TheCommodore
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FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:04 pm

Not good news for those that invested unfortunately.

Shares are down nearly 30% from the listing price, they are now only worth $US23.94   

Where to from here I wonder, up or down ?

http://www.smh.com.au/business/world...-billion-users-20120727-22wxr.html

[Edited 2012-07-26 15:18:57]
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MD11Engineer
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:21 pm

In the end Facebook et al are not actually producing anything. They are just a fad.

Jan
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WestJet747
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:26 pm

Two things come to mind:

1) Duh. IPOs are incredibly expensive ventures. Combine that with a decreased share price since IPO, you've got yourself an operating loss for your first public quarter.

2) The non-business media emphasizes earnings way too much, as if it is the single metric that defines success. Cash flow is as important as earnings, but of the three articles I've read, none of them talk about their cash situation. At the end of the day, cash is king.

Regardless of the above, I still think they're overvalued. I see more troubles down the road.
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moo
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:26 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 1):

By that token, Google aren't producing anything either - are they just a fad?
 
kpitrrat
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:39 pm

Quoting moo (Reply 3):
By that token, Google aren't producing anything either - are they just a fad?

Google itself is a tool that is used by Billions every day. People see the value in searching for businesses, directions, maps, and even pointless trivia. Not to mention advertising.

Facebook has advertising, along side a page full of narcissistic banter that you are way more focused on anyways. Other than that the real value I see in facebook is staying connected to people. Which, in this day and age we have tools known as cell phones, e-mail, text messaging, and the Twitter machine that overloaded today. I could say we also have face to face conversation but that is only used as a last resort and is quite outdated.   

Everyone wants to be on FB but they still realize that its actual uses are limited to slandering others, posting sappy song lines, drawing attention to ones self, and growing a farm.
 
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moo
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:01 pm

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 4):

The difference between Google and Facebook is that Google wants to be Facebook...

Facebook has a lot more than you think - they have a serious amount of demographic data on near to a billion people. Highly specific, highly optimised data. That's something google has been after for half a decade now, and also something they been failing at for just as long.

Facebook has everything google wants. Give it a year, and you shall see...
 
Flighty
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:10 pm

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 4):
Everyone wants to be on FB but they still realize that its actual uses are limited to slandering others, posting sappy song lines, drawing attention to ones self, and growing a farm.

Same with real life, depending on your attitude.
 
TheCol
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:24 am

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 4):
Everyone wants to be on FB but they still realize that its actual uses are limited to slandering others, posting sappy song lines, drawing attention to ones self, and growing a farm.

  

Facebook, in it's current format, is just a carbon copy of Myspace, and the smaller social networking sites before that. The only difference being that people can clog up their pages with ridiculous games, which automatically spam and annoy the hell out of everyone else. It's likely that some other smartass college kid will come up with something better and everyone will eventually jump ship.
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moo
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:20 am

Quoting TheCol (Reply 7):
Facebook, in it's current format, is just a carbon copy of Myspace, and the smaller social networking sites before that. The only difference being that people can clog up their pages with ridiculous games, which automatically spam and annoy the hell out of everyone else. It's likely that some other smartass college kid will come up with something better and everyone will eventually jump ship.

I had a lengthy discussion on this exact topic not that long ago with someone - the difference between MySpace and Facebook is the interconnected network of accounts on Facebook, because that is what makes having an account so important. And its also what makes it hard to leave Facebook.

MySpace was really nothing more than a web page supplier - you signed up, you got your own web page and web address and you could customise it to a degree. People visited your page, all was good.

Facebook brings a lot of content from other people into your page, it keeps you well informed and keeps others informed of your activities - no more trawling other peoples pages to get information, its all posted on your own wall.

If you leave and go somewhere else, you lose the interconnectedness because your friends would also have to move - and thats like corralling cats.
 
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:31 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 1):

In the end Facebook et al are not actually producing anything. They are just a fad

They have a huge database of user information. There are assets there, but like quite a few internet things, going from a fad or movement to a business isn't the easiest thing. There was talk of a second tech bubble, which I tend to agree with, pointing out that a lot of "paper value" and people paying a lot of money for companies that don't necessarily make much money. Things like Instagram are cool ideas, but going from cool idea to profitable business can be kind of rocky.
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moo
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:35 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 9):

Its also worth noting that Facebooks reach stretches far beyond its own website - Facebook is collecting more directly linked demographic data than Google does, because it has Facebook Like links on practically every page out there - Even Amazon has it! Those links are almost always collecting data about what you are viewing, how long you linger on the page, even which parts of the page you have on screen.

