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zkojq
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Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:11 pm

The Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny has been detained by police then released weeks ahead of a presidential election in which he has been barred from running.

The 41-year-old anti-corruption campaigner has been jailed repeatedly for organising some of Russia’s biggest protests in recent years against what he says are the gilded lives of Vladimir Putin and his inner circle.

Navalny said on Twitter that police had detained him on Thursday as he left an appointment with his dentist. He said they had released him just under an hour later, but had started legal proceedings against him for organising illegal protests.

“They offered me a lift somewhere, but I declined and have gone to work. I don’t understand what happened, and why it took seven people to detain me,” he said.
If found guilty, Navalny faces up to 30 days in jail.

The latest detentions came ahead of a march on Sunday in memory of the opposition leader Boris Nemtsov, who was on a bridge near the Kremlin.

Navalny has faced a string of administrative and criminal charges that he and his supporters see as politically motivated since he became the leading opposition figure campaigning against Putin’s rule at mass rallies in 2011 and 2012.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... l-election

Honestly, what a joke. I guess he is lucky not to have been shot, or have found to have committed "suicide" but this is still pretty low. One likes to think that democratic causes are moving forwards, but they clearly aren't in some parts of the world.
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:23 pm

Anyone with two eyes and a nose can see that Alexei was jailed so that some kind of criminal record appears and he is barred from running. You're right: he should thank his lucky stars he wasn't "in an accident".

But hey, this is the country led by the strong man that the GOP is suddenly in love with so I wouldn't put it past them to engage in similar tactic (using the FBI for that goal).
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:34 pm

Quelle surprise
 
Redd
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:43 pm

Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:50 pm

Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html


Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:05 pm

jetero wrote:
Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html


Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.


Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.
I have all day.
 
cledaybuck
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:12 pm

CCGPV wrote:
jetero wrote:
Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html


Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.


Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.
Really? Didn't he have rallies chanting "lock her up?" Hasn't he said many times that she should be the one being investigated right now?
 
Scorpius
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:14 pm

Is someone else taking this clown seriously?
Bulk has never been and will never become a threat or a serious opponent of the current government. Stop kicking this horse. She died a long time ago.
The Russian opposition is itself the best killer of the Russian opposition. It is enough to recall the story with an attempt by Russian opposition parties to create a kind of unification. All failed because these boobies were unable to compromise even with each other.
 
WIederling
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:15 pm

Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html


PiSing it all away.

What I do wonder how people here come to the conclusion that Navalny is "opposition leader" ?

his party has zero seats in the duma. less members than the communist party in the US ...
The man is a clown artificially propped up here.
Murphy is an optimist
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:20 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
jetero wrote:

Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.


Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.
Really? Didn't he have rallies chanting "lock her up?" Hasn't he said many times that she should be the one being investigated right now?


Yes, chanting to a crowd during a Trump campaign rally during an election is exactly equal to imprisoning political opponents for bogus reasons after being a dictator for over a decade. Seeing he's opened an investigation into Hillary since them....oh wait he hasn't because it was just political BS speech during an election.

Do you honestly believe Trump wants to imprison and execute political opponents in order to become a dictator in the United States of America?
I have all day.
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:25 pm

jetero wrote:
cledaybuck wrote:
CCGPV wrote:

Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.
Really? Didn't he have rallies chanting "lock her up?" Hasn't he said many times that she should be the one being investigated right now?


Including today.

Essentially directing the AG over Twitter to investigate his political opponents:

-Hillary Clinton

-Adam Schiff

-Jim Comey

-Barack Obama

etc. etc. etc.

Calling investigations of his political allies a "witch hunt."

It's very strange what you seem to notice and what you don't, New Member CCGPV.


Yes, calling for investigations on twitter and imprisoning people under dubious laws is the same...sure thing.

What have all these calls trump makes has resulted in? Absolutely nothing because nobody actually believes it- including Trump. He's just being Trump and speaking to his base. He's not actually doing anything. You are falling for his trolling. The day after he was elected he said we shouldn't concentrate on investigating Hillary.

What's strange about pointing out how reactionary people are over things that aren't actually happening?
I have all day.
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:27 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
jetero wrote:

Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.


Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.
Really? Didn't he have rallies chanting "lock her up?" Hasn't he said many times that she should be the one being investigated right now?


Including today.

Essentially directing the AG over Twitter to investigate his political opponents:

-Hillary Clinton

-Adam Schiff

-Jim Comey

-Barack Obama

etc. etc. etc.

Calling investigations of his political allies a "witch hunt."

It's very strange what you seem to notice and what you don't, New Member CCGPV.
 
jetero
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Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:38 pm

CCGPV wrote:
What have all these calls trump makes has resulted in? Absolutely nothing because nobody actually believes it- including Trump.


Then what's the point in saying it?

CCGPV wrote:
He's just being Trump and speaking to his base.


You mean riling people up?

CCGPV wrote:
He's not actually doing anything. You are falling for his trolling.


Your logic is confounding. He's saying something that he doesn't believe to a group of people, none of whom believe it either for the purpose of "speaking to his base."

Er, alrighty then.

CCGPV wrote:
The day after he was elected he said we shouldn't concentrate on investigating Hillary.


And since then he's said the opposite just for sh*ts and giggles?

CCGPV wrote:
What's strange about pointing out how reactionary people are over things that aren't actually happening?


What'll your litmus test be as to when things "start happening," CCGPV?

