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Aloha717200
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Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:30 pm

You guys might remember back in April, an Australian firm announced its intentions to comission the construction of a Titanic II, which would be a full-scale replica of the original Titanic, save for modifications to comply with modern safety regulations. Several of us were skeptical that this would ever see the light of day, but many hoped it would. Myself included.

Today an update on the status of the project was sent out via email. Since the update isn't available on their website (it was sent out to their mailing list only), I'm going to post it here in its entirety, if the mods don't mind.

Quote:
Media Release

June 19, 2012
GLOBAL SHIP DESIGN FIRM COMMISSIONED TO TITANIC II PROJECT

Blue Star Line Chairman, Professor Clive Palmer, today announced one of the world’s leading ship design and marine engineering companies has been commissioned to assist with the Titanic II project.

Finnish-based Deltamarin, which has offices worldwide, will undertake a full review of the Titanic II project to ensure the vessel will be compliant with all current safety and construction regulations, as well as meeting the design criteria laid down by Blue Star Line.

The work carried out by Deltamarin will enable China’s CSC Jinling Shipyard to begin construction of the passenger liner.

Professor Palmer said Blue Star Line had been overwhelmed by the international response to the Titanic II project, which was announced in April this year.

“More than 20,000 people have registered on Blue Star Line’s website expressing an interest in receiving regular updates from us or requesting information on how to secure bookings for Titanic II’s maiden voyage,” Professor Palmer stated.

He reaffirmed the 2016 launch date for the ship and the intention for Titanic II to sail from China to England before her maiden passenger voyage retracing its original journey.

“Titanic II will be a regular feature on the transatlantic route between the UK and USA,” Professor Palmer said.

“This magnificent vessel is being constructed in memory of the heroic people who served on the first ship, as well as the passengers who sadly shared their fate.

“We also want to recognise the artists and artisans whose skill, creativity and dexterity has never been fully recognised because of the ship’s limited service.”

On April 30, 2012, Professor Palmer announced to the world his intention to build and launch Titanic II in conjunction with leading Chinese shipbuilders, CSC Jinling Shipyard.

The announcement came 100 years after the original vessel last sailed.

Professor Palmer said Titanic II would have the same dimensions as its predecessor, with 840 rooms and nine decks. The main changes to the original Titanic would be below the water line including welding, a bulbous bow for greater fuel efficiency, diesel generation and bow thrusters for increased manoeuvrability.

Deltamarin specialise in consulting, design and engineering and project management from small concept development tasks and studies, to complete engineering packages in the marine field. They offer services to the marine and offshore industries worldwide.

They were founded in 1990 by a group of naval architects and engineers, some of whom still work for the company. More than 400 people are currently employed by the group worldwide.

Their major projects include ‘Oasis of the Seas’, a vast cruise vessel launched in 2009 that can carry over 5400 people. Also on Deltamarin’s impressive list of more than 5000 marine developments are ‘Celebrity Solstice’ and ‘Celebrity Equinox’, two of the most ground breaking cruise ship designs in operation today.
 
Superfly
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:42 pm

Great, but this time they better show Kate Winslet's.....well... you know.  
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:44 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 1):
Great, but this time they better show Kate Winslet's.....well... you know.

I bet Kate Winslet avoids this ship like the plague XD Around the anniversary I read a number of stories about how the poor girl can't go anywhere without someone mentioning Titanic to her. So, Mr Fly, your way to Kate's heart is to tell her you hate "My Heart Will Go On"  
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:45 pm

Quoting Aloha717200 (Thread starter):

On April 30, 2012, Professor Palmer announced to the world his intention to build and launch Titanic II in conjunction with leading Chinese shipbuilders, CSC Jinling Shipyard.

This is the problem right here, the Chinese have never built a cruise ship, cruise ships are very very complicated vessels, they are completely different from knocking up a tanker, box ship or dry cargo vessel, (the Chinese are very good at this), even the Koreans haven't ventured into the cruise and ferry market. This vessel needs to be built in Europe.
 
