AeroWesty
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Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 4:11 pm

The big PACs are already jostling between themselves to decide whom to support in the 2016 races, so digging into possible candidate's pasts are to be expected. Apparently having learned nothing from one of the biggest race-based stories of the year, here we have Sen. Rand Paul surrounding himself with those with troubling pasts to be exposed, including a close aide who used to call himself the "Southern Avenger".

Rand Paul's troubling ties to racists

Quote:
The libertarian senator's new media guy has a pro-Confederate past filled with controversial comments.

A close aide to Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) is a former member of a pro-secessionist group who used to wear a luchador mask emblazoned with a Confederate flag under the moniker, "Southern Avenger."

Jack Hunter, Paul's director of new media, who also co-wrote Paul's 2011 book The Tea Party Goes to Washington, is a former radio shock jock and former member of a neo-Confederate organization, according to a report in the Washington Free Beacon. Hunter is the second Paul staffer to have his troublesome views on racial issues revealed.


It's almost as if all of the corporate endorsements Paula Deen lost, so as not to be associated with troubling race issues, hasn't been fully assimilated into Sen. Paul's consciousness. Ah well, one down, many yet to go.
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WestJet747
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 4:53 pm

Then surely Barack Obama is an anti-semite for having been a member of Jeremiah Wright's congregation, right?

It's a bit of a leap to compare Rand Paul, who I assume you're accusing of having racist tendencies for hiring people who have questionably racist pasts, to Paula Deen, who herself is accused of being racist.

Justin Trudeau's brother is pretty friendly with Iran and condemns Israel, but nobody (other than the furthest reaches of the right) is accusing Justin of himself being friendly with Islamists.

There's some leaps you simply shouldn't make without more legs to stand on.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:04 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Thread starter):
It's almost as if all of the corporate endorsements Paula Deen lost, so as not to be associated with troubling race issues, hasn't been fully assimilated into Sen. Paul's consciousness.

If you hire someone, are you expected to know everything he's ever written or said?

I seem to recall a thread here that went into the question of whether an employer has the right to examine your facebook account. I suppose, if you would blame Paul for the misdeeds of a subordinate (and I would agree that the guy is a liability and should be asked to leave), that you believe that employers should have the right to examine your social history?
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AeroWesty
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:12 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 1):
It's a bit of a leap to compare Rand Paul, who I assume you're accusing of having racist tendencies for hiring people who have questionably racist pasts, to Paula Deen, who herself is accused of being racist.

Wrong assumption, I thought I covered in this sentence:

Quoting AeroWesty (Thread starter):
It's almost as if all of the corporate endorsements Paula Deen lost, so as not to be associated with troubling race issues, hasn't been fully assimilated into Sen. Paul's consciousness.

People are saying that they don't want to be associated with those perceived to have race issues. The way in which the press and society works, Rand Paul's endorsement of these assistants, and the possible influence they could have on him, could be enough to decide to reject him as a troubling candidate by the PACs who are in the midst of deciding which candidate to promote.

Quoting dreadnought (Reply 2):
If you hire someone, are you expected to know everything he's ever written or said?

If you're positioning yourself for a presidential nomination, doing some fact-checking on those you surround yourself with should be common sense. It didn't take much to find the "Southern Avenger" background of one of Paul's "close aides".
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flymia
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:16 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 1):
Then surely Barack Obama is an anti-semite for having been a member of Jeremiah Wright's congregation, right?

   And this is something he did himself not some staffer.

Quoting dreadnought (Reply 2):
If you hire someone, are you expected to know everything he's ever written or said?

Exactly. At this point he should be asked to leave. But he hired him. I am sure in the interview or in conversations he did not bring up, "oh by the way I have done some questionable things in the past that many will see as racist"

Rand Paul did nothing wrong. We will see if the guy stays on board.
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WestJet747
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:33 pm

Quoting dreadnought (Reply 2):
If you hire someone, are you expected to know everything he's ever written or said?