You've got a seahawk thing going on, dontcha?
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:40 pm

jetero wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
What have all these calls trump makes has resulted in? Absolutely nothing because nobody actually believes it- including Trump.


Then what's the point in saying it?

CCGPV wrote:
He's just being Trump and speaking to his base.


You mean riling people up?

CCGPV wrote:
He's not actually doing anything. You are falling for his trolling.


Your logic is confounding. He's saying something that he doesn't believe to a group of people, none of whom believe it either for the purpose of "speaking to his base."

Er, alrighty then.

CCGPV wrote:
The day after he was elected he said we shouldn't concentrate on investigating Hillary.


And since then he's said the opposite just for sh*ts and giggles?

CCGPV wrote:
What's strange about pointing out how reactionary people are over things that aren't actually happening?


What'll your litmus test be as to when things "start happening," CCGPV?

You've got a seahawk thing going on, dontcha?


The point in saying it is to pivot the news away from him.

Yes, riling his base up. It works.

Yes, he is. There have been numerous polls that show his base loves to hate the Clintons. It works for him so he pushes it. He obviously doesn't believe it behind closed doors due to the complete inaction by any government agency actually investigating the Clintons. He has the power and authority to do so but he has not. What other indications do you want?

Yes, pretty much for shits and giggles. His twitter and half his speeches are stream of conscious vomiting.

I think the litmus test is when the FBI or other government agency makes a political arrest or something similar, which hasn't and wont happen. Do you really think that's possible?

Do you really believe he has aspirations to be a dictator? I mean do you really think that?

And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.
I have all day.
 
Scorpius
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:52 pm

CCGPV wrote:

And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.

...but at the same time, you allow yourself to call Putin a dictator. Amusingly.
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:00 pm

Scorpius wrote:
CCGPV wrote:

And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.

...but at the same time, you allow yourself to call Putin a dictator. Amusingly.


I don't really consider it a real democratic system (and neither does the rest of the world) so I guess so.
I have all day.
 
Scorpius
Posts: 468
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:12 pm

CCGPV wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
CCGPV wrote:

And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.

...but at the same time, you allow yourself to call Putin a dictator. Amusingly.


I don't really consider it a real democratic system (and neither does the rest of the world) so I guess so.

You can as much as necessary to hold the government of Russia are not democratic. From this the crux of the not will change. For that matter, no government guarantees and protects the rights and interests of ordinary citizens under capitalism. Instead, the capitalist government serves the interests of the holders of large capital, making it essentially oligarchic rather than democratic.
In any case, Putin is dictator exactly to the same extent as, for example, the king of Sweden or the Queen of Britain, or the Emperor of Japan, or any other country relying on one leader standing at the head of state.
I will tell you more-in "dictatorial" Russia, an ordinary citizen has more freedoms than in many "democratic" countries.
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:33 pm

Interesting CCGPV, very interesting.

In another thread you stated that you hope Trump "gets nailed, too," but you wish people would stop criticizing Trump because we may very well "be embarrassed."

You then say the Democrats don't have a strategy and are doomed to fail. You are presented with at least some evidence to the contrary, which you dismiss. You are invited to share your own perspective as to how things can be done differently. You decline.

BUT you continue posting stuff of this ilk? You're so sensitive about the prospect of "being embarrassed," and hoping he "gets nailed" that you go out of your way to defend his behavior as meaning "nothing." Once again, you profess that you're concerned about the Democrats' prospects in the 2018 elections, saying they're "doing it all wrong," yet spend any of your energy engaging on that topic.

Very, very strange.

CCGPV wrote:
The point in saying it is to pivot the news away from him.


Don't disagree.

CCGPV wrote:
Yes, riling his base up. It works.


The base that who you said before "doesn't believe it"?

So if we took a poll (hell, I'm sure there are plenty out there) of self-identified Trump supporters, and we ask them whether they think that Hillary is guilty of a crime, in fact "the real criminal," what would you expect the response to be? If you say that the majority of them would say "Yes" (and I think we can agree that's an understatement if there ever were one), why would they not believe Trump when he questions the AG over Twitter as to why she is not being investigated? You're saying that they just shrug him off, i.e., "Ha, ha, ha, that just Trump being Trump"?

CCGPV wrote:
He has the power and authority to do so but he has not.


Does he?

CCGPV wrote:
What other indications do you want?


Well one standard--albeit an old one--would be not to say anything, no? Is your contention that Trump is just throwing red meat at his rabid base--"inciting" them, which you agree that he does--and they're not going to demand actual blood one day? That Trump is, at heart, a responsible leader who is putting on all of this for show because he knows that at the end of the day said rabid base wouldn't be happy with his policies?

CCGPV wrote:
I think the litmus test is when the FBI or other government agency makes a political arrest or something similar, which hasn't and wont happen. Do you really think that's possible?


It isn't possible until it is, now is it? And history has plenty of examples of that.

CCGPV wrote:
Do you really believe he has aspirations to be a dictator? I mean do you really think that?


Well, let's think about what he says repeatedly and whether or not we can trace such behavior to prior dictators that weren't "dictators" once.

-Implying that if he loses the election is "rigged"

-Spreading a narrative of voter fraud

-Spreading a narrative that the media is lying

-Illogically blaming failures on political opponents (e.g., "Why didn't Obama do anything about election meddling?" thereby implying it's wrong, but by the same token, not taking any personal responsibility)

-Lying day after day after day

CCGPV wrote:
And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.


