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2707200X
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Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:50 am

Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney is just plain bland by a lot of people including much of the right wing. He cannot generate excitement and he has little charisma. On the other hand, Rick Santorum generates excitement and has a strong charisma but his social and cultural views are extreme by most people and though he believes his contrasting views will make him more competitive with Obama he is less popular with the voting public than Mitt Romney according to most polls. Though Obama is a weak candidate, Romney looks like he is going to be a weaker candidate with all the explaining that he will have to do with the majority activist wing with of the GOP.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:51 am

Exited? I'd be EXCITED if Mittens EXITED the presidential race.
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LAXintl
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:53 am

He seem rather bland to me, and meek especially in his social views for my taste.

However I'd happily take President Romney with strong business and economic acumen over another 4 years under the great socialist Obama.

[Edited 2012-03-19 17:58:58]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:03 am

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 2):
He seem rather bland to me, and meek especially in his social views for my taste.

Oh, so you prefer a fascist like Santorum?

It's pretty rare I go that far for major U.S. politicians. But that bastard is bonafide. Capital F, Fascist.

How sadly ironic that the person using "socialism" to apparently invoke complaints of an extreme nature of the policies or location of Obama on the political spectrum in one breath, is calling the only major R challenger who is not completely off the deep end too "bland" and "meek" for him. Captain Murdoch was right, irony can be pretty ironic sometimes. And Santorum will always make Barack Obama look like Thomas Jefferson.

[Edited 2012-03-19 18:41:53]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:15 am

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 3):
It's pretty rare I go that far for major U.S. politicians. But that bastard is bonafide. Capital F, Fascist.

If he gets the nomination for whatever reason, I hope Obama defeats him 99%-1%. He deserves to be publicly shamed.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:37 am

Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney is just plain bland by a lot of people including much of the right wing. [/quote]
Well it's either Romney, or Obama, because Santorum is totally unelectable, and no one has heard from Gingrich in weeks.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:39 am

I am excited about him, believe it or not. But then again, I am a moderate Republican who is fiscally conservative. I am in no way a religious conservative.

It is a shame that such a hard working, competent, genial man is being treated to such a hard slog to get to the nomination. Sure, he isn't cool or witty or hip to modern music or other cultural things.

What Romney offers is a steady hand that is disciplined to work hard, look at every issue with an executive's bottom line, and not antagonize people with his cultural rhetoric.

In a fair world, he would have already won the Republican nomination by acclimation, and would easily win by a landslide over Obama.

On the other hand, it is not a fair world. Santorum is widely popular with the backward, resentful, rural voter, and still could pull the upset.

Furthermore, in a fair world, even Democrats would see that Obama's policies have not worked, will not work, and the man is an empty suit that galvanized a nation simply on high rhetoric and a chance to make racial history. Even devotees have soured on this man.

Having said that, I expect Obama to win easily. His supporters are canine in their affection for him. His media supporters would walk on hot coals to write great articles for him and spread his gospel on TV. The demography of the US is definitely on the democrat's side.

If this was 1988, Romney, like Bush senior, would win. However, it is now 2012. Decades of illegal immigration, legal immigration, and a general left shift amongst the young and college-educated, have changed the electorate markedly. Read Ruy Texeira's books for more on the emerging democratic majority and how it's here to stay.

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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:43 am

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 4):
If he gets the nomination for whatever reason, I hope Obama defeats him 99%-1%. He deserves to be publicly shamed.

Puerto Rico showed everyone how it should be done.

Any Santorum supporter to invoke the usual suspects of 'freedom', 'liberty', 'small government' and "constitutionalism" is complete reprehensible scum in my book. At least be honest with everyone else about your blatant hypocrisy.


Ah, but such is life amongst the conservative 'base' of the party. How truly embarrassing it is becoming to coexist with you for any true lover of freedom and liberty.


Politics are very complicated and convoluted, and peoples opinions and votes are shaped in many different ways. I have been receptive in the past to certain Republicans and positions, and typically had quite tempered and mixed opinions on GWB, etc. There is a time, however, when someone makes it necessary for a clear line to be drawn in the sand. The candidate is Rick Santorum. The time is right now.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:01 am

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
Decades of illegal immigration, legal immigration, and a general left shift amongst the young and college-educated, have changed the electorate markedly.

The funny thing is that these "changes" occurred during the 8 years of a Republican President. Surprising huh?

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
On the other hand, it is not a fair world. Santorum is widely popular with the backward, resentful, rural voter, and still could pull the upset.