And thats ignoring the ever increasing trend of having Facebook Connect as a sites login or the Facebook Comments as a sites discussion system.

Google only really collects loosely linked demographic data - Facebook has extremely tightly linked demographic data. The difference between the two when selling advertisers space is in the order of pennies for Googles, dollars for Facebooks.
 
TheCommodore
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:14 am

Quoting moo (Reply 10):
Google only really collects loosely linked demographic data - Facebook has extremely tightly linked demographic data. The difference between the two when selling advertisers space is in the order of pennies for Googles, dollars for Facebooks.

I think this article sums it up pretty well.
A friend passed it on to me, sort of explains it all really. FB is not going narrower, which according to this article, is the wrong move. System platforms are getting smaller and more highly focused, I suppose, to tune into the customers more.

http://dougcurling.wordpress.com/201.../why-facebook-is-a-bad-investment/
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windy95
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 11:57 am

Another drain on FB stock is Zynga. Another failed IPO...Their earnings report the day before FB's was a disaster

Zynga Posts Loss, Slashes Outlook, Shares Tank

http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2012...ise-loss-shares-down-more-than-30/
 
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:45 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 1):
In the end Facebook et al are not actually producing anything. They are just a fad.

I've only been on the last few months, but I find that they provide a service that no one else can/does: connection to my family members all around the country and all around the world.

I suppose I could have set up an e-mail list/group, but that is sooo 1990s.

Quoting moo (Reply 5):
The difference between Google and Facebook is that Google wants to be Facebook...

Yes, it's a misguided infatuation they have.

The main issue for both is: where will the growth come from?

Both are carrying huge market caps that presume the growth will happen.

Google thought it could grow by being FB, but they're a day late and a dollar short.

Quoting TheCol (Reply 7):
The only difference being that people can clog up their pages with ridiculous games, which automatically spam and annoy the hell out of everyone else.

One of the first things you have to learn to do is turn off apps yourself, and then turn off updates from all the rediculous games and media players that people use.

It seems FB doesn't make this as easy to do as they should, and they seem to change how to do it fairly often, but it's a skill that has to be mastered to make FB be of any use.

https://www.facebook.com/help/?faq=121070141307903 shows how to block all updates from a given app.

Quoting moo (Reply 8):
I had a lengthy discussion on this exact topic not that long ago with someone - the difference between MySpace and Facebook is the interconnected network of accounts on Facebook, because that is what makes having an account so important. And its also what makes it hard to leave Facebook.

Indeed, but as above, where is the growth going to come from? I don't think FB is going away, but it may be in transition from growth company to mature company.
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dl021
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:47 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 2):
2) The non-business media emphasizes earnings way too much, as if it is the single metric that defines success. Cash flow is as important as earnings, but of the three articles I've read, none of them talk about their cash situation. At the end of the day, cash is king.

Every time I see a statement like this I go nuts. Earnings are the product of a successful business, and the metric that represents the bottom line. Everything else is ancillary to varying degrees. At the end of the day your balance sheet/P&L are what's important. Cash can be nice, unless it's all owed to other people. Encumbered cash carries negative friction. It's better to have cash that's encumbered earning money rather than sitting there waiting to be spent.

Until the find a real way to monetize the assets Facebook holds in a major way it's going to be difficult to make FB a worthwhile venture for the average investor. It's so far worked out for the original stakeholders and their backers, but it remains to be seen what its going to do for the public buyers. People who bought at $39 are fairly pissed right now, and would like to see how the company is going to raise its value.
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ouboy79
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 3:25 pm

Quoting moo (Reply 3):
By that token, Google aren't producing anything either - are they just a fad?

Motorola phones, Android OS, Google Fiber, Mapping Software, etc. So exactly what aren't they producing?  

You can at least physically hold a product in your hand made by Google or one of their subsidiaries whereas with Facebook (to my knowledge) you can't.
 
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Francoflier
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:15 pm

Google does produce a lot of valuable real world tools. just about every TV newscast these days shows a Google map display, for instance. Lots of businesses use their data and services.