Strange thing to focus one's energy on getting annoyed about.

I see you joined a month ago and, on cursory glance, can see you've only posted in this Non-Aviation forum.

Did you join to spread your belief that if Democrats are going to win in 2018, they should stop being critical of Trump?

Very, very, very strange.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:33 pm

Scorpius wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
...but at the same time, you allow yourself to call Putin a dictator. Amusingly.


I don't really consider it a real democratic system (and neither does the rest of the world) so I guess so.

You can as much as necessary to hold the government of Russia are not democratic. From this the crux of the not will change. For that matter, no government guarantees and protects the rights and interests of ordinary citizens under capitalism. Instead, the capitalist government serves the interests of the holders of large capital, making it essentially oligarchic rather than democratic.
In any case, Putin is dictator exactly to the same extent as, for example, the king of Sweden or the Queen of Britain, or the Emperor of Japan, or any other country relying on one leader standing at the head of state.


- We explained this again and again. You know nothing about the world. Queen of Britain, Emperor of Japan or any other King in Europe doesn't have any real power. Putin is an autocrat, so he has almost all the power, see the difference there? :lol:

- The difference in wealth in Russia is higher than in India. Much less in the developed world, crazy capitalist :lol:

Scorpius wrote:
I will tell you more-in "dictatorial" Russia, an ordinary citizen has more freedoms than in many "democratic" countries.


Please observe the forum roles, if you claim something outlandish, please offer reliable proof and not your brainwashed self.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
CCGPV
Posts: 975
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:18 pm

Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:45 pm

jetero wrote:
Interesting CCGPV, very interesting.

In another thread you stated that you hope Trump "gets nailed, too," but you wish people would stop criticizing Trump because we may very well "be embarrassed."

You then say the Democrats don't have a strategy and are doomed to fail. You are presented with at least some evidence to the contrary, which you dismiss. You are invited to share your own perspective as to how things can be done differently. You decline.

BUT you continue posting stuff of this ilk? You're so sensitive about the prospect of "being embarrassed," and hoping he "gets nailed" that you go out of your way to defend his behavior as meaning "nothing." Once again, you profess that you're concerned about the Democrats' prospects in the 2018 elections, saying they're "doing it all wrong," yet spend any of your energy engaging on that topic.

Very, very strange.

CCGPV wrote:
The point in saying it is to pivot the news away from him.


Don't disagree.

CCGPV wrote:
Yes, riling his base up. It works.


The base that who you said before "doesn't believe it"?

So if we took a poll (hell, I'm sure there are plenty out there) of self-identified Trump supporters, and we ask them whether they think that Hillary is guilty of a crime, in fact "the real criminal," what would you expect the response to be? If you say that the majority of them would say "Yes" (and I think we can agree that's an understatement if there ever were one), why would they not believe Trump when he questions the AG over Twitter as to why she is not being investigated? You're saying that they just shrug him off, i.e., "Ha, ha, ha, that just Trump being Trump"?

CCGPV wrote:
He has the power and authority to do so but he has not.


Does he?

CCGPV wrote:
What other indications do you want?


Well one standard--albeit an old one--would be not to say anything, no? Is your contention that Trump is just throwing red meat at his rabid base--"inciting" them, which you agree that he does--and they're not going to demand actual blood one day? That Trump is, at heart, a responsible leader who is putting on all of this for show because he knows that at the end of the day said rabid base wouldn't be happy with his policies?

CCGPV wrote:
I think the litmus test is when the FBI or other government agency makes a political arrest or something similar, which hasn't and wont happen. Do you really think that's possible?


It isn't possible until it is, now is it? And history has plenty of examples of that.

CCGPV wrote:
Do you really believe he has aspirations to be a dictator? I mean do you really think that?


Well, let's think about what he says repeatedly and whether or not we can trace such behavior to prior dictators that weren't "dictators" once.

-Implying that if he loses the election is "rigged"

-Spreading a narrative of voter fraud

-Spreading a narrative that the media is lying

-Illogically blaming failures on political opponents (e.g., "Why didn't Obama do anything about election meddling?" thereby implying it's wrong, but by the same token, not taking any personal responsibility)

-Lying day after day after day

CCGPV wrote:
And for the umpteenth time I'll say I don't support Trump or his agenda. I'm not even a republican. It just annoys me when people make claims like we are in a dictatorship or Trump is acting like one- because its rediculous.


Strange thing to focus one's energy on getting annoyed about.

I see you joined a month ago and, on cursory glance, can see you've only posted in this Non-Aviation forum.

Did you join to spread your belief that if Democrats are going to win in 2018, they should stop being critical of Trump?

Very, very, very strange.


Why do you keep saying "very strange" "and very interesting." Are you implying I'm pretending to be some other user or something? Maybe I'm a Russian troll? I've posted in Tech ops and Civil Av as well.

I don't have this grand political agenda that you seem to think I do. I'm just taking every thread I talk in individually. Just like you I'm just another moron on the internet.

I want Trump to get nailed because I enjoy a political fiasco and their resulting books, documentaries, and news stories. Its simply entertainment. If he gets impeached I'm going to enjoy watching the Trumpers go bananas and if he's completely exonerated I'm going to enjoy watching the Left lose their minds. Either outcome will have virtually zero affect on my life what so ever.

The evidence in the other thread was about state house races in Florida. That had nothing to do with the national election and is not generally an indication of how a state will go in a national election. That's all I was saying.

