kaitak
Topic Author
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Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:37 am

The Egyptian army has given Pres. Morsi and the opposition 48 hours to resolve the current crisis ... a timeframe which expires today.

State media has already announced that President Morsi will either resign or be ousted. It appears that the president has no such intention.

Rival groups - supporting and opposing the president are gathered in Cairo. Needless to say, the president's supporters will see any such move by the army as a coup.

It seems that there is a stalemate ... a stalemate that is likely to be broken very violently.

http://news.sky.com/story/1110850/eg...sis-meeting-held-as-deadline-looms

Will Mohammed Morsi still be president 72, 48 or even 24hrs from now?
How will the Muslim brotherhood react?
How will the army react to their reaction?
Will we see General Al-Sisi become president, even for a limited time?
 
offloaded
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:19 pm

I have a few Egyptian friends and one of them posted this morning:

"And for all the media out there that question the Egyptian people living in egypt for protesting after 1 year of 'electing' their president. They are not being unrealistic, they have given enough time. YOU go live in a country where you can't afford bread, vegetables, eggs, oil. Water cut offs daily, electricity cuts all day long. No police. The price of medicine goes up everyday, literally. You can negotiate your exchange rate on the dollar. That's if you even have dollars. In one year, the standard of living has declined so poorly that no one should tolerate. So please SHUT UP! You have NO idea what it's like. Go live there for a week amongst the common people and see how you feel. At least during mubaraks time, these were minor issues in relation to what the people wanted then. Now they demand the basics of mankind."

And the post from Tarek Heggy doing the rounds I think explains in additional detail:

I could understand that a person who does not deal with the Middle East is to believe that the Ikhwan (The Muslim Brothers) are a political movement that accepts democracy in full. But a true Middle East expert knows rather well that Islamism and Democracy are 100% foes. When someone innocently says : Mohamed Morsy was democratically elected, I immediately expound : that both Adolf Hitler and Ismail Hanyiah of Palestine were also democratically elected ! but was Morsy truly elected ? No, he was not. I was personally told by the DCM (deputy chief of mission) at the USA Embassy in Cairo that Ahmed Shafeeq was the winner, but the Americans wanted Morsy to avoid a blood bath in case Ahmed Shafeeq became Egypt's President. I am currently working on a hearing session (under the oath) at the USA Congress concerning this particular point. Today, we have 33 million Egyptians who declared patently clear on 30th June, 2013 that Egyptians do not want the Muslim Brothers to rule Egypt anymore after a year during which Morsy was not only a rounded failure but a radical Islamist who spent his 365 days doing only one thing : radicalization of Egypt. It is totally incorrect to picturize what is taking place in Egypt as a split between those who are pro Morsy and those who are anti Morsy. The reality of the matter is that we have a majority that is pro civil Egypt and a minority that is pro an Islamist Egypt. It is also correct that Morsy's supports include a large number of terrorists. I am someone who spent the past four decades studying and writing about Political Islam and therefore give myself the right to claim that saying that Morsy is legitimate is a replica of what happened in Europe in the 1930s when some kept saying that Hitler was legitimate.

-----

Not long after Morsi took over, the Egyptian parliament debated banning bikinis in Egypt. For me that about summed it up, and the old adage "be careful what you wish for" sprung to mind.
To no one will we sell, or deny, or delay, right or justice - Magna Carta, 1215
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:51 pm

The MuSSolini Timer

http://morsitimer.com/

Tic Toc Tic Toc Tic...

