ImperialEagle
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Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:28 am

But, that hypocrit Ahmadinejad stands-by and lets the state police and army beat and shoot their protesters. Just barely a week ago he was praising the Egyptians for their protest. He is nothing but a puppet to the mullah's.

I wish the Iranian people well, but IMO for them to make a regime change will cost a lot of lives.

Here's an article from this evenings N.Y.Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/15/world/middleeast/15iran.html?hp
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:02 am

Frackin' idiots. Talk about talking out the corner of your mouth while biting your tongue.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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cpd
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:19 am

Hmm, just as expected - they are all trying to clean out their houses.

But I suspect this won't be so simple. It takes millions of people to protest - protests so massive that it's very hard to control.
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:38 pm

Hope the international community helps the people this time
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
ImperialEagle
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:48 pm

The Iranian parliament, as I expected, is ready to unleash death and destruction on the demonstrators and their leaders.

This is from today's N.Y.Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/16/world/middleeast/16iran.html?_r=1&hp
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:04 pm

The Iranian media has already started their coverup efforts. The lead page of Presstv.com shows nothing related to demonstrations in Iran, instead pointing to "500 missing Egyptian demonstrators". They then rail on the US and KSA in another article for "encouraging Bahrain to crack down on opponents". WTF??

In the actual article on the subject, they claim this is the work of an Anti-Iran terrorist organization.

http://presstv.com/detail/165306.html

Propaganda is incredible to watch in action.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
einsteinboricua
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 1:20 am

This is a lose-lose situation for the Iranian government. To let the protests take place would mean allowing dissent; to not allow the protests would show hypocrisy from its part. Of course, just throw in the Revolutionary Guards and the Army and call it a day.

I certainly hope one day the Iranian regime crumbles and collapses so that Iranians can have true freedom. The Ayatollah (aka Supreme Leader) is no different from Mubarak IMO except that Mubarak was allied with the US.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
CaliAtenza
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 3:13 am

I wish the protestors well. Take those bastards down! Unfortunetly, it might take some heavy firepower from outside to finally dismantle the Mullahs  .
 
Mudboy
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:47 am

I think that Iran could open fire and kill every opposition group if they wanted to, and the world would do nothing, but stand by and watch, and they know this. What are we going to do, more sanctions? It is pretty sad for the Iranian people.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:24 am

Quoting Mudboy (Reply 8):
I think that Iran could open fire and kill every opposition group if they wanted to, and the world would do nothing, but stand by and watch, and they know this.

What's the punishment for the height of hypocrisy and showing the world you're up to your ears in BS??
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Mudboy
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:37 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 9):
What's the punishment for the height of hypocrisy and showing the world you're up to your ears in BS??

Nothing, and I think the Iranian Gov. knows this, we can only hope for the best for the people of Iran.
 
deltaownsall
Posts: 1091
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:45 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 9):
What's the punishment for the height of hypocrisy and showing the world you're up to your ears in BS??

In the era of a neutered U.S.? Harshly worded letters and sanctions on things that they're already getting from China and Russia anyways. It didn't take long after the U.S. invasion of Iraq for so many to forget all about Saddam Hussein's countless atrocities and unbelievably inhumane treatment of his people. Who knows how quickly the world would forget about the Ayatollah and Ahmadinejad in the face of the Big Bad Oil-seeking Empire (even though it ironically allows the oil fields to be freely auctioned off to non-U.S. firms...silly us!).

That said, I damn sure don't want a war with Iran...it would be a disaster. Just a shame we can't seem to find a way to help the struggling Iranians who must feel like the world has forgotten about them.

[Edited 2011-02-15 21:47:20]
 
NorthstarBoy
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:50 am

I have a feeling that the whole middle east is going to go. First you had Tunisia, then Egypt, now Yemen and Bahrain. I suspect that within the next few years every tyrant and monarchy in the middle east will be wiped out by a general public that's fed up with being treated like crap. Personally, and no offense to any of the islamic faith, i say that it's about time, let's drag these middle eastern theocracies, oligarchies, and absolute monarchies out of the thirteenth century and into today's world. to put it another way, a police force whose whole job is to enforce religion has no place in a modern, civilized society.
Yes, I'd like to see airbus go under so Boeing can have their customers!
 
ImperialEagle
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 1:01 pm

Quoting Mudboy (Reply 8):
think that Iran could open fire and kill every opposition group if they wanted to, and the world would do nothing, but stand by and watch, and they know this. What are we going to do, more sanctions? It is pretty sad for the Iranian people.

