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Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:28 pm

I was driving about my fair city yesterday and saw a row of signs put up along the road by a Romney supporter.

They had Romney's slogan on them: "Believe in America".

And that set me to thinking about the slogan itself and why it was chosen and if it'd be effective or not.

To me, it's the usual baloney right wing claim to own patriotism. We're the ones that believe in America, everyone else is some sort of communist/socialist/whatever. I suppose that appeals to those who are already on board, but what about the swing voter?

Also, to me, it's an offensive statement (as opposed to defensive) saying that the current government doesn't believe in America, but of course the right wing does.

And to me it's not that effective. Romney's most effective weapon is the economy, and this slogan misses that mark. The only way I interpret "believe in America" economically would be to go back to Reagan era trickle down economics which is not what most people want to do.

IMHO Romney's slogan would be more effective if it directly targeted job creation.

Comments?
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Mir
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:48 pm

Quoting Revelation (Thread starter):
IMHO Romney's slogan would be more effective if it directly targeted job creation.

There were the "Obama Isn't Working" ads that were popping up on the internet (including on this site) a while ago. Those were pretty well done, I have to admit.

But my favorite slogan is this one:



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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:55 pm

Quoting Revelation (Thread starter):
They had Romney's slogan on them: "Believe in America".

It's a very dunb slogan. Especially for someone who belives in offshoring and keeps offshore bank accounts.
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:16 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 1):
There were the "Obama Isn't Working" ads that were popping up on the internet (including on this site) a while ago. Those were pretty well done, I have to admit.

Yes, I agree that would be more effective, but do to AdBlock etc I have not seen them.
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Superfly
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:37 pm

Romney's slogan sure as hell beat this one;






...and this is officially sanctioned by the Obama 2012 campaign!   
It's an admission that he couldn't deliver in his 3.5 years in office.

"Believe in America" is a great slogan for these times. Given the constant America-bashing by Obama and his supporters, it's a fitting slogan. Just listen to the 'occupy Wall Street' crowd which Obama supports that are now begging for socialism. It's as if Obama and his supporters have given up on America. After all, Obama wants to 'fundamentally transform the United States of America' his words not mine.

Quoting casinterest (Reply 2):
keeps offshore bank accounts.


If that income was generated in another country, he has every right to do so. I have a bank account here in Thailand. Does that mean I hate my country?
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:06 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
It's an admission that he couldn't deliver in his 3.5 years in office.

A president can't snap his fingers and get things his way.

As the other thread points out, Obama does what executive powers allow and the other side howls.

Clearly Congress is happy to do nothing these days.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Given the constant America-bashing by Obama and his supporters

So pointing out areas we could do better in is bashing?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Just listen to the 'occupy Wall Street' crowd which Obama supports that are now begging for socialism.

From what I hear, they want middle class opportunities like were available in decades past. I guess that means the US was socialist in decades past?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
It's as if Obama and his supporters have given up on America.

It's as if Romney and his supporters have given up on the middle class.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
If that income was generated in another country, he has every right to do so. I have a bank account here in Thailand. Does that mean I hate my country?

Romney earned a lot of money by offshoring US labor. Your case, in which you have offshored yourself, is quite different.

Besides, why all this surity about who loves the US and who doesn't?

Why is it hating the US to be in favor of US labor, wanting Americans to have good access to health care, preventing US companies from going under and preventing them from taking down the economy with them?

We could be just as pragmatic as the German politicians are being and lead the regional economy down the drain and take most of the world's ecomomy with it, if you prefer.

Why is it loving America to take away personal liberties and misleading Americans into sending our troops to fight the wrong war?
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fr8mech
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:20 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):

A president can't snap his fingers and get things his way.

“Look, I'm at the start of my administration. One nice thing about the situation I find myself in is that I will be held accountable. You know, I've got four years,” Obama told The Today Show’s Matt Lauer on February 1, 2009.

“A year from now I think people are going to see that we're starting to make some progress," said Obama. "But there's still going to be some pain out there. If I don't have this done in three years, then there's going to be a one-term proposition.”

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/flas...oposition-if-economy-doesnt-turn-3

He refuses to be held accountable. He is still blaming President Bush.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
From what I hear, they want middle class opportunities like were available in decades past. I guess that means the US was socialist in decades past?

They want those 'opportunities' through handouts from the government.