     

Crowd at Tahrir Square (live feed)

http:// rt.com/ on-air/opposition-rally-egypt-morsi/

(please paste link together)

  

[Edited 2013-07-03 06:55:59]
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
directorguy
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:04 pm

The situation at the moment is very volatile. The military issued an ultimatum to the president 2 days ago, giving him 48 hours to either 'fulfill wishes or the people' or the military would implement its own 'roadmap'. The President responded by giving a 45-minute rant/hate speech on TV, where he essentially made no sign of backing down or seeking to accommodate the protesters. Those 48 hours are almost up.
The Muslim Brotherhood are delusional in thinking they have the support of the street of the common Egyptian. In every city, you have massive gatherings that certainly eclipse anything seen in 2011. In his speech, Morsi referred to his 'legitimacy' 50 times, and is using the fact that he came to power through democratic elections as a pretext to stay in power. He does not appreciate the irony that Mubarak, in 2011, was the legitimate president, and yet people insisted that he go. Morsi was never popular to begin with. Perhaps not everyone is familiar with this, but Morsi ran against a Mubarak-era politician with a military background who was seen as an unsavoury choice for president by many. Many people voted for Morsi not because they were Islamist, but because they wanted a civilian president, or a president who didn't remind them of Mubarak (agree or disagree, these were the reasons for millions).
As offloader rightly puts it, scratch an Islamist and you'll find how regressive, violent, and anti-democratic they can be. So many in Egypt who voted for him forgot this, or (temporarily) deluded themselves otherwise. Although I did not vote for Morsi, and hated him from day one, even I am surprised (but deeply thankful) at how quick people exposed him and his group for the frauds they are on a nationwide scale.
My hope is that the military will force Morsi to stand down, assemble a provisional government involving liberal figures such as El Baradei or Amr Moussa, and pave the way for a proper constitution, proper presidential elections, and a proper people's assembly. If the MB were smart, they would back down, lick their wounds in a corner and bide their time. But then again, they're not that smart, given how their president threatened the
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:06 pm

Quoting offloaded (Reply 1):
Not long after Morsi took over, the Egyptian parliament debated banning bikinis in Egypt. For me that about summed it up, and the old adage "be careful what you wish for" sprung to mind.

Sounds like the Muslin Brotherhood hasn't learned the value of what "a chicken in every pot" would do for the country. Debating social issues before maintaining the infrastructure to keep economic order in the country is shameful.
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Braybuddy
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:34 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 4):
Sounds like the Muslin Brotherhood hasn't learned

You'd think that they'd cotton on . . .  
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:39 pm

Quoting Braybuddy (Reply 5):
cotton on

A great underutilized idiom. Well done!   

ETA: And now I'm smacking myself, because I just realized what you did there!  tongue   laughing 

[Edited 2013-07-03 08:21:49]
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:45 pm

http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo250/parisquilts/MorsiTimer_zps0aeda85d.jpg
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
kaitak
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:15 pm

The army is currently consulting various factions - but the Muslim Brotherhood has refused to meet the army to discuss the situation.

The situation now seems to be very fluid. The MB is - according to Al Jazeera - alleging that a military coup is under way and has that it would stand between tanks and the president.

President says he is willing to sacrifice his blood for the sake of Egypt.

As yet, no independent verification of what is happening.

http://www.aljazeera.com/
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:09 pm

This is another live feed from Cairo

It shows Tahrir Square but also moves to different places in the city

There is one huge avenue with massive crowds

Maybe it's the Pro-Mursi protesters?

http:// www.livestream. com/ontveglive

(please paste the link)



[Edited 2013-07-03 09:10:24]
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
mercure1
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:16 pm

Very dirty actions by the army.

Like him or not, Morsi is the legitimate elected president of Egypt.

Same goes for the parliament which various parties have tried to discredit.

Elections have consequences and people need to respect the results and let the winners govern. If you don't like the outcome, better luck at the next election.

Using the army to push around civilian government is not the answer.
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:21 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 9):
http:// www.livestream. com/ontveglive

(please paste the link)

tinyurl.com can solve these kinds of problems for you. Example: http://tinyurl.com/TahrirLive
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Dreadnought
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:41 pm

Quoting mercure1 (Reply 10):
Using the army to push around civilian government is not the answer.

I would normally agree, but we are talking about the Muslim Brotherhood here. Any reason should be taken to remove them from power and line them up against the wall. They are no better than Nazis.
Forget dogs and cats - Spay and neuter your liberals.
 
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Braybuddy
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:43 pm

A coup is under way. We were lucky to be in Cairo last December and only spoke to one person who supported Morsi -- and even that was qualified.