That's about right. And yes, the mullah's know that.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 9):
What's the punishment for the height of hypocrisy and showing the world you're up to your ears in BS

Nothing. Nobody cares anymore because we see hypoctites everywhere.

Quoting Mudboy (Reply 10):
Nothing, and I think the Iranian Gov. knows this, we can only hope for the best for the people of Iran

Yes, the Iranian government has spent years now proving to the world that they have a very high level of violent response to anything they don't like. So now most of the free world has become "conditioned" to not give a s$@t about what Iran does.
Everybody thinks most of the people in Iran support their regime blindly. "So who cares?"

I know many Iranian people who live here in the US. Some here in Roanoke and I have known them in Atlanta, too. They would all love to see some sort of democratic government in place.
The Persian civilization is very, very old. It has survived a lot of turbulence in it's long history. It will survive this. The bad part is the heavy human sacrifice that will be needed to rid themselves of the current regime.
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
einsteinboricua
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 1:14 pm

Quoting deltaownsall (Reply 11):
That said, I damn sure don't want a war with Iran...it would be a disaster.

   Very true. Though the US doesn't import Iranian oil (at least, I don't think it does), one strike against a big oil producer like Iran will send oil prices up through the roof. Add to that that Iran has already made threats against sealing off the Strait of Hormuz (though technically if Oman, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE allow ships to pass through their maritime borders, Iran's threat is null AND if oil is not allowed to flow from the Persian Gulf to the world, you can be pretty sure that China and Russia will immediately demand for Iran to end the blockade)

Quoting NorthstarBoy (Reply 12):
to put it another way, a police force whose whole job is to enforce religion has no place in a modern, civilized society.

   Couldn't have said it better myself. I wonder if the feelings among Arabs (and non-Arabs as well) toward an Islamic state right now are the same back when monarchies were overthrown.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
ImperialEagle
Topic Author
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:18 pm

I find it interesting that not one of the a.netters who usually posts on things related to the Middle East has posted a thing on this thread!

Do they not care a thing about Iranians?
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
bhill
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:26 pm

ImperialEagle, the Persian civilization without Islam is very, very old. I seriously doubt if any form of real democracy can coexist with a sharia based government...church mixing with state has never worked.
Carpe Pices
 
Thorben
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:50 pm

I really wish them all the best. These are brave people to protest against such a cruel regime.

It seems the whole Middle East is in turmoil.

Just the Al-Jazeera headlines:

Bahrain protesters hold ground

Libyan police stations torched

Protesters killed in Yemen clashes

Iran funeral triggers new clashes

Iraqis attack government offices




I hope they all succeed.

Down with dictators, tortures, and corruption!!

Human rights are universal, I hope some day they'll be fully in place in all countries around the world.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
na
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:56 pm

Iran´s situation is uncalculable, the governments fist very strong, more brutal than in any other muslim country aside Libya.

Still from all those regimes Iran´s Mullah-madmen deserve to fall the most. Ahmadinedjad is one of the most ridiculous rulers anywhere, ridiculous as Berlusconi, cruel as Ghaddafi, such a shame for such a great people as the Iranians are. I know quite a lot of Iranians, for a long time, and almost all are fine people.
 
BN747
Posts: 5344
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:11 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 3):
Hope the international community helps the people this time

A snowball in hell has better chance than that happening..for a multitude of reasons.

Quoting na (Reply 18):
Iran´s situation is uncalculable, the governments fist very strong, more brutal than in any other muslim country aside Libya.

Exactly, and for the Iranians to have half a chance, they must follow the Egyptians..

1) Mob-Attack...Beat the crap out of the 1st 50 cops of each crowd/riot control team -
Result: Cops then realize that the crowd is united and will not tolerate 'beatings from them'
Last time, the Iranian protesters tried to be friends with the cops right at the start
..that doesn't work til the cops realize the 'determination' of the various crowds.

2) Realize the old Gov't trick of pulling in outsiders to fire on the people (they have no ties to the locals and will kill for sport! -- exactly why you must attack the police first ..when they stand down, welcome them to the fold.

3) Crowd rush on vital gov't institutions, the state News Agency and Telecommunications Centers, Parliament and Energy facilities.

..at that point the Army holds all the cards and has to choose between - the will of the people or a bloodbath. The latter is not the likely choioce as most of the troops are young men like the majority of the country, they are more in-sync with each other than their older ruling mullahs.

