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Aaron747
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25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:04 am

As the song says..."say it ain't so". You'd like to think that we live in a country of reasonable people, capable of reasonable thought, with reasonable expectations of themselves and others. Then you see things like this and just have to wonder who the hell our fellow citizens really are. Being out of the country for a few years, I realize I was a bit out of touch with the true level of acrimony in politics, but this is a blinding example of things having gone too far. Not liking someone, even a President, fine! But I seriously thought this birther crap was mostly behind us save for a few crackpots here and there who are the right-wing equivalent of the morons who don't buy the 9/11 story.

Now I'm trained in statistics and recognize that ~1,000 is a mostly meaningless sample size, but nonetheless the responses are there and do have some intrinsic meaning. Namely that the people who answered in the 27% are a few short of a full set if they really believe the Republican governor of Hawai'i, public records staff of Hawai'i and Obama's grandparents all the way back to the summer of '61 were involved in some conspiracy to get him elected President. Because yes folks, that's what you'd have to accept as fact to buy these theories.

On President Barack Obama’s birthday, a new CNN/Opinion Research released Wednesday shows 41 percent of Republicans believe Obama was “probably” or “definitely” born in another country.

The poll of 1,018 adults shows 27 percent of Americans believe the president was “probably” or “definitely” born in another country, compared with 71 percent who think he was born in the United States.

Among the 285 self-identified Republicans polled, however, the percentage who think Obama was born outside of the country spikes to 41 percent, with 57 percent believing he was born in the United States.

Nineteen percent of independents think Obama was “probably” or “definitely” born in another country, as do 15 percent of Democrats. CNN/Opinion Research surveyed 398 independents and 335 Democrats for the poll.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0810/40644.html

Two separate independent fact-check treatises from two different non-partisan groups that spend all their time catching politicians of all stripes in mistruths:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me.../obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/

This is gold:

At PolitiFact.com, we're all about original sources. We don't take anyone at their word or take the reporting of other media organizations as proof. We go to the heart of the story, the source of the truth — original, corroborating documents.

When the official documents were questioned, we went looking for more answers. We circled back to the Department of Health, had a newsroom colleague bring in her own Hawaii birth certificate to see if it looks the same (it's identical). But every answer triggered more questions.

And soon enough, after going to every length possible to confirm the birth certificate's authenticity, you start asking, what is reasonable here?

Because if this document is forged, then they all are.
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DocLightning
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:19 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
As the song says..."say it ain't so". You'd like to think that we live in a country of reasonable people, capable of reasonable thought, with reasonable expectations of themselves and others.

We don't and we never did, which is precisely why our founders were very careful to not make this a direct democracy.
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OA412
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:02 am

Unbelievable that we're seriously discussing the fact that 1 in 4 citizens in this Country believe that our President is serving illegally. How can people still buy into this crap? The "birthers" need to get over it. Barack Obama was born in Hawaii, he was elected President by a majority of citizens in this Country, and he is therefore your President whether you like him or not. As Aaron suggests, you can hate the President all you want (I am certainly no fan of former President Bush), but these lies about President Obama's citizenship status need to end. If you they were just making laughingstocks of themselves, I wouldn't so much mind, but the fact that they're embarrassing all of us with this "birther" crap is unacceptable.

[Edited 2010-08-08 01:05:43]
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Aeri28
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:06 am

i really don't believe that number. Just seems awfully high. 25% of x amount polled (and when and where).
 
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:15 am

This constant drum beating about Obamas place of birth and in this token his religion I think is driving some into doubt, this is not about disliking the presidents policies, this about the hatred of the man, his family and those who are not opposed to all of his policies. Like I said before no birth certificate presented to them will ever convince them that he was born in America, the birther movement is to deny that he is an American and to de legitimize the election as well as those who take a different view from their cultural interpretation of what defines America.
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DocLightning
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:27 am

This comes from http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/.

This blog is chiefly about scientific denialism. The current denialism that is a pain in my butt is the anti-vaccine claptrap that has resulted in the worst pertussis epidemic in California in decades.

In this case, it isn't about science, but it is about truth. The ultimate example is point (4). The Birthers want to know "why hasn't he produced his full-form birth certificate?" Well, he has. But that birth certificate, they claim, could be a forgery. They want the FULL-FORM birth certificate. The catch is: there ain't no such animal. By their standards, none of them, not even themselves, could prove that they are born U.S. citizens.

