RussianJet
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Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:06 pm

Really sad breaking news. The nurse duped by an Australian radio station has apparently killed herself. Too early to know why, but if it is a result of the prank then I hope a few people might consider how they treat people in future.

Thoughts?
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damirc
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:16 pm

 
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alberchico
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:29 pm

Was she in danger of losing her job because she fell for the prank ? That could have been the prime reason.
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Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:30 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
Too early to know why, but if it is a result of the prank then I hope a few people might consider how they treat people in future.

By not trying to do anything entertaining for fear that someone might take things too seriously and kill themselves?

Obviously, it's tragic that someone felt the need to take their life over what was, as prank calls go, pretty harmless. And I'm sure the hosts feel pretty bad about this. No need to brand them as horrible people the way I've seen some doing (not on this thread, at least not yet, but in articles I've read elsewhere).

-Mir
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Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:35 pm

Quoting alberchico (Reply 2):
Was she in danger of losing her job because she fell for the prank ? That could have been the prime reason.

I'd really hope not. She didn't give away any revealing information, just a general report of things we knew (or could assume) already. A review of hospital policy about dealing with phone calls would have been in order, and then let things go.

The same would go for the switchboard operator who put the DJs through to her, of course - it's not like they called the ward directly.

-Mir
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WestJet747
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:36 pm

I've already seen people on Twitter calling for the radio DJs to be arrested/charged in connection to her death. As tragic as this is, there's no crime here.

My condolences to her family.

Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
but if it is a result of the prank then I hope a few people might consider how they treat people in future.

Why? How did they mistreat her?
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4holer
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:14 pm

Ah, the "hysterical" radio prank call. I thought radio had moved on from that after those DJs prank called the recently widowed wife of that St Louis Cardinals pitcher who had suddenly died.
Edit: link to widow prank story http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sport...dinals/2002-10-07-kile-prank_x.htm

[Edited 2012-12-07 09:21:49]
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HOMER71
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:25 pm

Quoting 4holer (Reply 6):
those DJs prank called the recently widowed wife of that St Louis Cardinals pitcher who had suddenly died.

Was that Darryl Kile? What happened with that prank call?
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RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:39 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
need to brand them as horrible people

I've deliberately not done that. I was pretty clear that judgement was reserved.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 5):
Why? How did they mistreat her?

They did potentially jeopardise her job for the sake of a cheap laugh. Whether she did her job properly or not I don't know, I guess more information will come in due course.
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stlgph
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:49 pm

I've not seen a picture, but the name of the nurse suggests she was an Indian woman. If it's the truth, I'm thinking it was more of a pride/shame thing than anything. God only knows what the kind people at the Palace had to say to her after it all went down.

That being said, to the nitty gritty: I don't blame the DJ's for any fault here.
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:57 pm

Quoting stlgph (Reply 9):
God only knows what the kind people at the Palace had to say to her after it all went down.

Here is a clip from the BBC website...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20645838


That says...

A palace spokesman later added that "at no point did the palace complain to the hospital about the incident".

The DJs that did the prank call are idiots - Kate was in hospital with severe morning sickness; trying to entertainment out of that situation is pretty crass.
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RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:05 pm

Quoting stlgph (Reply 9):
I've not seen a picture, but the name of the nurse suggests she was an Indian woman. If it's the truth, I'm thinking it was more of a pride/shame thing than anything.

If you want assumptions, this one would take the cake.
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stlgph
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:13 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 11):

Cool. Because my London bureau just told me I'm not too far off.
So, I'm gonna have some cake.
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idealstandard
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:24 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 5):
Why? How did they mistreat her?

The way I see it is that if they hadn't done it, she'd still be alive.
 
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:33 pm

Quoting stlgph (Reply 9):
but the name of the nurse suggests she was an Indian woman

I'm thinking Brazilian.
 
Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:21 pm

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 10):
The DJs that did the prank call are idiots - Kate was in hospital with severe morning sickness; trying to entertainment out of that situation is pretty crass.

