iowaman
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Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:44 am

As the previous thread was quite lenghty and hard to load for some of our members please continue the discussion here.

Part 1:
Pope Benedict XVI To Resign (by andrej Feb 11 2013 in Non Aviation)
 
Confuscius
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:43 am

The next pope should be Irish. I would like the Pope of Greenwich Village, Mickey Rourke, as the next pontiff.

...or perhaps Cardinal Roger Mahony or Mgsr. Thomas Curry, neither one is busy right now.
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:31 pm

The greatest Pope of my lifetime, I wish His Holiness well and blessings be upon him

-a
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:34 pm

Looks like Pope BXVI wants to make some changes before resignation time.

La Stampa:

20/02/2013
Il Papa si appresta a modificare le procedure del Conclave

The Pope is preparing to change the procedures in the conclave

Translation
"The Pope is considering posting a Motu Proprio, in the next few days, obviously before the seat becomes vacant, to clarify some particular points of the Apostolic Constitution on the Conclave (Universi Dominici Gregis, ndr) that in recent years had been presented".
The announcement came in late morning by the Vatican spokesman, father Federico Lombardi, after anticipating this morning to Vatican Insider. The Director of the Vatican Press Office noted, however, did not know if Pope Ratzinger "deems necessary or appropriate to make a clarification on the issue of the time of the beginning of the Conclave. If and when the document is released we'll see ".

Link to the story in Italian
http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/va...o/vaticano-vatican-vaticano-22499/


Cardinals with the easy Tweets

Timothy Dolan leads the pack with 82,000 followers
Gianfranco Ravasi comes second with 38,000 followers
Bronze medal winner is Odilo Scherer from Brazil with 23,000 followers
Angelo Scola gets 4th place with 18,000 followers
Sean Patrick O’Malley Archbishop of Boston gets 5th place with 10,000 followers
Norberto Rivera Archbishop of Mexico claims the 6th place with 4,000 fans
Cardinal Napier Achbishop of Durban S.A. gets 7th place with 3,400 fans
Rubén Salazar Gómez, Bogotà, Colombia gets 8th place with some 3,000 followers
Seguono Sistach, Archbishop of Barcelona is 9th with some 2,600 fans
Roger Mahony the controversial former Archbishop of Los Angeles is in 10th place with 559 followers.

Some few days ago Mahony said he was ready to leave for Rome. I will tweet every day said Mahony.
The question is: will he be the Mole?

Link to the article in Italian:
http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/ne...olo/twitter-twitter-twitter-22512/

 Wow!  
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:51 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 3):
Cardinals with the easy Tweets

Ah I forgot that the next Pope gets elected by the number of Twitter followers  
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:10 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 3):
Some few days ago Mahony said he was ready to leave for Rome.

Just like Cardinal Law of Boston, he wants to be one step ahead of the law (no pun intended).
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:11 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 4):
Ah I forgot that the next Pope gets elected by the number of Twitter followers

Dolan is probably one of the most open minded cardinals among them in the conclave so I would not mind that he become the next Pope. The trouble is they will probably choose another conservative.

 
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:18 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 6):
I would not mind that he become the next Pope.

Why would it really matter who is pope to non-Catholics?
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:35 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 7):
Why would it really matter who is pope to non-Catholics?

Because he has Millions of followers all over the world especially in poor countries so what he will do and what choices he makes is very important. One Billion is 1000 Millions if I am right. So a leader of One Billion people isn't just nothing.

from wiki:
The Catholic Church, also known as the Roman Catholic Church, is the world's largest Christian Church, with more than one billion members worldwide.[1] It is among the oldest institutions in the world and has played a prominent role in the history of Western civilisation.[2] The Catholic hierarchy is led by the Pope and includes cardinals, patriarchs and diocesan bishops.

more:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church

Better be a good man rather than a corrupt man with a bad image.

  
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:40 pm

Yes, I am familiar with the Catholic church, but thanks for the wiki link regardless.  