Quote:
How to be a denialist Martin McKee, an epidemiologist at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine who also studies denial, has identified six tactics that all denialist movements use. "I'm not suggesting there is a manual somewhere, but one can see these elements, to varying degrees, in many settings," he says (The European Journal of Public Health, vol 19, p 2).
1. Allege that there's a conspiracy. Claim that scientific consensus has arisen through collusion rather than the accumulation of evidence.
2. Use fake experts to support your story. "Denial always starts with a cadre of pseudo-experts with some credentials that create a facade of credibility," says Seth Kalichman of the University of Connecticut.
3. Cherry-pick the evidence: trumpet whatever appears to support your case and ignore or rubbish the rest. Carry on trotting out supportive evidence even after it has been discredited.
4. Create impossible standards for your opponents. Claim that the existing evidence is not good enough and demand more. If your opponent comes up with evidence you have demanded, move the goalposts.
5. Use logical fallacies. Hitler opposed smoking, so anti-smoking measures are Nazi. Deliberately misrepresent the scientific consensus and then knock down your straw man.
6. Manufacture doubt. Falsely portray scientists as so divided that basing policy on their advice would be premature. Insist "both sides" must be heard and cry censorship when "dissenting" arguments or experts are rejected.

We see it over and over again.
Global Warming
Vaccines
Obama's birthplace
Healthcare --> Communism
Evolution
HIV-AIDS link
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Aaron747
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:29 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 2):
As Aaron suggests, you can hate the President all you want (I certainly was no fan of former President Bush), but these lies about President Obama's citizenship status need to end.

Through some digging on local discussion boards, it seems the good denizens here in Honolulu are pretty amused by all this. Even though the state doesn't grant access to hospital records to people other than family and such apparently it's no secret among current and former staff at Kapi'olani Hospital that he was born there, and there's people around town who remember his parents as well.

Quoting Aeri28 (Reply 3):
i really don't believe that number. Just seems awfully high. 25% of x amount polled (and when and where).

They posted the data here:

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/08/04/rel10k1a.pdf

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 4):
Like I said before no birth certificate presented to them will ever convince them that he was born in America, the birther movement is to deny that he is an American

Well that's the whole point I'm trying to make - I want to believe that at some point people are reasonable. If not then they are just plain dumb when the logic is right there in front of them. Case in point:

We talked to reporter Will Hoover, who wrote a well-researched story for the Honolulu Advertiser on Nov. 9, 2008, about Obama's childhood years in the the Aloha State. It ran under the headline "Obama Slept Here."

In researching the story, he went to the microfilm archives and found the birth announcement for Obama. Actually, he found two of them, one in his Honululu Advertiser on Aug. 13 , 1961, and in the Honolulu Star-Bulletin the next day . They both said the same thing: "Mr. and Mrs. Barack H. Obama, 6085 Kalanianaole Highway, son, Aug. 4."

But here's the thing. Newspaper officials he checked with confirmed those notices came from the state Department of Health.

"That's not the kind of stuff a family member calls in and says, 'Hey, can you put this in?'" Hoover explained.

Take a second and think about that. In order to phony those notices up, it would have required the complicity of the state Health Department and two independent newspapers — on the off chance this unnamed child might want to one day be president of the United States.


http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...bbs-lied-when-he-said-obamas-birt/

So, in other words, the Hawai'i Department of Health and local newspapers, ostensibly with the help of Obama's family, started this conspiracy in 1961. If anyone can actually believe that, I'd like to know how many medications they're on!
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slz396
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 10:28 am

Why do the US discriminate between natural-born citizens and naturalized citizens in the first place?

I think it is a disgrace to any democratic country naturalized citizens see their rights constititionally limited as if they are some sort of second class citizens, which can never fully be trusted!
 
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 11:17 am

Quoting slz396 (Reply 7):
Why do the US discriminate between natural-born citizens and naturalized citizens in the first place?

It goes all the way back to the founding of the US. The founding fathers were afraid that some European royalty might take on an American citizenship just to become president and then re-establish a monarchy. Remember, more than 25% of the population of the original US were outspoken loyalists in favour of being British. Napoleon Bonaparte e.g. put a relative on the then vacant throne of Sweden, Count Bernadotte, whom he thought would then support him as a proxy. Only that Count Bernadotte, once he was King of Sweden, suddenly strongly supported Sweden´s interests and fought against his relative.
Napoleon also planted relatives all over Europe to rule conquered territories.
Later his nephew Napoleon III tried unsuccessfully to install a relative as Emperor of Mexico.

