zhiao
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Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:27 am

All things equal, eliminating differences in clothes, language, and weight, are there any particular characteristics, facially, and bone structure wise that separates White Americans from White Europeans?

The US white population of course is mainly Anglo-Saxon, with elements from Scandinavia, S. Europe, and E Europe. I wonder if all that mixed together creates a white race that looks different than say whites in UK, Germany, etc., where marriage is almost always among people of the same country.

Does anyone notice any particular physical differences in bone structure, or anything else? I know for example that there is some differences between Koreans and Japanese.
 
sccutler
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:57 am

Not really - it is not as if Europeans are strictly homogeneous group - or NorteAmericanos, for that matter.
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radicaldudejom
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:05 am

I've always thought people tend to look different based on the chemicals they put in your tap water, dairy and meat products. All those hormones have to change the way people develop.
Sometimes, your cards aren't worth a dime, if you don't lay them down.
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:08 am

Quoting zhiao (Thread starter):
The US white population of course is mainly Anglo-Saxon,

Actually, a bulk of us are German. Many East Europeans as well as Italians and Irish poured into America. I venture to say that only a small portion of the US is Anglo-Saxon (small=a lot smaller than many think.) Our culture is what is the closest to Britain's.

To answer your question, most white Americans are European descendants, and I doubt much evolution or hereditary differences came about from the last few hundred years (not too long in the grand scheme of things)
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
slz396
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:00 am

Quoting zhiao (Thread starter):
All things equal, eliminating differences in clothes, language, and weight, are there any particular characteristics, facially, and bone structure wise that separates White Americans from White Europeans?

At first glance, I'd have said no, but coming to think of this more carefully, I think the 'average' white American may have a somewhat more pronounced yawbone than most Europeans, the reason being you guys seem to be chewing gum and other stuff all the time... Surely all that chewing must have trained those muscles and thus result in measurable differences in facial characteristics, although one may argue those are not genetic differences, but culturally defined ones as they come into being during life, rather than at birth itself.
 
travelavnut
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:45 am

I really cannot put my finger on it, but most of the time in Amsterdam I can pick Americans from the crowd very very easy. Granted, often this is due to clothing (bit baggy business suits where the pants are pulled up pretty high, or high-school/college sweaters, white sneakers, baseball caps, or a the All-American La Coste shirt tucked in a Levis with white sneakers, that's almost an uniform  ) but also I have a "collection" (don't know how else to describe it) of faces in my memory that when I see them I almost certainly know they are American.

BTW; I have the same with the English, Irish (duh) and also Scandinavians (they look a lot like the Dutchies, but subtle differences are enough for me most of the times). French are a bit harder, I often confuse them with Italians or vice versa. Also I find it very difficult to directly notice from which specific country an Asian or African person is (with the exception of the Somali, they have a very specific face).

Quoting slz396 (Reply 4):
I think the 'average' white American may have a somewhat more pronounced yawbone than most Europeans,

I would tend to agree. Although I don't think it's due to the gum   (but who knows!  
Live From Amsterdam!
 
PanHAM
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:13 am

Quoting slz396 (Reply 4):
Surely all that chewing must have trained those muscles and thus result in measurable differences in facial characteristics, although one may argue those are not genetic differences, but

That's an interesting point I never thought about.   But I think the most obvious item is the clothing, if they don't open their mouth. The latter however erases any possible doubt instantly. Never fails.  

We can only be glad that the Walmartians never make it outside their country.  
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travelavnut
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:17 am

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 6):
We can only be glad that the Walmartians never make it outside their country.



Well, I'm still fearing that the Walmartian Mothership will eventually land on the European continent, this will inevitably bring Walmartians with it. Just as a sunny spring day seems to spawn hot ladies  
Live From Amsterdam!
 
Klaus
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:19 am

Europeans have been mixing their genes for millenia, even before they invaded the Americas; There is no real specific genetic makeup in any european country, even if there are regional tendencies.

