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Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:09 pm

So I guess Trump finally made his pick. Had to laugh all the liberal doomsdayers had their signs made up no matter who Trump nominated. Even better yet when someone went out to the campus of NYU to interview students about Trumps pick to replace Kennedy they all had a lot to say even though Trump hadn't yet picked anyone. Just shows you how ignorant college progressives are just lay out he's a racist a xenophobe etc that's the standard answer from brainwashed college students by radical professors god forbid anyone can think for themselves. This country is doomed after listening to these nitwits. At any rate good luck to this nominee I am sure Chuckie Schumer and his bunch will put him through the grinder. I can only hope Ruth Buzzi Ginsberg will now pack it in soon and Trump will get to nominate yet another SCOTUS pick.

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=11100
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:21 pm

This was one of the better gaffes:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... nomination

What's genuinely scary to our democracy is that Senator Bob Casey went on record saying that he would oppose Trump's nomination even before the nomination was known to him. Casey will not carefully weigh the selection. He won't hear Kavanaugh out, ask probing questions, then make a considered judgment.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:26 pm

I think it's fair to say that Roe v. Wade is safe.
 
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seahawk
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:29 pm

Any judge who would not overturn Roe v. Wade is too liberal and Kavanaugh lacks Christian values. Not a great pick. Better than a crazy liberal, but not as conservative as many hoped for.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:39 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
This was one of the better gaffes:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... nomination

What's genuinely scary to our democracy is that Senator Bob Casey went on record saying that he would oppose Trump's nomination even before the nomination was known to him. Casey will not carefully weigh the selection. He won't hear Kavanaugh out, ask probing questions, then make a considered judgment.


Almost (but not quite) as scary as the entire GOP not even giving Merrick Garland a hearing and preventing our democracy from being allowed to function properly in 2016.

I think Bob Casey and the Women's March could safely assume the type of judge Trump would nominate when they made those statements, especially given the fact that there was a public 'short list' to pick from.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:45 pm

2122M wrote:
Almost (but not quite) as scary as the entire GOP not even giving Merrick Garland a hearing and preventing our democracy from being allowed to function properly in 2016.

If whataboutism is your thing I suppose so.

2122M wrote:
I think Bob Casey and the Women's March could safely assume the type of judge Trump would nominate when they made those statements especially given the fact that there was a public 'short list' to pick from.

The Women's March could do more than assume the "type" of nominee. They could also safely assume who the nominee actually was, since the tweet was released after Trump announced his nomination. I just said that it was a gaffe, which it most certainly was.

As for Bob Casey, I still maintain that it is not in keeping with Democratic principles to automatically eliminate a nominee from contention before you have had a chance to ask probing questions and then make a considered judgment.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:54 pm

casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.

The hyperbole train has just left the station!

Oh, not only is Trump not a Nazi, he's not even a fascist.
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1 ... -democracy
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:57 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Almost (but not quite) as scary as the entire GOP not even giving Merrick Garland a hearing and preventing our democracy from being allowed to function properly in 2016.

If whataboutism is your thing I suppose so.

2122M wrote:
I think Bob Casey and the Women's March could safely assume the type of judge Trump would nominate when they made those statements especially given the fact that there was a public 'short list' to pick from.

The Women's March could do more than assume the "type" of nominee. They could also safely assume who the nominee actually was, since the tweet was released after Trump announced his nomination. I just said that it was a gaffe, which it most certainly was.


I'm curious as to which of the two events mentioned more "genuinely scary to our democracy". Casey knowing in advance he won't like Trumps pick, or the entire GOP blocking even a hearing for Merrick Garland? After all, you biggest fear with Casey is that this one senator "won't hear Kavanaugh out, ask probing questions, then make a considered judgment." If that scares you just a little, the behavior of the entire GOP should terrify you.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:57 pm

Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:05 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.

The hyperbole train has just left the station!

Oh, not only is Trump not a Nazi, he's not even a fascist.
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1 ... -democracy


Go back and reread my statement.
Didn't call him that. But thanks for missing the point.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:09 pm

2122M wrote:
I'm curious as to which of the two events mentioned more "genuinely scary to our democracy". Casey knowing in advance he won't like Trumps pick, or the entire GOP blocking even a hearing for Merrick Garland?

