk, spitgate, because someone spitted...and all this...when did this word start beginning

Watergate.

filler

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
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LTU932
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:10 am

OK, so we're still suffering from Global Warming? Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

I hope that next winter, we've also freeze our asses off like this winter, even if only to prove a point to the climate change scaremongers.
 
baroque
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:13 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
I hope that next winter, we've also freeze our asses off like this winter, even if only to prove a point to the climate change scaremongers.

Best wait until the data are in, but you are likely to find that globally, the first three months of 2010 were a bit on the warm side. Just check what was happening near the pole this northern winter, you might be surrpised.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:25 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
OK, so we're still suffering from Global Warming? Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

*sigh* Because GERMANY IS NOT THE WHOLE WORLD even though you Germans seem to be worse than we Americans sometimes about thinking that it is.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
NAV20
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:21 am

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Thread starter):
No real surprise to anyone who actually knows what's going on

Reading the 'report,' I must confess that my own reaction was similar. But virtually the opposite of your own, Longhornmaniac:-

"One that attracted particular media attention was Jones' reference to a "trick" that could be used to "hide the decline" of temperatures.

"Hide the decline" was not an attempt to conceal data but was scientific shorthand for discarding erroneous data, the committee concluded. Similarly, Jones intended "trick" to mean a neat way of handling evidence, rather than anything underhanded, the inquiry found."


The allegation was surely that said data was 'discarded' because it did not fit Jones' agenda - not that it was 'erroneous'?

"Phil Willis, the committee's chairman, said of the e-mails that "there's no denying that some of them were pretty appalling."

"But the committee found no evidence of anything beyond "a blunt refusal to share data," adding that the idea that Jones was part of a conspiracy to hide evidence that weakened the case for global warming was clearly wrong.

"In a briefing to journalists ahead of the report's release, Willis said the controversy would ultimately help buttress the case for global warming by forcing the University East Anglia — and other research institutions — to stop hoarding their data.

"The winner in the end will be climate science itself," he said."


Oh, finally I think I get it. All those 'pretty appalling' emails were just aimed at 'raising the standard of debate' in relation to climate change..........

"Lawmakers stressed that their report — which was written after only a single day of oral testimony — did not cover all the issues and would not be as in-depth as the two other inquiries into the e-mail scandal that are still pending and which were instigated by the University of East Anglia.

"Willis said the lawmakers had been in a rush to publish something before Britain's next national election, which is widely expected in just over a month's time.

"Clearly we would have liked to spend more time of this," he said, before adding jokingly: "We had to get something out before we were sent packing."


So putting it into plain English - the taxpayer wouldn't front enough money for more than one day of hearings, and the government was anxious that the 'investigators' should try to 'defuse' the issue, at least temporarily, before it had to face the electorate?

Quoting Baroque (Reply 1):
After all when you have your fingers in your ears and are going "ting a ling a loo" it is difficult to absorb what you don't want.

Sorry, Baroque, one of our (thankfully rare) disagreements. This 'report' has all the appearance of being a bit of short-term political 'damage control.' The giveaway is that the authors (and the funders) have organised things so that if (more likely when) the whistle blows, all they'll have to say is, "Well, of course, this was only a preliminary report with a limited brief, there wasn't time to go into the whole business fully........"

Straight out of 'Yes Minister,' really. Particularly that Sir Humphrey classic - "Minister, with respect, you should never, EVER, set up an enquiry into anything before you're absolutely certain what its findings are going to be..."
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
baroque
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:38 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 8):
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
OK, so we're still suffering from Global Warming? Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

*sigh* Because GERMANY IS NOT THE WHOLE WORLD even though you Germans seem to be worse than we Americans sometimes about thinking that it is.

Well, he is a bit young to know what the German winters of the 40s were like so we need to cut him a bit of slack??? Anyway, I hope to see their average for the year increased when I spend a nice hot week in Potsdam in June.

Mind you, I think there are a couple more investigations of Climategate taking place, but whatever they find will barely affect the "price of fish" as it were, the d ls will bash on regardless.
 