Distinguishing "white" Americans from Europeans is much easier by clothing, posture, behaviour and of course by language than by genetic makeup (extreme obesity is relatively rare here, so that can be a tell together with other features, but that's not genetic either).
 
Klaus
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:22 am

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 7):
Well, I'm still fearing that the Walmartian Mothership will eventually land on the European continent, this will inevitably bring Walmartians with it. Just as a sunny spring day seems to spawn hot ladies

They've already attempted an invasion in Europe, but they had to retreat again when their mind-control emitters turned out to be incompatible with european mind-control standards...   
 
travelavnut
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:37 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 9):
european mind-control standards

Fa Shower Gell is the expert on European Mind control, using naked boobies in their TV-ads during prime time (yes, my first encounter with naked boobies when I was young were the Fa Shower Gel commercials   ) Thank you Fa!
Live From Amsterdam!
 
Klaus
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:58 am

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 10):
Fa Shower Gell is the expert on European Mind control, using naked boobies in their TV-ads during prime time (yes, my first encounter with naked boobies when I was young were the Fa Shower Gel commercials   ) Thank you Fa!

Tells you something about diversity around here that I seem to be immune to that one.

Davidoff's "Cool Water" spots, on the other hand...! 
 
Pyrex
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:24 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 6):
We can only be glad that the Walmartians never make it outside their country.

Thank you for proving my theory.
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baroque
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:37 pm

Most body and face shapes have changed dramatically with diet. The late (and great) John Ferm commented to me about the folk in Appalachia that the men all looked like Lil Abner when he first worked there in the 1950s. Once the Interstates came through, the prominent adam's apples disappeared and he took me to a diner to show me what the average Appalachian looked like now.
The illustration in the Wiki entry does not do justice to the scrawny figure usually portrayed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li%27l_Abner
This is a bit better
http://www.archive.org/details/lil_abner

Singaporeans now has a totally body and face shape to 1970.

So you are asking about moving targets.

Another issue is that each racial group is great at differences within that group and hopeless with another racial group. In 1987 I visited Beijing for a conference where there was a total of about 18 westerners. Two of us had beards. One a then youngish German had a black beard (it is white now) and mine was grey to white. Half the time I was addressed by the Chinese with his name, and half my own, and I found he had the same experience but reversed. I am still scratching my head to think what our hosts thought when they saw the two of us talking together.

My wife is Indonesian and picks differences in Indonesians that I simply cannot see and of course she has trouble with some westerners, we all look alike you know!
 
Rara
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:44 pm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 13):

My wife is Indonesian and picks differences in Indonesians that I simply cannot see and of course she has trouble with some westerners, we all look alike you know!

Same here, my girlfriend is Chinese and we watch both Western and Chinese movies. In the Western movies, I have to help her keep the actors apart, and in the Chinese movies, she has to help me. Of course we're both convinced that people of the other race "all look the same".  
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
 
windy95
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:01 pm

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 5):
I really cannot put my finger on it, but most of the time in Amsterdam I can pick Americans from the crowd very very easy. Granted,

Same for me in my wandering around Orlando. I can always pick out a Brit before they open their mouths.

But as for the question posed bu the thread starter I would have to agree with some and say it is size. Weight and height may both be invloved in this. I am a European Mutt. One half Swedish, One quarter German and an eight each Irish and Boehemian. All of my ancestors stayed in their own group for marriage including most of the recent generations until the last. I have absolutely no one over 5'10" in any of my family yet I am over 6'1".. Was this chemistry of all the above or a different diet, hormones in food...etc? And then their is the obesity here. What can I say about that other thtan we are trying to export that to the world thru Mcdonalds, Burger King and KFC..




edited for typos

[Edited 2011-08-31 07:02:24]
 
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Braybuddy
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:33 pm

There are definite individual "looks" to most European nations, and I reckon a lot of it comes down to language: someone above mentioned the distinctive American jawline and I agree, but I put this down to the way Americans speak: they tend to lower the jawbone when pronouncing words (I have to do this if I want to imitate an American accent), therefore using a different musculature, which is bound to affect the shape of the face over time.