Well, your question is a false premise. But it's a good question if we rectify that.

My beef is not Casey knowing in advance that he will not like Trump's pick. My beef is that he did not withhold final judgment until after an opportunity to ask probing questions and then make a considered judgment based on the responses to those questions.

So with that clarification in mind, let's look at your question.

The Constitution is what establishes our democratic framework. So if we are asking which is more scary to our democracy, we have to look at the document that establishes that democracy.

Simply put, the Constitution did not require the Senate to hold hearings or conduct a vote on Mr. Garland. This is explained very well here:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ee/482733/

So there is no question that the Republicans were acting within the framework of the Constitution when they chose not to hold a hearing on Mr. Garland. Essentially, the Senate's "advice and consent" was to do nothing.

The Senate is clearly going to hold a hearing and take a vote in the case of Mr. Kavanaugh. Therefore, the process of "advice and consent" - which the Senate gets to choose - is going to play out differently in the case of Mr. Garland. It WILL involve a hearing. Senator Corey has made it very clear that he will not participate in the process that the body has decided to engage in.

Inasmuch as the Senate gets to decide what the process is - and Senator Corey has opted out of that process, I would say that his actions are more opposed to Constitutional principles than those of the Senate in regard to Mr. Garland.

Again, I am very sympathetic to those people who are offended over how Mr. Garland's nomination was handled. But these are just feelings. The logical side of me appreciates that everything was done within the letter of the Constitution.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:10 pm

casinterest wrote:
Go back and reread my statement.
Didn't call him that. But thanks for missing the point.

My bad. It's nice to see that you've finally dropped that false allegation! Well done!
 
LittleSprocket
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:15 pm

casinterest wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.

The hyperbole train has just left the station!

Oh, not only is Trump not a Nazi, he's not even a fascist.
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1 ... -democracy


Go back and reread my statement.
Didn't call him that. But thanks for missing the point.



You are right, you called his supporters Nazi's for voting for him. Ya'll wonder why the dimocrats lost the 2016 election? It wasn't because of Russia, it was because of people like you that claim that ANY time someone has a differing opinion on how the world should work, they are called racists, nazi's, homophobics, deplorables, and anything else under the sun that could be construed as an insult. Congratulations buddy, your continuing attacks on those that support Trump and like the way that the country is going is only going to drive more people to the polls come November.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:25 pm

LittleSprocket wrote:
You are right, you called his supporters Nazi's for voting for him. Ya'll wonder why the dimocrats lost the 2016 election? It wasn't because of Russia, it was because of people like you that claim that ANY time someone has a differing opinion on how the world should work, they are called racists, nazi's, homophobics, deplorables, and anything else under the sun that could be construed as an insult. Congratulations buddy, your continuing attacks on those that support Trump and like the way that the country is going is only going to drive more people to the polls come November.

Good points.

The whole "Nazi" allegation absurd. It's akin to saying that Bernie Sanders is supporting people who shoot Congressmen at baseball fields. Or that Hillary Clinton was secretly beholden to Antifa. Both sides have idiots.

So if we conceded that there are some idiots out there in the form of Nazis, let's look at what a threat they actually are.

Unfortunately, the Southern Poverty Law Center does not keep track of the number of Nazis. But they do keep track of the number of members of the KKK. They set this figure at between 5,000 and 8,000. Given that the KKK has a much deeper roots in America that the Nazi party, it is reasonable to infer that the number of Nazis is no greater than that amount. (There is probably substantial overlap.) And let's not forget that the Southern Poverty Law Center is not in the business of underestimating these numbers.

So if we go with their high estimate, 8,000, that is 0.002 percent of the United States Population. This is beyond infinitesimal.

And even if their impact outweighs their infinitesimal footprint, what have they actually done? I can think of one incident involving the car striking protesters at the Charlottesville rally. This was a horrible incident, for sure - and I am not saying that it is the only one - it is just the only one that I can think of without resorting to Google. My point is that you just don't read about anything other than the most isolated of incidents. You CERTAINLY don't read about their shutting down the press, killing Jews, etc.