Jan
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einsteinboricua
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 1:14 pm

All this is doing is making Obama look as a victim. I wouldn't be surprised that this gets so out of hand that it'll help him get elected instead of an opponent.
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baroque
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 2:08 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 1):
We don't and we never did, which is precisely why our founders were very careful to not make this a direct democracy.

To quote Urquhart from To Play the King, "You might very well think that; I couldn't possibly comment"   

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 5):
This comes from http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/.

Hope you have that in clipboard ready to post in 30% of other thread in non-av!!!!
 
KPDX
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 3:12 pm

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 10):
All this is doing is making Obama look as a victim.

Exactly. Awww poor lil' Barry. Everyone is so mean to him!   

Who really G.A.F. what 1000 people think? They have a right to their own opinions.
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PacNWjet
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 3:30 pm

This is now a game being played between the White House and the "birthers." The state of Hawaii has issued the "certificate of live birth," but not the long form birth certificate, the release of which requires the permission of the individual in question or someone with a personal interest in it (the certificate of live birth is an abbreviated document with some details in the long form birth certificate left out). The refusal of the White House to authorize the release of the long form birth certificate has led the "birthers" to suspect that there is something in the birth certificate that the White House is trying to hide (perhaps something not in any way related to the location of Obama's birth). The White House, in turn, declines to authorize the release of the birth certificate in order to paint opponents of Obama as nut case lunatics who don't believe he was born in the United States. Like I say, this is now just a game with each side seeking to paint the other as having a nefarious agenda, but with both sides looking pretty stupid.
 
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 3:31 pm

This survey pretty much tells us that 25% Of the usa's population are idiots! These people need to stop. It's stupid. They believe that there has been a 49 year conspiracy or something.
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Superfly
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 3:36 pm

Quoting Braniff747SP (Reply 17):
This survey pretty much tells us that 25% Of the usa's population are idiots!

  

Sarah Palin is part of this group.
A lot of these people think that the earth is still flat.
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OA412
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:02 pm

Quoting KPDX (Reply 12):
Who really G.A.F. what 1000 people think? They have a right to their own opinions.

I do, and so do most thinking people in this country. The fact that 1 in 4 in this country believe that our President is serving his term illegally is embarrassing. That they believe that all 51 Secretaries of State, and the Republican (yes Republican) governor of Hawaii are in on some giant conspiracy to falsify birth records is unbelievable. The fact that the "birthers" claim that Obama is not their present is un-American. So yeah, I think we, as a country, should care that these idiots are out there spouting lies.

Quoting KPDX (Reply 15):
LOL!

I assume you are joking, correct?

Here you are chastising "poor Barry", then you immediately jump in to suggest that GWB was a victime too. Ironic? Hypocritical?
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DeltaMD90
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:22 pm

Well you gotta realize some people vote in polls stupidly. Like "I don't like Obama so I'm gonna vote in this poll that he is Kenyan" or whatever. A lot of us are guilty of doing something like that. I doubt 25% really believe that
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KPDX
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:38 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 20):
Here you are chastising "poor Barry", then you immediately jump in to suggest that GWB was a victime too. Ironic? Hypocritical?

First off in my "poor Barry" post, I was being completely sarcastic in response to einsteinboricua's post . . . I suppose I should have added a wink. But I just thought it was funny that Rara actually didn't see Bush as hated. Saying you "hate Bush" is probably one of the nicer things you could say when it came to criticizing him.
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KPDX
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:39 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 21):
Well you gotta realize some people vote in polls stupidly. Like "I don't like Obama so I'm gonna vote in this poll that he is Kenyan" or whatever. A lot of us are guilty of doing something like that. I doubt 25% really believe that

+1

I find myself doing that often, like it or not.  
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AirframeAS
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:46 pm

IMO, I think most people are more focused on this mainly because of Obama's middle name. The only thing I would like to know is how did his parents end up giving him the "Hussein" middle name? That makes him sound foreign.

But then again, why are we rehashing this anyway?
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KPDX
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:49 pm

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 24):
But then again, why are we rehashing this anyway?

I agree.... This is stupid and shouldn't even be a discussion anymore. He is the POTUS and it should end there.
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aloges
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:54 pm

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 24):
how did his parents end up giving him the "Hussein" middle name?

His father had the same names, first and middle. His grandfather's name was Hussein Onyango Obama. So the name is family tradition like millions of others.
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AirframeAS
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:59 pm

Quoting KPDX (Reply 25):
This is stupid and shouldn't even be a discussion anymore.