And American English is very different in pronounciation to British English. Take Mrs Thatcher's accent, for example: when she used to pronounce "Falklands" she would raise her upper lip. An American would tend to pronounce it from the side of the mouth. Germans tend to use the lower facial muscles more than other nationalities, which probably accounts for the high percentage of square-jawed Deutschen. French speakers tend to use the front of the mouth when speaking, which is probably accounts for that famous Gallic pout. And so on . . . every language has its own distinctive use of facial muscles, which inevitably leads to distinct "looks".
 
zhiao
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:43 pm

My Q says to take into account clothing differences. Someone mentioned that Americans have smaller noses?

So basically, pretend if they did not speak, had the same weight, same haircut, did not show their teeth, and had the same clothes. Would there be a difference?
 
exFATboy
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:59 pm

Keep in mind that white Americans are not always "white" - I've seen statistics over the years that suggest that the average white American whose antecedents in the US go back more than 100 years is likely to be 5-10% African. And many white Americans have some Indian ancestry - I'm a quarter Cherokee, my maternal grandmother was born on-rez in Oklahoma.

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 7):
Well, I'm still fearing that the Walmartian Mothership will eventually land on the European continent, this will inevitably bring Walmartians with it.

Or the dreaded Ryanairians will begin providing service across the pond and bring a horde of Walmartians to Europe. Not sure what we Yanks would get on the other side of that exchange.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 15):
Same for me in my wandering around Orlando. I can always pick out a Brit before they open their mouths.

Or after they open their mouths but before they speak...  

(I'm sorry, I couldn't resist, and this is pretty much just an outdated stereotype these days anyway, I have several English friends and know a couple of Scots as well, and they all have perfectly fine teeth. "While you were gone, Austin, there have been some fabulous advances in the field of dentistry"...)
 
windy95
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:13 pm

Quoting zhiao (Reply 17):
Would there be a difference?

I think that there is not much of a difference. We still look like Swedes, Germans, Spaniards and the rest of our ancestors if you strip everything else away. If you take a picture of me with my relatives from Germany or Sweden I doubt you could tell who the American Swede was just by the facial look.
 
zhiao
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:15 pm

Most whites have No black at all. It was rare for a white woman to reproduce with a black man. Indian is more usual, but even that is overstated.

I wonder if the Native American mix gives some whites more pronounced facial
characteristics like higher cheek bones and larger chin? Look at Marlon Brando for example.

Another interesting thing is the "all American 1950s" look. But when you think
about it, it's basically a Scandinavian or German is nice
clothes and blondish hair. No difference! In fact A&F uses Scandinavian models to represent the all American
look.
 
zhiao
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:22 pm

http://www.google.com/m/search?site=...&maction=&q=all+american+look#i=38

Here's a perfect example of the stereotypical
American jock white face:

http://www.google.com/m/search?site=...&maction=&q=all+american+jock#i=11

http://www.google.com/m/search?site=...&maction=&q=all+american+jock#i=34

But would You consider them as distinctly American looking, or simply a muscular than avg European?
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:27 pm

Now I would expect DocLightning to be all over this one, so where is he, haven't seen him around here in a while?
 
travelavnut
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:29 pm

Quoting exFATboy (Reply 18):
Quoting travelavnut (Reply 7):
Well, I'm still fearing that the Walmartian Mothership will eventually land on the European continent, this will inevitably bring Walmartians with it.

Or the dreaded Ryanairians will begin providing service across the pond and bring a horde of Walmartians to Europe. Not sure what we Yanks would get on the other side of that exchange.

Haha touché  
Live From Amsterdam!
 
travelavnut
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:30 pm

Quoting zhiao (Reply 21):
But would You consider them as distinctly American looking, or simply a muscular than avg European?

Good to know the firewall at my work didn't filter out the jock with the hard mini-jock
Live From Amsterdam!
 