While Mittens goes our of his way to pander to this group. I would had more respect for him if he embraced his middle of the road thinking.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:10 am

Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 1):
I'd be EXCITED if Mittens EXITED the presidential race.

Yup.

In a nutshell I am about as excited as a cow about to get hit with the pneumatic hammer.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:16 am

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):
While Mittens goes our of his way to pander to this group. I would had more respect for him if he embraced his middle of the road thinking.

He can't in the primaries; that's the whole point of the primaries.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:23 am

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):

While Mittens goes our of his way to pander to this group. I would had more respect for him if he embraced his middle of the road thinking.

Unfortunately, that is an impossibility for him right now. It's the disgusting truth. It'd be political suicide.


Perhaps the most disappointing facet of this "surge of Santorum", is that in large part, its been predicated on a concrete fact: people haven't been voting.

Well not exactly true, some places they have, some places they haven't. Of course the south is rabid to do it. But i'm talking about places like the midwest which Santorum has been winning. Compare Minnesota to Alabama. Minnesota slightly larger. Obviously Alabama much more conservative, but still- look at these numbers. Apprx 600,000 people voted in the Alabama primary. Less than 50,000 Minnesotans voted in the OPEN primary.

I don't know what that is, extreme apathy, dissatisfaction with all the candidates, willingness to just vote for whoever gets the nomination- whatever, that is now a buffoon like Santorum started this all.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:29 am

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):
Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
Decades of illegal immigration, legal immigration, and a general left shift amongst the young and college-educated, have changed the electorate markedly.

The funny thing is that these "changes" occurred during the 8 years of a Republican President. Surprising huh?

No, mt99, these changes occurred over decades, not just under Bush. You weren't paying much attention to texdravids words, which, by the way, I heartily agree with. And while Mitt doesn't excite me, I'd happily take his blandness over another 4 years of the charlatan named Barack Obama who has contradicted his own words numerous times over his term thusfar and allies himself with the illegals who are relentlessly invading our nation instead of its rightful citizens. Piling debt on top of debt and driving energy prices skyward with Draconian EPA mandates and needless restrictions on domestic oil and gas drilling on federal lands and offshore aren't my idea of progress, either. But texdravid is likely correct that despite his shameful and often insipid demagoguery of the issues, Obama could well prevail, given demographic shifts and the insidious liberal indoctrination of our youth, thanks to the Leftists who educate the kids in public schools and universities.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:41 am

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 3):
Oh, so you prefer a fascist like Santorum?

It's pretty rare I go that far for major U.S. politicians. But that bastard is bonafide. Capital F, Fascist.

How sadly ironic that the person using "socialism" to apparently invoke complaints of an extreme nature of the policies or location of Obama on the political spectrum in one breath, is calling the only major R challenger who is not completely off the deep end too "bland" and "meek" for him. Captain Murdoch was right, irony can be pretty ironic sometimes. And Santorum will always make Barack Obama look like Thomas Jefferson.

   

Who says I support Santorum? The thread was about Romney.

Personally for me the social platform is just as important as the economic and foreign affairs one. Romney is simply too weak for me on his social stands, while I understand Santorum and Newt are not electable. If I had a choice, I'd prefer someone like McCain again if age and history was not an issue.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:45 am

Fair enough. Seemed like a logical deduction at the time, but admittedly some sort of assumption. Out of curiosity, what particularly do you find him weak on?

The strange thing to me, is most would argue that Romney ran more right of McCain in 2008, so i'm constantly confused how these reputations seem to evolve over time.

[Edited 2012-03-19 19:46:05]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:48 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 10):
He can't in the primaries; that's the whole point of the primaries.
Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 11):
Unfortunately, that is an impossibility for him right now. It's the disgusting truth. It'd be political suicide.

Oh i know.. so he lies now, so he can back track later. Again, i would be more impressed with him if he wouldn't do that.
But I agree, its all about the politics.

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
No, mt99, these changes occurred over decades, not just under Bush.

But Bush didn't put a stop to them didn't he? Besides this "youth" vote you fear, was brought up during the 8 years of GWB. They grew up with a Republican President.

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
Obama could well prevail, given demographic shifts and the insidious liberal indoctrination of our youth, thanks to the Leftists who educate the kids in public schools and universities.

Again - the "youth" grew up under Bush and under No Child Left Behind and not under Obama...

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
Leftists who educate the kids in public schools and universities.