I hate Nazis and the KKK just as much as the next guy. You have no soul if you don't. But the truth is that they are not NEARLY the threat to this country that the leftists want you to believe they are. The left has created a bogeyman to scare you into subscribing to their ideas. That is the tactic of someone who does not have logic and reason on their side.
Last edited by VTKillarney on Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:25 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
I'm curious as to which of the two events mentioned more "genuinely scary to our democracy". Casey knowing in advance he won't like Trumps pick, or the entire GOP blocking even a hearing for Merrick Garland?

Well, your question is a false premise. But it's a good question if we rectify that.

My beef is not Casey knowing in advance that he will not like Trump's pick. My beef is that he did not withhold final judgment until after an opportunity to ask probing questions and then make a considered judgment based on the responses to those questions.

So with that clarification in mind, let's look at your question.

The Constitution is what establishes our democratic framework. So if we are asking which is more scary to our democracy, we have to look at the document that establishes that democracy.

Simply put, the Constitution did not require the Senate to hold hearings or conduct a vote on Mr. Garland. This is explained very well here:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ee/482733/

So there is no question that the Republicans were acting within the framework of the Constitution when they chose not to hold a hearing on Mr. Garland. Essentially, the Senate's "advice and consent" was to do nothing.

The Senate is clearly going to hold a hearing and take a vote in the case of Mr. Kavanaugh. Therefore, the process of "advice and consent" - which the Senate gets to choose - is going to play out differently in the case of Mr. Garland. It WILL involve a hearing. Senator Corey has made it very clear that he will not participate in the process that the body has decided to engage in.

Inasmuch as the Senate gets to decide what the process is - and Senator Corey has opted out of that process, I would say that his actions are more opposed to Constitutional principles than those of the Senate in regard to Mr. Garland.

Again, I am very sympathetic to those people who are offended over how Mr. Garland's nomination was handled. But these are just feelings. The logical side of me appreciates that everything was done within the letter of the Constitution.


The Senate made the CHOICE to ignore the nomination of Garland. My argument is that the act of doing nothing by the entire GOP was far more nefarious than one Senator knowing correctly that he's not gonna like the nominee. Do you disagree?
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:28 pm

2122M wrote:
The Senate made the CHOICE to ignore the nomination of Garland. My argument is that the act of doing nothing by the entire GOP was far more nefarious than one Senator knowing correctly that he's not gonna like the nominee. Do you disagree?

Well, you keep moving the goalposts. The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:31 pm

LittleSprocket wrote:
casinterest wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The hyperbole train has just left the station!

Oh, not only is Trump not a Nazi, he's not even a fascist.
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1 ... -democracy


Go back and reread my statement.
Didn't call him that. But thanks for missing the point.



You are right, you called his supporters Nazi's for voting for him. Ya'll wonder why the dimocrats lost the 2016 election? It wasn't because of Russia, it was because of people like you that claim that ANY time someone has a differing opinion on how the world should work, they are called racists, nazi's, homophobics, deplorables, and anything else under the sun that could be construed as an insult. Congratulations buddy, your continuing attacks on those that support Trump and like the way that the country is going is only going to drive more people to the polls come November.




Yes, Trump will dive more of a dwindling minority of racist older folks that don't recognize the damage they are doing to themselves and the US.
It's amazing that the party that loves to use the term snowflake has become a whole pile of them.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:31 pm

2122M wrote:
What do you call people that voted for Hilary?

Members of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences?
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:31 pm

LittleSprocket wrote:
You are right, you called his supporters Nazi's for voting for him. Ya'll wonder why the dimocrats lost the 2016 election? It wasn't because of Russia, it was because of people like you that claim that ANY time someone has a differing opinion on how the world should work, they are called racists, nazi's, homophobics, deplorables, and anything else under the sun that could be construed as an insult. Congratulations buddy, your continuing attacks on those that support Trump and like the way that the country is going is only going to drive more people to the polls come November.


What do you call people that voted for Hilary?
 
Bricktop
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:36 pm

Trump could have nominated Louis Brandeis, Byron White or Thurgood Marshall and you would have seen the same reaction. The tantrum continues.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:36 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
The Senate made the CHOICE to ignore the nomination of Garland. My argument is that the act of doing nothing by the entire GOP was far more nefarious than one Senator knowing correctly that he's not gonna like the nominee. Do you disagree?

