TheCommodore
Topic Author
Posts: 3458
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:14 am

Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:37 am

Even if there is only an ounce of truth in this, it has to be a good thing.

Its at least a different approach, and it should be applauded!      

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...npals/story-fni0xs63-1226719683046
“At first, they'll only dislike what you say, but the more correct you start sounding the more they'll dislike you.”
 
oly720man
Posts: 5740
Joined: Fri May 21, 2004 7:13 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:01 am

Quoting TheCommodore (Thread starter):

"to write write is better than to fight fight" to borrow from Winston Churchill.

Certainly, non-aggressive actions are to be preferred over any attacks that can generate all sorts of unintended consequences. It's not as if that part of the world is a disagreement between just 2 sides and you end up supporting one or the other.

History has a lot to answer for.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
MadameConcorde
Posts: 9197
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:08 pm

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:04 pm

The new Iranian President is highly educated. He holds a doctorate.

I am sure he can write decent English.

I doubt Obama can write in decent Persian, if any Persian at all.
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
gkirk
Posts: 23345
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:10 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 2):
I doubt Obama can write in decent Persian, if any Persian at all.

Hell, given that he is American, I doubt he can write decent English either. And don't get me started on aluminium  
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
Klaus
Posts: 20578
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 5:02 pm

Quoting gkirk (Reply 3):
Hell, given that he is American, I doubt he can write decent English either. And don't get me started on aluminium

Come on – that applies to britons at least as much, doesn't it?  
 
The same of course applies to many if not most germans writing in german...!

(We completely agree on aluminium, of course!)
 
User avatar
DeltaMD90
Posts: 8245
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 8:37 pm

Hm, hope some good will come out of this. I don't see Iran changing their course very much, but talking instead of threatening and fighting could go very far. I doubt it'll Iran to scrap their nuclear program but we may see a more tame Iran. A "scary" country getting nukes really isn't the end of the world, it's undesirable, but look at the whacky North Korean government. They have nukes but they haven't attacked anyone (yet.)

Not condoning anyone getting nukes, but I think invading them to stop them is worse
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
TheCommodore
Topic Author
Posts: 3458
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:14 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 8:45 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 5):
Not condoning anyone getting nukes, but I think invading them to stop them is worse

Then please tell that to Israel !

Because that's exactly what they are pushing the U.S. to do, where their help of course.
“At first, they'll only dislike what you say, but the more correct you start sounding the more they'll dislike you.”
 
User avatar
DeltaMD90
Posts: 8245
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:26 pm

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 6):
Then please tell that to Israel !

Because that's exactly what they are pushing the U.S. to do, where their help of course.

I hope you aren't implying that I condone all of Israel's actions in regards to Iran and other neighbors, because I have plenty to say about them  
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
TheCommodore
Topic Author
Posts: 3458
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:14 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:18 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 7):
I hope you aren't implying that I condone all of Israel's actions in regards to Iran and other neighbors, because I have plenty to say about them

No not at all, sorry If you felt I was.

I was just making the "Nuke" point.   

Ok for some, but not for others. Go figure!  
“At first, they'll only dislike what you say, but the more correct you start sounding the more they'll dislike you.”
 
solarflyer22
Posts: 1446
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:07 pm

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Tue Sep 17, 2013 3:09 am

Well, recall that they also totally ignored two previous letters from Iran. The first was prior to the US going into Afghanistan where they pretty much put everything on the table and GWB Jr. totally ignored it.

Then there was Ahmadinejad's letter which the west consistently derided and referred to as a "rambling, stream of conscious" letter, which they also ignored. I actually read part of the letter and though it touched on several topics, it was hardly rambling.

Unfortunately, for the US of A, it just so happens that for the past 2,800 years, the Persian Empire and its descendants have had a long standing tradition of royal roads and Persian Couriers who deliver letters from the King and the government. As a result, there is a certain formality around letters in Iran and in Persian culture the single worst thing you can do is ignore a letter. You might as well staple a sign on your head that says "I'm an A-Hole, Ignore me". It would actually be better to write back something unpleasant.

I give credit to Obama for responding but culturally there is actually a huge divide between Persians and Americans. We generally don't view Americans and other anglophones as being particularly cultured. Little slights, such as ignoring a letter addressed specifically to you, just reinforce the stereotypes. And unlike Putin, they'd rather keep these letters private.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Royal_Road
 
User avatar
DocLightning
Posts: 19604
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Tue Sep 17, 2013 5:07 pm

Quoting gkirk (Reply 3):
Hell, given that he is American, I doubt he can write decent English either. And don't get me started on aluminium

At least we don't throw extra vowels in words like "labor" and "honor" and dyslexically reverse letter orders in words like "theater."

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 2):

I doubt Obama can write in decent Persian, if any Persian at all.

It would shock me if he could. But I'm equally sure he has at least one translator on staff who can do that part for him. Rank hath its privileges.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
kaitak
Posts: 8934
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Tue Sep 17, 2013 8:30 pm

I think there would be more than a few people in the State Department who could translate to and from Farsi. I doubt if this would be a major obstacle.

However, let's think a little about what such correspondence would entail.