And I suppose all the news crews set up shop outside the hospital because their studios were closed that day? This is a celebrity news story - it serves no purpose other than entertainment.

Quoting idealstandard (Reply 13):
The way I see it is that if they hadn't done it, she'd still be alive.

In order for that logic to work, the death would have to be a reasonable reaction to what they did. But since suicide is a reasonable reaction to almost nothing, certainly not a harmless prank call, it doesn't.

-Mir
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Bongodog1964
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:21 pm

Quoting AM744 (Reply 14):
Quoting stlgph (Reply 9):but the name of the nurse suggests she was an Indian woman
I'm thinking Brazilian.

My first guess would be Filipino.

There's lots of them working in the health service in the UK. Many here alone, with families back home.

Pure speculation, but it might explain how the farcical impersonation of the Queen wasn't picked up, and the subsequent isolation and lonliness that might lead to this terrible conclusion.
 
idealstandard
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:30 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
In order for that logic to work, the death would have to be a reasonable reaction to what they did. But since suicide is a reasonable reaction to almost nothing, certainly not a harmless prank call, it doesn't.

Really do not understand this comment, I hope you are not insinuating that you have no sympathy for those who are driven to a state where they honestly believe in their minds that the only option is to end it.

Who knows what else was going on in this woman's life, and perhaps the stress of the past few days tipped her over the edge, back to my original point.
 
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:31 pm

Quoting alberchico (Reply 2):
Was she in danger of losing her job because she fell for the prank ?

No. Not at all.

Quoting alberchico (Reply 2):
That could have been the prime reason.

That was neer an issue. I believe it was based on being humiliated in public.

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
By not trying to do anything entertaining for fear that someone might take things too seriously and kill themselves?

When what you do can have serious consequences you need to re-look at what you consider "entertainment". If you are given a radio mike you need to accept the responsibilities for how you use it.

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
No need to brand them as horrible people the way I've seen some doing

Basically their actions have caused the death of an innocent. Most important is that their actions were intentional with a total disregard for any results that they have caused. It was past "bad judgement".

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 5):
As tragic as this is, there's no crime here.

The Sydney paper did mention that they violated Australian Laws. That, and the result of their actions should be sufficient for the DJ's to have their licenses pulled permanently. A permanent ban from radio and TV is a good way to set standard back where it should be in Australia.
 
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:59 pm

Quoting idealstandard (Reply 17):
I hope you are not insinuating that you have no sympathy for those who are driven to a state where they honestly believe in their minds that the only option is to end it.

Not at all. I have a lot of sympathy for her. But that doesn't mean I think anyone else did wrong.

Quoting idealstandard (Reply 17):
Who knows what else was going on in this woman's life, and perhaps the stress of the past few days tipped her over the edge

That's entirely possible, even likely. But it's not reasonable to expect someone halfway around the world to know that, and thus it's not reasonable to expect them to not do something that would, in 99.99% of cases, be harmless.

This is not the first time people have been prank called. It is the first time I have heard of anyone killing themselves over it, certainly over one as harmless as this.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
If you are given a radio mike you need to accept the responsibilities for how you use it.

They have apologized, which they should have done. I don't see any malice on their part, so I don't see what else could be expected of them.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
Basically their actions have caused the death of an innocent.

No. She caused her own death. Nobody else.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
Most important is that their actions were intentional with a total disregard for any results that they have caused.

A completely unfounded accusation.

Again, it is not reasonable to expect that someone would kill themselves over this, therefore you can't say that someone is acting with disregard for the consequences of their actions if they don't consider a consequence that is so remote it's almost implausible.

-Mir
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nwadeicer
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:10 pm

They should be terminated from their jobs and then prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law with a minimum of 35 years in prison.

Isn't that how the over-reactors say it? Just want to make sure  
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mariner
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:16 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
This is not the first time people have been prank called. It is the first time I have heard of anyone killing themselves over it, certainly over one as harmless as this.