I just don't see how the election of Pope Benedict was better or worse for non-Catholics than any of the other choices at the time, nor how any on the current list would have any bearing on my daily life as a non-Catholic.
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:04 pm

According to Forbes list the Pope is the 5th most powerful person in the world.
This is a list that can be taken seriously.

http://www.forbes.com/profile/pope-benedict-xvi/

4th is Bill Gates
3rd is Vladimir Putin
2nd is Angela Merkel
1st is Barack Obama

  
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:21 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
This is a list that can be taken seriously.

It seems as if my question of what the effect one pope over another would have over my daily life as a non-Catholic is unanswerable.
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:34 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 11):
It seems as if my question of what the effect one pope over another would have over my daily life as a non-Catholic

No one is forcing you to follow the Pope or any other religious leader for that fact but he is certainly the most respected religious leader worldwide - for right or wrong.

If I was asked to choose as a Western woman I would certainly rather the Pope than Shariah.

Good thing I can still choose to go my own way.

 Wow!
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:47 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 12):
No one is forcing you to follow the Pope or any other religious leader for that fact but he is certainly the most respected religious leader worldwide - for right or wrong.

I marginally follow the goings on in the Vatican as it pertains to current events. When you said you wouldn't mind Dolan becoming the next pope, I asked what difference it would make one way or another to non-Catholics which candidate is chosen, as I've never seen one.

My curiosity has been satisfied now—it is either an unanswerable question or it makes no difference at all.
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Tugger
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:03 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 9):
I just don't see how the election of Pope Benedict was better or worse for non-Catholics than any of the other choices at the time, nor how any on the current list would have any bearing on my daily life as a non-Catholic.

Becasue in the USA, Catholics vote, and those votes affect the leaders and laws of the land. So if the Pope gives permission for women to use contraceptives, or allows women into leadership, or allows Priests to marry, or introduces excommunication with liability for Priests that molest.... Well that will greatly affect how millions of Catholics will vote. And don't kid yourself that this would not affect those votes (or actions within their respective communities).

Tugg
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:29 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 14):
So if the Pope gives permission for women to use contraceptives, or allows women into leadership, or allows Priests to marry, or introduces excommunication with liability for Priests that molest.... Well that will greatly affect how millions of Catholics will vote.

Thank you, interesting perspective. I may still be coming from the basis of that Catholics don't have that much of an effect upon politics, emanating from JFK being considered unelectable due to being Catholic (yes, I realize that was many moons ago, but old habits die hard).

Coming from a non-religious viewpoint, it's always seemed that among Christians, the Protestant-evangelical bloc was the one which made much more of a difference in a political vein—or at least they got the most press.
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Quokkas
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:16 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 7):
Why would it really matter who is pope to non-Catholics?

It is speculative of course but perhaps a more 'liberal" Pope might introduce a more flexible approach to abortion and that could lead to improvements in access to safe abortion. Recall recently in this forum that there was discussion of a woman who died in Eire after doctors refused to perform an abortion despite it being possibly the only way to save her life. It is alleged that she was told that an abortion could not be performed because "this is a Catholic country." The woman involved was not a Catholic yet because of the laws in Eire, heavily influenced by the Church, she was denied possible life-saving surgery.

So yes, non-Catholics can be affected by Church-based laws and a different view adopted by one Pope or another might make a difference. Better yet is for countries not to base law on religion, but that's another story.
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 7:54 am

AP is reporting Timothy Dolan has been fired for his role in covering up the sexual scandals in Milwaukee.
 
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 7:55 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 7):
Why would it really matter who is pope to non-Catholics?

Because we are affected by the resultant levels of lunacy, misogyny, bigotry, and homophobia. It is very important for us to know if the next pope will be extremely lunatic, or just very lunatic.
Cheers
 
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:39 am

Quoting AF1624 (Reply 18):
It is very important for us to know if the next pope will be extremely lunatic, or just very lunatic.

LOL, okay then!

It's times like this when having not been exposed to organized religion growing up, nor it being an important part of the landscape of where I was raised or now live as an adult, that occasionally pops up as a disadvantage in terms of cultural intelligence.
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AR385
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:45 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 15):
Coming from a non-religious viewpoint, it's always seemed that among Christians, the Protestant-evangelical bloc was the one which made much more of a difference in a political vein—or at least they got the most press.

Funny, how we in Catholic countries see the Evangelicals as the more "fringe" parts of Christianity.
 