As a Republican, I agree.

Quoting aloges (Reply 26):
His father had the same names, first and middle. His grandfather's name was Hussein Onyango Obama. So the name is family tradition like millions of others.

I can understand that, to keep the family name going (or what have you....) however, I don't understand why people refuse to let this go all because of his name. That is how I see it. People think of Hussein, they think of the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein.
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aloges
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:24 pm

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 27):
I don't understand why people refuse to let this go all because of his name.

One word: Hatred, with a capital H.

He's not right-wing, he's not white, he's not a jingoist, he's not a devout Christian, so he must be a terrorist-supporting communist who will sell out "America as we know it" to anyone. Add the influence of the Murdoch Media Machine and you're guaranteed to go from frenzy to frenzy to frenzy.
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:57 pm

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 24):
That makes him sound foreign.

How does a non-foreign American name sound?

Would he sound American if his name was Running Fox or Soaring Eagle?   
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bjorn14
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:02 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 29):
Would he sound American if his name was Running Fox or Soaring Eagle?

At least they'd be "natural born"
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Scorpio
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:18 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 29):
Would he sound American if his name was Running Fox or Soaring Eagle?

Well, I know of at least one hardline Republican who would probably love a president by that last name. He's even written a song for him already (anyone remember this gem from the 'most embarrassing moments ever' compilation?): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=woLQI8X2R6Y

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 31):
At least they'd be "natural born"

Kind of like Obama, you mean?
 
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:27 am

Quoting Rara (Reply 18):
But statements of "hate" against people who haven't even harmed you personally bother me, so I think I'd remember if that would have been frequent during the Bush years. Again, I know he wasn't treated nicely in discussions, but there were limits, as far as I remember

Give me a break..The hate started from day one with the supposed stolen election. The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 20):
Well you gotta realize some people vote in polls stupidly.

And many here also vote stupidly.

Quoting aloges (Reply 27):
He's not right-wing, he's not white,

He is also not Black....

Quoting aloges (Reply 27):
so he must be a terrorist-supporting communist who will sell out "America as we know it"

We fianlly agree on something

[Edited 2010-08-08 22:39:43 by ManuCH]
 
cws818
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:38 am

Quoting windy95 (Reply 35):

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 20):
Well you gotta realize some people vote in polls stupidly.

And many here also vote stupidly.

By this do you mean voting in a way different from you?
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Ken777
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:42 am

1. The President is black.

2. He has a "foreign" name.

3. He is a Democrat.

It's like those who believe that Cheney was the "real President" and Bush was a Good Old Boy "front".

Except for the bigotry.
 
mt99
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 2:32 am

Quoting windy95 (Reply 35):
Give me a break..The hate started from day one with the supposed stolen election. The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush

So your anger is fueled by revenge?
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Superfly
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 2:55 am

Quoting windy95 (Reply 35):
The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush

Secret service would disagree.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/20091021/ts_ynews/ynews_ts950

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-stretching-US-Secret-Service.html
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ltbewr
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 3:41 am

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 37):


1. The President is black.

2. He has a "foreign" name.

3. He is a Democrat.

I would also add:

4. He was born in Hawaii, which at the time of the now-President's birth was a very new state, a very exotic place to many Americans and with an American Mother but an Foreign national. I bet if he had been born in Kansas, the original home of his mother I bet there his Birth Certificate would be much less of an issue.
 
Superfly
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:14 am

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 40):
He was born in Hawaii, which at the time of the now-President's birth was a very new state, a very exotic place to many Americans

As you may already know, I collect LPs, reel to reel tape an other vintage audio formats.
At used record stores I come across tons of Hawaiian records that all seem to come out in the late 1950s and early 1960s. These records were sold at department stores to bring the 'sounds of Hawaii' to your living room.
I picked up a few of these records since a lot of them have nice large color photos of brand new DC-8s, 707s, DC-9s and even a few Constellations.
Back then if you couldn't afford a trip to Hawaii, you could buy one of those records and bake a ham and decorate it with Dole pineapples and listen to the sounds of Hawaii in your living room.  