JJJ
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:05 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
I hope that next winter, we've also freeze our asses off like this winter, even if only to prove a point to the climate change scaremongers.

You probably will. Also here we've had some of the coldest (and wettest, btw) December and January and still, 2009 was one of the hottest on record.

Part of the climate change seems to be that temperatures will be more extreme. Here we've gone from full winter gear to short sleeves in a matter of days, not even weeks. Spring, what's that?
 
MoltenRock
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:48 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
OK, so we're still suffering from Global Warming? Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

A new Peekaboologist emerges, I see!

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/we...-10-2010/unusually-large-snowstorm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 1):
I will bet however, that this makes absolutely ZERO difference. After all when you have your fingers in your ears and are going "ting a ling a loo" it is difficult to absorb what you don't want.

The Ting A Ling A Loo Syndrome is quite severe with some. Much less how bad their Cognitive Dissonance and No True Scotsman thought processes overwhelm them.
 
UAL747
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:11 am

I believe our climate is changing. I remember when I was younger our summers here in OK not being so hot, and our winters not being so mild. What's really gotten me is not necessarily the change in temperatures, but the odd weather. While our weather here has always seemed to change with the days, it is interesting to note that last week it was 75 degrees on day, the next day, we had a blizzard at 28F and it lasted for 3 days, and this was in late march, very odd for Oklahoma. We've had a record amount of snow since the early 1900's here in OK, including the Christmas Eve blizzard which shut the state down, but then it pops back up into the 70's.

Our spring storms have become more fierce over the years, even though the number or tornadoes has not really increased. I think all across the globe, the intensity of storms and hurricanes have increased. I personally believe in global warming, or climate change, whatever you want to call it. I think that "Global Warming" is a misnomer in the fact that it really means to describe climate change. An increase in worldwide temperatures doesn't necessarily mean that it's going to be hotter all across the globe, more that weather activity will be affected by an overall warmer global temperature, which is what I think confuses people. In all reality, I don't think we've covered enough time to accurately assume that temps are on the rise, because I think there probably is a global fluctuation throughout the worlds history, but before humans, there was a lot less going into the atmosphere than there is today. We produce a lot of waste in so many ways. I know the popular scenario to introduce right now is that "cows produce more greenhouse gasses than humans have ever produced," but I'm not necessarily convinced that it's just greenhouse gasses that are the culprit. There are so many ways in which we have manipulated our environment that could set the balance off. We are the only species capable of doing this.

Ahh, mother nature's immune response to humans. Wonder when she decides to eradicate us all together?  

Edit: That said, I still drive a 5.0 litre V8 that gets about 19mpg in the city and 23mpg on the HWY. Why? Because it's fun.
UAL

[Edited 2010-03-31 04:53:14]
"Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy. Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy.....Okay, fine, we'll just turn 190 and Visual Our Way
 
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Dreadnought
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:50 am

Quote from the article in the OP:
Lawmakers stressed that their report — which was written after only a single day of oral testimony — did not cover all the issues and would not be as in-depth as the two other inquiries into the e-mail scandal that are still pending and which were instigated by the University of East Anglia.

Willis said the lawmakers had been in a rush to publish something before Britain's next national election, which is widely expected in just over a month's time.

Translation - this is purely a political announcement for political reasons by politicians, with no actual investigation to back it up.
Forget dogs and cats - Spay and neuter your liberals.
 
AverageUser
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:54 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

Because (relatively) warm air in the Arctic replaced the cold air that would normally be contained in the Arctic and pushed it southwards. Arctic Oscillation at the warm extreme:

 
Longhornmaniac
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:18 pm

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 14):

Translation - this is purely a political announcement for political reasons by politicians, with no actual investigation to back it up.

-OR-

It's saying what leading scientists with an understanding of how things work and what's going on have been saying all along...or are they all part of the conspiracy, too?   

Cheers,
Cameron
Cheers,
Cameron
 
Boeing1970
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:27 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 13):
I remember when I was younger our summers here in OK not being so hot, and our winters not being so mild.