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:20 am

Quoting tugger (Reply 14):
So if the Pope gives permission for women to use contraceptives, or allows women into leadership, or allows Priests to marry,

Not going to happen - not in the Roman Catholic church. There are many other Christian groups/churches where this is the norm, the Church of England, Evangelical, Mormons, Episcopalian and others. The choice is there.
The next Pope will be no different in that respect. He is kept under control by those around him - nothing will change.

Quoting tugger (Reply 14):
introduces excommunication with liability for Priests that molest.

Seems that some of them were fired and sent away from their dioceses - Mahony in Los Angeles and the one in Boston. I think they had to sell their most important real estate assets to pay back all the families - financially speaking. The harm these creepy priests have done to the children/young boys will never be repaired.

      
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:48 am

Quoting AF1624 (Reply 18):
Because we are affected by the resultant levels of lunacy, misogyny, bigotry, and homophobia.

This is not only the Pope. It goes for hundreds thousands everywhere in the world.
Not everybody agrees with some of the changes in society at large.

Hundreds of thousands march in Puerto Rico against gay rights.
More than 200,000 religious Christians marched against gay rights in Puerto Rico on Monday in the largest such demonstration in the history of the US commonwealth.
Gathering in front of San Juan’s Capitol building, hundreds of thousands of Christian Puerto Ricans stopped traffic while defending “traditional marriage” and protesting against the idea of granting gay couples legal rights.
http://www.rt.com/usa/gay-rights-puerto-rico-167/
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AF1624
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:36 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 22):
This is not only the Pope. It goes for hundreds thousands everywhere in the world.

Yes but the hundreds of thousands everywhere in the world you refer to do not have the power of life or death that the pope has over hundreds of millions in the world (see declarations re: condom usage in Africa for example).
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:51 pm

Quoting AF1624 (Reply 18):
Because we are affected by the resultant levels of lunacy, misogyny, bigotry, and homophobia. It is very important for us to know if the next pope will be extremely lunatic, or just very lunatic.

I mean even as a Catholic I disagree with a lot of their positions, but really, what has the Pope done that is considered lunatic? Homophobia? A shame, yes, I don't think it's lunatic, up to a couple decades ago that was basically the norm. Didn't make it right, but lunatic? Covering for pedophiles? I mean we can go on about conspiracy theories, but don't you think that was just a way to make the aftermath less bad (even if it was wrong?) That's not really lunatic either
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 6:39 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 22):
Hundreds of thousands march in Puerto Rico against gay rights.

As a gay man who has been to Puerto Rico many times, that is deeply ironic.  

mariner
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luv2fly
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:05 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 25):
As a gay man who has been to Puerto Rico many times, that is deeply ironic.

mariner

I was thinking moronic myself.
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:11 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 22):
Hundreds of thousands march in Puerto Rico against gay rights.

Going back to what I asked earlier, would one pope over another make a difference in a situation like this? I've never believed that the Catholic church would ever modernize its views towards homosexuality.

Disclosure: I've only ever been to P.R. as a connection point for SXM.  
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:21 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 27):
I've never believed that the Catholic church would ever modernize its views towards homosexuality.

I don't see how the Church can change its views as long as its fundamental belief is that the sexual act is reserved solely for the purpose of creating new souls. And even that is a Pauline compromise - the "ideal" state is celibacy, marriage is for those who cannot control their lust.

There's a problem without that compromise, of course. The Shakers embraced celibacy for men and women, zero sexual congress, as their own road to Calvary - "the true cross is our own self-denial" - and they died out (duh!), which is the last thing the Catholic church wants.

But people, especially men, will do it. Sexual activity between young men is widespread in all the countries that border the Mediterranean (Catholic and Muslim). It is not "gay" as such - it is female substitution in most cases - and it's been going on for ever. The great explorer, Sir Richard Burton, published a 19th century map of what he called "the soditic zones."

It applies in the Latin American countries, too, and Latin Caribbean - the British and French seem to have more success in making it even more tortured and discreet, but it all seems to me to be hypocritical, a denial of the life force.

Although even the Brits couldn't stamp out (or even make discreet) the socially accepted trans-genderism of the Samoas - the Fa'afafine - an acknowledged "third gender."