GOOD LUCK TO THE ORDINARY PEOPLE OF EGYPT, particularly all the people below. May Allah be with you!
        

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c07.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c08.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c19.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c09-1.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c04-1.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c03-1.jpg

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http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c21.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c06-1.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c16.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/Braybuddy/c26.jpg

[Edited 2013-07-03 09:46:38]
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:09 pm

Quoting offloaded (Reply 1):
"And for all the media out there that question the Egyptian people living in egypt for protesting after 1 year of 'electing' their president. They are not being unrealistic, they have given enough time. YOU go live in a country where you can't afford bread, vegetables, eggs, oil. Water cut offs daily, electricity cuts all day long. No police. The price of medicine goes up everyday, literally. You can negotiate your exchange rate on the dollar. That's if you even have dollars. In one year, the standard of living has declined so poorly that no one should tolerate. So please SHUT UP! You have NO idea what it's like. Go live there for a week amongst the common people and see how you feel. At least during mubaraks time, these were minor issues in relation to what the people wanted then. Now they demand the basics of mankind."

This is one of the most useful things I've read so far. I've heard about the protestors and their demands, but never been explained what the grievances are.

Sadly, if they replace one theocratic dictator with another, the outcome will be no different.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:09 pm

Egypt uprising: the pictures the mainstream media will not show you

15 Photos From the Tahrir Square Protests You'll Never See In Legacy Media. #Egypt #Morsi #Obama

http://directorblue.blogspot.fr/2013...s-from-tahrir-square-protests.html

  

EGYPT’S MURSI IS DETAINED, TAKEN TO MILITARY HOUSE:AL ARABIYA

At least 37 people have been killed and 1600 injured in violence since Tuesday night, Al Arabiya correspondent reports

 Wow!

Twitter feeds:

Military vehicles heading in direction of pro Morsi rally
https://twitter.com/kfahim/status/352460211207933953/photo/1

NewsBreaker ‏@NewsBreaker 1m
NOW: @kfahim: "Islamists fighting with officers. Commander orders soldiers down from vehicles" near Nasr City, Egypt pic.twitter.com/7Lqkj8vbp2

Kareem Fahim ‏@kfahim 2m
Islamists climb on top of armoured vehicles. "Your our military!"

Soldiers fire in the air to disperse Islamists
https://twitter.com/kfahim/status/352462851887230976/photo/1

Gun shots at #Rabaa now. NOW. People running, screaming. #Rabaa

The army bans any presidential statements on State TV
Finally the Islamist travel ban by the military is confirmed by MENA
After #Giza, the army steadily deploys in Cairo #Egypt #Tamarod #SCAF

The military are being deployed to separate the pro-Morsi protesters at Rabaa Al-Adawiya Mosque and the anti-Morsi demonstrators in front of the headquarters of the Ittihadiya presidential guard, reports Ahram Arabic.

i could go on and on...

Edited:

@jenanmoussa: "@AlArabiya: [Egypt Pres] Morsi being moved to Ministry of Defense for his own protection."



 Wow!

[Edited 2013-07-03 10:15:30]
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
us330
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:34 pm

Quoting directorguy (Reply 3):
Many people voted for Morsi not because they were Islamist, but because they wanted a civilian president, or a president who didn't remind them of Mubarak (agree or disagree, these were the reasons for millions).

No explanation/elaboration needed. This happens all the time in elections--picking the guy you dislike the least based on the information at the time. My late grandfather once told me that while he voted in every presidential election, he only actually voted "for" someone once or twice--the rest of the times, he voted "against" a candidate.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:36 pm

BREAKING FROM EGYPT Mohammed Mursi no longer in power, State newspaper reports - @CNN

let's hope this is true

karma for the brotherhood and their nasty tactics

     

Edited:

[19:59] Military source: State of emergency will be declared in Egypt following army statement
https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/mena/live-coverage-egypt-protests

 alert 

[Edited 2013-07-03 10:41:12]
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
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Aesma
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:42 pm

I'm certainly not a supporter of Morsi or the MB, but don't forget the military is part of the problem. The military owns most of the economy.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:52 pm

This is a really great picture

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/q71/s720x720/1016097_10151574042143763_8679362_n.jpg

  
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
LAXintl
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:55 pm

Shame yet again an elected government is subverted by a military coup.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 6:01 pm

This is a picture of army trucks deployment ner Islamis gathering in Cairo

https://twitter.com/samy_qaid/status/352468827826688000/photo/1


Edited:
Muslim Brotherhood will hold press conference at 10pm (9pm GMT) on latest developments in Egypt.