So Santorum has it right? College is a Liberal conspiracy.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:54 am

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
charlatan named Barack Obama

Not only is BHO a Muslim, communist, fascist he is a charlatan too.

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
that despite his shameful and often insipid demagoguery of the issues, Obama could well prevail, given demographic shifts and the insidious liberal indoctrination of our youth, thanks to the Leftists who educate the kids in public schools and universities.

So what, so you can declare war on women's health, gays, workers, the environment, education, suppress voting and let a so called so called neighborhood watchman shot a black kid for no reason in Florida and get away with it, hell no.

These kinds of comments should be the best reason to vote for Obama at least just to give an FU to all the right wing conspiracy theorist.

These people have their self to thank when Obama gets elected, another reason not to vote Republican from a former Republican like myself.

[Edited 2012-03-19 19:58:24]

[Edited 2012-03-19 20:01:18]

[Edited 2012-03-19 20:03:45]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:58 am

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
What Romney offers is a steady hand that is disciplined to work hard, look at every issue with an executive's bottom line, and not antagonize people with his cultural rhetoric.

I agree with everything you have said about him but what will hurt him is "The executive bottom line". Through the primaries Replublicans have been attacking him and Bain Capital and if they are then the democrats are going to do it 10 times more.

He has to convince at minimum the centre that he has their interests in hand and he can barely convince the GOP base, his gaffes about his wife owning a couple of Cadillacs and him knowing only NASCAR and NFL owners also hurt him.

However if he wins and governs the nation like he did Massachusetts and not be loyal to the tea-party and the GOP base he probably can be a very good president.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 5):
Well it's either Romney, or Obama, because Santorum is totally unelectable, and no one has heard from Gingrich in weeks.

Maybe to you and I but he polls well against Obama in the swing states and there could be the possibility of him winning the EC (the the election) but Obama winning the popular vote by several million. Although I reckon he has lost the vote of all sex loving women which is about half the electorate.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 10):
He can't in the primaries; that's the whole point of the primaries.

You might get a brokered convention which as a non-American I want to see because this reality show will get that much better.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:00 am

Quoting mt99 (Reply 15):

So Santorum has it right? College is a Liberal conspiracy.

True, the much more unbiased and virtuous way to get an education is in the kitchen with Karen Santorum.

There was so much hoopla about Obama or his wife 'hating' America and all that. I don't know how it could be argued that Rick Santorum looks at present day America and the vast majority of present day American's with great scorn and disgust, and sees himself as a savior.


I just saw this headline tonight:

"ROCKFORD, Ill.—Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum says the issue in the presidential race is not the economy but an oppressive government that's taking away people's freedom."

How could anyone possibly believe this crap and actually vote for this man. I can't even describe the amount of extreme irony and hypocrisy in that sentence.

Someone defend him, I dare you.

[Edited 2012-03-19 20:02:43]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:07 am

You're right about one thing, mt99. Bush also was one bad apple. He shamelessly pandered to the illegals as much as Obama while in office. But the liberal pervasion of the public education is no myth and it's no coincidence that the majority of NEA members are Democrats and that the Association broadly supports Obama's policies. And while Santorum is a truly unelectable candidate, he's got that right. There's good reason to fear the youth vote if the youth have been getting their thinking patterns from only one basic political viewpoint. Their embrace of the decidely Leftist Occupy Movement shows the extent of the liberal stranglehold on education; it's something all reasonable Americans should be greatly concerned about.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:20 am

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 4):
If he gets the nomination for whatever reason, I hope Obama defeats him 99%-1%. He deserves to be publicly shamed.

I hope that happens also, because when it does, we, the people of Pennsylvania, will never have to hear from this scumbag again. He did absolutely nothing in the House or Senate, then acts like he defends the people.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:12 am

Often the Democrats have been associated with "falling in love" with a candidate rather than "falling in line" like the Republicans have been doing. I remember when Hillary and Obama where campaigning and things where competitive between the two but in the end Hillary threw her endorsement behind Obama and she did it in an orderly fashion even if many of her supporters have threatened to and in many cases have voted for McCain. What I see today is a malaise between the moderate "in today's terms" Mitt Romney and the culturally conservative Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich. Mitt and Rick want Newt to leave but he won't and Rick is staying in though he is trailing bad behind Romney and the former governor probably won't hit the number to click in the nomination before the convention. I think the convention will be brokered giving Romney little time to campaign on his own as the official nominee. Like him or not he has a hard road ahead and I don't think Newt or even Santorum will enthusiastically back Romney and in Newts case probably not openly at all.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:16 am

I wonder if Romney is excited about Romney...