What puzzles me more is why people even want or expect the Church to change.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 27):
Disclosure: I've only ever been to P.R. as a connection point for SXM.  

Dare I say you don't know what you're missing?  

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Quokkas
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:05 am

Quote:
A potentially explosive report has linked the resignation of Pope Benedict XVI to the discovery of a network of gay prelates in the Vatican, some of whom – the report said – were being blackmailed by outsiders.

That is what The Guardian is reporting, quoting Italian daily newspaper La Repubblica. It seems the Pope made the decision to resign on the day he received a dossier compiled by three cardinals delegated to look into the so-called "Vatileaks" affair - 17 December.

Quote:
It quoted a source "very close to those who wrote [the cardinal's report]" as saying: "Everything revolves around the non-observance of the sixth and seventh commandments."

The seventh enjoins against theft. The sixth forbids adultery, but is linked in Catholic doctrine to the proscribing of homosexual acts.

We won't know for a while what the reports contain because the documents have been locked away and will be given to the Pope's eventual successor.

Perhaps he was threatened with being "outed".   
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:27 am

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 29):
That is what The Guardian is reporting, quoting Italian daily newspaper La Repubblica. It seems the Pope made the decision to resign on the day he received a dossier compiled by three cardinals delegated to look into the so-called "Vatileaks" affair - 17 December.

I found it very weird from the time they announced that the Pope resigned for "health reasons". Pope JPII was in much worse health than him and he continued his service as Pope until the very end. The excuse that other Popes had resigned hundreds of years back was most probably just an excuse for him and the Cardinals to explain the resignation to the Pope's followers.
That he is tired - yes most probably so, just like every other 85 year old with a charge of work such as his not counting huge pressure coming from all directions...

There will be more coming out... and that is only in the press... where there is smoke there is fire they say...

If people think Ratzinger is a bad man, there must be a lot of those who are much worse than him in his "close guard" me humbly thinks the next Pope could be a much worse person than him... one of those who have really covered the pedophiles in the RCC... and maybe BXVI had no other choice than go along with that...?
... and why would a former Pope have to hide in a convent inside the Vatican walls when he could spend the rest of his life leisurely in his native Bavaria with prayers, writing, his cats and his grand piano studying his favourite composers...? The man does not have to hide from the world....

 Wow!

Vatican scandal cited in Pope resignation
Pope Benedict XVI resigned after an internal investigation informed him about a web of blackmail, corruption and gay sex in the Vatican, Italian media reports say.
Three cardinals were asked by Benedict to verify allegations of financial impropriety, cronyism and corruption exposed in the so-called VatiLeaks affair.
On December 17, 2012, they handed the pontiff two red-leather bound volumes, almost 300 pages long, containing "an exact map of the mischief and the bad fish" inside the Holy See, La Repubblica said.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/...-scandal-cited-in-Pope-resignation

 Wow!

Secret Sex Scandal Report Behind Pope Resignation?
Pope Benedict XVI’s abrupt resignation was prompted by a secret report revealing sex and graft scandals inside the Vatican, according to the Italian daily La Repubblica.
“The Pope decided to step down the week before Christmas,” the newspaper wrote.
ANALYSIS: Rumors Swirl Amid Pope’s Resignation
Relying on an unnamed Vatican source, La Repubblica revealed that on December 17 three cardinals presented the pontiff with the “Relationem,” a 300-page report which investigated allegations brought up last year by the so-called Vatileaks scandal.
and then this...
Last autumn Benedict’s butler, Paolo Gabriele, was found guilty of having stolen confidential documents from the papal apartment.
http://news.discovery.com/history/re...mpted-popes-resignation-130221.htm

 Wow!
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 29):

We won't know for a while what the reports contain because the documents have been locked away and will be given to the Pope's eventual successor.

for a while? I would say never - except from non-official Vatican sources.

 Wow!
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 29):
Perhaps he was threatened with being "outed".

Perhaps he was threatened of a "John Paul I"... could be anything....

 Wow!

and...
Remember what I said in the other "Pope resigns" thread...

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 11):
Apparently he is resigning due to declining health limiting his ability to fully do his job.

Quoting MadameConcorde:
This is what we are being told - which I don't believe is the real truth.