Derico
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:08 pm

Uff, easy.

If the caucasian person cannot place anything on a map, American.
If the caucasian person believes you are not worth his/her time, European.
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Bongodog1964
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:19 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):
Europeans have been mixing their genes for millenia, even before they invaded the Americas; There is no real specific genetic makeup in any european country, even if there are regional tendencies

Very true, take the UK as an example, until the 10th century the nation was almost exclusively populated by celts, mass immigration from Scandinavia (Vikings) and from France (1066 and all that) pushed the celts into the fringes of Wales, Scotland and over to Ireland. The invaders being sensible people weren't too bothered about these outposts and left them to the natives !!!

Quoting windy95 (Reply 15):
Same for me in my wandering around Orlando. I can always pick out a Brit before they open their mouths.

Its not difficult though is it ? just look for all the red shirts with Rooney on the back and the blue ones with Lampard on them.
 
PanHAM
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:30 pm

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 26):
and from France (1066 and all that) pushed the celts into the fringes of Wales, Scotland and over to Ireland. The invaders being sensible people weren't too bothered about these outposts and left them to the natives !!!

Not only that, they divided Brittany / Bretagne in those who can cook and those who cannot.   

Quoting Klaus (Reply 9):
They've already attempted an invasion in Europe,

That was just Walmart, Walmartians are a special breed of their customers. When they discovered that the Mart was nothing without the Martians, they retreated.
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NoUFO
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:35 pm

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 26):
Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):
Europeans have been mixing their genes for millenia, even before they invaded the Americas; There is no real specific genetic makeup in any european country, even if there are regional tendencies

Very true, take the UK as an example, ...

Wait, Klaus did not say that something good will come of it *all* the time.   
I support the right to arm bears
 
YokoTsuno
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:52 pm

This might help

http://www.faceoftomorrow.com/thefaces.asp

Click on the name of the city.
 
Klaus
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:56 pm

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 28):
Wait, Klaus did not say that something good will come of it *all* the time.

True.

But a shocking fact ist also that there has been a significant germanic invasion into Britain as well. Today's britons are actually genetically germans in large part, with much less celtic or viking ancestry still present than was once believed... (no, not just the very recently imported royal family, even regular british citizens!)

Note that again I have not said whether that was a good thing. It seems that they've unfortunately decided to retain the culinary traditions from that invasion, of all things...!   

The Anglo-Saxon Invasion: Britain Is More Germanic than It Thinks - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 27):
Quoting Klaus (Reply 9):
They've already attempted an invasion in Europe,

That was just Walmart, Walmartians are a special breed of their customers. When they discovered that the Mart was nothing without the Martians, they retreated.

It was indeed the supply pioneer division which had failed. But who knows – if they had actually succeeded establishing their first beachheads, they might have terraformed all of Europe for a rollout of the main invasion as the second wave...!  Wow!
 
TSS
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:15 pm

I've seen residents of the European continent take issue with being labeled generically as "Europeans" because Europe comprises such a wide range of ethnic and cultural diversity. I take the same issue with being labeled generically as "American" for the same reason: There are huge regional differences in ethnic background and culture throughout the US.
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
NoUFO
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:29 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 30):
Today's britons are actually genetically germans in large part,

And vice versa, or maybe not genetically but more "behaviorally":

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...non_aviation/print.main?id=1142308
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MD11Engineer
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:40 pm

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 7):
Quoting PanHAM (Reply 6):
We can only be glad that the Walmartians never make it outside their country.



Well, I'm still fearing that the Walmartian Mothership will eventually land on the European continent, this will inevitably bring Walmartians with it. Just as a sunny spring day seems to spawn hot ladies

They tried, but failed completely. I was in the Walmart shop in CGN, they had to hire cleaners to keep the place clean all the time, as Germans wouldn´t want to buy in dirty shops, unlike the Walmart shops I´ve seen in the US. And there were issues like the staff joining a union and labour laws they didn´t like.