FB has little other than the entertainment value and associated advertising space which, while valuable, is also subject to FB's popularity. And in a volatile internet environment in which most of the userbase are trendy 15-35 year old people, that can go as it came...
There might be a new Facebook just as it became the new Myspace. Then again, Google+ won't be it...

You also can't really talk much about diversification in FB's case, as most of their purchases concern services which use are linked with that of FB. This adds to the volatility of their business case.
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WestJet747
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:22 pm

Quoting dl021 (Reply 14):
Earnings are the product of a successful business, and the metric that represents the bottom line. Everything else is ancillary to varying degrees. At the end of the day your balance sheet/P&L are what's important.

I agree with most of that, but it's assinine to gauge "overall success", by any definition, based on a single metric. In the investing world (which it sounds like you are very familliar with) it is dangerous to be tunnel vision on earnings.

Quoting dl021 (Reply 14):
Cash can be nice, unless it's all owed to other people. Encumbered cash carries negative friction. It's better to have cash that's encumbered earning money rather than sitting there waiting to be spent.

My statement wasn't based on the assumption that cash is tied up in debt. I was speaking more generally than that. In Facebook's case, I wasn't even able to find the actual official earnings report; none of the articles sourced it   

Anyway, my point is that I wouldn't cast a doom-and-gloom shadow over Facebook for a quarterly earnings loss. For all we know, they could be cash-flow positive with minimal debt.

Quoting dl021 (Reply 14):
People who bought at $39 are fairly pissed right now

As they should be...at themselves. There were so many warning signs that this was a bad buy. But I guess that's how the game works: risk and reward  
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Superfly
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:01 pm

Quoting TheCommodore (Thread starter):
Not good news for those that invested unfortunately.

Shares are down nearly 30% from the listing price, they are now only worth $US23.94  

The experts were saying that it was a fool's stock anyway.

Now can someone explain to me the point of the whole timeline thing?
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Flighty
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 2:12 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 18):
Now can someone explain to me the point of the whole timeline thing?

More efficient raping of people's identities and personal info to sell to megacorp, netbots and soon, verify via aerial drones.  
 
LMP737
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 4:25 pm

Quoting francoflier (Reply 16):
FB has little other than the entertainment value and associated advertising space which, while valuable, is also subject to FB's popularity. And in a volatile internet environment in which most of the userbase are trendy 15-35 year old people, that can go as it came...

When you first sign up for FB there's that initial honeymoon period. It's neat finding people you have not heard from in years. Then it becomes boring. Then it becomes annoying because there are people who want to share every detail of their day to day lives, political and religious views, games they want you to play etc. Go a week without checking your FB page an see it filled up with that stuff. Then you end up unsubscribing to to people, which makes you wonder why you even signed up in the first place.
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CXfirst
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:11 pm

I think it is ridiculous when people say Facebook is a fad, it will go away, it will become the new myspace to another social media service.

We cannot really compare it to Myspace, with the size it has reached.

Myspace had what, 25 million users? Facebook has 1 billion. It was much easier leaving Myspace. I had some friends with it, many without it, a knew nobody over 30 with it...

Nowadays, practically everyone I know uses facebook, and that includes all age groups. And so many other services use facebook as well, including comment sections in many forms of media, log in details to many different services (aka Spotify), and many companies use facebook as well as twitter in order to communicate with their clients.

When facebook came, it got a lot of users, they attracted friends and family, and they eventually attracted myspace users over, killing myspace.

When the next service comes, it will attract some users, but I cannot see it converting the required amount of facebook users to get everyone over. And people just cannot be bothered with having half of their friends and family on one service, and half on another. When I tried Google+, I found it to be very good, just not needed, and a waste of time when I already had all my friends on facebook, and only a few on Google+ trying it like I did.

I'm not saying facebook won't ever die. It will, but not to the hands of a competing service offering basically the same. The next must be so innovative, and outside of the current form of social media (don't know what this will be, I wish I did, as that would make me a billionaire).

I do believe however, facebook was majorly overpriced on the stock market, and growth will slow down substantially, unless they can crack the Chinese market, which seems to have their own version of just about every big IT service already. The stocks might fall some more, but not much in my opinion.

-CXfirst
 
Superfly
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:29 pm

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 21):

Excellent point and I agree with all of your comments.
I find it funny when some people make big announcements about deleting or taking a break from Facebook, only to return within 24 hours.
It's the adult version of running away from home.  
Quoting LMP737 (Reply 20):
Then it becomes annoying because there are people who want to share every detail of their day

I hate those updates when people tell the world that they have diarrhea. I mean do we really need to know this?