I smell a lot of fishy stuff...

 Wow!
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:25 pm

Cardinal Peter Turkson of Ghana: the Catholic Church, Africa and gays

CNN/Christiane Amanpour

The Catholic Church is growing fastest in Africa and Asia, so many are wondering if the next Pope might come from outside Europe.
...
When Amanpour asked Turkson about the possibility of the Catholic Church’s sexual abuse scandal spreading to Africa, he said it would unlikely be in the same proportion as it has in Europe.
“African traditional systems kind of protect or have protected its population against this tendency,” he said. “Because in several communities, in several cultures in Africa homosexuality or for that matter any affair between two sexes of the same kind are not countenanced in our society.”
...
(says Arch. Peter Turkson)

watch the video of the interview here:
http://amanpour.blogs.cnn.com/2013/0...who-could-be-the-first-black-pope/

Turkson looks like a really nice man... only that somehow he has a serious hangup on gays...

    Wow!
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luv2fly
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:02 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 31):
Turkson looks like a really nice man... only that somehow he has a serious hangup on gays...

Ironically it is what the priest prefer to molest!
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:43 pm

The story of Cardinal Dr. Tagle, 55, Archbishop of Manila - one of the contenders.
The man has a most unusual profile. He is an outsider so he stands a good chance if they want a non-Vatican man.

Papabile of the Day: The Men Who Could Be Pope

One could make a pretty strong argument that nobody's chances of becoming the next pope benefit more from Benedict XVI's resignation than those of Cardinal Luis Antonio Tagle of Manila in the Philippines.
Under ordinary circumstances, Tagle's youth would be seen as an almost insuperable bar to election. At 55, he's three years younger than John Paul II was when he was elected in 1978, so a vote for Tagle would be tantamount to a vote for another long papacy, perhaps as much as 30 years.
...
When they do, they're likely to find a lot to like about the man touted as the "Great Asian Hope" to take over the Throne of Peter. One Filipino commentator has said Tagle has "a theologian's mind, a musician's soul and a pastor's heart."

read more:
http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today...pabile-day-men-who-could-be-pope-3

     
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Quokkas
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:02 am

Well, the discussion about what the next Pope should consider and what direction the Church should take is getting more interesting, with Britain's Cardinal Keith O'Brien suggesting Catholic priests should be able to marry and have children, saying the demand for celibacy was not of "divine origin".

Quote:


"For example the celibacy of the clergy, whether priests should marry – Jesus didn't say that," O'Brien said. "There was a time when priests got married, and of course we know at the present time in some branches of the church – in some branches of the Catholic church – priests can get married, so that is obviously not of divine of origin and it could get discussed again."

He also pointed out the the Church has accepted into the priesthood former CoE priests who were married.

Perfectly reasonable on the surface. Now before we run away with the idea that the Cardinal is some kind of liberal when it comes to human relationships, he is staunchly opposed to gay rights, has condemned homosexuality as immoral, opposes gay adoption, and most recently arguing that same-sex marriages would be "harmful to the physical, mental and spiritual well-being of those involved".

Which makes the timing of another report all the more interesting. Three priests and a former priest have accused the Cardinal of "inappropriate contact", stretching back over thirty years. Now if the allegations are true, then that would tend to make a mockery of his statements concerning homosexuality. Is this another example of not practising what one preaches? Or is one party seeking to muddy the waters?
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:07 am

Taking a look at St. Peter's Square live cam there are a lot of people there, the square is packed on this Sunday morning - probably trying to catch a last glimpse of Pope Benny, waiting to see if he ever comes to the window as he will no longer be the Pope in 4 days. This is his last Sunday as Pope.

A historical event if there is one. There have not been a resigned Pope in 600 years.

http://www.vaticanstate.va/EN/Monuments/webcam/

        

[Edited 2013-02-24 02:57:23]
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:16 pm

As I have said for several weeks since the announcement of his Resignation, to me the pope is doing so for a mix or reasons including his health and the growing scandals. Perhaps in the most recently discussed scandal it involves people he knows personally, that he could not fairly judge them. Perhaps too he knows a new Pope is needed, one not connected to the Vatican and the various scandals (as Benedict was) for the lasting good of the church, to clean it up.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:24 pm

I knew this Pope was on to something different!