That's attributable to aging and your actual memory not global warming. Based on your profile, you haven't been alive long enough to notice a difference. Your lack of summer memory is from playing in the heat vs. working in it. It has always been hoter than hell in Oklahoma in the summer. "Observations" of weather have more to do with attention to the issue as well. Its like when you buy a car. Before you buy it, its as if you don't see many of them. Once you buy one, suddenly everyone has one. If you tell yourself enoguh times that the weather is different, you'll start to beleive it.
 
UAL747
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:47 pm

Quoting Boeing1970 (Reply 17):
Your lack of summer memory is from playing in the heat vs. working in it. It has always been hoter than hell in Oklahoma in the summer.

Okay, my memory, perhaps. But my grandmother was born in the 1920's and has the same remarks about winter and summer. And they definitely worked outside back in the day.
"Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy. Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy.....Okay, fine, we'll just turn 190 and Visual Our Way
 
Longhornmaniac
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:48 pm

Quoting Boeing1970 (Reply 17):

Until heaps of peer-reviewed evidence also begins to support it, then maybe he's onto something.

But you're absolutely right about your last point: if you tell yourself enough times things aren't different, you'll start to believe they aren't, even in the face of logic.

Cheers,
Cameron
Cheers,
Cameron
 
Boeing1970
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:54 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 18):
But my grandmother was born in the 1920's and has the same remarks about winter and summer. And they definitely worked outside back in the day.

My grandfather, also from Oklahoma born in 1922, would disagree.

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 19):
Until heaps of peer-reviewed evidence also begins to support it, then maybe he's onto something.

Thats not my point.
 
Rara
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:07 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 8):

*sigh* Because GERMANY IS NOT THE WHOLE WORLD even though you Germans seem to be worse than we Americans sometimes about thinking that it is.

  
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
 
UAL747
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:18 pm

Quoting Boeing1970 (Reply 20):
My grandfather, also from Oklahoma born in 1922, would disagree.

For your Grandfather's sake, I hope he never meets my grandmother. LOL.
"Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy. Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy.....Okay, fine, we'll just turn 190 and Visual Our Way
 
4holer
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:43 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 8):
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6):
OK, so we're still suffering from Global Warming? Then somebody explain to me why the hell we've been freezing our asses off during this February/March in Hamburg, and why the hell Germany had such a long winter?

*sigh* Because GERMANY IS NOT THE WHOLE WORLD even though you Germans seem to be worse than we Americans sometimes about thinking that it is.

If you guys *sigh* are sooo annoyed at weather = climate or local = global posts, maybe you should quit posting your own. Do I even need to bother posting links? You have some in this very thread so you don't need to look very far.

As for the report.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 14):
Translation - this is purely a political announcement for political reasons by politicians, with no actual investigation to back it up.

Bingo.
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
BMI727
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:15 pm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 1):
After all when you have your fingers in your ears and are going "ting a ling a loo" it is difficult to absorb what you don't want.

I don't even bother doing that. I just don't care.

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 13):
That said, I still drive a 5.0 litre V8 that gets about 19mpg in the city and 23mpg on the HWY. Why? Because it's fun.

Good for you. I just hope the ecotards don't try to ruin our fun anymore, CAFE comes close enough for me. (and don't get me started on that)

[Edited 2010-03-31 08:15:40]
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
Boeing1970
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:04 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 22):
For your Grandfather's sake, I hope he never meets my grandmother. LOL.

Damn. That's messed up.
 
JoeCanuck
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Thu Apr 01, 2010 12:16 am

One whole day of testimony to a bunch of hand picked politicians. Gee...that sounds like a credible review. Maybe parliament can appoint a committee to solve the dark matter issue over the weekend.
What the...?
 
TheCol
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RE: Climategate Scientists Vindicated...

Thu Apr 01, 2010 5:43 am

Quoting Baroque (Reply 7):
Quoting UAL747 (Reply 13):
While our weather here has always seemed to change with the days, it is interesting to note that last week it was 75 degrees on day, the next day, we had a blizzard at 28F and it lasted for 3 days, and this was in late march, very odd

Although I don't doubt that climate change exists, it seems that El Nino has been playing a bigger part in the short term.
No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.

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