10 years later, it didn't help when Greg Brady was cursed with bad luck after wearing a sacred Hawaiian Idol around his neck he found in Hawaii. He nearly died in a surfing accident.  
Ok I am starting to show my age. 
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Aeri28
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 6:53 am

I think Elvis' Blue Hawaii introduced many to regular travel to "America's exotic eden. Our polynesian paradise.." (as said in the film trailer back in 1961). Hawaii had been a US territory since 1898, so it wasn't exactly 'new'. Plus, WWII put Hawaii in the publics eye for years, but obviously with statehood and the advent of the jet, travel became easier.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zsn-81yMbPQ


anybody remember this zinger before the election? lol

"I know Hawaii is a state,, but..."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwpUTHsFzlk

I live here in Honolulu, and I still find a few people will refer to the mainland as "the states". I know they know they are in the US and they know HI is a state, but I think innocently they may refer back to seeing hawaii as far away locale.

[Edited 2010-08-09 00:07:07]
 
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OA412
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:08 am

Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
Give me a break..The hate started from day one with the supposed stolen election. The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush

Oh please! The anti-Obama hatred in the last year and a half has risen to levels not seen with Bush or Clinton or really any other President in recent memory. The "birther" BS is but one example of the absolute hatred that some people in the Country harbor for our President.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
And many here also vote stupidly.

Why? Because they vote for candidates with whom you don't agree? Seriously, what exactly do you mean by this?

Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
He is also not Black....

Then what is he?
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Superfly
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:09 am

Quoting Aeri28 (Reply 34):
anybody remember this zinger before the election? lol

...or even better.

Watch from 0:52 onward.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIFggCQv4J4
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bjorn14
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RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:35 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 35):
Then what is he?

Mullato
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
Rara
Posts: 2296
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:41 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 12:55 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
Give me a break..The hate started from day one with the supposed stolen election. The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush

As I said, I know there was plenty of dislike and criticism, but my entirely personal opinion is that there were less instances of simply and without reason stating hate.

The original post (since been deleted) didn't qualify that statement at all. No reason, just hate. Again, it may just be me, but I don't remember a whole lot of that.
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
 
windy95
Posts: 2660
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 1:11 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 12:59 pm

Quoting mt99 (Reply 30):
So your anger is fueled by revenge?

No Anger here. So sorry.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 29):
1. The President is black.

He is...

Quoting OA412 (Reply 35):
Oh please! The anti-Obama hatred in the last year and a half has risen to levels not seen with Bush o

You keep on believing that

Quoting OA412 (Reply 35):
Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
He is also not Black....

Then what is he?

Well he came out of a white womb..So he is either Bi-racial or Mullato.

Is Tiger Woods Thai or African? Or is he Bi-racial? I am 50/50 Swedish/Irish...What am I..Calling Obama black was used as a racial crutch by the left and is still being used to try and paint anyone against him into the racism box..
 
ozglobal
Posts: 2536
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:33 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:05 pm

Quoting KPDX (Reply 11):
They have a right to their own opinions.

Rights arise from duties. No-one has a duty to deny the facts of a situation in order to maintain an ideological position. These people have no right to irrational views. This is a sorry by product of the evangelical protestant dichotomy of faith and reason. People in large parts of the US have been brought up accustomed to the suppression of reason in the name of faith. Real Christianity abhors this travesty of the mind. Couple this neurosis with the lack of adequate education and real journalism in the US and one can say, with Bill Maher, that much of the US is like a high school girl after two Long Island Iced Teas: they can be talked into ANYTHING....

[Edited 2010-08-09 06:06:31]

[Edited 2010-08-09 06:06:57]
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
windy95
Posts: 2660
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 1:11 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:11 pm

The Obama family has always maintained that Obama Jr. was born in Hawaii. The family has changed its story about his hospital of birth, first claiming it was Honolulu's Queens Medical Center then changing it to Kapi'olani Medical Center.

What has yet to be produced is a long-form certificate of birth that lists the hospital where Obama was born and the doctor that attended the birth.

If he has nothing to hide he could of taken the wind out of this sail a long time ago. By letting it fester he will never satisfy everyone.

Also his citizenship is still in question with his going to Indonesia and becoming a citizen there. In a passport amendment submitted Aug. 13, 1968, Obama's mothe ridentified her son with an Indonesian surname and asked the State Department to drop him from her U.S. passport. Why because he became a citizen of Indonesia? You cannot be a dual citizen in Indonesia.

All I am saying is that there is several open ended questions that he could of taken care of and prevented this. The fact that his citizenship was rubber stamped by the Fed government will do little to bolster support from people who do not trust the Feds one bit. From what I can tell the amount of people I come in contact with who know believe this is growing not shrinking. But I imagine we will still be waiting for this just like we are still waiting for John Kerry to release his original DD214....  
 
mt99
Posts: 6166
Joined: Wed May 26, 1999 5:41 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:17 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 41):
You cannot be a dual citizen in Indonesia.