So it is - or may be - a first?

For Prince William, I assume it brings back fairly ugly memories of what happened to his mother and the relentless pursuit of her by the paparazzi.

And it was probably inevitable that eventually, one day, an underling was going to get caught in the cross fire of these so-called "prank" calls and this radio station was already operating under probation for previous "pranks."

For myself, I fail to see what is funny about a sick pregnant woman or the possibility that whoever took the call was going to get at least a bolllocking over it.

These two attention seeking dimwit DJ's did not think their actions through, but at the very least, the radio station lawyers who approved the "prank" call tape before it was broadcast should review their own attitudes.

mariner

[Edited 2012-12-07 12:49:19]
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GIANCAVIA
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:46 pm

I cant believe the cretins I see who say "oh the poor dj's were just making a prank call it happens everyday". What a croc, show me these prank calls where a hospital or medical conditions have been involved. These 2 vile pos knew regardless that this call was going to cause the nurse some kind of ass chewing or ultimately to lose her job and make her life harder but who cares because they can get themselves a few giggles.

I dont want to imagine the shame this woman felt to stoop to suicide, In reality she was the victim of a sad pathetic world that just gets worse every year. I am glad to see the treatment the dj's are recieving, They earned it.. this woman didnt ask to be stuck in the middle of this game, she was just living a life protecting and caring for others. Now her 2 children get to see in Christmas in a few weeks and spend the rest of their life with no mother. All so some losers can have a brief laugh? This planet really disgusts me. Is this evolution?

Those 2 fools were the cause of this, without this low level gutter breeding kind of entertainment this woman would be alive.
I hope the outcome will englighten other people that every action has a consequence. They will have to live with this forever, May it eat them alive.
 
RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:49 pm

Quoting stlgph (Reply 12):
Cool. Because my London bureau just told me I'm not too far off.
So, I'm gonna have some cake.

They gave you an insight into her thoughts and motives for resorting to suicide?? Wow, I'd love to know how they knew what they were. Did they get a hold of her suicide note or something?
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GIANCAVIA
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:54 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 21):
For myself, I fail to see what is funny about a sick pregnant woman or the possibility that whoever took the call was going to get at least a bolllocking over it.

This for me was the main thing that just shows the level of these scumbags. The target of their prank was a pregnant woman suffering from a serious debilitating illness.

Why be surprised though it is the same station that got a 14 yr old kid to admit she was raped on air while attached to a lie detector. Anyone who finds this kind of stuff amusing is a low life.
 
planejamie
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:07 pm

I think the DJs were almost entirely to blame for causing this. Shall I remind everyone what Johnnathon Ross and Russel Brand did a couple of years ago on Radio? They prank called someone at their home and left offensive messages on their answer machine. What happened after that? The guy took offence, the BBC came under scrutiny and the pair lost their jobs and in Ross's case contracts with the BBC.

So therefore causing someone to commit suicide over this because they had a fear of media bashing, social outcast (I've been there, not fun) and losing her job (and therefore her visa if she was working over here without citizenship and therefore a risk of being deported back home possibly). All these things are what possibly went through that poor nurse's mind. It wasn't her job to answer the phone since the receptionist wasn't there, she just did it anyway.

I feel the 2 Austrailian DJs in this case should at the very least lose their jobs over this, with or without the nurse's suicide and be forced into at least giving a formal apology to the family of the nurse, Kate and William and I feel the Queen and Prince Charles for impersonating them over the phone like this. Having anyone in hospital during the early stages of pregnancy is no laughing matter. What if a miscarriage had been reported and leaked in that way? So don't anyone on here come back with "oh it was only a joke" because would you like it if you were in the nurse's position?
 
Acheron
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:20 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
By not trying to do anything entertaining for fear that someone might take things too seriously and kill themselves?