Of course Trump's supporters think Hillary is a criminal and they believe his Tweets but they don't act upon it. They are reactionary idiots just like most people. He's saying things they want to hear but he's not acting on them in an official way- AKA opening an investigation, etc.

No, they will not want "blood one day" because people forget and move on to the next boogyman. These aren't high-information voters we're talking about.

You keep mentioning narrative....and that's exactly what it is. Just him talking like an idiot. He can say all these crazy things but, again, there's no action. Of course he lies, of course he says dumb things. Literally everyone knows that.

Or is this still very strange?
I have all day.
 
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readytotaxi
Posts: 5259
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:56 pm

Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html

Agree, Poland is slipping back after good progress.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
jetero
Posts: 2762
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:04 pm

CCGPV wrote:
Why do you keep saying "very strange" "and very interesting." Are you implying I'm pretending to be some other user or something? Maybe I'm a Russian troll? I've posted in Tech ops and Civil Av as well.

I don't have this grand political agenda that you seem to think I do. I'm just taking every thread I talk in individually. Just like you I'm just another moron on the internet.

I want Trump to get nailed because I enjoy a political fiasco and their resulting books, documentaries, and news stories. Its simply entertainment. If he gets impeached I'm going to enjoy watching the Trumpers go bananas and if he's completely exonerated I'm going to enjoy watching the Left lose their minds. Either outcome will have virtually zero affect on my life what so ever.

The evidence in the other thread was about state house races in Florida. That had nothing to do with the national election and is not generally an indication of how a state will go in a national election. That's all I was saying.

Of course Trump's supporters think Hillary is a criminal and they believe his Tweets but they don't act upon it. They are reactionary idiots just like most people. He's saying things they want to hear but he's not acting on them in an official way- AKA opening an investigation, etc.

No, they will not want "blood one day" because people forget and move on to the next boogyman. These aren't high-information voters we're talking about.

You keep mentioning narrative....and that's exactly what it is. Just him talking like an idiot. He can say all these crazy things but, again, there's no action. Of course he lies, of course he says dumb things. Literally everyone knows that.

Or is this still very strange?


Less strange.

So, in short, you're a cynic who loves political theater and not really interested in a dialogue (or as much as can happen over an Internet forum).

OK.
 
CCGPV
Posts: 975
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:18 pm

Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:16 pm

jetero wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
Why do you keep saying "very strange" "and very interesting." Are you implying I'm pretending to be some other user or something? Maybe I'm a Russian troll? I've posted in Tech ops and Civil Av as well.

I don't have this grand political agenda that you seem to think I do. I'm just taking every thread I talk in individually. Just like you I'm just another moron on the internet.

I want Trump to get nailed because I enjoy a political fiasco and their resulting books, documentaries, and news stories. Its simply entertainment. If he gets impeached I'm going to enjoy watching the Trumpers go bananas and if he's completely exonerated I'm going to enjoy watching the Left lose their minds. Either outcome will have virtually zero affect on my life what so ever.

The evidence in the other thread was about state house races in Florida. That had nothing to do with the national election and is not generally an indication of how a state will go in a national election. That's all I was saying.

Of course Trump's supporters think Hillary is a criminal and they believe his Tweets but they don't act upon it. They are reactionary idiots just like most people. He's saying things they want to hear but he's not acting on them in an official way- AKA opening an investigation, etc.

No, they will not want "blood one day" because people forget and move on to the next boogyman. These aren't high-information voters we're talking about.

You keep mentioning narrative....and that's exactly what it is. Just him talking like an idiot. He can say all these crazy things but, again, there's no action. Of course he lies, of course he says dumb things. Literally everyone knows that.

Or is this still very strange?


Less strange.

So, in short, you're a cynic who loves political theater and not really interested in a dialogue (or as much as can happen over an Internet forum).

OK.


I love dialogue. But when people are convinced literally everything Trump (or whoever) does is a disaster what can you say to them? They are so far up their own you know what. That's why I butt in these overtly political threads. When its constructive I just read and move on but when someone makes an inflammatory or untrue claim I come in and try and be a moderate voice. You originally made a statement implying we were on the cusp of a Trump dictatorship with political imprisonment imminent and I called you out on how over the top that was. Simple as that.
I have all day.
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:27 pm

CCGPV wrote:
I love dialogue. That's why I butt in these overtly political threads. When its constructive I just read and move on but when someone makes an inflammatory or untrue claim I come in and try and be a moderate voice. You originally made a statement implying we were on the cusp of a Trump dictatorship with political imprisonment imminent and I called you out on how over the top that was. Simple as that.


Well if your standard is "it's over the top" because you think "it's over the top," QED, I wouldn't call that much of a dialogue. By your self-described standard a country is a democracy one day and a dictatorship the next when "something is actually done." I disagree with you as I think history has shown such things have evolved over time as a person in an elected position slowly, but actively, erodes trust in government. It is an event when a country goes from it being completely unheard of to call for a president to question the legitimacy of an election or rally supporters for criminal prosecution of his opponent to it suddenly becoming OK. When one of the "checks" in constitutional government essentially gives him a free pass to do so, that represents further degradation. Both of those bridges has been crossed. It's not a "que sera, sera, everyone knows it's not real" moment. Your flippancy in and of itself is disturbing.

I'm sure plenty on here would agree. Hell, I know of several members who lived through such an experience.

But I'm sure plenty would agree with your flippancy.
 