Superfly
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:20 pm

Quoting Aloha717200 (Reply 2):
So, Mr Fly, your way to Kate's heart is to tell her you hate "My Heart Will Go On"

I'm not after her "heart".  
Bring back the Concorde
 
Klaus
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:57 pm

Quoting Aloha717200 (Thread starter):

You guys might remember back in April, an Australian firm announced its intentions to comission the construction of a Titanic II, which would be a full-scale replica of the original Titanic, save for modifications to comply with modern safety regulations.

Spoilsports. If it's not an exact replica, what's the point…?   
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:00 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 5):
Spoilsports. If it's not an exact replica, what's the point…?

you want to sign on as a stoker?
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:06 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 3):
This is the problem right here, the Chinese have never built a cruise ship, cruise ships are very very complicated vessels, they are completely different from knocking up a tanker, box ship or dry cargo vessel, (the Chinese are very good at this), even the Koreans haven't ventured into the cruise and ferry market. This vessel needs to be built in Europe.

I wouldn't underestimate the Chinese. I've been surprised by their capabilities in unfamiliar areas before.

Heck, the Chinese even plan to put a man on the moon in 2016. I bet they can build a cruise ship.
 
Superfly
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:12 pm

Quoting Aloha717200 (Reply 7):
Heck, the Chinese even plan to put a man on the moon in 2016.



Do they plan on bringing that man back?
This ship should be built in Belfast like the original.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 6):
you want to sign on as a stoker?


        
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Aloha717200
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:15 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 8):
This ship should be built in Belfast like the original.

I agree. I'd much rather that. But...since it isn't...my point is that I be the Chinese can do it. Can they do it better? Probably not. But they probably can accomplish the task.
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:26 pm

Quoting Aloha717200 (Reply 7):

I wouldn't underestimate the Chinese. I've been surprised by their capabilities in unfamiliar areas before.

A cruise ship is about the most complicated vessel you can build, the Koreans are better shipbuilders than the Chinese and they haven't had a go so far, STX one of the big players in Korean shipbuilding even bought Aker Yards to get expertise from the Finns, to date they haven't decided to have a go in Korea. One of the biggest problems the Chinese will face is all the specialist suppliers for fit out are all based around the 4 main cruise and ferry yards which are in Europe.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 8):
This ship should be built in Belfast like the original.

That would be nearly impossible, most of the infrastructure required to build a large cruise ship like this hasn't be in place in Belfast for decades.
 
Klaus
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:52 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 6):
you want to sign on as a stoker?

About as likely as I'd book a bunk in steerage! 
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:55 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 1):
Great, but this time they better show Kate Winslet's.....well... you know.
Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
I'm not after her "heart".

I figured she'd be too skinny for you.

I wonder how TITANIC II's cruise speed will compare to the original. Wikipedia states that TITANIC had a maximum speed of 24kt, but cruised at 21kt. This is actually not too far outside the normal range for modern cruise ships (OASIS OF THE SEA can do ~22kt, per Wiki). Later ocean liners moved more quickly. SS UNITED STATES could do 34kt and still holds the Blue Riband for fastest transatlantic crossing.

I also wonder how many screws she will have, whether they will mount them on azipods or use a conventional screw-and-rudder arrangement, and what other modifications below the waterline she will have. Certainly she will have a bulbous bow and bow thrusters, neither of which were available in 1912.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
connies4ever
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:35 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 3):
This is the problem right here, the Chinese have never built a cruise ship, cruise ships are very very complicated vessels, they are completely different from knocking up a tanker, box ship or dry cargo vessel, (the Chinese are very good at this), even the Koreans haven't ventured into the cruise and ferry market. This vessel needs to be built in Europe.

There is a basic flaw in your argument here: Titanic was not a cruise liner, it was an ocean liner. Ocean liners are built to withstand a lot more pounding than cruise liners ever have been. Stronger hulls, stronger superstructures. The QE2, for example, was more than once subject to 60ft waves in the Atlantic, something a cruise liner is not really up to.

Cruise liners built in Finland are generally built for service in the Med or Caribbean. For delivery to the Caribbean, they generally track through the Channel, down the west coast of Europe & Africa, then head west near the Canaries, avoiding most if not all heavy weather.

Quoting Aloha717200 (Reply 7):
Heck, the Chinese even plan to put a man on the moon in 2016. I bet they can build a cruise ship.