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 18):
I don't know how it could be argued that Rick Santorum looks at present day America and the vast majority of present day American's with great scorn and disgust, and sees himself as a savior.

Do you mean you DO know how? Because that's about the best wording I've read in a while.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:22 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 22):

Do you mean you DO know how? Because that's about the best wording I've read in a while.

Ah, yeah, poor wording on my part. I meant to say that I don't know how anyone can argue that he DOESN'T look at America with contempt.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:25 am

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 12):
Piling debt on top of debt and driving energy prices skyward with Draconian EPA mandates and needless restrictions on domestic oil and gas drilling on federal lands and offshore aren't my idea of progress, either

A few points.

- The reason for the current price hike in oil right now is mostly (approx. 64%) speculation and domestic production is at an all time high with the US importing less oil then the Bush admin.

- A lot of the drilling and the ANWR, the gulf and the Alberta tar sands are very expensive to extract and are only profitable when oil is high. If gas went down to what Gingrich proposes ($2.50 a gallon) none of these sources are profitable and won't be extracted.

- Also conservatives in 2008 when oil was high simply said "You can't blame the president for it". Now the tune has changed like it's all Obama's fault. Remember Bush has 6 years of total congressional control to do whatever he pleased and could have started domestic production that would be yielding good production but in 2002 gas costed peanuts back then and there was no need to have a long term investment in domestic reserves.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:45 am

Quoting 2707200X (Thread starter):
Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney is just plain bland by a lot of people including much of the right wing. He cannot generate excitement and he has little charisma. On the other hand, Rick Santorum generates excitement and has a strong charisma but his social and cultural views are extreme by most people and though he believes his contrasting views will make him more competitive with Obama he is less popular with the voting public than Mitt Romney according to most polls. Though Obama is a weak candidate, Romney looks like he is going to be a weaker candidate with all the explaining that he will have to do with the majority activist wing with of the GOP.

I think the last 4 years are proof enough that voting for someone just because they are somehow cool, or hip, or charismatic, or good at reading from a teleprompter can have catastrophic results. Excitement is way over-rated.

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
and a general left shift amongst the young and college-educated

Young people have always been leftists. Young people have always done other really stupid stuff too, like smoke because they think it's cool, or drive metal studs through their skulls. For most people it takes experience and wisdom to realize that utopia is just that, utopic. It is only very rare people that are more enlightened than that.

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 16):
So what, so you can declare war on women's health

So not wanting to pay for someone else's contraception is somehow a "war on women's health"? So can I assume you are engaging in a war against personal responsibility?
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:06 am

Normally there is a lot of blame and scapegoating that goes around when we don't like what is happening in politics. Either its a politicians own greed, incompetence, or dishonest. Or then it's the political system. Or it's the media.

But this is different.

Party leaders, general media sentiment, established conservatives voices- endorsements for Santorum have been few and far between. Even in CPAC Romney managed to come out ahead. The blame here lies squarely with one clear source-- the 'conservative base'. The people. The heart of the GOP.

Their rallying cries against the 'establishment', 'media' and seemingly anyone who has half a brain have all the intellectual traits of a middle schooler eating in the hallway since the cafeteria is too conformist.

That is what the base has become. A bunch of emo kids with such a distrust of authority, instead of slamming the door very hard, they decided to vote for a fascist. Why? Because they can..


I studied Political Science and took classes on elections and campaigns by some of the most respected professors in the field.

Trust me, throw it out the window. This is breaking all of the rules in a fascinating, but frightening, way . I cannot explain it, i cannot make sense of it.

You have the far right base of party, who made a name on opposing Obama with the Tea Party and their 'fiscal conservatism' and a thirst for 'real world' and private sector experience, claiming to put all else on the back burner. A year later you have the very same people shunning a wealthy businessman with executive and Governor experience, who ran right of John McCain, largely being shunned in favor of a career politician lawyer who left the Senate in disgrace known predominantly for his crazed social conservatism and contribution to vocabulary.

Explain that. It can't be done, by any other reason than looking at the mentality of the base. I'd call them spoiled children. , but that is offensive. I was once a spoiled child, and I was nowhere near that stupid.