Scorpius
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:42 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
CCGPV wrote:

I don't really consider it a real democratic system (and neither does the rest of the world) so I guess so.

You can as much as necessary to hold the government of Russia are not democratic. From this the crux of the not will change. For that matter, no government guarantees and protects the rights and interests of ordinary citizens under capitalism. Instead, the capitalist government serves the interests of the holders of large capital, making it essentially oligarchic rather than democratic.
In any case, Putin is dictator exactly to the same extent as, for example, the king of Sweden or the Queen of Britain, or the Emperor of Japan, or any other country relying on one leader standing at the head of state.


- We explained this again and again. You know nothing about the world. Queen of Britain, Emperor of Japan or any other King in Europe doesn't have any real power. Putin is an autocrat, so he has almost all the power, see the difference there? :lol:

- The difference in wealth in Russia is higher than in India. Much less in the developed world, crazy capitalist :lol:

Scorpius wrote:
I will tell you more-in "dictatorial" Russia, an ordinary citizen has more freedoms than in many "democratic" countries.


Please observe the forum roles, if you claim something outlandish, please offer reliable proof and not your brainwashed self.


You're throwing statements here that you're not even trying to prove. According to international studies (UN R/P 10% index), the stratification of income in the United States(18,5), Britain(13,8) and, for example, in Israel(13,4) is higher than in Russia(12,7).
So once again you show how you are brainwashed by propaganda.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:59 pm

Image

On income equality: Russia 98 and India 77, Gini Index, thus right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribut ... _of_wealth

India, median: 1,040
Russia, median: 871

Thus right.

Woepsie Scorpius, wrong again. I take no pleasure in continuously proving you wrong, but your worldview is just so twisted and has nothing to do with reality.

So now back-up your fairytale ;-)
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:41 pm

jetero wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
I love dialogue. That's why I butt in these overtly political threads. When its constructive I just read and move on but when someone makes an inflammatory or untrue claim I come in and try and be a moderate voice. You originally made a statement implying we were on the cusp of a Trump dictatorship with political imprisonment imminent and I called you out on how over the top that was. Simple as that.


Well if your standard is "it's over the top" because you think "it's over the top," QED, I wouldn't call that much of a dialogue. By your self-described standard a country is a democracy one day and a dictatorship the next when "something is actually done." I disagree with you as I think history has shown such things have evolved over time as a person in an elected position slowly, but actively, erodes trust in government. It is an event when a country goes from it being completely unheard of to call for a president to question the legitimacy of an election or rally supporters for criminal prosecution of his opponent to it suddenly becoming OK. When one of the "checks" in constitutional government essentially gives him a free pass to do so, that represents further degradation. Both of those bridges has been crossed. It's not a "que sera, sera, everyone knows it's not real" moment. Your flippancy in and of itself is disturbing.

I'm sure plenty on here would agree. Hell, I know of several members who lived through such an experience.

But I'm sure plenty would agree with your flippancy.


Well yes I always base my replies on my opinion. I think saying the USA is starting down the road towards dictatorship or anything like that is a bit much. I guess I just have more faith in the system and the American people.

You are right that its a slow march towards things like that but we have a long history of stable transfer of power- something other nations didn't have. That's our saving grace. Nobody thought things would be where they are now with Trump in 2015 and I have faith that things can and will swing back the other way. They always have and I think they will.

I might be flippant but I just don't see any indications of any major changes. The man can't even get through a press conference and we're expecting him to alter the fabric of the USA? I guess I'm either naive or I just don't see it as such a dire situation. I've lived in some oppressive and backwards places in my life and I just chuckle to myself when I see people talking about how America is finished or has change "so much" since Trump. Its kind of insulting to be honest.
I have all day.
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:05 pm

CCGPV wrote:
I might be flippant but I just don't see any indications of any major changes. The man can't even get through a press conference and we're expecting him to alter the fabric of the USA? I guess I'm either naive or I just don't see it as such a dire situation. I've lived in some oppressive and backwards places in my life and I just chuckle to myself when I see people talking about how America is finished or has change "so much" since Trump. Its kind of insulting to be honest.


I think the increasing "normalcy" of things that were "unacceptable" before as described above (case in point in "The Snake" poem today) is pretty remarkable for a country like the United States.

But these things can't be measured so it's all relative. That said, I also don't find any comfort in the fact that other countries have "changed much more" or "are way worse."
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:47 pm

jetero wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
I might be flippant but I just don't see any indications of any major changes. The man can't even get through a press conference and we're expecting him to alter the fabric of the USA? I guess I'm either naive or I just don't see it as such a dire situation. I've lived in some oppressive and backwards places in my life and I just chuckle to myself when I see people talking about how America is finished or has change "so much" since Trump. Its kind of insulting to be honest.


I think the increasing "normalcy" of things that were "unacceptable" before as described above (case in point in "The Snake" poem today) is pretty remarkable for a country like the United States.

But these things can't be measured so it's all relative. That said, I also don't find any comfort in the fact that other countries have "changed much more" or "are way worse."


I agree. The one thing I think we have with Trump though is that he's so far different than traditional politicians we might see that sort of rhetoric from a President die off with his administration. I can't imagine a Romney, Clinton, or Sanders taunting other nations or using such coarse language if they were President. I can't think of any legitimate politician coming up that would, either. Again, fingers crossed.