Well, you keep moving the goalposts. The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.


Irrelevant. Even if he has made a final decision based on the 300+ decisions this nominee made, is that worse than the GOP making the decision not to even listen to Merrick Garland?

You have missed the point entirely. Senator Corey adopted his stance before the nominee was even announced.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:39 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
The Senate made the CHOICE to ignore the nomination of Garland. My argument is that the act of doing nothing by the entire GOP was far more nefarious than one Senator knowing correctly that he's not gonna like the nominee. Do you disagree?

Well, you keep moving the goalposts. The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.


Irrelevant. Even if he has made a final decision based on the 300+ decisions this nominee made, is that worse than the GOP making the decision not to even listen to Merrick Garland?
 
apodino
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:39 pm

seahawk wrote:
Any judge who would not overturn Roe v. Wade is too liberal and Kavanaugh lacks Christian values. Not a great pick. Better than a crazy liberal, but not as conservative as many hoped for.

I don't get how Christian Values is a litmus test for what should be a supreme court justice. This alone would be dangerously close to a first amendment violation of the establishment clause. As for Roe, it has been argued for years that Roe was either rightly or wrongly decided from a legal standpoint. Because Abortion itself is not specifically mentioned in the constitution, some originalists argue that there is no legal right to abortion and that liberal judges tend to draft rights in the constitution that aren't specified by using other rights that are there.

That being said it is not proper for a potential justice to say how he would rule prior to actually hearing a case, which would include how he would rule on Roe V Wade. We should never know how any justice will rule on such a case prior to him being placed there. And this is also the danger with the courts deciding such cases and not having the issues dealt with legislatively. Because if the ruling is controversial and is a ruling that is closely decided, the danger is future justices may not interpret the law the same. This is why we need judges who will follow the law and not make the law.

Kavanaugh was not my first choice. I was really hoping he would pick Barrett. That would have posed all sorts of difficulties for the democrats. But he seems like a good guy, who does a lot in the community. And one interesting thing is that Elana Kagan hiired him for a law professor job. That should leave little doubt about the mans intelligence.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:45 pm

2122M wrote:
Still irrelevant. He knew the short list. And even if he didn't, is one senator knowing in advance that he's not going to support the kind of judge Trump will nominates a bigger problem to you than an entire political party making the decision to not even allow an Obama appointee a hearing?

Well, we are going to have to agree to disagree. I just don't condone a Senator opting out of a Constitutional procedural mechanism based solely on his personal opinion prior to any opportunity to ask probing questions of the nominee.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:48 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Well, you keep moving the goalposts. The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.


Irrelevant. Even if he has made a final decision based on the 300+ decisions this nominee made, is that worse than the GOP making the decision not to even listen to Merrick Garland?

You have missed the point entirely. Senator Corey adopted his stance before the nominee was even announced.


Still irrelevant. He knew the short list. And even if he didn't, is one senator knowing in advance that he's not going to support the kind of judge Trump will nominates a bigger problem to you than an entire political party making the decision to not even allow an Obama appointee a hearing?

If you are halfway intelligent you should understand the question being asked here, so why are you avoiding the answer?
 
tommy1808
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:54 pm

2122M wrote:
If you are halfway intelligent you should understand the question being asked here, so why are you avoiding the answer?


For the same reason a biblical literalist will not answer on which day Jesus was crucified: they don't like the answer.

Best regards
Thomas
This Singature is a safe space......
 
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:55 pm

apodino wrote:
seahawk wrote:
Any judge who would not overturn Roe v. Wade is too liberal and Kavanaugh lacks Christian values. Not a great pick. Better than a crazy liberal, but not as conservative as many hoped for.

I don't get how Christian Values is a litmus test for what should be a supreme court justice. This alone would be dangerously close to a first amendment violation of the establishment clause. As for Roe, it has been argued for years that Roe was either rightly or wrongly decided from a legal standpoint. Because Abortion itself is not specifically mentioned in the constitution, some originalists argue that there is no legal right to abortion and that liberal judges tend to draft rights in the constitution that aren't specified by using other rights that are there.