  

[Edited 2013-07-03 11:16:17]
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:18 pm

Mega-party at Tahrir Square!!!

Lasers and fireworks abound!

Supreme Constitutional Court deputy chief justice Adly Mansour is president of Egypt

Edited:

BREAKING: Morsi's aide says Egyptian leader has been moved to an undisclosed location.

           

[Edited 2013-07-03 12:24:04]
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
Braniff747SP
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:26 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 17):

karma for the brotherhood and their nasty tactics

Regardless, he was a democratically elected leader. I had no problem with Mubarak, but since they ousted him this was the best they could hope for. If they ever do elections, the same thing will happen.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 22):

Mega-party at Tahrir Square!!!

And what are they expecting now?
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alberchico
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:32 pm

short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
fatmirjusufi
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:32 pm

It's official now — Le coup d'etat!
DO FLIGHTS. NOT FIGHTS.
 
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alberchico
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:57 pm

Where did they get so many fireworks ? Was an official holiday coming up ???
short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:00 pm

The atmosphere at Tahrir Square tonight is freaking unreal

http://rt.co m/on-air/oppo sition-rally-egypt-morsi/

Party like an Egyptian!

  

A Coup?!

This is PURE democracy in action!

  

[Edited 2013-07-03 13:03:09]
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directorguy
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:15 pm

Simply put, Morsi was an incompetent president. He presided over a year in which his cohorts tried to impose their will and influence on every single institution in Egypt. The rate of inflation was practically double. The constitution he rammed down our throats was a farce. He did not deal with a single issue. He would either postpone it, or rely on a Qatari bailout to fix it, or make grand rhetorical statements that never translated into action. People only voted for a radical Islamist group on the basis that he would 'fix' the country's woes, and admittedly the public was very vigilant in checking him every step of the way, and even that didn't help. He was at one point ruling by decree. Had he continued his full term, Egypt would have deteriorated further in every single aspect. When he came to power, the economy had hit rock bottom, and tourism was in bad shape. A year later, the economy, shall we say, had fallen off the proverbial cliff, and tourist arrivals had decreased. All his political decisions were made with one end in mind-cementing his party's hold on power. Every time he invited the opposition/liberals for political dialogue, it would end in shambles. Every time a crisis would happen, nearly all of Morsi's non-Muslim Brotherhood cabinet members would resign in protest.
People forget that Mubarak was equally the legitimate president of Egypt in January 2011. Yet when Egyptians demanded his ouster I do not recall Western media suggesting that he should stay on because he was the 'legitimate' president.
 
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OA260
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:19 pm

Good news for Egypt. Im sure the Coptic Christians are going to sleep a bit better now. Lets see what replaces Morsi. You never know with these things.
 
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ER757
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:29 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 22):
Mega-party at Tahrir Square!!!

They had a big party when Mubarak left too - are we going to see these "parties" every year?
Don't care for the Muslim Brotherhood and Morsi was their puppet, but as others have said, they won a free election fair and square and military coups rarely end up being beneficial to the masses. Hoping the best for the good people of Egypt
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:30 pm

Quoting directorguy (Reply 28):
People forget that Mubarak was equally the legitimate president of Egypt in January 2011. Yet when Egyptians demanded his ouster I do not recall Western media suggesting that he should stay on because he was the 'legitimate' president.

I believe the question of whether this is how Egypt views democracy is supposed to work is a valid question for the news media to ask. It doesn't suggest that Morsy stay on, it helps define the situation for westerners who don't swarm squares and issue ultimatums to their elected leaders in public votes of no confidence in their government's legitimacy.
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Dreadnought
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:32 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 20):

Shame yet again an elected government is subverted by a military coup.