[Edited 2012-03-19 23:22:16]

[Edited 2012-03-19 23:25:39]
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:32 am

Yeah you have the consequences of having only two political parties. In France the Tea Party would really be another party (the National Front) and not be part of the primary, because it would have its own candidate (Bachman or Palin, in your case, Marine Le Pen in ours).
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:55 am

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
I think the last 4 years are proof enough that voting for someone just because they are somehow cool, or hip, or charismatic, or good at reading from a teleprompter can have catastrophic results. Excitement is way over-rated.

I guess you don't want Rick Santorum as the GOP candidate.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
So not wanting to pay for someone else's contraception is somehow a "war on women's health"? So can I assume you are engaging in a war against personal responsibility?

In this case it was about the use of contraceptives on a non contraception case. Darrell Issa did not allow Sandra Fluke to testify at the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee hearing called "Lines Crossed". Only religious people where allowed to testify. Sandra Fluke was not allowed to testify about her friend who has Polycystic Ovary Syndrome and needs contraception medicine costing her over $100 per month. Her insurance company denied coverage believing that the she was using the contraceptives for birth control. This was not about free money form the government for women to have rampant sex like Rush, O'reilly and Ingraham would have their listeners believe. To the detractors is was about promiscuity and religious discrimination. She has a condition that is beyond her control. The problem is... it is not about personal responsibility, this is about the Republicans particularly at the state level that think women cannot be responsible. Look as Gov. Bob McDonald of Virginia with his invasive vaginal probes and look at Tennessee they want to publish names of abortion providers.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 8:27 am

The GOP now reminds me of the end of Pulp Fiction.

Romney is the weak and Santorum the tyranny of evil men, but he's trying real hard to be the shepherd.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:10 am

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):

I shed a tear to the great nation that was once America.....

You'll shed another when you realize that for many people, his election actually restored a good bit of that greatness.   I don't expect you to care, but Obama's time in office has worked tremendously towards restoring America's image in the world. Not for flag-burning radicals, but for average people in average countries that don't usually make it to the news.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:01 pm

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 28):
Sandra Fluke was not allowed to testify about her friend

Come on, stop pretending Sandra Fluke was just some random woman talking about her friend. She is a radical left-wing activist, and has always been, that just picked up a rare case to make her point. I am sure there are a few people who might need contraceptives for medical reasons but for the vast, vast, vast majority that is not the case. Now if you could trust doctors to keep their professions separate from their ideologies perhaps you could have insurance cover contraceptives if the person needs them for medical reasons, but since you cannot (plus, I heard those drug reps are really flirty and give away free trips to "congresses" in the Caribbean) then I guess there needs to be some sort of control by the payer. As they say, "this is why we can't have nice things".

Quoting Rara (Reply 30):
You'll shed another when you realize that for many people, his election actually restored a good bit of that greatness.

Yes, his first 11 days in office were just great. At least according to those Norwegians who gave a peace prize to Yasser Arafat.

Quoting Rara (Reply 30):
I don't expect you to care, but Obama's time in office has worked tremendously towards restoring America's image in the world. Not for flag-burning radicals, but for average people in average countries that don't usually make it to the news.

Honestly, Europeans don't know sh*t about America (they are just as ignorant about America as they believe America is about the world - I guess that is what happens when you only source of information is Daily Show re-runs), so somehow changing a warped vision deturped by a biased media to another warped vision (only pinker) does not count as success in my book.
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mt99
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:32 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
am sure there are a few people who might need contraceptives for medical reasons but for the vast, vast, vast majority that is not the case.

The vast majority are married women who do not want to become pregnant.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
Honestly, Europeans don't know sh*t about America (they are just as ignorant about America as they believe America is about the world

So you are European living in the US? Does that make you special or give you any sort of special power?

You don't HAVE to be in Boston (if your profile is correct). I am sure that you can come up with a lot of better places to be
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:59 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
So not wanting to pay for someone else's contraception is somehow a "war on women's health"? So can I assume you are engaging in a war against personal responsibility?

Ahhh, but are you ready to pay the taxes for more schools, more infrastructure ,parks, and even welfare for those kids?

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 26):
Trust me, throw it out the window. This is breaking all of the rules in a fascinating, but frightening, way . I cannot explain it, i cannot make sense of it.

It is easy to make sense of when you realize that part of the GOP's success has been in it's ability to motivate a certain segment of it's base to rally against the Government's intrusion into their lives, while also using religion and the 2nd amendment as a major whipping point. There are portions of the GOP that are truly fiscally conservative, and they want the government ot take a step out of some of the programs it is currently mired in. However the problem becomes that fiscally the GOP can't abandon major social programs such as Social Security, Governemnt Pensions, and Medicare without inciting unrest amongst the elderly member. Defense can't be cut as it is deemed a pillar of the constitution.