To be fair, this guy's past is pretty out in the open. Paul also co-wrote a book with him a couple years ago, so his beliefs were probably known to Paul on some level.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 3):
Wrong assumption, I thought I covered in this sentence:

What I'm saying is that it's a leap to compare the degrees of severity. There are many, many people who won't forgive a racist, but will forgive someone who isn't racist that has a racist friend. I don't personally feel this will harm Paul in the long run.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 3):
The way in which the press and society works, Rand Paul's endorsement of these assistants, and the possible influence they could have on him, could be enough to decide to reject him as a troubling candidate by the PACs who are in the midst of deciding which candidate to promote.

Granted, that is very possible, but do you think the media guy is going to have much of an influence over a sitting senator's mandate? I would hope people recognize that he's basically a marketing manager, and not a policy advisor.

Quoting flymia (Reply 4):
Rand Paul did nothing wrong. We will see if the guy stays on board.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe it's the campaign manager that hires these guys?

Either way, I'm all for hiring the candidate that brings the most value to the organization (in this case, campaign), even if they harbour questionable personal bias. So long as this "Southern Avenger" nonsense doesn't bleed into his day-to-day duties as Director of New Media, it would be forgivable in my eyes if he were the premier candidate for the role. I'm not sure what exactly his job description is, or the depth of his secessionist routes, but Paul should take a good, hard look at the pros and cons before moving forward with him.
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AeroWesty
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:40 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 5):
What I'm saying is that it's a leap to compare the degrees of severity.

When a PAC is looking at committing substantial resources to a candidate, I would expect them to do their due diligence. Paul's association, in light of the reaction we've seen in corporate offices around the country lately, could be a red flag.

If you were positioning yourself to market yourself to the PACs to receive their endorsements, would you want to risk having them view you as having a race issue liability? Without Sen. Paul even declaring his candidacy, the press is already bringing up this kind of association.
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flymia
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:49 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 5):
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe it's the campaign manager that hires these guys?

For a large office like a Senator, yes absolutely. Maybe not for running for House or Mayor of a town for Senators' have many staff members so many they likely don't know all of them.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:28 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 3):
Rand Paul's endorsement of these assistants, and the possible influence they could have on him, could be enough to decide to reject him as a troubling candidate

Uh, see... the thing about that is, Rand Paul is 250% of a gooficus in his own right, so I'd just be like let's get a better candidate.

The assistant mess doesn't enter into it.

[Edited 2013-07-11 18:33:21]
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:55 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 8):
Uh, see... the thing about that is, Rand Paul is 250% of a gooficus in his own right, so I'd just be like let's get a better candidate.

I ask, and I have watched Rand's speech's before, does anyone seriously think that the Republican Party is that dumb to even think of nominating this man. Seriously????
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:58 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 9):
I ask, and I have watched Rand's speech's before, does anyone seriously think that the Republican Party is that dumb to even think of nominating this man. Seriously????

In a word....yes.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:01 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 10):
In a word....yes.

Ok, I grant they maybe that dumb. I ask again, is there anyone dumb enough to think he can win a national presidential race?
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:50 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 11):
Ok, I grant they maybe that dumb. I ask again, is there anyone dumb enough to think he can win a national presidential race?

Obama did. Never underestimate the stupidity of the electorate.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 3:58 am

Quoting dreadnought (Reply 12):
Obama did. Never underestimate the stupidity of the electorate.

If you have been listening to what many of the Republicans have been doing and proposing the electorate made the right choice. Let the tea party and conservatives be flamed up at least America as a country is not electing science rejecting theocrats, total corporatists and Archie Bunkers who want to move America to a glorious past time when white men where in control of everything. The states who elected tea party members are paying a price of many of whom did not intend initially.

[Edited 2013-07-11 21:12:44]
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AeroWesty
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:00 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 9):
does anyone seriously think that the Republican Party is that dumb to even think of nominating this man.

Yes, in a now deleted thread (concerning the filibuster Sen. Paul led in the Senate over the use of drones), I was called "ignorant" for not realizing his brilliance. Sen. Paul was also asked this week by Fox News to comment on the presidential prospects of outgoing Texas Gov. Perry:

2016 watch: Sen. Rand Paul jabs at Rick Perry with “oops” reminder

Quote:
Asked on Fox News whether he welcomes Perry to the 2016 race, Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul offered a compliment wrapped in a reminder of the faltering debate performance from which Perry never recovered. The infamous “oops” moment, when the governor couldn’t remember the third federal agency he promised to shut down.