There is quite a difference between being entertaining at the expense of yourself or others in a harmless way(hidden cam shows, etc.) and doing it at the expense of someone's employment, specially during times like these where losing your job can be hard thing to cope with.
 
RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:24 pm

Quoting planejamie (Reply 25):
I feel the 2 Austrailian DJs in this case should at the very least lose their jobs over this, with or without the nurse's suicide and be forced into at least giving a formal apology to the family of the nurse, Kate and William and I feel the Queen and Prince Charles for impersonating them over the phone like this. Having anyone in hospital during the early stages of pregnancy is no laughing matter. What if a miscarriage had been reported and leaked in that way? So don't anyone on here come back with "oh it was only a joke" because would you like it if you were in the nurse's position?

This is a very tricky area. The problem with suicide is that things which one person might be able to just shrug off in an instant, for others might represent something that could push them over the edge. In defence of the DJs I would say that this factor is something fairly impossible, or at least very difficult, to judge. Nonetheless, I doubt it would take too much imagination to figure out that you might at least risk getting someone sacked, and I guess that is something that might profoundly affect many people. On one hand, it is unlikely she killed herself just because of this - usually something happens which just tips the balance, when things have already built up for a while, to then lead someone to taking such a drastic step as suicide. On the other hand, suicide is more common that we think, and perhaps we should try and be a little more sensitive to others - particularly when we know nothing about them personally yet choose to intervene in their lives in some way.
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:28 pm

Though this may have pushed her over the edge, this nurse probably had some preexisting depression before the incident. This is nothing to kill yourself over, unless you were down in the dumps already.

As for the prank callers, it may be kind of a crappy thing to do, but as long as they didn't break any laws, I don't see how they could (or should) be held responsible
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PC12Fan
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:33 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
Basically their actions have caused the death of an innocent.

She got duped. She could have left it with just her pride getting hurt. I do sympathize with some cases of suicide. This is not one of them.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
The Sydney paper did mention that they violated Australian Laws.

By making a phone call? Out of curiousity, Is there some malicious intent clause or something?
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mariner
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:36 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 28):
Though this may have pushed her over the edge, this nurse probably had some preexisting depression before the incident. This is nothing to kill yourself over, unless you were down in the dumps already.

She may have, but that's the point - she may have been caught in a quite unnecessary crossfire that pushed her over the edge.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 28):
As for the prank callers, it may be kind of a crappy thing to do, but as long as they didn't break any laws, I don't see how they could (or should) be held responsible

I seriously doubt the DJ's thought anyone would take their own life, but - actions have consequences.

Despite their denials, the DJ's clearly expected their was the chance they might get through (else why do it?) and thus that person may have faced unpleasant consequences.

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RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:39 pm

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 29):
I do sympathize with some cases of suicide. This is not one of them.

Umm, what do you know about her circumstances beyond this incident, or indeed in the context of her life how precisely this affected her?? Nevermind the fact that every suicide is a tragedy.....
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GIANCAVIA
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:45 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 28):
As for the prank callers, it may be kind of a crappy thing to do, but as long as they didn't break any laws, I don't see how they could (or should) be held responsible

Without their call she wouldnt be dead.. They are solely responsible for the whole situation.

And they have broken laws, Impersonating a family member to obtain medical information.

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 29):

She got duped. She could have left it with just her pride getting hurt. I do sympathize with some cases of suicide. This is not one of them.

Ridiculous comment, What does pride have to do with it.. She may have feared for current employment which her family depends on? She may have been on the recieving end of bullying? Her name flashed accross the media for all to see and mock. Potential to ruin her future employment possibilities. Not to mention most nurses thrive and live for the protection of their patients. Everything that she worked hard for in jeopardy for 5 minutes of amusement for a bunch of *****.

It was only up until a few hours ago the 2 smug dj's were still linking to their video laughing and joking and bigging themselves up for putting a womans job on the line during a recession. Now she is dead they can run off into hiding until it blows over, Her children lose out on a mother for life.
 
RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:10 pm

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 32):
Without their call she wouldnt be dead

To be fair we really can't be certain of that. We don't know that something else didn't come her way that day, or the day she took her life. No note has been referred to in the press as far as I know, and in those circumstances it is always going to be very difficult to accurately judge the motives. I had a friend who very seriously attempted to take their own life, and nearly succeeded. We all thought we *understood* the reasons, and over time it became clear that we really just didn't know the half of what was going on in his mind.
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AR385
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:32 pm

Well, so far Mel Greig and Michael Christian, the offending DJs have been suspended untill further notice and the station has offered some sort of statement. It´s not one of condolences, nor of apology but it does show they are shocked and worried.
 
Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:35 pm

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 22):
his woman didnt ask to be stuck in the middle of this game, she was just living a life protecting and caring for others. Now her 2 children get to see in Christmas in a few weeks and spend the rest of their life with no mother. All so some losers can have a brief laugh?

You're saying all this as if they expected this outcome. I'll bet you they didn't expect anything close.

Quoting planejamie (Reply 25):
What if a miscarriage had been reported and leaked in that way?

That would have definitely been inappropriate. But that didn't happen, and we don't know that it would have happened. I assume they were pre-recording this and not doing it live - if so, they'd have the opportunity not to run the tape if something like that came out. Assuming that they would run in anyway is an overreach.

Quoting planejamie (Reply 25):
Shall I remind everyone what Johnnathon Ross and Russel Brand did a couple of years ago on Radio? They prank called someone at their home and left offensive messages on their answer machine.

There's a big difference between leaving offensive messages on someone's answering machine and asking "how is Kate doing?"

Quoting planejamie (Reply 25):
nd be forced into at least giving a formal apology to the family of the nurse, Kate and William

That they should definitely do (and I believe they have). I don't believe they need to do much else.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 26):
There is quite a difference between being entertaining at the expense of yourself or others in a harmless way(hidden cam shows, etc.) and doing it at the expense of someone's employment, specially during times like these where losing your job can be hard thing to cope with.

This was pretty harmless. The hospital said that her job was never in jeopardy, and she didn't reveal anything that we didn't know.

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 32):
Without their call she wouldnt be dead..

No, if she hadn't taken her own life she wouldn't be dead.

-Mir
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vikkyvik
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:42 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
By not trying to do anything entertaining for fear that someone might take things too seriously and kill themselves?

Obviously, it's tragic that someone felt the need to take their life over what was, as prank calls go, pretty harmless. And I'm sure the hosts feel pretty bad about this. No need to brand them as horrible people the way I've seen some doing (not on this thread, at least not yet, but in articles I've read elsewhere).

Whether or not they're horrible people, I don't believe they're responsible for the nurse's death.

Quoting idealstandard (Reply 13):

The way I see it is that if they hadn't done it, she'd still be alive.

Maybe so. But say I'm driving slower than the guy behind me wants to drive. He gets a serious case of road rage, gets pissed off at the world, goes home and kills himself.

If I hadn't done that, he'd still be alive........But what did I really do?

It's just the first example that came to mind.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 18):
When what you do can have serious consequences you need to re-look at what you consider "entertainment". If you are given a radio mike you need to accept the responsibilities for how you use it.
Quoting RussianJet (Reply 27):
This is a very tricky area. The problem with suicide is that things which one person might be able to just shrug off in an instant, for others might represent something that could push them over the edge.

With regard to those two comments, the problem is that anything we do (absolutely ANYTHING) can have a slight chance of having a negative effect on someone. I could tell, say, a "dead baby" joke, and someone might overhear it, get incredibly offended and/or depressed (say, if they had a baby that died), and go home and kill him/herself.

Is that really my fault?