I'm still going to stick to my trust in the people and larger government apparatus mindset for the time being.
I have all day.
 
jetero
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:58 pm

CCGPV wrote:
jetero wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
I might be flippant but I just don't see any indications of any major changes. The man can't even get through a press conference and we're expecting him to alter the fabric of the USA? I guess I'm either naive or I just don't see it as such a dire situation. I've lived in some oppressive and backwards places in my life and I just chuckle to myself when I see people talking about how America is finished or has change "so much" since Trump. Its kind of insulting to be honest.


I think the increasing "normalcy" of things that were "unacceptable" before as described above (case in point in "The Snake" poem today) is pretty remarkable for a country like the United States.

But these things can't be measured so it's all relative. That said, I also don't find any comfort in the fact that other countries have "changed much more" or "are way worse."


I agree. The one thing I think we have with Trump though is that he's so far different than traditional politicians we might see that sort of rhetoric from a President die off with his administration. I can't imagine a Romney, Clinton, or Sanders taunting other nations or using such coarse language if they were President. I can't think of any legitimate politician coming up that would, either. Again, fingers crossed.

I'm still going to stick to my trust in the people and larger government apparatus mindset for the time being.


I can appreciate that. Thanks for indulging me.
 
Jouhou
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:24 am

Scorpius wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
...but at the same time, you allow yourself to call Putin a dictator. Amusingly.


I don't really consider it a real democratic system (and neither does the rest of the world) so I guess so.

You can as much as necessary to hold the government of Russia are not democratic. From this the crux of the not will change. For that matter, no government guarantees and protects the rights and interests of ordinary citizens under capitalism. Instead, the capitalist government serves the interests of the holders of large capital, making it essentially oligarchic rather than democratic.
In any case, Putin is dictator exactly to the same extent as, for example, the king of Sweden or the Queen of Britain, or the Emperor of Japan, or any other country relying on one leader standing at the head of state.
I will tell you more-in "dictatorial" Russia, an ordinary citizen has more freedoms than in many "democratic" countries.


Putin is an autocrat. He is unique where he does seem to actually care about his country. But only his country. Everyone else not so much.

I don't get the point of jailing the opposition when Putin has other methods of ensuring he doesn't lose. I wonder if he's getting paranoid after pissing off the governments of so many other countries in such a short time.

I'm also not sure how credible your enthusiasm for your nation is when you won't acknowledge the existence of the Olgino bots. Most Russians are well aware of them. You'd have to be living under a rock in Siberia to not know.
CCGPV wrote:
jetero wrote:
Redd wrote:
Same is happening in Poland. The government just arrested a Solidarity anti-communist icon for ''obstructing a pro-government rally'' . Communism is alive and well in Russia and Poland again.

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/0 ... itics.html


Trump would do it in the U.S. if he could. Unfortunately, I fear that there's only a very thin line preventing him from trying now.


Are people really this out of touch? Talk about paranoia.


It's readily apparent the man isn't well versed in the founding documents of the nation. He doesn't seem to understand boundaries(except for the mexican one? And that's questionable). However by virtue of that same ineptitude he'd likely blunder horribly any attempt to give himself enough legal power to be a dictator.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:09 am

Jouhou wrote:
Putin is an autocrat. He is unique where he does seem to actually care about his country. But only his country. Everyone else not so much.


Does he though? Or does he care more about his own position and the clique around him that is the base of his power?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
Scorpius
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:35 am

Dutchy wrote:
Image

On income equality: Russia 98 and India 77, Gini Index, thus right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribut ... _of_wealth

India, median: 1,040
Russia, median: 871

Thus right.

Woepsie Scorpius, wrong again. I take no pleasure in continuously proving you wrong, but your worldview is just so twisted and has nothing to do with reality.

So now back-up your fairytale ;-)

Image

Quite often, the Gini coefficient is given without a description of the grouping of the population, that is, there is often no information about what exactly the quantiles divided the set. So, the more groups shared the same combination (over the quantiles), the higher value of the Gini coefficient.
The Gini coefficient does not take into account the source of income, that is, for a certain geographical unit (country, region, etc.) the Gini coefficient can be quite low, but at the same time some part of the population provides its income at the expense of excessive labor, and the other-at the expense of property. For example, in Sweden, the Gini coefficient is quite low, but only 5% of households own 77% of the shares of the total number of shares owned by all households. This ensures that 5% of the income that the rest of the population receives at the expense of labor.
The Lorentz curve and Gini coefficient method in the study of the uneven distribution of income among the population deals only with cash income, while some workers are paid in the form of food, etc.; also widespread is the practice of issuing wages to employees in the form of options for the purchase of shares of the employer company (the latter consideration is insignificant, the option itself is not income, it is only an opportunity to get income by selling, for example, shares, and when the shares are sold and the seller received money, this income is already taken into account when calculating the Gini coefficient).
Differences in methods of collecting statistical data to calculate the Gini coefficient leads to difficulties (or even impossibility) in comparison the obtained coefficients.

Anyway, I don't know why you're lying all the time.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:47 am

CCGPV wrote:
That's why I butt in these overtly political threads. When its constructive I just read and move on but when someone makes an inflammatory or untrue claim I come in and try and be a moderate voice. .



You will never be considered any sort of moderate.


Jouhou wrote:
However by virtue of that same ineptitude he'd likely blunder horribly any attempt to give himself enough legal power to be a dictator.


Agreed. I'm not even convinced he ever actually wanted this job to begin with.