The real shame is that some people tolerate the intolerant (and intolerable).

Quoting Braniff747SP (Reply 23):
Regardless, he was a democratically elected leader.

Democracy is not the be-all and end-all of all authority.

From the US Declaration of Independence:

Quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

You cannot ask for a better definition for the Right of Revolution than this - and notice that there is no exclusion to whether the despotic government in question is a monarch or democratically elected.

Quoting directorguy (Reply 28):
People only voted for a radical Islamist group on the basis that he would 'fix' the country's woes,

Not to mention the millions of illiterates who believed their local imams that it was their duty as muslims to vote for the Muslim Brotherhood.
Forget dogs and cats - Spay and neuter your liberals.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:33 pm

Quoting directorguy (Reply 28):

Thank you for your reports. We are lucky to have you!

Tahrir Square is going haywire tonight! Oh what a night!!!!

Quoting OA260 (Reply 29):
Lets see what replaces Morsi. You never know with these things.

Coming from Twitter

911 Operator ‏@911BUFF 3m
INTERIOR MINISTER ORDERED SHUT DOWN ALL RELIGION SATELLITE CHANNELS. THE MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD CHANNEL AND HAFIZ THE SALAFI ARE NOW OFF LINE.


NewsBreaker ‏@NewsBreaker 27s
NOW: NBC's Peter Alexander reports Pres Obama is in the White House meeting with advisers on Egypt.


Military vehicles tightly surround the pro #morsi protest in nasr city
#Egypt #AFP


#BREAKING: #Assad says whats happening in #Egypt is the fall of political Islam


#Morsi is reportedly speaking at pro -#Morsi sit-in at Rabaa Al-Adiwaya mosque in Cairo saying he is still president #egypt (recorded)


 Wow!


OH ERDOGAAAAAAN, YOU'RE NEXT!! MUAHAHA!

         
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OA260
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:43 pm

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 32):
The real shame is that some people tolerate the intolerant (and intolerable).

Very well said .

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 32):
Not to mention the millions of illiterates who believed their local imams that it was their duty as muslims to vote for the Muslim Brotherhood.

Exactly the wonders of these evil men that say they are religious . They are the worst of society IMHO.
 
777way
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:49 pm

I wonder if Egyptair crew who demanded to be allowed to wear hijab and won will now be forced to drop it.

Also surprised at some disappointed members here, seems like they were they hoping for destruction of Egypt and more slander for Islam? wonder which camp they belong to, obvious?

[Edited 2013-07-03 14:10:04]
 
Braniff747SP
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:06 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 27):

This is PURE democracy in action!

A military coup? No. Democracy would entail a simple recall election. Democracy has nothing to do with force.

God knows where Egypt will go now that they're in military control.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 32):
Democracy is not the be-all and end-all of all authority.

Of course not. It's tyranny by majority. But to ensure a democratic system one must go through diplomatic channels.
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OA260
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:17 pm

Quoting 777way (Reply 35):
I wonder if Egyptair crew who demanded to be allowed to wear hijab and won will now be forced to drop it.

Egyptians have more things to worry about than wearing hijab! Like how they intend to feed their kids and revive the economy. Also the ethnic minorities who were being actively cleansed out of the country.
 
777way
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:23 pm

I know but still, interesting if its reversed.
 
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OA260
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:31 pm

Quoting 777way (Reply 38):
I know but still, interesting if its reversed.

I don't believe it should be reversed if that's what they truly want as long as they realise they cant enforce it where other FA's don't want it. That's the problem with an issue like this down the line does the FA who doesn't want it get ignored and feel less of a crew member because she decides she doesn't want it. That would be my concern.

There should be freedom for all citizens in Egypt within the law and they should not do what Morsi was trying to do and make minorities feel second class and made to leave the country. It was going in a very dangerous direction.
 
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mad99
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:33 pm

looks like Morsi has walked like an Egyption
 
Flighty
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:13 pm

In Egypt, they are still new to democracy and experimenting with it. Good for them.