Quoting Baroque (Reply 13):
Most body and face shapes have changed dramatically with diet. The late (and great) John Ferm commented to me about the folk in Appalachia that the men all looked like Lil Abner when he first worked there in the 1950s. Once the Interstates came through, the prominent adam's apples disappeared and he took me to a diner to show me what the average Appalachian looked like now.
The illustration in the Wiki entry does not do justice to the scrawny figure usually portrayed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li%27l_Abner
This is a bit better
http://www.archive.org/details/lil_abner

To be fair, the Appalachians used to be one of the poorest and most backward regions of the US. The poor people inhabiting the place back during the early 20th century were often undernourishedband shaped by hard physical work, be it as a sharecropper or coal miner. The isolation of many remote places and the resulting inbreding also did nothing to improve the health of the inhabitants (which is BTW similar to the rural, hilly region of Germany I live in. Up to post WW2, when affordable motorisation cut in and improved mobility, many people would marry within their own little village. An American colleague has compared the Hunsrück hills, always a poor region in the past, with West Virginia).

Up to WW2 the Dutch used to be the short@rses of Europe. Today, thanks to better and more food, they are among the tallest.

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 26):
Very true, take the UK as an example, until the 10th century the nation was almost exclusively populated by celts, mass immigration from Scandinavia (Vikings) and from France (1066 and all that) pushed the celts into the fringes of Wales, Scotland and over to Ireland. The invaders being sensible people weren't too bothered about these outposts and left them to the natives !!!

What about the Romans (including Numidians, Syrians, Iberians etc., who served in their legions) and the Angles and Saxons, who came before the Vikings and happily mixed with the original Briton population?


Jan
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windy95
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:52 pm

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 26):
Its not difficult though is it ? just look for all the red shirts with Rooney on the back and the blue ones with Lampard on them.

You forgot the pasty white skin with the sundurn lines on it.
 
iakobos
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:04 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 30):
But a shocking fact ist also that there has been a significant germanic invasion into Britain as well. Today's britons are actually genetically germans in large part, with much less celtic or viking ancestry still present than was once believed

Just for the record...
What Klaus omits to say is that (proto-) "Germanic" does not relate per se to present day Germany and modern-day Germans.

From Gardiner's History of England
{i]During the time when this trade was being carried on, tribes of Gauls and Belgians landed in Britain. The Gauls were certainly, and the Belgians probably, of the same Celtic race as that which already occupied the island. The Gauls settled on the east coast as far as the Fens and the Wash, whilst the Belgians occupied the south coast, and pushed northwards towards the Somerset Avon.[/i]

From the recent research based also on genetics from Stephen Oppenheimer
So who were the Britons inhabiting England at the time of the Roman invasion? The history of pre-Roman coins in southern Britain reveals an influence from Belgic Gaul. The tribes of England south of the Thames and along the south coast during Caesar’s time all had Belgic names or affiliations. Caesar tells us that these large intrusive settlements had replaced an earlier British population, which had retreated to the hinterland of southeast England.
The common language referred to by Tacitus was probably not Celtic, but was similar to that spoken by the Belgae, who may have been a Germanic people, as implied by Caesar. In other words, a Germanic-type language could already have been indigenous to England at the time of the Roman invasion.
 
Doona
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:26 pm

Quoting Derico (Reply 25):

I'm sorry, did someone say something?

Cheers
Mats
Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
 
Confuscius
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:34 pm

Quoting zhiao (Thread starter):
Difference Between White Americans And Europeans

Being a non-caucasian, you guys all look alike to us. 
Ain't I a stinker?
 
Klaus
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:57 pm

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 32):
And vice versa, or maybe not genetically but more "behaviorally":

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...42308

And almost true..! 

(The last sentence is actually completely true!)

Quoting iakobos (Reply 35):
Just for the record...
What Klaus omits to say is that (proto-) "Germanic" does not relate per se to present day Germany and modern-day Germans.

Of course not, but still close enough for a good ribbing!
 