 

Pope refers to God as "Her"

Emotional Pope says he's following God's wishes

""The Lord is calling me to climb onto the mountain, to dedicate myself even more to prayer and meditation," he said to cheers of "Long Live the Pope".
"But this does not mean abandoning the church.
"Actually, if God asks this of me, it is precisely because I can continue to serve -- her -- with the same dedication and the same love I have shown so far."."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-02-2...-prayer-for-emotional-pope/4537042

     
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ktrick45
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:32 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 37):
Pope refers to God as "Her"

Emotional Pope says he's following God's wishes

""The Lord is calling me to climb onto the mountain, to dedicate myself even more to prayer and meditation," he said to cheers of "Long Live the Pope".
"But this does not mean abandoning the church.
"Actually, if God asks this of me, it is precisely because I can continue to serve -- her -- with the same dedication and the same love I have shown so far."."

The "her" refers to the Church. It's that Latin syntax, just like in the new English translations of the Mass.
 
luv2fly
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 8:56 pm

I like how people try to make something out of nothing
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:16 pm

Quoting ktrick45 (Reply 38):
The "her" refers to the Church. It's that Latin syntax, just like in the new English translations of the Mass.

I would not be able to tell if the Pope spoke directly in English and I did not know the English translation of the Mass referred to the Church as "her".

In Italian the Church is "la chiesa"
In French it is "l'Eglise"
so both are addressed as "her"

Now I understand better. Thank you for explaining.

  
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ltbewr
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:00 pm

The Cardinal for Scotland and parts of England, Keith O'Brian, and would have been eligible to vote for the next Pontiff, has resigned over charges of improper sexual behavior with other priests in the 1980's.

It is just about to be announced what the date of the start of the Conclave to choose the next Pope will be, it appears it will be much earlier than historical practice.

Now if we could get removed, have resign or prevent the travel to Rome of the dozens of other eligible voter-Cardinals for their mortal sins of either involved directly or helped to hide sexual abuse of children and teens, perhaps then a true rebuilding of the Church can begin.
 
luv2fly
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:23 pm

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 41):
The Cardinal for Scotland and parts of England, Keith O'Brian, and would have been eligible to vote for the next Pontiff, has resigned over charges of improper sexual behavior with other priests in the 1980's.

At least he kept it all in the family and didn't go after kids. Give him credit for that.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:03 pm

Quoting luv2fly (Reply 42):
At least he kept it all in the family and didn't go after kids. Give him credit for that.

True.

BBC Breaking News
As it happened: Cardinal Keith O'Brien resigns

1101: Cardinal O'Brien's decision follows allegations of inappropriate behaviour towards priests dating back to the 1980s. He contests the claims and is seeking legal action.

1108: Cardinal O'Brien's resignation is also a personal tragedy for himself, the BBC's Robert Pigott says. "He was about to retire after taking part as Britain's only representative in the papal election next month, a role he took extremely seriously. He said in a BBC interview on Friday that he found the responsibility of helping to choose a successor to Pope Benedict 'almost frightening'."

1122: Cardinal Keith O'Brien, confirmed that he is to step down immediately, saying "The Holy Father has now decided that my resignation will take effect today."

read more:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/21573123#TWEET624654

The UK church will have no say on who will be the next Pope.

 Wow!

Three cardinals from the US should not participate and now comes this one from Scotland who gets fired. Let's see how many cardinals will be left until the conclave

 Confused

Pope Benedict reportedly learned of a secret gay conclave at the Vatican on Dec. 17, the same day he decided to resign. The Vatican insisted the reports are false, and simply an attempt to influence the next pope's election.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/worl...al-article-1.1271641#ixzz2LuXdnfbL

 Wow!

me thinks they already have a next Pope lined up before they even conclave. Looks like it will happen fast this time around. Habemus Papam will happen in no time. My take is on an ultra-conservative choice to so-call clean up the house (fut only on the surface).