Quoting LMP737 (Reply 20):
political and religious views,

I avoid that on Facebook. I rather do that here in the non-aviation forums. 
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:36 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 20):
Then it becomes annoying because there are people who want to share every detail of their day to day lives, political and religious views, games they want you to play etc. Go a week without checking your FB page an see it filled up with that stuff. Then you end up unsubscribing to to people, which makes you wonder why you even signed up in the first place.

Or you take 10 minutes to learn how to turn off updates from the most annoying apps, and turn the update level to the most annoying people to "important updates".

I've turned off updates from three music playing apps and two game apps and all is well on that front.

I've reduced the updates to "important" from two people (one who clearly is an attention "diva" and another who's a potty mouthed teenage girl) and that fixed that, no unsubscribing needed.

If that doesn't work, then you just may have to consider who your FB friends are and why you find them so annoying...

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 21):

Nowadays, practically everyone I know uses facebook, and that includes all age groups. And so many other services use facebook as well, including comment sections in many forms of media, log in details to many different services (aka Spotify), and many companies use facebook as well as twitter in order to communicate with their clients.

Personally I'm not fond of media comments being funneled through FB - it puts FB into the middle of something I prefer that they'd just stay out of, which is the relationship between the media and the public.

I dont/wont turn on FB apps so I don't use those add-ons anyway.
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redflyer
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:01 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 1):
In the end Facebook et al are not actually producing anything. They are just a fad.

  

I have no doubt social networking is here to stay, and stay in a big way. But FB will NOT be the engine of social networking beyond a few more years, at least not in its current form. The service is simply just too broad to sustain its viability as a useful tool of the social networking arena. It will morph into something more specialized while other players take up a niche role, too. And if it doesn't, well, it may become another MySpace - a has-been.

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 4):
Google itself is a tool that is used by Billions every day. People see the value in searching for businesses, directions, maps, and even pointless trivia. Not to mention advertising.

Facebook has advertising, along side a page full of narcissistic banter that you are way more focused on anyways. Other than that the real value I see in facebook is staying connected to people. Which, in this day and age we have tools known as cell phones, e-mail, text messaging, and the Twitter machine that overloaded today. I could say we also have face to face conversation but that is only used as a last resort and is quite outdated.   

Everyone wants to be on FB but they still realize that its actual uses are limited to slandering others, posting sappy song lines, drawing attention to ones self, and growing a farm.

And that is the very reason why FB in its current form will not last. When I joined FB it was fun to catch up with old acquaintances and see how past friends were doing - didn't need to do that with current friends and acquaintance because I already kept in touch with them if I needed to. After a while, though, the luster wore off and it's now at the point where it's an annoyance and I only log in rarely.

Quoting francoflier (Reply 16):
There might be a new Facebook just as it became the new Myspace. Then again, Google+ won't be it...

I wouldn't discount Google+ just yet. If FB had to do it all over again from scratch and reinvent themselves, I would be willing to bet they would look very similar to Google+.

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 21):
I think it is ridiculous when people say Facebook is a fad, it will go away, it will become the new myspace to another social media service.

We cannot really compare it to Myspace, with the size it has reached.

Myspace had what, 25 million users? Facebook has 1 billion. It was much easier leaving Myspace. I had some friends with it, many without it, a knew nobody over 30 with it...

Nowadays, practically everyone I know uses facebook, and that includes all age groups. And so many other services use facebook as well, including comment sections in many forms of media, log in details to many different services (aka Spotify), and many companies use facebook as well as twitter in order to communicate with their clients.

When facebook came, it got a lot of users, they attracted friends and family, and they eventually attracted myspace users over, killing myspace.

When the next service comes, it will attract some users, but I cannot see it converting the required amount of facebook users to get everyone over. And people just cannot be bothered with having half of their friends and family on one service, and half on another. When I tried Google+, I found it to be very good, just not needed, and a waste of time when I already had all my friends on facebook, and only a few on Google+ trying it like I did.

Interesting post, but, very respectfully, I think it's highly short-sighted. People used to think Microsoft was the end-all to everything. Look at them today. Although still huge, people are coming to realize that there is life outside of Microsoft. And there are lots of other - and better in many cases - alternatives.