That being said it is not proper for a potential justice to say how he would rule prior to actually hearing a case, which would include how he would rule on Roe V Wade. We should never know how any justice will rule on such a case prior to him being placed there. And this is also the danger with the courts deciding such cases and not having the issues dealt with legislatively. Because if the ruling is controversial and is a ruling that is closely decided, the danger is future justices may not interpret the law the same. This is why we need judges who will follow the law and not make the law.

Kavanaugh was not my first choice. I was really hoping he would pick Barrett. That would have posed all sorts of difficulties for the democrats. But he seems like a good guy, who does a lot in the community. And one interesting thing is that Elana Kagan hiired him for a law professor job. That should leave little doubt about the mans intelligence.


All the pundits have said that Barrett is the next choice should Trump get another shot and picking another nominee.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:58 pm

Trump's pick is pretty savvy in at least one regard.

I have never believed that Trump wants to see Roe v. Wade overturned. I doubt that was a concern of his when selecting a nominee.

In his 2006 confirmation hearing, Kavanaugh said he would follow Roe v. Wade "faithfully and fully."

This gives a LOT of cover to Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski. Cover that Susan Collins indicating that she was looking for.

So Trump gets a candidate that will deliver for him on economic and other matters while conceding Roe v. Wade, which he never really cared about in the first place.

This shows the folly of the left making Roe v. Wade the lightning rod issue. Everyone is so focused on that one issue, that they don't pay enough attention to the other issues.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:59 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
2122M wrote:
If you are halfway intelligent you should understand the question being asked here, so why are you avoiding the answer?


For the same reason a biblical literalist will not answer on which day Jesus was crucified: they don't like the answer.

Best regards
Thomas


The fact of the matter is, Antonin Scalia died in February of 2016 and the GOP senate decided that was too close to the November election to push through a new justice. That was the precedent they set. Now, Kennedy announced his retirement in July, 5 months sooner to a national election that could very well flip the senate, which has as big of an effect on the eventual confirmation of a SCOTUS justice as a change in the White House.

Will the GOP recognize the precedent they set 2 years ago? Obviously not, but it is impossible to ignore the hypocrisy there.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:59 pm

2122M wrote:
The fact of the matter is, Antonin Scalia died in February of 2016 and the GOP senate decided that was too close to the November election to push through a new justice. That was the precedent they set. Now, Kennedy announced his retirement in July, 5 months sooner to a national election that could very well flip the senate, which has as big of an effect on the eventual confirmation of a SCOTUS justice as a change in the White House.

Will the GOP recognize the precedent they set 2 years ago? Obviously not, but it is impossible to ignore the hypocrisy there.

Apples to oranges. One was a presidential election. The other is a mid-term election,
 
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seahawk
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:00 pm

Barrett is better in some key points like Christian believes.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:03 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Still irrelevant. He knew the short list. And even if he didn't, is one senator knowing in advance that he's not going to support the kind of judge Trump will nominates a bigger problem to you than an entire political party making the decision to not even allow an Obama appointee a hearing?

Well, we are going to have to agree to disagree. I just don't condone a Senator opting out of a Constitutional procedural mechanism based solely on his personal opinion prior to any opportunity to ask probing questions of the nominee.


Agree to disagree? Since I think the GOP stonewalling Garland is worse, does that mean you believe Corey's knowledge that we won't like Trump's pick to be the bigger issue?

And it is truly hilarious how you worded that. "I just don't condone a Senator opting out of a Constitutional procedural mechanism based solely on his personal opinion prior to any opportunity to ask probing questions of the nominee" when that was what the ENTIRE GOP DID in 2016.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:03 pm

2122M wrote:
Agree to disagree? Since I think the GOP stonewalling Garland is worse, does that mean you believe Corey's knowledge that we won't like Trump's pick to be the bigger issue?

For the third time, please stop misrepresenting what I have said in regard to Corey's "opinion." I have not once criticized his having an opinion. I have only criticized him for being inflexible and for not participating in a Constitutionally established procedure.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:07 pm

2122M wrote:
Can a president appoint a SCOTUS justice without the senate's approval? No. Seems to me that both parties play an equal role in this process. Almost as if (and bear with me as this is kind of a crazy theory) the whole system was designed that way.

So by that logic, the makeup of the Senate is equally as important as the occupant of the White House.