So with that left, the GOP has recently rattled it's saber about the national debt, which is high due in no small part to the above programs. The tea Party got all excited about this in 2010, and now they have been hijacked by the same old social conservatives who somehow equate governemnt intrusion in personal decisions with less government intrusion and spending.

So now you have the base, who really just want someone to stay the course, and "try" to reign in spending or improve the economy. Then you have the activists who want a Christian social conservative who promises to do better on spending then he did as a Senator.

No one is excited for Romney because it just seems inevitable. He is the rich guy with lots of backing ( kinda like George W.) but he doesn't quite have the charisma and good feel (Christian) that most of the GOP wants.

The GOP old guard is winning out, and Mitt Romney will seal the deal by May, but I expect that with the rightward march he has had to make to get the nomination, he will stand very little chance of getting elected. Especially with the Social Conservatives make sure a Good strong Christian with stronger social moral convictions is placed on the ticket with Romney.
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Rara
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:10 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):

Honestly, Europeans don't know sh*t about America (they are just as ignorant about America as they believe America is about the world - I guess that is what happens when you only source of information is Daily Show re-runs), so somehow changing a warped vision deturped by a biased media to another warped vision (only pinker) does not count as success in my book.

I've lived in America, Europe and Asia for longer periods of time and I can confirm that your assessment is totally wrong. Of course Europeans aren't totally knowledgeable about the United States - after all, it's a far-away country that many people will never go to. Still, Europeans know a lot more and care a lot more about America than vice versa.

Besides, what does it matter? Obama's election has vastly improved the United States' image - that's a fact, whether it's by informed opinion or "biased media" or mere sentiment or whatever. From a foreign viewpoint, this guy is the best thing that happened to America probably since JFK.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:23 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
So can I assume you are engaging in a war against personal responsibility?

Like the long-term hetrosexual couples who know they can not afford to raise children right now, but can not afford health care either? Why is it when women want to take personal responsibility, they are sluts?

I don't think anyone is "excited" about any of the right-wing candidates. I think they are all pandering to the lowest common denominator so they can stay relevant. When push comes to shove and one of these right-wing candidates becomes the nominee and keeps making all his speeches from a teleprompter, I wonder what the excuse will be....

Let's not forget how Bush II did that. And McCain. And Palin. And Romney. And Santorum. And Gingrich.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:20 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
So can I assume you are engaging in a war against personal responsibility?

Forget any of that, it's a war on common sense. "Paying" for contraception yields returns like no other--fewer abortions, lower crime, less welfare, and on and on--all things that Republicans should want to reduce, never mind Democrats. I don't understand why there's such opposition to something that has been proven over and over to yield huge benefits compared to the cost.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:36 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
She is a radical left-wing activist, and has always been, t

Why, because she did not make an apperance on FOX News but went on CNN and MSNBC.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
Now if you could trust doctors to keep their professions separate from their ideologies perhaps you could have insurance cover contraceptives if the person needs them for medical reasons, but since you cannot (plus, I heard those drug reps are really flirty and give away free trips to "congresses" in the Caribbean) then I guess there needs to be some sort of control by the payer. As they say, "this is why we can't have nice things".

You obviously don't have a good retort, Pyrex. It is right wingers that have that have the biggest problems with doctors and ideologies. It is the right in this country that has allowed for pharmacies to not dispense certain pills if they did not want to. It is the right that has policies like the mandatory vaginal probe that initially was required before the VA governor changed his mind thanks people who object. It is right wingers that run the insurance company like the one that dropped this lady's policy that is making ideology a priority. Do some real research before you lecture me on doctors and ideologies and Rush Limbaugh AM Talk and FOX Nation ain't the place to go for fair and balanced information.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:59 pm

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):

I think the last 4 years are proof enough that voting for someone just because they are somehow cool, or hip, or charismatic, or good at reading from a teleprompter can have catastrophic results.

Catastrophe? I haven't noticed any catastrophies since the inauguration. Just before the inauguration there were a number of them.

Quoting casinterest (Reply 33):
Ahhh, but are you ready to pay the taxes for more schools, more infrastructure ,parks, and even welfare for those kids?