RobertNL070
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:00 pm

It's all in the teeth  
Youth is a gift of nature. Age is a work of art.
 
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shamrock604
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:28 pm

Quoting Derico (Reply 25):

Wow! Bitter and Judgemental much?  

Us "Europeans" are a collection of several nationalities, and I can tell you that rudeness and uncaring is NOT part of the culture everywhere in Europe!

Neither indeed is being unable to name places on a map a trait common to every American!

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 5):
BTW; I have the same with the English, Irish (duh)

May I please point out that not ALL Irish people are red haired, freckled and short@rsed? In fact, most of us are brown or blonde haired!!    
 
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falstaff
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:44 pm

Quoting Rara (Reply 14):
Of course we're both convinced that people of the other race "all look the same".


I used to teach in a nearly all black high school, in Detroit. A lot of students couldn't remember my name and called me by the names of other white teachers. I had not had that experience before our school went from 25% black to 99.9% black. I asked a few students why they couldn't keep my name straight. They told me that all us white guys look alike. I got a good laugh out of that one. A few of our black staff members agreed when I brought it up in the staff break room.

Quoting exFATboy (Reply 18):
Keep in mind that white Americans are not always "white" - I've seen statistics over the years that suggest that the average white American whose antecedents in the US go back more than 100 years is likely to be 5-10% African. And many white Americans have some Indian ancestry - I'm a quarter Cherokee, my maternal grandmother was born on-rez in Oklahoma


Not me.... Italian, German, Irish and maybe some English in me. But I don't like saying I am any of those. I am an American.

Give it a couple of hundred years and the middle eastern people will change the cultural makeup of Europe. Studying birthrate statisics gives you all the information you need. Here in the US the white population in shrinking too. Give it a while and the racial and genetic makeup will be a lot different than it is now.
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
Klaus
Posts: 20622
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:43 pm

Quoting falstaff (Reply 41):
Give it a couple of hundred years and the middle eastern people will change the cultural makeup of Europe. Studying birthrate statisics gives you all the information you need.

Oh, come on! This old, certified piece of bunk again?

This has been examined and found to be a silly extrapolation of assumed dynamics which just don't happen to fit with reality. Immigrants from muslim countries are a relatively small minority and their birth rates decline pretty rapidly after arriving, basically to the local european standard.

They will stay small minorities long beyond being ordinary Germans, for instance, no more exotic with a name of "Özkan" than people with a name of "Pawelczik" today (who immigrated from Poland about a century ago).

I'm aware that this was one of the mainstays of the neocon cabale which grasped at any possible straw to justify its excursions into Iraq and all kinds of other paranoia-fueled endeavours, but really. It's 2011, and the world has (mostly) awoken from that nightmare by now. Let it go. We've got many more relevant problems ahead of us.
 
Derico
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:05 pm

Quoting shamrock604 (Reply 40):
Us "Europeans" are a collection of several nationalities, and I can tell you that rudeness and uncaring is NOT part of the culture everywhere in Europe!

Neither indeed is being unable to name places on a map a trait common to every American!
Quoting Doona (Reply 36):
I'm sorry, did someone say something?

Hey, just keeping it real. With a good dose of generalization. Which is a really good segway to this:

Quoting TSS (Reply 31):
I've seen residents of the European continent take issue with being labeled generically as "Europeans" because Europe comprises such a wide range of ethnic and cultural diversity. I take the same issue with being labeled generically as "American" for the same reason: There are huge regional differences in ethnic background and culture throughout the US.

A large number of Europeans and North Americans prove completely incapable or, perhaps more damning of all UNWILLING, in distinguishing between (for example) a group of Afro-Brazilians from northeastern Brazil with their unique spiritual and cultural traditions, a village in Mexico where 1000 year old Mayan culture thrives and people retain their identity, or a family in an estancia in Argentina that trace back their ways to Ligurian, Gallego, or Bavarian roots. They are all "Latin Americans" regardless of any cultural, language, ethnic, religious and life-style differences. That in itself is not what is bad.