Apples to Apples.

Uh... no. The President gets to actually identify the nominee. The Senate cannot. That is a HUGE difference.

Again, not apples to apples.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:07 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
The fact of the matter is, Antonin Scalia died in February of 2016 and the GOP senate decided that was too close to the November election to push through a new justice. That was the precedent they set. Now, Kennedy announced his retirement in July, 5 months sooner to a national election that could very well flip the senate, which has as big of an effect on the eventual confirmation of a SCOTUS justice as a change in the White House.

Will the GOP recognize the precedent they set 2 years ago? Obviously not, but it is impossible to ignore the hypocrisy there.

Apples to oranges. One was a presidential election. The other is a mid-term election,


Can a president appoint a SCOTUS justice without the senate's approval? No. Seems to me that both parties play an equal role in this process. Almost as if (and bear with me as this is kind of a crazy theory) the whole system was designed that way.

So by that logic, the makeup of the Senate is equally as important as the occupant of the White House.

Apples to Apples.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:10 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Agree to disagree? Since I think the GOP stonewalling Garland is worse, does that mean you believe Corey's knowledge that we won't like Trump's pick to be the bigger issue?

For the third time, please stop misrepresenting what I have said in regard to Corey's "opinion." I have not once criticized his having an opinion. I have only criticized him for being inflexible and for not participating in a Constitutionally established procedure.


But you refuse to criticize the GOP controlled Senate in 2016 for being inflexible and not participating (or even allowing) a Constitutionally established procedure.

How very 'moderate' of you.

Incorrect.

I said this in post #11 in this very thread:
VTKillarney wrote:
Again, I am very sympathetic to those people who are offended over how Mr. Garland's nomination was handled. But these are just feelings. The logical side of me appreciates that everything was done within the letter of the Constitution.


So, yes, I have been critical of the GOP.
Last edited by VTKillarney on Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:11 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Agree to disagree? Since I think the GOP stonewalling Garland is worse, does that mean you believe Corey's knowledge that we won't like Trump's pick to be the bigger issue?

For the third time, please stop misrepresenting what I have said in regard to Corey's "opinion." I have not once criticized his having an opinion. I have only criticized him for being inflexible and for not participating in a Constitutionally established procedure.


But you refuse to criticize the GOP controlled Senate in 2016 for being inflexible and not participating (or even allowing) a Constitutionally established procedure.

How very 'moderate' of you.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:16 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Can a president appoint a SCOTUS justice without the senate's approval? No. Seems to me that both parties play an equal role in this process. Almost as if (and bear with me as this is kind of a crazy theory) the whole system was designed that way.

So by that logic, the makeup of the Senate is equally as important as the occupant of the White House.

Apples to Apples.

Uh... no. The President gets to actually identify the nominee. The Senate cannot. That is a HUGE difference.

Again, not apples to apples.


Dose the President's pick matter if the Senate won't approve them?

Let me put it to you this way, do you think a President would pick differently if he knew the nominee had to clear an opposition controlled senate?
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:20 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
So, yes, I have been critical of the GOP.


That's being critical? You called Senator Corey's move "Genuinely Scary", but the entire GOP does the same or worse in 2016 and the best you can muster is:

" very sympathetic to those people who are offended over how Mr. Garland's nomination was handled. But these are just feelings. The logical side of me appreciates that everything was done within the letter of the Constitution."

Has Corey violated the constitution? Where is your logical side there?

Congrats on your well balanced political views.
 
bagoldex
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:20 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Senator Corey has made it very clear that he will not participate in the process that the body has decided to engage in.


VTKillarney wrote:
Senator Corey has opted out of that process, I would say that his actions are more opposed to Constitutional principles than those of the Senate in regard to Mr. Garland.


VTKillarney wrote:
The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.


VTKillarney wrote:
You have missed the point entirely. Senator Corey adopted his stance before the nominee was even announced.


VTKillarney wrote:
For the third time, please stop misrepresenting what I have said in regard to Corey's "opinion."


Who the hell is Senator Corey?
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:21 pm

bagoldex wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Senator Corey has made it very clear that he will not participate in the process that the body has decided to engage in.