Don't bet on the lunar thing happening for at least a decade, if not much longer.
http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Fi...rbiting_China_space_module_999.htm
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:00 am

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 15):
Cruise liners built in Finland are generally built for service in the Med or Caribbean. For delivery to the Caribbean, they generally track through the Channel, down the west coast of Europe & Africa, then head west near the Canaries, avoiding most if not all heavy weather.

They do wind up in the occasional hurricane. I was aboard Legend of the Seas in a storm with 30-foot waves and other than some minor fore-aft jolts felt in the deck, she barely moved. We took more than one wave that washed over the bow and a few that washed up amidships. We even took some water through a sliding side door, but the ship barely moved.

It is true that liners are designed to take higher seas more routinely and have a higher freeboard. They are structurally stronger and use more steel than their cruise ship counterparts. The only true liner in service is QMII, although some might argue that the Holland-America Vista class ships are liners. There is also a cultural difference aboard, with liners tending to have a more mature, sophisticated crowd and cruise ships being based around partying and vacationing.

To put it another way, a liner is a hotel built on top of a hull, while a cruise ship is a hull built around a hotel.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
747400sp
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:08 am

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 3):
This is the problem right here, the Chinese have never built a cruise ship, cruise ships are very very complicated vessels, they are completely different from knocking up a tanker, box ship or dry cargo vessel, (the Chinese are very good at this), even the Koreans haven't ventured into the cruise and ferry market. This vessel needs to be built in Europe.





Or a shipyard based in Japan. I believe, that the two widest ships of Princess Cruises Grand class, the Diamond Princess and the Sapphire Princess, were built in Japan. Also, AIDA first Post Panamax or New Panamax class of ships, (which ever way you want to call it) is being built in Japan, so the Japanese, knows a little something about building cruise ships .  
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:14 am

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 13):
Titanic was not a cruise liner, it was an ocean liner.

Still doesn't matter the Chinese have never built one before, they haven't even built a large ro-pax vessel.

Quoting 747400sp (Reply 15):
Or a shipyard based in Japan. I believe, that the two widest ships of Princess Cruises Grand class, the Diamond Princess and the Sapphire Princess, were built in Japan.

Woops I forgot about Mitsuibishi Heavy Industries, still Japan is not China, building this vessel in China is just asking for trouble.
 
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Aesma
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:52 am

Quoting Aloha717200 (Thread starter):
“We also want to recognise the artists and artisans whose skill, creativity and dexterity has never been fully recognised because of the ship’s limited service.”

I don't see how they'll be "recognised", since it won't be built with the same technique, and not at the same place either !
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Superfly
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:56 am

With all of this nostalgia for the Titanic, I wouldn't be surprise if they reenact the crash and everything.
Bring back the Concorde
 
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Francoflier
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:46 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 18):
With all of this nostalgia for the Titanic, I wouldn't be surprise if they reenact the crash and everything.

That would erode my faith in humanity even more...
The Titanic wouldn't even be remembered by anyone if it hadn't killed 1500 people. What is it with our fascination for disaster and suffering?

Let me guess. There will be a line of fat cruise tourist couples who payed $100 to have the 'I'm flying' picture of them taken on the prow.

Ooooooh can I go can I go can I go? Can I can I???
  
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
connies4ever
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:35 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 14):
To put it another way, a liner is a hotel built on top of a hull, while a cruise ship is a hull built around a hotel.

That is a very apt definition !   
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
comorin
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:13 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 18):
With all of this nostalgia for the Titanic, I wouldn't be surprise if they reenact the crash and everything.

But this time around, they will have appropriate Celtic music to sink to.
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:02 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 14):
some might argue that the Holland-America Vista class ships are liners.

The Vista/Spirit class were built for all Carnival companies, Holland America Line, P&O Cruises, Cunard Line, Costa Cruises, all told there are 17 ships in service. They are not ocean liners, I can't see how anyone could argue that they are.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 14):
The only true liner in service is QMII

Not true Saga Ruby is still afloat and working, she was built as an ocean liner/cruise ship for Norwegian American Line originally named MS Vistafjord. Pretty much the same concept as QEII, transatlantic crossings in the off season and cruising the rest of the year.
 
daviation
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:14 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 14):
I was aboard Legend of the Seas in a storm with 30-foot waves and other than some minor fore-aft jolts felt in the deck, she barely moved.