Technology is ever changing and to think something that is popular today will be popular tomorrow is very short-sighted.

Also, with regards to Google+ and the fact that most of your friends and family were on FB, the best advantage of Google+ is that your friends and family don't have to be joined up to the service to get updates from you when you post on it. You can configure it so that they get an email with a link to your Google+ post/photos. To my knowledge, FB does not offer this feature and to see a FB post you have to have an account and profile set up.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 23):
Or you take 10 minutes to learn how to turn off updates from the most annoying apps, and turn the update level to the most annoying people to "important updates".

That's the whole problem with FB. That 10 minutes that you allude to is far too long. Changing account settings should be easy and intuitive - and permanent. Every time I've ever tried to do anything with regards to changing a setting in FB it takes me a while to figure out what I'm changing and how it will impact everything. I've also had settings change without my knowledge. And I'm pretty techno-savvy. I think FB does it this way deliberately so that its users broadcast as much information about themselves as possible without realizing it (which is only to FB's advantage).
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:20 pm

Quoting redflyer (Reply 24):
didn't need to do that with current friends and acquaintance because I already kept in touch with them if I needed to.

Everyone is different. In my case, I have a lot of family members of all ages across the country and world, and FB is the main path to keep in touch with them. It's the one they themselves chose.

Quoting redflyer (Reply 24):

Also, with regards to Google+ and the fact that most of your friends and family were on FB, the best advantage of Google+ is that your friends and family don't have to be joined up to the service to get updates from you when you post on it. You can configure it so that they get an email with a link to your Google+ post/photos. T

Seems to me that kind of "push model" is what made email unpopoular - it leads to spam. In FB, people opt in, and have ways to opt out that are easier than setting up email filters.

Quoting redflyer (Reply 24):
Every time I've ever tried to do anything with regards to changing a setting in FB it takes me a while to figure out what I'm changing and how it will impact everything. I've also had settings change without my knowledge. And I'm pretty techno-savvy. I think FB does it this way deliberately so that its users broadcast as much information about themselves as possible without realizing it (which is only to FB's advantage).

I agree with all of this, but it is the price to be paid, and the positives outweigh the negatives.

If you're not paying for it, you're the product, not the customer...
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Marcus
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:39 pm

If consumer technology has shown us anything in the last 30 years is that anything is possible, big companies fail and small companies prosper….big today does not necessarily mean big tomorrow and the same goes for small companies.

Where is Nokia today compared to 5 years ago?
Where is Microsoft today compared to the late 80’s and all of the 90’s
Where is Netscape today?
Where is Apple today compared to the 90’s?
Where was Apple in the 90’s compared to the 80’s?
Where is Atari now?
Where are Myspace, Hi5 and Friendster today?
Where are IBM-HP et al today compared to the 80’s?
Where is Yahoo today?
Where is Sony today compared to the 80’s?
Where is Samsung today compared to the 80’s?

You get the point….
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redflyer
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:13 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 25):
Seems to me that kind of "push model" is what made email unpopoular - it leads to spam. In FB, people opt in, and have ways to opt out that are easier than setting up email filters.

It's a push model in a way, but highly specialized. Based on your circle of friends you get to decide who sees it. And even then you can opt-out people even if they are within an included distribution circle.

But I don't want to hijack this into a discussion on Google+. The fact is that FB is HUGE by any standard or measure, yet the company is not making money. And it would appear with that kind of user base, they should be making money, or at least be able to show a clear path forward on how they will make money, and soon. Otherwise, they will squander one of the most spectacular opportunities any tech company has ever had. Personally, I see them going down in flames in a few years. The reason being they are trying to be everything to everyone, and that is just impossible to do. I think the hype around their IPO occurred because people are thinking with that kind of user base there must be gold to be had. But as has been pointed out, they are probably a flash-in-the-pan.

Quoting Marcus (Reply 26):
Where is Nokia today compared to 5 years ago?
Where is Microsoft today compared to the late 80’s and all of the 90’s
Where is Netscape today?
Where is Apple today compared to the 90’s?
Where was Apple in the 90’s compared to the 80’s?
Where is Atari now?
Where are Myspace, Hi5 and Friendster today?
Where are IBM-HP et al today compared to the 80’s?
Where is Yahoo today?
Where is Sony today compared to the 80’s?
Where is Samsung today compared to the 80’s?