Oh no no no no. See, the pro-life people feel that the parents should be responsible. So what if they aren't? Well, then the kids, by extension, should suffer because their parents are idiots. Let 'em starve to death.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:03 am

I'll vote for Mitt because I think he'll be far better than Obama. If he had stuck to the principles he espoused as governor, maybe I'd be a little more excited. But to tell you the truth, I don't know where he stands on much of anything.

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
I am excited about him, believe it or not. But then again, I am a moderate Republican who is fiscally conservative. I am in no way a religious conservative.

Is he still socially liberal these days?

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
If this was 1988, Romney, like Bush senior, would win. However, it is now 2012. Decades of illegal immigration, legal immigration, and a general left shift amongst the young and college-educated, have changed the electorate markedly. Read Ruy Texeira's books for more on the emerging democratic majority and how it's here to stay.

Funnily enough, I'd bet that many young people today would respond well to a limited government. The only problem is that Republicans get the same amount of press for nutty social policies.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:17 am

Quoting aa757first (Reply 39):
But to tell you the truth, I don't know where he stands on much of anything.

So how do you know that he will be better than Obama?
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:29 am

As a centrist Romney can win my vote based on his national loyalty. Is he loyal to the USA or to Israel? If the answer is USA, he gets my vote. He can't be too Christian Right because those people won't talk to him. So that rounds him out as a nice candidate.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:06 am

Quoting mt99 (Reply 40):
So how do you know that he will be better than Obama?

Sorry, I meant on social issues.
 
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:48 am

Note to conservatives, Romney has those Reagan characteristics you should love:
1. Phony factor
2. Art of BS taken to new highs
3. Ties with the GOP elite class
4. A Morman (big Love in the Oval office)
5. Over the top folksy mixed with elite Northeast BS.
6. Has the best chance to beat the POTUS.
7. HIs wife has that wholesome wealthy country club look that Republicans love and desire. (Maybe Mittens if he gets elected will take on multiple concubines and make the White House one Big Love country club and can promote and start that Eugenics and American Taliban leadership.
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
oldeuropean
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:56 am

As long as he feels that "the trees are the right height", the Republicans have to live (and later lose) with him and the rest of the world, who is after all interested in this subject, is still yawning.  

The important thing is, that you never elect a christian fundamentalist like Santorum or another lunatic from the Tea Party. Such a president even would let Dubya look like a wise man.

[Edited 2012-03-21 01:12:58]
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StarAC17
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:09 am

Quoting aa757first (Reply 39):
I'll vote for Mitt because I think he'll be far better than Obama. If he had stuck to the principles he espoused as governor, maybe I'd be a little more excited.

Well if he did that he would basically be the same as Obama on many issues. Remember Obamacare is basically a copy of what Romney put into place as governor. If his had been a clusterf*ck then he could have said it was a mistake but as far as a I know Massachusetts has the best health care statistics in the nation.

It will be a choice with two general centrists one black and one white, it will be a toss up I'm betting as of how things are now.

Quoting aa757first (Reply 39):
But to tell you the truth, I don't know where he stands on much of anything.

That pandering will hurt him, in this age of 24 hour news and youtube anyone can find out every single flip-flop that he has made.
Also there is no way he is winning any election against Obama if he has to go farther right that Santorum to win the nomination and still be able to carry the middle because he will get called on it and have to defend himself.

Quoting aa757first (Reply 39):
Is he still socially liberal these days?

Who knows, would it pass anyone's scope of though if he said tomorrow that women cannot choose their sexual partners, and that sex for pleasure is punishable by death.   
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oldeuropean
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:27 pm

Wer nichts weiss muss alles glauben
 
tommy767
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:30 pm

Excited about Romney? No. Is he a better candidate than W Bush or Obama? Yes.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 2):
However I'd happily take President Romney with strong business and economic acumen over another 4 years under the great socialist Obama.

Easily.

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
It is a shame that such a hard working, competent, genial man is being treated to such a hard slog to get to the nomination. Sure, he isn't cool or witty or hip to modern music or other cultural things

Yeah you can thank the librun media for showing how hip and cool Obama was. By the end of the 2008 campaign the media was saying the most ridiculous stuff to portray McCain as out of touch: doesn't know how many houses he owns, can't lift his arms over his head. Meanwhile Obama gives a 5th rate MLK inspired speech and all the young kids go wild.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
If I had a choice, I'd prefer someone like McCain again if age and history was not an issue.

Had McCain had a bit more capital in 2000, I think he would have won.