"Generally, Indonesian citizen is those natural Indonesian people and those of other nations that endorsed by the law as citizens. Indonesian nationality law does not recognize dual citizenship except for children under 18 years old . After they reached 18, they have to choose their citizenship."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indonesian_nationality_law

"From ages six to ten , Obama attended local schools in Jakarta, including Besuki Public School and St. Francis of Assisi School.[17][18]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

Its really simple to find information these days..

Quoting windy95 (Reply 39):
Quoting mt99 (Reply 30):
So your anger is fueled by revenge?

No Anger here. So sorry.

What is it then? Boredom? Need for attention?

[Edited 2010-08-09 06:22:22]
Step into my office, baby
 
windy95
Posts: 2660
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 1:11 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:26 pm

Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 40):
ouple this neurosis with the lack of adequate education and real journalism in the US and one can say, with Bill Maher, that much of the US is like a high school girl after two Long Island Iced Teas: they can be talked into ANYTHING..

Like voting for Hope and Change.....
 
mt99
Posts: 6166
Joined: Wed May 26, 1999 5:41 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:28 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 43):

Like voting for Hope and Change.....

Or voting for "family values"...
Step into my office, baby
 
windy95
Posts: 2660
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 1:11 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:41 pm

Quoting Rara (Reply 38):
The original post (since been deleted) didn't qualify that statement at all. No reason, just hate. Again, it may just be me, but I don't remember a whole lot of that.

Well lets see

Quote:
On Air America, talk show host Randi Rhodes recommended doing to Bush what Michael Corleone, in ''The Godfather, Part II," does to his brother. ''Like Fredo," she said, ''somebody ought to take him out fishing and phuw!" -- then imitated the sound of a gunshot. In the Guardian, a leading British daily, columnist Charlie Brooker issued a plea: ''John Wilkes Booth, Lee Harvey Oswald, John Hinckley Jr. -- where are you now that we need you
Quote:
At Chicago's Columbia College, a curated exhibit included a sheet of mock postage stamps bearing the words ''Patriot Act" and depicting President Bush with a gun to his head. There are even Bush-assassination fashion statements, such as the ''KILL BUSH" T-shirts that were on offer last year at CafePress, an online retailer.
Quote:
''Death of a President," a new movie about the assassination of George W. Bush.

Written and directed by British filmmaker Gabriel Range, the movie premieres today at the Toronto Film Festival and will air next month on Britain's Channel 4. Shot in the style of a documentary, the movie opens with what looks like actual footage of Bush being gunned down by a sniper as he leaves a Chicago hotel in October 2007. Through the use of digital special effects, the film superimposes the president's face onto the body of the actor playing him, so that the mortally wounded man collapsing on the screen will seem, all too vividly, to be Bush himself.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/edi...06/09/10/a_new_low_in_bush_hatred/

http://www.thebushconnection.com/photos/bushconcover1.jpg

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...qpvt=+George+W+Bush+Nazi+pictures#

Follow this link for many more loving photos of Bush
 
Superfly
Posts: 37735
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:47 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 45):

Umm about that first photo.
There IS some truth to it.
Dubya's granddaddy Prescott Bush was funding the Nazis up until 1944.
For someone that claims to be an Israeli should find that very disturbing.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2003/oct/17/20031017-110534-8149r/
Bring back the Concorde
 
windy95
Posts: 2660
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 1:11 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 2:12 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 46):
For someone that claims to be an Israeli should find that very disturbing.

I have no control over what my grandfather did. Should Jews hold the grandsons of ex Nazis in contempt for the forefathers actions. Did This Generation have anything to do with slavery or the destruction of the Native Americans... Stupid argument.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37735
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 2:20 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 47):
Stupid argument.

That is your argument and yes it is VERY stupid!

Like Hitler, Bush killed innocent people for no reason.
Bush build a campaign of fear and lies to justify his acts of war.
Bring back the Concorde
 
BAKJet
Posts: 393
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:58 pm

RE: 25% Of Americans Still Believe Obama Foreign-born?

Mon Aug 09, 2010 3:00 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 41):

First off - http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

Quoting windy95 (Reply 27):
The dislike right now with Obama has not even come close yet to the rage that was set against Bush


I guess you missed some of the stuff going on at Tea Parties.

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