Pope changes church law to allow cardinals to start conclave earlier than originally stipulated

Pope Benedict XVI has given the college of cardinals authority to change the date of the upcoming conclave to elect his successor, the Vatican announced today.
The Pope has signed a Motu propio on the issue, setting aside parts of a previous mandate from Pope John Paul II governing the working of a conclave, said Jesuit Fr. Federico Lombardi, the Vatican spokesperson, at a press conference.
With a potential date for the concave now in the cardinals' hands, it is unknown when they will choose to meet to elect Benedict's successor.
http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en...the-vatican/detail/articolo/22647/

 Wow!

[Edited 2013-02-25 07:25:26]
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:23 pm

O'Brien had already submitted his resignation in November 2012, to be effective on March 17th this year, but it's been moved up so that the allegations against him won't distract from the conclave.

Sounds like a sensible thing to do given all of the rumors and suggestions floating around, such as the pope being threatened with a "John Paul I" if he didn't resign being one of the more outlandish of the lot.  
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luv2fly
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:26 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 43):
Three cardinals from the US should not participate and now comes this one from Scotland who gets fired. Let's see how many cardinals will be left until the conclave

He resigned, the American ones have not. Nor were they the guilty party, they just covered it up, which was SOP = standard operating procedures.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:40 am

This is a very clever animation on how a Pope is elected (English)

Follow the arrows and click on the little crosses on each page.

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en...he-vatican/come-si-elegge-il-papa/

           
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Tue Feb 26, 2013 11:08 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 44):
O'Brien had already submitted his resignation in November 2012, to be effective on March 17th this year, but it's been moved up so that the allegations against him won't distract from the conclave.

Daily Mirror

Britain's top Catholic Cardinal steps down amid accusation of "inappropriate acts"
25 Feb 2013 22:32
His resignation followed a series of recent allegations against him dating back to the 80s by three priests and one former priest
The controversial cleric said he did not want the scandal surrounding him to overshadow the papal election.
His resignation followed a series of recent allegations against him dating back to the 80s by three priests and one former priest.

more here:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...-keith-obrien-resigns-wake-1730479


and then comes Jimmy Savile
The picture on this page looks Photoshopped

Jimmy Savile and the Cardinal: Britain's top Catholic cleric was friend of disgraced TV host

Cardinal O’Brien, who – along with Prince Philip – welcomed Pope Benedict to Scotland in 2010, was no stranger to controversy.
He recently clashed with the Scottish government over its plans to enshrine same-sex marriage in law by 2015.
A year ago he described gay marriage as a “grotesque subversion of a universally accepted human right”.

more:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...vile-cardinal-keith-obrien-1731376

Another picture of Cardinal Keith O'Brien with Jimmy Savile. - no Photoshop here
http://s2.postimage.org/wbpavvw8p/ca...nal_keith_o_brien_jimmy_savile.jpg

 Wow!    Wow!
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AeroWesty
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:54 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 47):
Daily Mirror

I don't know why you quoted my post for this. It doesn't change that O'Brien had originally submitted his resignation last year to be effective next month. Have you ever thought of writing for the National Enquirer?  
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Pope Benedict XVI To Resign Part 2

Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:19 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 48):
Have you ever thought of writing for the National Enquirer?

I am making use of all sorts of sources on this Pope's resignation and all that is around it.

What if Cardnal O'Brien had really been friends with Jimmy Savile? I have no idea if this true or not, I just posted a picture and a link to an article.

I will quote from all sorts of sources and links, from the most official Vatican sources, classic Italian news sites to the most outlandish or populist news sites or the BBC or CNN or which ever other sites. - and I never even looked at the "National Enquirer" I don't even know what they are about. Maybe like the French Canard Enchainé ?

You seem to be very US-centric. We here on Anet are from all parts of the world - not only the U.S.

Back to the news.
Vacancy will start Thursday at 8.00 PM.

It looks like they still haven't made up their mind on how the no-longer Pope Ratzinger will be addressed. He will no longer be Bishop of Rome (Pope). He will no longer be a Cardinal as he will have no diocese. A Cardinal is in fact a Bishop with a honorific title. A Bishop is in charge a diocese. A Cardinal or arch-bishop has an arch-diocese.

It's all rather complicated. There are all sorts of Cardinals. Who can or cannot be a Cardinal has changed through the centuries.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardinal_%28Catholicism%29

 
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