Another one that had a history similar to the one FB is having now is AOL. Although its user base was a fraction of FB's today, it was THE means to get on and take advantage of the Internet for common folks back in the 90's, much as FB is THE means to get on and take advantage of social networking today. AOL's growth was boundless in some peoples' minds, resulting in its disastrous merger with TimeWarner. The rest, as they say, is history. And, for the most part, so is AOL.
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LMP737
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:09 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 22):
I avoid that on Facebook. I rather do that here in the non-aviation forums.

Gues we can agree on that.  
Quoting Revelation (Reply 23):
Or you take 10 minutes to learn how to turn off updates from the most annoying apps, and turn the update level to the most annoying people to "important updates".

Or do what I do and unsubscribe the people who fill up my FB page with crap.  
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ltbewr
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:28 am

One problem for Facebook is that ads don't show up much at all on i-Phones and smartphones with their relatively small screens vs. a laptop or home computer. That kills off a lot of ads that get seen as well as reactive clicks on ads and hence revenue for FB.

Still far too many want to find that next big jackpot either in a lottery ticket or in a hot stock, problem is for every winner there are far more losers in the short run. Facebook is still very young, the owners and people involved in the company who got stock wanted their jackpot now. I bet a lot of the selling off is FB employees who are taking their jackpot out now to spend on cars, homes, gadgets, living a luxury life, paying off student loans and so on before the company matures and plateaus.
 
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Wed Aug 01, 2012 10:50 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 22):
Quoting LMP737 (Reply 20):
political and religious views,

I avoid that on Facebook. I rather do that here in the non-aviation forums.

It's funny you mention that, because that's what I do too.

I really try to keep FB about being in contact with my family members.

I have two relatives who do push my buttons, though.

One is the stereotypical liberal. She works at a quiet New England college, drives a Volvo, lives in a 100+ year old farm house with a barn out back.

The other is a stereotypical conservative. Lives in the Southern US, sends out Bible quotes several times a week, "likes" George W. Bush.

I just ignore them to the greatest extent possible.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 29):
Facebook is still very young, the owners and people involved in the company who got stock wanted their jackpot now.

Indeed. Seems these young folks must have been passing out some good stuff at their "road show" where they got the IPO community foaming at the mouth.

I'm thinking of buying some FB stock just on contrarian principals, but I still can't see their upside. Keep in mind I'm a crap investor...
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TheCol
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Wed Aug 01, 2012 10:07 pm

Quoting moo (Reply 8):
I had a lengthy discussion on this exact topic not that long ago with someone - the difference between MySpace and Facebook is the interconnected network of accounts on Facebook, because that is what makes having an account so important. And its also what makes it hard to leave Facebook.

There's no denying that Facebook is the better product, which is why people flocked over to it, but, like Myspace, Facebook is eventually loosing it's identity as the userbase grows and is becoming more like a consumer marketing product.

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 21):
Myspace had what, 25 million users? Facebook has 1 billion. It was much easier leaving Myspace. I had some friends with it, many without it, a knew nobody over 30 with it...

Nowadays, practically everyone I know uses facebook, and that includes all age groups. And so many other services use facebook as well, including comment sections in many forms of media, log in details to many different services (aka Spotify), and many companies use facebook as well as twitter in order to communicate with their clients.

In the last half-decade, social networking as spread like wildfire. The user-base has grown by hundreds of millions, due to greater accessibility, cultural development, and marketing. It's no surprise that there are more people using Facebook now than when Myspace was around.

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 21):
When the next service comes, it will attract some users, but I cannot see it converting the required amount of facebook users to get everyone over. And people just cannot be bothered with having half of their friends and family on one service, and half on another.

People are sheep when it comes to social media and technology. They will flock to the next best thing with shiny new features and better marketing by the proprietors. Facebook's biggest shortcoming is that Zuckerberg has little to no understanding of PR. If it wasn't for his PR and business savvy partners, ''The Facebook'' would have been dead in the water a long time ago. Since he he fell out with most of them, Facebook has has a lot of trouble spinning the negativity in the media over the various legal and privacy issues that have landed them in court, amongst other things. If Zuckerberg had any sense at all, or cared, he would have made damn sure his company wouldn't have made decisions that were legally questionable and alienated their user-base. Now Facebook is portrayed, fairly successfully, in the media as just another greedy and evil American corporate empire. All it will take is some decent PR from a viable competitor to spin that negativity some more and cause people to flock over to their site.