For all the talk about personal responsibility that I see on here, this is a pretty good example of it. Ultimately, you are responsible for taking your own life. And before someone says it, yes, I know there are people with mental illnesses or whatever that make such judgments difficult. But you still can't really blame that on someone else.
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RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:54 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 36):
With regard to those two comments, the problem is that anything we do (absolutely ANYTHING) can have a slight chance of having a negative effect on someone. I could tell, say, a "dead baby" joke, and someone might overhear it, get incredibly offended and/or depressed (say, if they had a baby that died), and go home and kill him/herself.

Is that really my fault?

For all the talk about personal responsibility that I see on here, this is a pretty good example of it. Ultimately, you are responsible for taking your own life. And before someone says it, yes, I know there are people with mental illnesses or whatever that make such judgments difficult. But you still can't really blame that on someone else.

That is absolutely fair comment, and you're completely right - sometimes there is NO telling what will affect someone profoundly. However, to play devil's advocate, is it not also fair to say that the risk of someone getting into trouble at work or even losing their job was really quite predictable? I'm not saying that happened here, we don't know an awful lot about the work situation other than that the hospital say they were giving support to the affected staff. However, IF that had been the case, for example, then it's a pretty heavy consequence. Losing a job wouldn't be a small issue for many, in fact it could be totally life-changing. So I guess my point is that there were potentially some fairly serious, potentially readily-identifiable consequences here, and it may not just be one of those cases where there was genuinely no telling how it might affect someone. Granted, suicide would be an extreme reaction to losing a job, but not such a leap of imagination to foresee.
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GIANCAVIA
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:59 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 35):
No, if she hadn't taken her own life she wouldn't be dead.

Since they have both been taken off the air you should apply for their position, Your attitude fits right in.

I'm sure you would be happy if some random loser was calling up pretending to be your relative to find out medical information about your children or wife or you to use against you. Or was jeopardizing your future for a laugh. Nah you wouldn't.. not even remotely.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 36):
But you still can't really blame that on someone else.

Its total BS, So lets use an example of all the kids who kill themselves after endless torment and bullying or being abused by parents.. its their own fault because they are the ones who took their own life to get away from misery. You cant judge someone like that who is desperate to escape such a situation. You can however place blame with those who cause the situation. In this case the whole situation would not be relevant if 2 morons in australia didn't think ruining someone else's career and ultimately life was worth 2 minutes of lowsy gutter level humour.
 
Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:01 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 36):
For all the talk about personal responsibility that I see on here, this is a pretty good example of it. Ultimately, you are responsible for taking your own life. And before someone says it, yes, I know there are people with mental illnesses or whatever that make such judgments difficult. But you still can't really blame that on someone else.

   The standard is "knowing everything this person knew, or had cause to suspect, is it reasonable to think that the actions they took would have the resulting consequences?" If you can answer that question with a yes, then hold them responsible. Otherwise, you can't.

The nurse in this case may have been under a lot of stress, paranoid about keeping her job, etc., and there's nothing wrong with that. But you can't expect a complete stranger to know that. It is not reasonable to think that calling a hospital to ask "how is this patient doing" while impersonating a relative would cause someone to take their own life. Therefore, you can't hold the DJs responsible for what happened.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 37):
However, to play devil's advocate, is it not also fair to say that the risk of someone getting into trouble at work or even losing their job was really quite predictable?

I don't know if it's predictable. It's certainly possible, but I'd say unlikely unless the hospital management was incredibly draconian or the nurse just really bungled her job (and I want to make very clear that I am NOT suggesting that she did - I think she did nothing wrong). But it's still a long way from losing a job to taking your own life. So you'd have to first think that she might lose her job (unlikely), and then think that it would drive her to take her own life (very unlikely). In other words, it's doubly unlikely, and outside the realm of plausibility.

-Mir
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RussianJet
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:08 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 39):

I don't know if it's predictable. It's certainly possible, but I'd say unlikely unless the hospital management was incredibly draconian or the nurse just really bungled her job

The potential for media focus was pretty clear I think, so while you're right it's not easy to predict how draconian or otherwise the management would be at the hospital it is nonetheless a distinct possibility that one might consider.
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Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:27 pm

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 38):
I'm sure you would be happy if some random loser was calling up pretending to be your relative to find out medical information about your children or wife or you to use against you. Or was jeopardizing your future for a laugh. Nah you wouldn't.. not even remotely.