The one "dictatorial" thing he's doing right, getting rid of the folks who got him elected, is, to me, a red herring. There haven't been anything like enough events he can make decent propaganda off of, nor a strong enough opposition narrative to solidify his position. Let's also not forget the not inconsequential fact that he's not only beyond reasonable retirement age, but wealthy as well. There's just no real motivation for him to go that route.


None of the above is intended to imply he's doing a good or even defensible job as president. Just that him becoming a dictator is unlikely.
Much like a GE90, I'm a huge fan of Big Twins...
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:59 am

Scorpius wrote:
Anyway, I don't know why you're lying all the time.


Namecalling again, your preferred way of communications. That's why I said I didn't believe your apologies were sincere and they weren't.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
Jouhou
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:34 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Putin is an autocrat. He is unique where he does seem to actually care about his country. But only his country. Everyone else not so much.


Does he though? Or does he care more about his own position and the clique around him that is the base of his power?



He is former KGB. He acts in line with that history, so I do not doubt he has retained the kind of mentality an agent of such an infamous intelligence agency would have. He is loyal to Russia but "the end justifies the means". There would be no reason to be pissing off multiple nations at once it it was simply about fleecing his people.

Agents of intelligence agencies are among the most loyal people to their respective countries- so much so that they are willing to do terrible things for the sake of their country.
 
WIederling
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:04 pm

Jouhou wrote:
Agents of intelligence agencies are among the most loyal people to their respective countries- so much so that they are willing to do terrible things for the perceived sake of their country.


And they also lose complete contact to reality.
Look into the bio of the lesser Dulles brother, The CIA and its predecessor. then follow up with all the "gone overboard" snooping done by NSA and their brethren. Look into human experimenting continuity from 3rd Reich to post WWII USA. Look into all the things done in scope of "Domino theory of regions falling to communism".

all shows that select people "are willing to do terrible things" for whatever highflying cheap objectives they have.
Humanism has not touched the US.

The nice thing with Putin is _he is rational_.
Murphy is an optimist
 
CCGPV
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:28 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
CCGPV wrote:
That's why I butt in these overtly political threads. When its constructive I just read and move on but when someone makes an inflammatory or untrue claim I come in and try and be a moderate voice. .



You will never be considered any sort of moderate.


Jouhou wrote:
However by virtue of that same ineptitude he'd likely blunder horribly any attempt to give himself enough legal power to be a dictator.


Agreed. I'm not even convinced he ever actually wanted this job to begin with.

The one "dictatorial" thing he's doing right, getting rid of the folks who got him elected, is, to me, a red herring. There haven't been anything like enough events he can make decent propaganda off of, nor a strong enough opposition narrative to solidify his position. Let's also not forget the not inconsequential fact that he's not only beyond reasonable retirement age, but wealthy as well. There's just no real motivation for him to go that route.


None of the above is intended to imply he's doing a good or even defensible job as president. Just that him becoming a dictator is unlikely.


Why not? What's so radical about anything I've said?
I have all day.
 
c933103
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:36 pm

Scorpius wrote:
Is someone else taking this clown seriously?
Bulk has never been and will never become a threat or a serious opponent of the current government. Stop kicking this horse. She died a long time ago.
The Russian opposition is itself the best killer of the Russian opposition. It is enough to recall the story with an attempt by Russian opposition parties to create a kind of unification. All failed because these boobies were unable to compromise even with each other.

And yet Russian government still do what they did to stop him despite being a non-threat?
 
Scorpius
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:12 pm

c933103 wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
Is someone else taking this clown seriously?
Bulk has never been and will never become a threat or a serious opponent of the current government. Stop kicking this horse. She died a long time ago.
The Russian opposition is itself the best killer of the Russian opposition. It is enough to recall the story with an attempt by Russian opposition parties to create a kind of unification. All failed because these boobies were unable to compromise even with each other.

And yet Russian government still do what they did to stop him despite being a non-threat?

If the Russian government really wanted to do something with Navalny - he would have been in prison for a long time or escaped from the country. But you somehow it turns out that the evil Russian government is afraid of Navalny, but for some reason it does not touch. Wonderful miracle!
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:34 pm

Scorpius wrote:
c933103 wrote:
Scorpius wrote:
Is someone else taking this clown seriously?
Bulk has never been and will never become a threat or a serious opponent of the current government. Stop kicking this horse. She died a long time ago.
The Russian opposition is itself the best killer of the Russian opposition. It is enough to recall the story with an attempt by Russian opposition parties to create a kind of unification. All failed because these boobies were unable to compromise even with each other.

And yet Russian government still do what they did to stop him despite being a non-threat?

If the Russian government really wanted to do something with Navalny - he would have been in prison for a long time or escaped from the country. But you somehow it turns out that the evil Russian government is afraid of Navalny, but for some reason it does not touch. Wonderful miracle!


Agreed, but apparently this deems effective enough.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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DDR
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:00 pm

WIederling wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Agents of intelligence agencies are among the most loyal people to their respective countries- so much so that they are willing to do terrible things for the perceived sake of their country.


And they also lose complete contact to reality.
Look into the bio of the lesser Dulles brother, The CIA and its predecessor. then follow up with all the "gone overboard" snooping done by NSA and their brethren. Look into human experimenting continuity from 3rd Reich to post WWII USA. Look into all the things done in scope of "Domino theory of regions falling to communism".

all shows that select people "are willing to do terrible things" for whatever highflying cheap objectives they have.
Humanism has not touched the US.