I'm not a fan of political slogans. But, as 'Hope and Change' proved, they work. Take some time and review Mr. Romney's speeches and counterpoint those with President Obama's speeches. Romney's speeches reflect a belief that America can (and is) an exceptional nation. Obama's speeches don't.

'Forward' indeed.
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Superfly
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:48 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
A president can't snap his fingers and get things his way.

Clearly Congress is happy to do nothing these days.

Wrong. Obama had the luxury of an almost 2/3rds majority of Congress and veto-proof Senate. No President since LBJ had that much power and Obama DID get a lot of laws passed. None of which helped the economy.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
From what I hear, they want middle class opportunities like were available in decades past.

No they do not.
Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
It's as if Romney and his supporters have given up on the middle class.

Most of his support comes from middle-class and lower-class Americans.



Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
Romney earned a lot of money by offshoring US labor.

Just like Obama's jobs czar Jefferey Immelt of General Electric which paid ZERO taxes.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
Besides, why all this surity about who loves the US and who doesn't?

That was your assumption based on Romney's campaign slogan.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
wanting Americans to have good access to health care

I want that too. I wouldn't be covered under the 2700+ page Obamacare but I sure as hell would have the IRS coming after me if I didn't purchase it. That could end up with a prison sentence.
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EricR
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:55 pm

Oh......I thought Obama was running on the slogan of "The private sector is doing fine"

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
He refuses to be held accountable. He is still blaming President Bush.

        

Never have I seen a president blame so many other people for his own failures. His lack of leadership and inability to unite people for the sake of progress are his biggest downfalls. He was more than willing to take the role of president knowing the difficult issues he was about ready to face, but now wants to blame everyone else.

My question is why would anyone want to vote for him again when we know he is incapable of uniting parties for the benefit of getting main pieces of legislation passed through congress?
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:33 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Most of his support comes from middle-class and lower-class Americans.

If you consider Sheldon Adelson, Trump and the Koch Bros. the middle class who are bankrolling his campaign.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
America-bashing by Obama and his supporters,

You know that old conservative canard does not work and is not true I actually watch his stumps.

Obama is a very imperfect but I trust him over a guy who flip flops at every opportunity other than his taxation of the middle class and big government policies on his social views.
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:19 pm

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
He is still blaming President Bush.

Why shouldn't he? Bush dug us an incredibly deep hole to get ourselves out of.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Obama had the luxury of an almost 2/3rds majority of Congress and veto-proof Senate.

Veto-proof does not mean super-majority proof.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Obama DID get a lot of laws passed. None of which helped the economy.

Tell that to anyone working in the banking and auto sectors.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
They want those 'opportunities' through handouts from the government.

I got government backed student loans and government grants back in the "socialist" Reagan era that pretty much covered my tuition, room and board. Try doing that now.

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 9):
Obama is a very imperfect but I trust him over a guy who flip flops at every opportunity other than his taxation of the middle class and big government policies on his social views.

  

We still don't know if Romney would or would not have bailed out the banks or if he's for or against health care mandates.
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:37 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
My question is why would anyone want to vote for him again when we know he is incapable of uniting parties for the benefit of getting main pieces of legislation passed through congress?

Because the alternative is just as bad if not worse. Do you really think after all the venom that comes out of this election that Romney will be able to unite both parties...particularly when many in his own party don't really trust/like him?

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
Romney's speeches reflect a belief that America can (and is) an exceptional nation.

But his actual behavior speaks otherwise. America wasn't made exception by intellectually-lazy investors whose beliefs flip-flop from year to year. It was made great by people sacrificed and triumphed in the face of adversity. That's not Mitt Romney. Even Mitt Romney is embarrassed of his record which is why he rarely likes to talk about his time as governor. Why doesn't he brag more about his "success" as governor of Massachusetts?
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sat Jun 16, 2012 11:46 pm

I personally think Romney could have done better than Believe in America. While meaningful it doesn't have much impact. Though Obama's not going to be able to rely on Hope and Change this time around which lowers the stakes in the sloganeering. Having a quick look at his website Obama doesn't have a slogan prominently displayed anywhere while Romney does. Its interesting comparing the two websites.

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 9):
If you consider Sheldon Adelson, Trump and the Koch Bros. the middle class who are bankrolling his campaign.

As opposed to the Sarah Jessica Parker, George Clooney, Oprah and Anna Wintour's of the world bankrolling Obama's campaign? I'm sure they're having to cutback to throw Obama what most people earn in a lifetime. Lets face it joe democrat and bill republican don't have much impact on the fundraising for either campaign.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Why doesn't he brag more about his "success" as governor of Massachusetts?