First of all, what information were they asking about that could be used against anyone? They asked how Kate was doing, and the answer was that she was doing fine. And second of all, if I had been the nurse, I'll readily admit that I probably would have fallen for it, and I'd have felt like an idiot. But that's about it.

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 38):
So lets use an example of all the kids who kill themselves after endless torment and bullying or being abused by parents..

You seem to be confusing endless torment or abuse with a one-time prank.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 40):
The potential for media focus was pretty clear I think

If we're going to play devil's advocate, why aren't we blaming the hospital for not supporting her fully and making sure that she didn't suffer any ramifications other than perhaps some review/update of their communications policy for what was an honest mistake (and it's even a stretch to call it a mistake, since the situation was rather unfair towards her)? If we're going to say that the fear of losing her job drove her to take her own life, why shouldn't the hospital (who is much more likely to be aware of her mental state) take some blame for ever letting her think that that was a possibility?

-Mir
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Ken777
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:44 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
They have apologized, which they should have done.

Gee, that makes ALL the difference. I'm so bloody impressed with that pathetic effort I could gag.

Especially since:

Quote:

In reports about her suspected suicide, British newspapers and BBC television ran large smiling photos of the Australian hoaxers. They said the DJs and the station had continued to advertise the stunt world-wide.

The Daily Mail wrote, "today Christian was continuing to boast about the prank 'making international headlines' on Twitter".
http://www.smh.com.au/world/nurse-at...-20121208-2b1u2.html#ixzz2EPXX9bla

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
No. She caused her own death. Nobody else.

She was a nurse taking care of her patients and all of a sudden she is known around the world for being the blunt of a rancid hoax. The two sh*ts who played the hoax are the ones who put her in a position when they played the hoax.

Reality is that if these two sh*t had not played their games she would still be living a normal life and taking care of patients.

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
Again, it is not reasonable to expect that someone would kill themselves over this

It is not reasonable that you can play pathetic (and illegal) games without understanding that you are hurting people in order to be "cute" on the air.

You might put up some type of argument that these two sh*ts are oh, so innocent,

Quoting mariner (Reply 21):
this radio station was already operating under probation for previous "pranks."

Guess it might be time to shut it down. I was assuming that it was a responsible radio station that simply made an error in hiring these two yo-yos.

Reality is that when people are given the rights to broadcast they are also given responsibility for their actions. It looks like this station has no concerns about their responsibilities as a broadcaster so maybe it is time to take away those rights

Shut them down, both as pubishment for their irresponsibility and as a clear lesson for other stations.
 
A346Dude
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:50 pm

How about instead of chastising the DJs for a possibility nobody would have considered in foresight in a million years, we look at the actual causes of this? Namely an insane media-driven culture and one person's depression.

Radio DJs are not particularly funny or smart, that's why they're on the radio. They didn't do this out of malice, they were just trying to get a cheap joke like they do every other day. Blaming them for someone's suicide is way out of line.

[Edited 2012-12-07 15:53:58]
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:52 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 41):
First of all, what information were they asking about that could be used against anyone? They asked how Kate was doing, and the answer was that she was doing fine. And second of all, if I had been the nurse, I'll readily admit that I probably would have fallen for it, and I'd have felt like an idiot. But that's about it.

There are issues of patient confidentiality but the nurse who gave out that information is not the nurse who committed suicide.

But we are talking about a very high-profile patient here - in a precarious medical condition - and an impersonation of a head of state.

A jape? I'll buy that and I don't believe it was ill-intentioned - if certainly thoughtless. Again, what is funny about a sick, pregnant woman and why put an underling in what is at the least an invidious position?

Are there some obscure issues of "free speech" that I'm not seeing?