Right now approval of US Congress is well below 20%. Our democracy might benefit from 10 million people marching and leveling the Capitol, letting all the corrupt hangers-on and thieving maggots scurry out. Public engagement is public engagement.
 
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Aesma
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:21 pm

Quoting ER757 (Reply 30):
they won a free election fair and square

They (probably) got the majority of the votes, that doesn't make it a fair and square (or free) election. The political landscape was chaotic, it would be like a US election with one big party with supporters against dozens of small opposing parties, no free press, no informed people... If so many people here think that that was a free election, I guess even in democratic countries people don't understand what democracy is.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:25 pm

Quoting alberchico (Reply 26):
Where did they get so many fireworks ? Was an official holiday coming up ???

It's the Fourth of July tomorrow, duh  

It's too early for me to celebrate, for the future of Egypt is very uncertain. I hope them all the best. As different as the culture was to mine, they were a very friendly people
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
777way
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:33 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 39):

Yes its optional and not imposed.
 
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Aesma
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:52 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 37):
Egyptians have more things to worry about than wearing hijab! Like how they intend to feed their kids and revive the economy.

Well a big part of the economy was tourism, and the signals the MB was sending were not helping tourism at all.

I mean, recently they put a new governor in charge of Luxor that was a member of Gamaa Islamiya, the militant group responsible for the 1997 Luxor massacre !
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Dreadnought
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:26 pm

Quoting Braniff747SP (Reply 36):
Of course not. It's tyranny by majority. But to ensure a democratic system one must go through diplomatic channels.

They tried that. Morsi responded by announcing Rule-By-Decree and other such tactics.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 45):
Well a big part of the economy was tourism, and the signals the MB was sending were not helping tourism at all.

Last I heard, tourism was down over 40% per year since 2011, maybe more.
Forget dogs and cats - Spay and neuter your liberals.
 
TheCol
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:34 am

Quoting mercure1 (Reply 10):
Very dirty actions by the army.

Like him or not, Morsi is the legitimate elected president of Egypt.

The military serves the people, and the people have spoken. Morsi and the MB are considered a danger to society by the majority.

Quoting Braniff747SP (Reply 36):
A military coup? No. Democracy would entail a simple recall election. Democracy has nothing to do with force.

Good luck with that. The Muslim Brotherhood would scoff at such an idea.

Quoting Braniff747SP (Reply 36):
God knows where Egypt will go now that they're in military control.

The people are well represented by the opposition leaders. They will govern Egypt while new elections are held.
No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
 
AyostoLeon
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Thu Jul 04, 2013 2:53 am

Quoting directorguy (Reply 28):
A couple of differences. First, Mubarak was part of the military establishment, having risen in its ranks. Theorectically elected but could only remain in office with the support of the military. Second, the response in the West was initially cautious. While there were calls to not use excessive force against protesters, and then prompts to introduce reforms, the attitude only become one of support for Mubarak doing when it became clear that he enjoyed little support inthe wider population and more crucially could no longer count on the military.

In constrast, Morsi has never enjoyed the support of the military establishment or a large sector of the judiciary. The judiciary had tried its level best to frustrate whatever plans Morsi may have had and his resorting to enhance his position by decree did nothing to strengthen his popular base. So now he is gone and some prominent MB members are now guests of the military.

The military has promised fresh elections and the drafting of a new constitution. Hopefully two things will occur. One, the interim government will be able to address some of the economic issues, though with continuing uncertainty that remains difficult. Two, that a constitution that provides for a state that's both secular and democratic is drafted and approved by a clear majority.

My best wishes to the people of Egypt in these difficult times.
The person with no dignity eats his dinner twice
 
Braniff747SP
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RE: Egypt: Crunch Time Approaches

Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:31 am

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 46):
Morsi responded by announcing Rule-By-Decree and other such tactics.

And the military will be different?

Quoting TheCol (Reply 47):
The people are well represented by the opposition leaders. They will govern Egypt while new elections are held.

Really? And then, if they even get to elections... the military holds the right to kick them out?
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