Why doesn't Obama brag more about his success doing...anything. Southside of Chicago sure looked nice and organised when I went there.
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:27 am

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
Bush dug us an incredibly deep hole to get ourselves out of.


Very true. Therefore we should have elected a true leader with balls to pull us out of that mess. Not some pretty boy that looks good on camera but no solutions or substances.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
Veto-proof does not mean super-majority proof.


Oh come on dude. Bush had a much smaller majority to dig the "incredibly deep hole".

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
Tell that to anyone working in the banking and auto sectors.


Not so fast. Those bailouts was already in the pipeline under the final months of Dubya & co.

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 12):
As opposed to the Sarah Jessica Parker, George Clooney, Oprah and Anna Wintour's of the world bankrolling Obama's campaign? I'm sure they're having to cutback to throw Obama what most people earn in a lifetime. Lets face it joe democrat and bill republican don't have much impact on the fundraising for either campaign.


  
It really puzzles me as to why some people still think that it's the poor & working class that's funding Obama.
Obama is funded by the wealthiest 1%.

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 12):
Why doesn't Obama brag more about his success doing...anything.


He can't. He hasn't accomplished anything.

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 12):
Southside of Chicago sure looked nice and organised when I went there.


           

Everyone I know that lives there has bars on their windows for a reason.
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fr8mech
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:21 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
I got government backed student loans and government grants back in the "socialist" Reagan era that pretty much covered my tuition, room and board. Try doing that now.

I did also. But, I paid back my (and my wife's) loans and received the loans and grants on the sole condition that I go to school. Can the current crop of teat-suckers say the same?

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
Veto-proof does not mean super-majority proof.

But, he had that also, didn't he? Let's recall, that until the 'Lion of the Senate' died he did hold a filibuster proof senate. He got all his major legislation passed, except 'Cap & Trade' and yet the economy stll flounders.

Forward, indeed.

That should be Romney's slogan: "Forward, indeed?"

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
"But there's still going to be some pain out there. If I don't have this done in three years, then there's going to be a one-term proposition.”

Prophetic.
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:35 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Wrong. Obama had the luxury of an almost 2/3rds majority of Congress and veto-proof Senate.

You have said this many times, and it has never been true.

Look at your facts. Senator Franken wasn't sworn in until July of 2009 because Norm Coleman refused to accept that he had been defeated, and took to the Courts to overturn the voters.

Meanwhile, Ted Kennedy was unable to vote from March of 2009 until his death.

It is wholly untrue, Superfly, that Obama had a filibuster-proof majority. I wish you would stop perpetuating this myth.
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:45 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Given the constant America-bashing by Obama and his supporters

You're making things up again. Calling for change, or pointing out a country's faults is not tantamount to "America-bashing." There is a difference, and a lot of people in this country need to learn what that difference is.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Just listen to the 'occupy Wall Street' crowd which Obama supports that are now begging for socialism.

No they're not. Please provide a legitimate source indicating that they are (i.e. not a heavily edited YouTube video).

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
It's as if Obama and his supporters have given up on America.

No they haven't.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
After all, Obama wants to 'fundamentally transform the United States of America' his words not mine.

And wanting to fundamentally transform the US means that he has given up on America? Please explain.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
They want those 'opportunities' through handouts from the government.

No they don't.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
No they do not.

Again, please provide a legitimate source indicating otherwise.

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 9):
You know that old conservative canard does not work and is not true I actually watch his stumps.

Exactly. It's ridiculous, and no one falls for it.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Because the alternative is just as bad if not worse. Do you really think after all the venom that comes out of this election that Romney will be able to unite both parties...particularly when many in his own party don't really trust/like him?

Precisely. Things aren't going to get better if Romney is elected.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
Very true. Therefore we should have elected a true leader with balls to pull us out of that mess. Not some pretty boy that looks good on camera but no solutions or substances.

Then why did you vote for him? Do you think anyone could have done much better given the mess the previous administration put us in? These things don't happen overnight. It really does take quite a while to bring about recovery.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
Not so fast. Those bailouts was already in the pipeline under the final months of Dubya & co.

So the transformation to Republican really is complete.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
It really puzzles me as to why some people still think that it's the poor & working class that's funding Obama.
Obama is funded by the wealthiest 1%.