But that "general label" is immediately TRANSFERED when something bad happens somewhere in Latin America that is obviously a localized issue. All I hear then is, well ''it's how it is everywhere... there''.

Absolutely no distinction in terms that the social problems of one area may not exist in another, and viceversa.
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
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HELyes
Posts: 1238
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:26 am

RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:24 pm

Quoting Derico (Reply 25):
If the caucasian person cannot place anything on a map, American.

In summer Helsinki gets a lot of American day tourists from the cruise ships and they seem to get disorientated easily. Once I was stopped by an elderly American couple who showed me the map of Oslo and asked me the way to the harbour... They were great, after a little confusion they had a good laugh and said that somehow the map had worked that far!

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 5):

Usually I can pick up my own countrymen easily. At the airports there is a simple way to find the gate when flying to HEL: just follow the big blond ugly people, usually those are Finns going home.  
 
baroque
Posts: 12302
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:01 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 30):

Note that again I have not said whether that was a good thing. It seems that they've unfortunately decided to retain the culinary traditions from that invasion, of all things...!

Probably true both at its worst and best but not its Würste. However are you familiar with Pie in the Sky?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pie_in_the_Sky_%28TV_series%29
The most worrying thing is how much fatter the excellent Richard Griffiths gets in successive series - and he started undertall for his weight.

And you must be forgetting rote Grütze?
 
zhiao
Topic Author
Posts: 441
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:15 am

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 24):
Good to know the firewall at my work didn't filter out the jock with the hard mini-jock

I am so sorry, but that wasn't my intent! I have no idea how that happened. How can I edit that? I just posted 2 face pics, and now I realize that it turned to something else.
 
zhiao
Topic Author
Posts: 441
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:52 am

RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:28 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 30):
But a shocking fact ist also that there has been a significant germanic invasion into Britain as well. Today's britons are actually genetically germans in large part, with much less celtic or viking ancestry still present than was once believed... (no, not just the very recently imported royal family, even regular british citizens!)

Note that again I have not said whether that was a good thing. It seems that they've unfortunately decided to retain the culinary traditions from that invasion, of all things...!

So that would mean that most American whites are actually Germanic, if we now include the English colonial stock. Of course, "Germanics" were an Indo-European tribe, who like the Celts, Angles, etc., all came from the same area (around the Caspian Sea). They displaced the previous ancient European populations many thousands of years ago (the Indo European tribes).

Though actually, there's a large Iberian presence in UK and Ireland. You can tell; Collin Ferrell, Bono, P Brosnan, etc., look much more S European. Netherlands also has a substantial Iberian presence, which is why Dutch people are not as blond-blue-eyed as other parts of N Europe. Spain itself has plenty of light eyed people, but he proportion is less.
 
zhiao
Topic Author
Posts: 441
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:52 am

RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:31 am

Quoting falstaff (Reply 41):
Here in the US the white population in shrinking too.

Not true. It is growing.
 
zhiao
Topic Author
Posts: 441
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RE: Difference Between White Americans And Europeans?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:56 am

I think this is a good test. I am posting 4 White Europeans and 4 white Americans (with their permission of course). Tell me if you can identify who belongs to the E and who to the A. Pay no attention to clothing or environment, as I corrected for this bias by putting very neutral visuals. Also, all the Americans are all more than 3 generations.


Person 1:

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...7_511500606_20376927_6474215_n.jpg

Person 2:

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photo...0275064/n670275064_691917_5629.jpg

Person 3:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...45_602605645_8541378_5130607_n.jpg

Person 4:

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...43_761079043_5982756_1629518_n.jpg

Person 5:

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...328_1101060066_30038499_1204_n.jpg

Person 6:

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...231_2056878_63027782_2953911_n.jpg

Person 7:

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photo...5254531/n5254531_35546713_1384.jpg

Person 8:

http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/228138...4217842_664597842_267687_756_n.jpg

[Edited 2011-08-31 20:09:45]

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