Quoting redflyer (Reply 24):
I have no doubt social networking is here to stay, and stay in a big way. But FB will NOT be the engine of social networking beyond a few more years, at least not in its current form. The service is simply just too broad to sustain its viability as a useful tool of the social networking arena. It will morph into something more specialized while other players take up a niche role, too. And if it doesn't, well, it may become another MySpace - a has-been.

  

Quoting redflyer (Reply 24):

And that is the very reason why FB in its current form will not last. When I joined FB it was fun to catch up with old acquaintances and see how past friends were doing - didn't need to do that with current friends and acquaintance because I already kept in touch with them if I needed to. After a while, though, the luster wore off and it's now at the point where it's an annoyance and I only log in rarely.

  

Quoting Marcus (Reply 26):

  
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redflyer
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:57 pm

And today the BBC is reporting that FB admits that 83 million of its user base is bogus. Personally, I think that number is way, way too low. I have a 2nd account that I use in order to see the effects of changes I make to my legitimate account, as well as to "troll". In the past I've created other accounts in order to be able to join groups to see what they were up to, but I haven't used them in a couple of years, so I don't know if FB counts those as part of their 900+ million or if they discount accounts that haven't been accessed in a while. And I know of many friends who have done the same thing as I have done, so it makes me wonder how many of FB's "users" are actually legit. Whatever the number is, I think the 83 million that they are 'fessing up to is far too low.

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-19093078
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Geezer
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RE: FB Big Loss Despite Almost 1 Billion Users

Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:43 am

I have only read about half of the posts so far; I think the biggest mistaken assumption most posters are making is, they are "measuring" everyone else by themselves. As a few have noted, everyone's "situation" is different.

I remember well when FB first started up; as I had no interest, I paid no attention to it, and had no idea what was "going on"; (assuming everyone else thinks like me) Finally, sometime during the past couple of years, my fiancee', Miss Arlie got on FB; Arlene worked in a big Chicago bank for around 20 years; because of this, she has literally hundreds of friends. The amazing thing to me though is, even though she's been retired from the bank for around 11 years, she used to receive anywhere from a few dozen to a hundred emails every single day from all of her old bank lady friends !

Then, along came FB; soon, almost all of these people started using FB; ( someone mentioned people insulting each other, etc. etc. ) That's a good example what I'm talking about; in some "groups" of people, that's definitely what happens; (an aviation website comes to mind) But in many other groups, people treat each other respectfully all of the time; it just all depends on what groups you are part of.

I still don't have an account with FB; I still have no need of one; but I have become fairly familiar with a few of Miss A's friends, and I occasionally even send an occasional email to a few; here's my big problem.........even though I bought Miss A a new Dell 17 in laptop just as Win 7 came out, I "assumed" she's do all of her emails, her "farm", and later, her FB, on the laptop, thus leaving me to pursue my "interests" on my new iMac; it turned out to be a mistaken assumption !

Just recently, since I have finally started finding a bit of time to start taking a few photos with my new Nikon D SLR, she has been "urging" me to stick a few photos of my flowers in my rock garden onto her FB page; so it's all right there on my computer........Face Book, photos of all of these friends from all over the country; ( I think I must see more FB "stuff" than any other non-facebook user on the planet ! )


Is FB "going away", going broke, etc.? Personally, I seriously doubt it;

I remember very well when Jeff Bezos was trying to get Amazon up and running; for 3 or 4 years, everyone was laughing, saying he was "nuts", etc, never going to make a profit, and on and on; (that was all a few short years back)

Like everyone else, I wondered why everyone wanted to buy "stuff" online, rather than at a local store; ever since I bought my first camera gadget on Amazon, (and paid no sales tax, burnt no gas running to a store, have 1000 times as much to choose from, far more product information, I seriously doubt if I'll ever buy anything from a camera shop again !

These are all reasons why I think FB will be with us in one form or another, for a long time to come.

So FB isn't "making money", despite it's billion users ? That all "just depends" on what your take on "making money" means. I think everyone running FB is doing just splendid ! As for the "shareholders" ? I'm perfectly aware that many people have their 401K's, and their "investment accounts" tied to shares of common stock in corporations; I don't !
I noticed a long time ago that people who depended on other people to manage their money, were often times very disappointed !

Charley
Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein

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