So the Dallas Morning News considers Sen. Paul actively a part of the 2016 race for president, one I expect to be interesting just for its entertainment value alone.
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WestJet747
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:16 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 9):
I ask, and I have watched Rand's speech's before, does anyone seriously think that the Republican Party is that dumb to even think of nominating this man. Seriously????

What about him is worse than the other guys they've put forward the past few years? I find Rand Paul a far more attractive candidate. He actually possess some of the qualities a real conservative should have, unlike his counterparts in the GOP. If I were American he would have my vote.
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AeroWesty
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:49 am

Sen. Paul went on the record today defending his "Southern Avenger." As the article states at the end, what else was he supposed to do, "firing him would have been allowing other people to tell him what to do." So to look like he's his own man, Paul will allow guilt by association slowly creep into his persona as he's selling himself to the PACs as an early contender. Brilliant!

Rand Paul Stands By His 'Southern Avenger'

Quote:
In an interview with The Huffington Post, Sen. Rand Paul stoutly defended an aide who, as a radio shock jock in South Carolina, praised John Wilkes Booth, heaped scorn on Abraham Lincoln and wore a ski mask emblazoned with the stars and bars of the Confederate Battle Flag.

Paul (R-Ky.) stressed that he opposed such views, many of which have been recanted by the Senate aide, Jack Hunter, who co-wrote Paul's first book in 2010 and who is now his social media adviser in Washington.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:59 am

Putting Paula Deen (who actually said racist things) and Rand Paul (who has yet to be heard saying racist things) are two different things. I can not stand Rand Paul and putting a racist in a position of power in his closest company is bad for him. But, he is still ahead of Paula, in my book, because he has not said anything as bad as Paula said. Yet.
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:06 pm

In my opinion it is ridiculous to assume that ANY human being with any kind of "life's experience" has no prejudices. We all have them in some form or another. So, to think that there may be politicians out there with no prejudices whatsoever is equally ridiculous.

Every single administration of every government in the world is full of prejudiced people.

As a dear friend back in Atlanta used to say "politicians don't get to the top by "living at the foot of the cross".

So we do the best we can and hope we don't elect some kind of "hate monger".
And btw neither Ron Paul or Paula is a "hate monger".
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Fri Jul 12, 2013 7:41 pm

....and those that did not piss away a perfectly good vote; if those of us that won...ahem...are soooo stuuupid, YOU are CAVORTING with US...speaks volumes...Frankly, as long as I can see 10 years of unmassaged 1040's.................
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Sat Jul 13, 2013 2:04 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 14):
Yes, in a now deleted thread (concerning the filibuster Sen. Paul led in the Senate over the use of drones), I was called "ignorant" for not realizing his brilliance. Sen. Paul was also asked this week by Fox News to comment on the presidential prospects of outgoing Texas Gov. Perry:

Ignorant for not recognizing his brilliance. I must confess, I must be ignorant also because I'll be damned if I see it. I will predict that he does not stand a chance for the nomination. I make that prediction because the Republicans are not that unaware of another impending disaster no matter who they nominate. After all the good press they are getting for social issues they must be quaking in their shoes. Certainly not a party of the common man, and most of us are in the common man category. Well I know I am, I do not have a private jet, nor a mansion, nor a Yacht. I am not a religious right type who ignores all else so their agenda against a woman's right to choose is pushed by the party.

[Edited 2013-07-12 19:08:06]

By the way, Perry has no Presidential prospects, I probably have more of a chance, nobody knows me.


[Edited 2013-07-12 19:12:21]

[Edited 2013-07-12 19:17:46]
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RE: Did Rand Paul Learn Nothing From Paula Deen?

Sat Jul 13, 2013 2:26 am

He's a political, the rules are different

Beside the people who would make the bigges stink about it wouldn't vote for him anyway. So has he really lost anything?
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