As are all politicians today (especially those running for President). There is not a single President in recent memory who wasn't bankrolled by the wealthiest few. It's an extremely unfortunately reality that needs to be dealt with. You know the same is true for Romney, and that the same was true for Bush, Kerry, McCain, Clinton, Gore, etc., etc.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
He can't. He hasn't accomplished anything.

You know that's not true. You really need to do research outside of heavily edited YouTube videos and stop making up lies.
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fr8mech
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:58 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 16):
You know that's not true. You really need to do research outside of heavily edited YouTube videos and stop making up lies.

You're right, he's accomplished plenty.

A job destroying health care bill
A stimulus package that stimulated the public unions
A financial sector package that will make it harder for business to do business
Sky-rocketing energy prices because of his policies
His policies have arrested any recovery from the recession

Oh, yeah, his orders killed three pirates and Osama bin Laden.   
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FlyPNS1
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:49 pm

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
A job destroying health care bill

The private sector has created millions of jobs since the health care bill was signed. Not enough jobs, but it certainly hasn't destroyed jobs.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
Sky-rocketing energy prices because of his policies

Energy prices were skyrocketing before Obama came to office. We had an oil-man in the White House before and he wasn't able to exert much force on energy prices either.
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:08 pm

Nicolas Sarkozy's 2012 slogan : La France forte => The strong France, very similar to Romney's slogan
François Hollande's slogan : Le changement, c'est maintenant => Change is now, clearly inspired by Obama

I just found that other one, Édouard Balladur's slogan in 1995, Sarkozy was his spokesman for the campaign : Croire en la France => Believe in France, the exact same slogan ! Balladur didn't even make it to the second round in the election...
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fr8mech
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:30 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 20):
I just found that other one, Édouard Balladur's slogan in 1995, Sarkozy was his spokesman for the campaign : Croire en la France => Believe in France, the exact same slogan ! Balladur didn't even make it to the second round in the election...


I know this is going to start a flame war, but I just can't help myself:

European nations, in general have been emasculated when it comes to patriotism. Your politicians have been telling you that you are the same as everybody else. That no one nation is superior to another. In fact, that kind of talk is considered dangerous. So, you're surprised that a slogan that should inspire patriotism doesn't do well?

Again, I don't put a whole lot of stock in slogans, but, many people (maybe, too many) do.

"Believe in America", could be better.

"Forward", to what?
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Aesma
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:59 pm

Well, believing in your country is not what I would call patriotism. But I agree that you wouldn't see people here saying stuff like "we're exceptional" or superior, that's just in bad taste, especially when blatantly not true, for any country.
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Mir
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:17 pm

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Even Mitt Romney is embarrassed of his record which is why he rarely likes to talk about his time as governor. Why doesn't he brag more about his "success" as governor of Massachusetts?

Obama is attacking him on his record now, apparently. I was in West Virginia and Ohio over the past two days, and in both places there were TV ads against Romney's record as governor in Massachusetts.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
His policies have arrested any recovery from the recession

That's speculation. We have no idea what would have happened had someone else been in charge.

-Mir
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Aesma
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:28 pm

Well, you could look at countries where right wing solutions have been tried, like the UK.
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fr8mech
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:44 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 22):
Well, believing in your country is not what I would call patriotism. But I agree that you wouldn't see people here saying stuff like "we're exceptional" or superior, that's just in bad taste, especially when blatantly not true, for any country.


And there, you prove my point. How can a country's people do exceptional things, if those people don't believe that they or their nation isn't exceptional? It's a state of mind.

I guess that's why slogans may work, for some. They elicit a reaction in the mind.

"Believe in America": we can do this

"Hope and Change": something is wrong and it needs to change

"Forward": I don't know, I still don't get that one
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:40 pm

Quoting Revelation (Thread starter):
Romney's most effective weapon is the economy

Until you start looking at his performance as Governor. 47th in the nation when it comes to building jobs. You really want to vote for someone from the bottom of the barrel?

Quoting casinterest (Reply 2):
Especially for someone who belives in offshoring and keeps offshore bank accounts.

Reality is that money is more important to Willard than the nation's well being is. He'll hide all he can and is going to have some major issues when it is time to disclose his financial statements for the election.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
It's an admission that he couldn't deliver in his 3.5 years in office.

He delivered on stopping the economic free fall.

He delivered on finding OBL & killing him

He delivered on the first step in health care reform.

He delivered on ending the Ego War in Iraq and is getting us out of Afghanistan

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
I have a bank account here in Thailand. Does that mean I hate my country?