VTKillarney wrote:
Senator Corey has opted out of that process, I would say that his actions are more opposed to Constitutional principles than those of the Senate in regard to Mr. Garland.


VTKillarney wrote:
The criticism was that Senator Corey made a final judgment. Not that he merely "didn't like" the nominee.


VTKillarney wrote:
You have missed the point entirely. Senator Corey adopted his stance before the nominee was even announced.


VTKillarney wrote:
For the third time, please stop misrepresenting what I have said in regard to Corey's "opinion."


Who the hell is Senator Corey?


Bob Casey. in the thread it got morphed to Corey accidentally from Casey.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:23 pm

2122M wrote:
Bob Casey. in the thread it got morphed to Corey accidentally from Casey.

Yowzers! How that happened I would love to know. Corey Booker must have been in someone's thoughts.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:35 pm

2122M wrote:
LittleSprocket wrote:
You are right, you called his supporters Nazi's for voting for him. Ya'll wonder why the dimocrats lost the 2016 election? It wasn't because of Russia, it was because of people like you that claim that ANY time someone has a differing opinion on how the world should work, they are called racists, nazi's, homophobics, deplorables, and anything else under the sun that could be construed as an insult. Congratulations buddy, your continuing attacks on those that support Trump and like the way that the country is going is only going to drive more people to the polls come November.


What do you call people that voted for Hillary?



Still Waiting for an answer here. You were indignant about names used to describe Trump supporters, so I'd love to know the reasonable, level headed approach you have when speaking about Hillary Clinton voters.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:37 pm

casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.


I hope you have some facts/sources to back that up.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:48 pm

casinterest wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.


I hope you have some facts/sources to back that up.


An entire Internet full.


Not all Trump voters are Nazi supporting white nationalists, but all Nazi supporting white nationalists are Trump voters. Wonder why that is.....
 
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casinterest
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:48 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Another White male for Trump's racist ,lying,cowardly agenda to take us back in time to our Jim Crow days. After all, this is what Trump's MAGA slogan is all about.

Good choice for his Nazi supporting white nationalist buddies in the GOP.


I hope you have some facts/sources to back that up.


An entire Internet full.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:51 pm

What is SCOTUS? There are more people here than just Americans......

:)
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:53 pm

2122M wrote:
Not all Trump voters are Nazi supporting white nationalists, but all Nazi supporting white nationalists are Trump voters. Wonder why that is.....

Not all Bernie Sander supporters shoot United States Congressmen in baseball fields. But every person who shoots a United States Congressman in a baseball field is a Bernie supporter.

This really doesn't forward the conversation. Both parties have idiots.

A 1994 study found the actual number of acts of terrorism committed by left-wing groups accounted for about three-fourths of all officially designated acts of domestic terrorism in America. But back when that study came out you didn't see the Republicans calling all Democrats members of the Symbionese LIberation Army. And the SLA was doing a WHOLE lot more than Nazis are doing today.

This forum would improve greatly if people talked about issues, not bogeymen.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:57 pm

Dutchy wrote:
What is SCOTUS? There are more people here than just Americans......

:)


Supreme Court Of The United States.
 
2122M
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Re: Brett Kavanaugh is Trump's pick for SCOTUS

Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:07 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
Not all Trump voters are Nazi supporting white nationalists, but all Nazi supporting white nationalists are Trump voters. Wonder why that is.....

Not all Bernie Sander supporters shoot United States Congressmen in baseball fields. But every person who shoots a United States Congressman in a baseball field is a Bernie supporter.

This really doesn't forward the conversation. Both parties have idiots.

A 1994 study found the actual number of acts of terrorism committed by left-wing groups accounted for about three-fourths of all officially designated acts of domestic terrorism in America. But back when that study came out you didn't see the Republicans calling all Democrats members of the Symbionese LIberation Army. And the SLA was doing a WHOLE lot more than Nazis are doing today.

This forum would improve greatly if people talked about issues, not bogeymen.


Between the baseball shooter and the SLA, you are talking about 23 total people. And there is no indication that the SLA supported any political candidate in particular. (Its also very telling that you had to dive 24 years in the past to make a #bothsides point)

However, every nook and cranny of this nations racist past and present is openly and fully supportive of Donald J Trump and the current incarnation of the GOP.

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