Quoting mt99 (Reply 15):
Again - the "youth" grew up under Bush and under No Child Left Behind and not under Obama...

Well that "youth" isn't really old enough to vote yet. Most people in my age group grew up under Clinton and were inspired by Clinton's politics to which many refer as "the good old days." Now Clinton was a great president but there were some things we often forget about which weren't so great (weak stance on terrorism for instance.)

It will be interesting in about 5-10 years when the kids who were in grade school under Bush and middle school/high school under Obama start to vote. Perhaps they won't be as liberal as my age group.

And for the record, "No Child Left Behind" was a horrible policy.

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 17):
Although I reckon he has lost the vote of all sex loving women which is about half the electorate.

I think I saw a poll the other day that said Santorum had more support from women in a few of the states that he won over Romzo. I thought that was pretty shocking.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 25):
Young people have always been leftists. Young people have always done other really stupid stuff too, like smoke because they think it's cool, or drive metal studs through their skulls. For most people it takes experience and wisdom to realize that utopia is just that, utopic. It is only very rare people that are more enlightened than that.

Winston Churchill had it right: "Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains."

They will likely grow out of it, just like many of the Baby Boomers grew out of their Hippy phase.
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:50 pm

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 47):
Well that "youth" isn't really old enough to vote yet.

I think that they old enough:

1-Someone turning 18 this year would have spent years 10-14 under Bush (middle school?) - Obama High school

2-Someone turning 25 this year would have spent years 13-21 under Bush (middle + high school?)

3-Someone turning 30 this year would have spent years 18-26 under Bush (college?)

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 47):
It will be interesting in about 5-10 years when the kids who were in grade school under Bush and middle school/high school under Obama start to vote.

Voting starts at 18 - you know,.. That puts them in Group 1 above.

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 47):
. Perhaps they won't be as liberal as my age group.

.

As far as "liberalness" goes - can you really mark a difference between Groups 1,2 and 3 above?
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RE: Are Any Conservatives Exited About Mitt Romney?

Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:57 pm

Quoting texdravid (Reply 6):
What Romney offers is a steady hand that is disciplined to work hard, look at every issue with an executive's bottom line, and not antagonize people with his cultural rhetoric.

Romney avoids discussion of cultural issues because he is so out of touch with mainstream American culture.

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 16):
Not only is BHO a Muslim, communist, fascist he is a charlatan too.

Credibility => 0.

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 19):
But the liberal pervasion of the public education is no myth

I was publicly educated from kindergarten to bachelor's degree, and I didn't run into the rabid liberals you seem to be so sure exist. I was in college during the Reagan years, and college Republican groups were far more active than Democat ones, yet they stuck to the issues and didn't make up nonsense about how they were being brainwashed by liberals.

How about you? Did you actually experience a public education, or do you get your stuff from Rush and FOX?

Do you think college students are mindless dolts that will accept political views without any scrutiny?

In my experience, it's the exact opposite.

Quoting AvObserver (Reply 19):
Their embrace of the decidely Leftist Occupy Movement shows the extent of the liberal stranglehold on education; it's something all reasonable Americans should be greatly concerned about.

All reasonable Americans should be greatly concerned about growing income disparity and should be greatly concerned that Romney's record and personal practices show he's in favor of the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
I am sure there are a few people who might need contraceptives for medical reasons but for the vast, vast, vast majority that is not the case.

The same can be said for Viagra, it's mostly being provided so that older men can have recreational sex.

Quoting casinterest (Reply 33):
The GOP old guard is winning out, and Mitt Romney will seal the deal by May, but I expect that with the rightward march he has had to make to get the nomination, he will stand very little chance of getting elected. Especially with the Social Conservatives make sure a Good strong Christian with stronger social moral convictions is placed on the ticket with Romney.

The election will be hard fought. Obama's poll numbers are low. There should be increased GOP unity after they have sorted out their ticket. I doubt Romney will take on a strong social conservative, because it's clear that those on the right will vote for him in any case, and he'll need to appeal to the independents to win. On the other hand, some pretty amazing things have happened in this campaign. If he fails to win election because he caves to the hard right wing, he deserves to lose.

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 47):
It will be interesting in about 5-10 years when the kids who were in grade school under Bush and middle school/high school under Obama start to vote. Perhaps they won't be as liberal as my age group.

On the other hand, most of them know friends who were cannon fodder for the neo-cons, and as above, are OWS supporters.
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