The nice thing with Putin is _he is rational_.


LOL. Why do you deflect every topic and bash the U.S.? This thread is about an Russian opposition leader that was jailed.

"Humanism has not touched the US." That statement is completely subjective on YOUR part.
 
Jouhou
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:09 pm

DDR wrote:
WIederling wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Agents of intelligence agencies are among the most loyal people to their respective countries- so much so that they are willing to do terrible things for the perceived sake of their country.


And they also lose complete contact to reality.
Look into the bio of the lesser Dulles brother, The CIA and its predecessor. then follow up with all the "gone overboard" snooping done by NSA and their brethren. Look into human experimenting continuity from 3rd Reich to post WWII USA. Look into all the things done in scope of "Domino theory of regions falling to communism".

all shows that select people "are willing to do terrible things" for whatever highflying cheap objectives they have.
Humanism has not touched the US.

The nice thing with Putin is _he is rational_.


LOL. Why do you deflect every topic and bash the U.S.? This thread is about an Russian opposition leader that was jailed.

"Humanism has not touched the US." That statement is completely subjective on YOUR part.


My guess is he's from the parts of Europe flooded with Russian propaganda. The U.S. Is not as awesome as some American citizens think, but at the same time it's not so bad.
 
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DDR
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:44 pm

Jouhou wrote:
DDR wrote:
WIederling wrote:

And they also lose complete contact to reality.
Look into the bio of the lesser Dulles brother, The CIA and its predecessor. then follow up with all the "gone overboard" snooping done by NSA and their brethren. Look into human experimenting continuity from 3rd Reich to post WWII USA. Look into all the things done in scope of "Domino theory of regions falling to communism".

all shows that select people "are willing to do terrible things" for whatever highflying cheap objectives they have.
Humanism has not touched the US.

The nice thing with Putin is _he is rational_.


LOL. Why do you deflect every topic and bash the U.S.? This thread is about an Russian opposition leader that was jailed.

"Humanism has not touched the US." That statement is completely subjective on YOUR part.


My guess is he's from the parts of Europe flooded with Russian propaganda. The U.S. Is not as awesome as some American citizens think, but at the same time it's not so bad.


You are probably correct. And as an American, I love the USA but I know it is not perfect (Vietnam, Iraq, Syria) but it just becomes boring reading the same anti American crap from the same poster.
 
WIederling
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:06 am

DDR wrote:
LOL. Why do you deflect every topic and bash the U.S.? This thread is about an Russian opposition leader that was jailed.
.


And his handlers sit in the US with some rather high probability.
There is a reason why a nonentity is lifted to "opposition leader" in Western Media.
Murphy is an optimist
 
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zkojq
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:01 pm

Personally I like living in a country where politicians who campaign for change don't get arrested/killed. Sometimes they even win elections (September last year being the most recent occasion).

One wonders about the endgame for Putin. He ascended to the presidency in 2000 and though there was a gap between 2008 and 2012, he has ruled since. How long does he plan on staying? How many terms can he "win" and still hold a straight face?
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:02 pm

zkojq wrote:
Personally I like living in a country where politicians who campaign for change don't get arrested/killed. Sometimes they even win elections (September last year being the most recent occasion).

One wonders about the endgame for Putin. He ascended to the presidency in 2000 and though there was a gap between 2008 and 2012, he has ruled since. How long does he plan on staying? How many terms can he "win" and still hold a straight face?


What do you mean by a gap between 2008 - 2012? That was in name only, the real boy in town was Putin, not Dmitri Medvedev for sure. I wonder if Putin can even retire without fairing for prison or the like. Or is he going to recruit someone whom is going to protect him and put him in power, just like Jeltsin has done with him?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
salttee
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:09 pm

Jouhou wrote:
My guess is he's from the parts of Europe flooded with Russian propaganda. The U.S. Is not as awesome as some American citizens think, but at the same time it's not so bad.
In a different era, he would have been "carrying a picture of Chairman Mao."

(He) ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow !

An identifiable "type"
 
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zkojq
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:26 pm

Dutchy wrote:
zkojq wrote:
One wonders about the endgame for Putin. He ascended to the presidency in 2000 and though there was a gap between 2008 and 2012, he has ruled since. How long does he plan on staying? How many terms can he "win" and still hold a straight face?


What do you mean by a gap between 2008 - 2012? That was in name only, the real boy in town was Putin, not Dmitri Medvedev for sure. I wonder if Putin can even retire without fairing for prison or the like. Or is he going to recruit someone whom is going to protect him and put him in power, just like Jeltsin has done with him?


Yes I know, but it's all about the presence of legitimacy, right?
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Dutchy
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Re: Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny gets jailed

Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:27 pm

zkojq wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
zkojq wrote:
One wonders about the endgame for Putin. He ascended to the presidency in 2000 and though there was a gap between 2008 and 2012, he has ruled since. How long does he plan on staying? How many terms can he "win" and still hold a straight face?


What do you mean by a gap between 2008 - 2012? That was in name only, the real boy in town was Putin, not Dmitri Medvedev for sure. I wonder if Putin can even retire without fairing for prison or the like. Or is he going to recruit someone whom is going to protect him and put him in power, just like Jeltsin has done with him?


Yes I know, but it's all about the presence of legitimacy, right?


Yeah I know, the facade of legitimacy needs there (for the Russians themselves at least)
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