Probably means you are living and working there. Unless you are in Willard's economic group and pulled in $20+ Million a year for at least the last two years.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
It's as if Romney and his supporters have given up on the middle class.

Who really believes that they ever gave a shit about them?

Quoting Revelation (Reply 5):
Why is it hating the US to be in favor of US labor, wanting Americans to have good access to health care, preventing US companies from going under and preventing them from taking down the economy with them?

Because in the GOP's eyes you are only supposed to love money and expanding more ways to make more money, regardless of the damage it does to the nation.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
He refuses to be held accountable. He is still blaming President Bush.

And you believe that Bush & Cheney should now be forgives for the horrible messes they put this country in?

You believe that we should forget the WMD propaganda that led us into a totally unnecessary war? But made a lot of money for Halliburton?

Or maybe we should forget the total incompetence W & Pals had when it came to the economy.

Reality is that Bush/Cheney drove us so deep into an economic mess (while they & their friends made massive fortunes) that it is going to take generations to fully recover. And that assumes that we will eventually recover.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
Romney's speeches reflect a belief that America can (and is) an exceptional nation.

There are a lot of exceptional nations in this world. To try to say that the US is the only exceptional nation is to look down your nose at other countries, showing your ignorance.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Obama had the luxury of an almost 2/3rds majority of Congress and veto-proof Senate.

The issue with the Democrats in the senate is the wide range of the political spectrum they represent. Unlike the GOP, who has effectively kicked out the moderates in their party, the Democrats don't always march in lock step, fearful of their expulsion if they don't jump when ordered to.

But, hey, you already knew that.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
No they do not.

That is pretty much a blanket statement - just like southern rednecks make about black folks.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
I wouldn't be covered under the 2700+ page Obamacare but I sure as hell would have the IRS coming after me if I didn't purchase it. That could end up with a prison sentence.

You really don't have to worry about US health insurance if you are living overseas. If you come back for a visit, however, I would strongly recommend you get traveler's health insurance for the trip.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
Oh......I thought Obama was running on the slogan of "The private sector is doing fine"

GM is making record profits as are many other companies. The CEO of JPMorgan just got to have his a$$ kissed by a bunch of GOP Senators after a multi-billion screw up.

The private sector is clearly doing well, especially when compared to W's last year in office.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
Never have I seen a president blame so many other people for his own failures.

And never in our lifetimes has a President assumed office with such a massive economic crisis dragging the country down.

You can forget the state of the nation that W passed on, but I can't.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
His lack of leadership and inability to unite people for the sake of progress are his biggest downfalls.

Leadership is a pretty odd word at times. I can remember W being priced for his "leadership", even after it was clear that the WMD BS was just that, BS propaganda. Even after the KIA's in Iraq exceeded the KIAs from 9/11. Even after it was clear that we were running a war on the credit card, ensuring future economic misery.

When I was in the military I wanted outstanding leadership because I had to obey their orders. And I was fortunate in that I had outstanding Commanding Officers.

When I went back to civilian life my preference for a President was someone who could deliver decisions that would improve the lives of Americans. Politics was less important than performance. Unfortunately these days we seem to be more concerned with politics than with serving. I therefore don't see "uniting the people" as a possibility in the future. The levels of political hate are simply too great, and will get greater as more wealth buys into various politicians.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 10):
We still don't know if Romney would or would not have bailed out the banks or if he's for or against health care mandates.

Romney probably would have given the job of saving the banks to Bain & Co - and kept his profit sharing relationship with them secret.

As for the health care mandate - he signed a law creating that mandate when he was Governor. He was FOR the mandate until Obama accepted it - now he is against what he was for. Surprised?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
Therefore we should have elected a true leader with balls to pull us out of that mess

We've had "leaders" with balls - which is why we invaded Iraq. Balls and dreams of oil.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 13):
Not some pretty boy that looks good on camera but no solutions or substances.

that sounds like Romney to me. Pretty boy and no real details of what he would do.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 14):
Can the current crop of teat-suckers say the same?

The difference is that these days the teat suckers are the universities who are charging massive fees & tuition, leaving students with a lifetime of debt, and the financial sector making very big profits off of servicing those student loans.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 14):
yet the economy stll flounders.