Quoting na (Reply 18):
Still from all those regimes Iran´s Mullah-madmen deserve to fall the most.

Yep, do the above and these old cretins will have nothing but canes to defend themselves.


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
sccutler
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:58 am

It is a sad and bitter irony that the current regime in Iran is vastly more abusive of its people than that of the Shah (which does not justify his abuses).
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
Thorben
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:25 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 20):
It is a sad and bitter irony that the current regime in Iran is vastly more abusive of its people than that of the Shah (which does not justify his abuses).

I don't mean to take this off-topic, but the worst concerning this was probably the Russian revolution. The czar was a dictator, no doubt, but compared to that what came after him he was incredibly soft.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:34 am

Ex-president Rafsanjani´s daughter has been imprisoned after having taken part in anti-government protests and is currently in jail.
[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12519418]Ex-President Rafsanjani daughter arrested in Iran[url]

During the last years it has become more and more a fight between various factions of the Iranian political scene.
On one hand there are the old-style Mullahs, who gained power after the revolution, like Rafsanjani, and became rich. He accepts limited reforms as long as he stays in power and earns money from it. He has power and will be seriouslxy p'ssed off about his daughter´s arrest.
Then there are the revoluntionary guards, religious hardliners, who have bleed and fought in the Iran-Iraq war (when Saddam Hussein thought that he could invade a weakened, after the revolution, Iran and nick their oil fields close to the border) and demand now access to the gravy pots. They are organised in a mafia-like style and are represented by Achmedinejad
Finally there are those who have enough of both and want a modern, democratic system.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
na
Posts: 9211
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:50 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 20):
It is a sad and bitter irony that the current regime in Iran is vastly more abusive of its people than that of the Shah (which does not justify his abuses).

Sadly, the Iranians have driven out the demon with the devil. That the French let Khomeni go to Tehran was a grave mistake, probably the worst political mistake a western state has made after WWII besides Vietnam.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 21):
I don't mean to take this off-topic, but the worst concerning this was probably the Russian revolution. The czar was a dictator, no doubt, but compared to that what came after him he was incredibly soft.

True. Stalin & Co killed hundreds if not thousands of times more people than the Czar. The true crime of the Czarist regime though was keeping his people in total ignorance.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:12 pm

Quoting na (Reply 23):
True. Stalin & Co killed hundreds if not thousands of times more people than the Czar. The true crime of the Czarist regime though was keeping his people in total ignorance.

Well, the last Czar was maybe the most political one (and insofar a tragic figure), he recognised that time for change was overdue. But the most dangerous time for any autocratic system is when it starts to "soften up". This will often be seen as a sign of weakness, which needs to be exploited.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Thorben
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:04 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 22):
Quoting na (Reply 23):
But the most dangerous time for any autocratic system is when it starts to "soften up". This will often be seen as a sign of weakness, which needs to be exploited.

As Jan pointed out for Iran, regimes always have their internal troubles, no matter how tight they seem from the outside. If the pressure is on, and especially from within the country, the regime can break. People don't want to be part of the "ancien regime" after it collapsed so they run away from it when it seems in danger. This actually accelerates the fall old the regime.

I hope Iran manages it this time. If Mubarak and Gaddafi fall, every one can fall.

Quoting na (Reply 23):
True. Stalin & Co killed hundreds if not thousands of times more people than the Czar. The true crime of the Czarist regime though was keeping his people in total ignorance.

Stalin had more people killed in a single day than the entire Czar's dynasty in 150 years. (1762-1917). Under the Czars people at least had a somewhat fair process, under Stalin they were just killed due to statistics/quotas.

This is not how you want your revolution to go.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
JoeCanuck
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RE: Again, The Iranian People Protest-----

Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:40 am

The mullahs are running on borrowed time. Iran has one of the youngest, most educated, politically aware, reasonable and intelligent populations on the planet, much less the middle east.

The old boys are getting older and there is little young blood willing to step in and replace them and their despotic rule. The revolutionary guard is in its death throws and like a cornered rat will fight like hell for its life.

Every man in the country has had military service and knows how to fight. The current regime doesn't have to worry about the west's reactions to atrocities...it has to worry about it's own people.

Look at the protests against just another, ordinary bought and paid for election. We will know relatively soon what the tipping point in blood is, that topples these greedy, self centered and rotten old men.

They seem to have forgotten the lessons of 1979; their regime was born of revolution. It can die of revolution.
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