From the US side:

- We must both recognise that there are aspects to our relationship over the last sixty years and in particular since the Revolution, which neither of us can change; we focus exclusively on the future
- The United States has no wish to have emnity with Iran or its people; to the contrary, we aspire ultimately to the normalisation of our relationship
- We recognise that Iran, like all countries, needs to plan for its long term energy requirements and that this may include the development of a civilian nuclear energy program
- The United States will not accept the development of nuclear arms by Iran
- The United States continues to express its concern about the arming of terrorist organisations by Iran, in particular Hezbollah
- We believe that Iran can, if it so chooses, be a force for stability in the region
- We are open to the possibility of a goodwill gesture, if Iran opens all of its nuclear facilities to inspection by the IAEA.
- We would like to continue this correspondence and to end the mistrust and antipathy which has bedevilled our relationship over the last 33 years; neither of us gains from such a level of emnity as we have experienced. Let us begin to rebuild a relationship of trust and respect.

Too much too soon? I think it would be helpful for each side to set out principles. Would the US comment on the Iranian attitude towards Israel, for example?

Hopefully this will lead to something better; it would be very good for ME stability for this to be the case.

[Edited 2013-09-17 13:32:21]
 
Rara
Posts: 2296
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:41 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Tue Sep 17, 2013 9:54 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 2):
if any Persian at all.

Indeed.  
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
 
solarflyer22
Posts: 1446
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:07 pm

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:32 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 10):
It would shock me if he could. But I'm equally sure he has at least one translator on staff who can do that part for him. Rank hath its privileges.
Quoting kaitak (Reply 11):
I think there would be more than a few people in the State Department who could translate to and from Farsi. I doubt if this would be a major obstacle

Well, actually....as a matter of fact they do not. So, I'll enlighten you a little bit by saying I'm a native Farsi/Persian speaker born in Iran and the US has consistently mis-translated or purposely slanted whats coming out of Iran. This is well known and often acknowledged by many Iranians but obviously impossible to pick up for English speakers.

Ahamdinejad's comments to quote "Wipe Israel off the map" is the premier example of this. "Wiping" in Persian is to wipe a table. The English language euphemism off "wiping something off the map" doesn't exist in Persian vernacular and it immediately drew skepticism in our circles. What he said was not nearly as threatening as portrayed in mass media.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNDkhmceQR8

Since there are nearly 50,000 Iranian Jews in Israel, this surely would have been known to Israel. Most of the translators for the State Department are white people trained in Farsi. Most Iranian Americans will not work for the US Government or CIA due to the Mossadegh coup and lack of respect for those entities. He probably did get a good translation of a letter though since they would have dumbed it down.

I have heard Arabs also complain of this.
 
EL-AL
Posts: 1414
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 8:29 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:03 pm

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 6):
Then please tell that to Israel !

I know you couldn't hold yourself, but that fast? Man you are in good shape.
every day is a good day to fly
 
RyanairGuru
Posts: 6554
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Wed Sep 18, 2013 1:45 pm

Quoting gkirk (Reply 3):
I doubt he can write decent English either

Touche  

But I wonder whether that is the pot calling the kettle black? Have you ever seen how your bunch spell "programme"?!?!?!!   

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 5):
I doubt it'll Iran to scrap their nuclear program

Probably not, but so long as they don't antagonise the USA, Europe, or Israel then I couldn't give a stuff how many nukes they have. Personally I'm much more concerned about India-Pakistan, but unfortunately most people in the West are blissfully unaware about that bubbling cauldron because they are distracted by the sideshows in Iran and DPRK.

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 6):
Then please tell that to Israel

It's funny, if one were to look at our domestic political opinions and guess which one supported Israel and which one diametrically opposed to it then they would almost certainly guess incorrectly. Don't get me wrong, I respect your opinions with the value they deserve, but it nonetheless surprises me how the chips fall  
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
TheCommodore
Topic Author
Posts: 3458
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:14 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:04 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 15):
It's funny, if one were to look at our domestic political opinions and guess which one supported Israel and which one diametrically opposed to it then they would almost certainly guess incorrectly.

Not sure I follow you correctly....?  

Both our political parties, Labor and Liberal, support Israel unequivocally. In fact, many federal pollies have been on junket visits to Israel.

Why, well I'm not exactly sure ?

I don't think Australia pays for other foreign Politicians to visit here. Yet Israel has done this in Australia over many years.

Whatever the reason/s I think its fairly suspicious...

Read below

http://antonyloewenstein.com/2010/10...tralian-minds-and-very-few-resist/
“At first, they'll only dislike what you say, but the more correct you start sounding the more they'll dislike you.”
 
seb146
Posts: 13768
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

RE: Obama & Iran President Become Penpals

Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:30 am

Quoting solarflyer22 (Reply 9):
there is a certain formality around letters in Iran and in Persian culture the single worst thing you can do is ignore a letter.

In the movie "Russian Ark" is an exchange between the heads of Russia and Persia where the Persian is apologizing for the murder of Russian diplomats during an uprising. It is all theater. A hundred or so spectators in their finest clothes, the Russian host in his robes and scepter. All in a large room in the Winter Palace. The narrator says something like "We should leave. This will go on for a long time."

There are many subtle nuances in culture of other lands that some people don't get. I didn't know about the letter thing until now. But, I don't know any Persians. I find that sort of thing interesting. Others don't.
Life in the wall is a drag.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: einsteinboricua, Redd, tommy1808 and 36 guests