Quoting Mir (Reply 41):
If we're going to say that the fear of losing her job drove her to take her own life, why shouldn't the hospital (who is much more likely to be aware of her mental state) take some blame for ever letting her think that that was a possibility?

I agree. But what did the DJ's think was funny about putting an underling in that position?

So mostly (again) I am scratching my head that the lawyers for the radio station approved the tape for broadcast.

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GIANCAVIA
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:55 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 41):
You seem to be confusing endless torment or abuse with a one-time prank.

And you seem to be under the impression that 1 enormous embarrassment can not psychologically destroy a person in an instant. There is no specific number of of times you have to be made fun of for you to break.

Some care givers entire culture and self worth can be based on never being publicy shamed or ridiculed, After a life time of training and tending to people she is given what she would consider a prestigious role of being one of the nurses to help Royalty and in one moment her absolute joy and dream is turned into the butt of the worlds latest joke. The negative power of Thrusting someone who had no intention to become part of the media limelight out there for the world to see and mock just for a laugh is not to be underestimated. As has been mentioned plenty of times in the very least they knew they were putting an innocent health workers job at risk by undertaking this prank. Is it worth the destruction of someones future?

I don't care what anybody says there is no amusement to be had prank calling a hospital. They would have totally been aware that they were going to cause misery of some sort.
 
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:56 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 42):
It is not reasonable that you can play pathetic (and illegal) games without understanding that you are hurting people in order to be "cute" on the air.

There's a difference between making someone look like an idiot and driving them to kill themselves. One does not follow the other.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 42):
You might put up some type of argument that these two sh*ts are oh, so innocent,

They're guilty of low-brow humor, sure. And guilty of impersonating someone else to get access to medical data as well. But guilty of causing someone to take their own life? That's too far.

-Mir
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:58 pm

Quoting A346Dude (Reply 43):
They didn't do this out of malice, they were just trying to get a cheap joke like they do every other day. Blaming them for someone's suicide is way out of line.

Whats the defense of them knowingly putting her job at risk, Trying to breach patient confidentiality? They knew full well what they were doing and they are part of the "media" you are trying to blame. Folks like these 2 are the gutter level of the media, Getting joy from ruining other peoples lives for a laugh.
 
ltbewr
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:00 am

One can blame the Aussie DJ's but I would also put blame on the hospital for not taking proper security and medical privacy precautions. I know in the USA hospitals and their staffs cannot disclose any thing about a patient to the media and if the do, they face significant civil and even criminal penalties (HIPAA). I know where such disclosures of of some celebrities in the USA by hospital staff led to their been fired and the hospital or other facility has faced stiff fines as well. I suspect similar laws and penalties exist in the UK/EU. I also doubt a member Royal Family would call the hospital, more likely they would have called the Prince directly per certain security protocols.

As to the Nurse taking her own life, if she was not a UK citizen, she could have been deported for her violation and out of the shame and fear of being forced out, unfortunately chose to take her life. She made a terrible mistake and should have deferred the call to her supervisor.
 
A346Dude
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RE: Royal Hospital Hoax Nurse Suicide

Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:10 am

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 47):
Whats the defense of them knowingly putting her job at risk, Trying to breach patient confidentiality? They knew full well what they were doing and they are part of the "media" you are trying to blame. Folks like these 2 are the gutter level of the media, Getting joy from ruining other peoples lives for a laugh.

When you accept a freebie from a cashier you are knowingly putting their job at risk. Are you then responsible if they get caught by their boss? What if they then kill themselves over it? That's pretty implausible, but arguably no more so than what actually happened.

That's what being employed is about: you try to do your best, sometimes you break the rules a little, sometimes you make a mistake. If you're generally a good employee in 99% of cases you won't be fired even if you mess up once in a while, and in this case all the evidence indicates the nurse was in no danger of being fired. But she killed herself anyways, almost certainly for reasons well beyond this incident.
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