True enough, modern cruise ships can certainly withstand some pretty rough weather. They can't maintain their speed, however, because the bow just digs itself into the sea. The QM2 and QE2 were designed to keep going. BTW, the original Queen Mary was once caught in 100-foot swells, keeled over 20-degrees but then righted herself.

When I worked for Bermuda Star Line back in the 1980s, we used the old SS Brasil and SS Argentina (renamed Bermuda Star and Canada Star), ships designed for ocean travel, not Carribbean cruising. On one ferocious trip from Bermuda to New York, we continued plowing through the waves at regular speed, while all the newer-class cruise ships had to drop back and cut their speeds nearly in half.
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daviation
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:20 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 22):
The Vista/Spirit class were built for all Carnival companies, Holland America Line, P&O Cruises, Cunard Line, Costa Cruises, all told there are 17 ships in service. They are not ocean liners, I can't see how anyone could argue that they are.

Again, true enough. These ships were not built for regular North Atlantic crossings. There are some differences between them and other Carribbean cruise ships, however. For example, the Holland America Vista ships are double-hulled. When I sailed on the Oosterdam to Alaska, we were able to move into ice-filled fjords at slow speed. The NCL ships were not able to enter the fjords at all on the same day. Their hulls were not designed to take ice at any speed, so their passengers missed a great deal of what we saw.
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connies4ever
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:18 pm

Quoting daviation (Reply 23):
True enough, modern cruise ships can certainly withstand some pretty rough weather. They can't maintain their speed, however, because the bow just digs itself into the sea. The QM2 and QE2 were designed to keep going. BTW, the original Queen Mary was once caught in 100-foot swells, keeled over 20-degrees but then righted herself.

I've read other reports on this regarding a rogue wave. Fair use quote from Wikipedia (not the most accurate source, I concede):

"In December 1942, Queen Mary was carrying 16,082 American troops from New York to Great Britain, a standing record for the most passengers ever transported on one vessel. While 700 miles (1,100 km) from Scotland during a gale, she was suddenly hit broadside by a rogue wave that may have reached a height of 28 metres (92 ft). An account of this crossing can be found in Walter Ford Carter's book, No Greater Sacrifice, No Greater Love. Carter's father, Dr. Norval Carter, part of the 110th Station Hospital on board at the time, wrote that at one point Queen Mary "damned near capsized... One moment the top deck was at its usual height and then, swoom! Down, over, and forward she would pitch." It was calculated later that the ship tilted 52 degrees, and would have capsized had she rolled another 3 degrees. The incident inspired Paul Gallico to write his story, The Poseidon Adventure, which was later made into a film by the same name, in which Queen Mary depicted SS Poseidon."

Last year the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation screened a 1 hour documentary on rogue waves, appropriately called "Rogue Wave". Very interesting phenomenon which is now only being adequately, or at least believably, explained. Some very interesting video within the doc of actual rogue wave events.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality

Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:00 pm

Quoting daviation (Reply 23):
BTW, the original Queen Mary was once caught in 100-foot swells, keeled over 20-degrees but then righted herself.

Oh wow... that must have been really scary. Crown Princess was involved in an incident due to a steering fault and the bridge crew's incorrect response in 2009 that led to a 24-degree roll. Here's a video of the kids' area during the incident. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKeJqDqBDi8&feature=related At about :50 is when you start to see that everyone is noticing that something has gone wrong. Furniture starts flying around shortly thereafter. Remember that the cameras are fixed to the walls, so you can't really appreciate the roll.

I grew up sailing small boats, so I am instinctively used to a certain feel of a boat's roll. When a small boat is about to capsize, the roll starts and then slowly gets worse and worse until you find yourself in the drink. Large ships roll more slowly, so I instinctively get that "OMG we're not righting" feeling on even a gentle roll. It takes me a few days aboard a ship to get over the slight panic I feel with each roll. I can only imagine that I would have been going bananas in the middle of an event like this.
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-Carl Sagan

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