We are no where close to the disaster of the last W years when we were REALLY floundering. Look at corporate profits and the reality that jobs are being created every month. Compare that to 750,000 job losses a month under Buh & Cheney.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
A job destroying health care bill

The real job destroying health care issue is the obnoxious annual increases from the health insurance companies. Consider employers who don't have that nanny care burden on their budgeting or P&L. Like every employer in Australia. If you get employer financed nanny care you are enjoying that benefit that is holding down employment.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
A stimulus package that stimulated the public unions

I always thought it was really queer that conservatives hate teachers, police and firemen so much. Even in a time when Exxon (NOT a liberal organization) is pushing for improving education in this country - especially in the areas of math & sciences.

Look for education especially to deteriorate under the GOP grip. But the top tax rate will be cut, won't it.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
A financial sector package that will make it harder for business to do business

So why are the banks doing so well?

Why has the market recovered from the Bush/Cheney Fall to the 7000 range?

And why is the financial sector so against regulations that clean up the industry a bit? Are you supporting the return to the games that were paid and took us to a brink? Really?

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
Sky-rocketing energy prices because of his policies

We had two oilmen in the White House and what did they deliver? Besides the invasion of an oil country I can't see any thing that would have helped keep prices down. Now take a timeline from the discovery of a field to that product hitting the market. Personally I don't see the GOP making any efforts to take care of the middle class in this area. The Koch Brothers certainly are not going to invest in politicians that cut their profits, or tries to reign in operations.

The GOP has already given production of solar energy products to China. Maybe that will allow a large import of products that can lower costs.

Other companies & countries have been successful in using natural gas in economically effective ways. Classic examples are the taxis in Sydney & Melbourne where Ford & GM cars run on dual fuels, holding down their operational costs. You, unfortunately, will never see the GOP pushing for dual fuels - unless the oil companies tell them to.

Your "Sky-rocketing energy prices" is the result of both Congress and the White House. And, of course, the political contributions from the oil industry.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 18):
His policies have arrested any recovery from the recession

Look at the DOW, the continual growth in jobs, etc.

The biggest factor I have seen was the GOP farce on increasing the debt limit. That little boy FUBAR caused sufficient deterioration in the confidence in the government to have one rating company actually cut the nation's credit rating.

Until the GOP in the House man up and take care of business instead of playing politics we will continue to have limited growth, but it will continue to be growth under Obama - far better than what the oilmen in the WHite House managed.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 24):
"Believe in America": we can do this

Actually the slogan appears to take attention away from Willard, and his time at Bain & was governor. It simply focuses on believing in the country and we can do that with Obama, or any other Democrat.

The closer we get to the Election the more we will learn about Willard. Then we can determine how much we can believe in him.
 
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:06 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 24):
How can a country's people do exceptional things, if those people don't believe that they or their nation isn't exceptional? It's a state of mind.

I doubt you can do exceptional things starting with a big ego.
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Revelation
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Fri Jun 22, 2012 1:20 pm

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 20):
European nations, in general have been emasculated when it comes to patriotism. Your politicians have been telling you that you are the same as everybody else. That no one nation is superior to another. In fact, that kind of talk is considered dangerous. So, you're surprised that a slogan that should inspire patriotism doesn't do well?

So are you suggesting a return to Deutschland Uber Alles????

Europe has been there, done that, paid the price, doesn't want to go there again.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 26):
I doubt you can do exceptional things starting with a big ego.

And a closed mind.
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Fri Jun 22, 2012 1:32 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 27):
So are you suggesting a return to Deutschland Uber Alles????

There's a difference between patriotism and nationalism.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 26):
I doubt you can do exceptional things starting with a big ego.

It's not ego, it's a state of mind. A belief that anything is possible.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 27):

And a closed mind.

Whose mind is closed? The individual that thinks he can do anything because he is in an environment that fosters innovation and exceptionalism or the individual who settles for what is given because he is told and taught that is all there is?
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RE: Mitt Romney's Slogan

Fri Jun 22, 2012 6:56 pm

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 28):
There's a difference between patriotism and nationalism.

One definition of nationalism is "excessive patriotism; chauvinism", and I think your statement:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 20):
European nations, in general have been emasculated when it comes to patriotism. Your politicians have been telling you that you are the same as everybody else. That no one nation is superior to another. In fact, that kind of talk is considered dangerous.

falls into that category quite neatly.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 28):
A belief that anything is possible.

How does that equate to "you are the same as everybody else, that no one nation is superior to another"?

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 28):
Whose mind is closed?

I think you are being close minded when you say it's dangerous to not feel that your nation is not better than others, especially when you use words like "emasculated" to describe that condition.

It's also being chauvinistic, egotistic and jingoistic, IMHO.
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