MaverickM11
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New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:20 pm

""It could be said," Benedict writes, "that in the 20 years from 1960 to 1980, the previously normative standards regarding sexuality collapsed entirely.""

https://www.npr.org/2019/04/11/71240911 ... se-scandal

No word on what was behind the mass graves of children at Catholic orphanages in the first half of the 1900s...
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
BestWestern
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:31 pm

So, the church has admitted the hypocrisy of its preaching, and that the priests were doing what they were telling others not to.

The mass graves of infants found in a mother and baby home isn’t sexual abuse, but murder. It’s also a wonderful example that anti abortionists don’t give a damn once the baby is born.
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BN747
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:52 pm

From the article -
Benedict blames the epidemic of clergy sex abuse largely on a collapse of moral standards in the 1960s and the subsequent failure of Catholic leaders to uphold traditional church teaching.

Hmmmm....why not reefer (madness), that wild Elvis and that Chuck Berry and their demonic hip gyrations on stage - in public!??

This is unbelievble, Benedict had to hustled out of the public quite hurriedly as his own past was threatening to 'disrobe' him for the world to really see who he had been.

That recent summit that was a nice attempt to address their historic centuries of every sexual abuse act imaginable...was good with intent but ended confusing and insulting to more people than it did to 'get people to ease up on the church and path a new path for snaring newer younger' followers.

The most recent revelation of past sexual abuse completely threw me off my feet - after thinking I had seen the worst they could guilty of.

I was thrown to hear them admit to forcing nuns into being personal sex slaves in a manner worst than you'd find on pornhub.

Then came this past week's telling of nuns recruiting and grooming the newbies for those positions as well as using them and keeping them for their own 'fun spaces'.

Sorry, still the devout Atheist here.

And on your next visit to the beach...pick up a grain of sand. NOT two or Three...just ONE single grain of sand.

Observe it for a moment.

Then, recall that saying we've all heard.
There are more Stars (most stars host planets) than there are grains of sand on EVERY beach on Earth combined.

Pause....

Now look at that grain of sand between your thumb and forefinger ....

NOW, tell yourselve :"BUT this one, this ONE grain of sand is super special more special than ALL the others!!! It will have life that can live forever..."

...then go enjoy your stroll along the beach.


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 5:49 pm

The anger of very conservative Catholics with modern sexuality issues is about openness. Sexual abuse and sexual power of the strong over the weak can be documented anywhere in Christendom where records are available. But so long as church and civil authorities are willing to insist as their version of biblical sexuality is publicly affirmed, things done secretly are understood and forgivable. Particularly if the powerful were the ones breaking accepted sexual practices.

Essentially the very conservative insist that what two consenting unmarried adults do is just as evil and wicked as the sexual abuse of children or the weak. Everyone else, including conservative Roman Catholics consider that nonsense and evil. Benedict is one of the former. Francis who is actually pretty conservative is one of the later.
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flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 6:36 pm

So basically the Catholic Church and it’s leaders are trying to blame others for the systematic rape of children perpetrated by the members of this cult and driven by the privileged access gained by oppressive tactics and fear of hell.

If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

It’s sometimes a shame that he’ll doesn’t exist because this is exactly where child rapists and their supporters deserve to go.

Fred


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bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 8:46 pm

It is the case that moral attitudes changed drastically during the 60’s, and not always for the better.

I also agree that there are things that are inherently bad those that are inherently good.

However, the changes in moral attitudes did not cause the sexual abuse. Those actions were inherently bad/wicked and must be seen as such.

I am and will remain a Catholic and view your attempt to allege that I support child rape as an out and out lie.
 
flyguy89
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:16 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

That's a pretty awful thing to say. There are hundreds of millions of decent Catholics in this world. Blanket, illogical assertions like that are ugly...are you also in that "all moozlems are terrorists" camp?
 
flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:40 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

That's a pretty awful thing to say. There are hundreds of millions of decent Catholics in this world. Blanket, illogical assertions like that are ugly...are you also in that "all moozlems are terrorists" camp?

No, I’m not in that camp as you are making a false comparison. If I had said that all catholic’s are child rapists then you would have been correct, I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

It is not an illogical statement at all. There is an organisation who covers up the rape of children by people who are marketed at being trustworthy for families and particularly to those in developing countries. In most places in the world one is pretty much allowed to believe anything they want and so o believe anything that this organisation promotes requires no endorsement of their activities yet somehow people still give vast amounts of money to them in the vain hope that god (cause even I he does exist is either a dick or not as perceived in the holy books) is going to grant them salvation (while still killing people and allowing them to suffer in horrendous ways).

There is nothing, NOTHING moral that a religious person can do or say that a non believer could also and yet the acts that are carried out and myths perpetuated by religions is absolutely staggering.

I’m sick and tired of religion getting a free ride, and please Muslims don’t feel that my lack of drawing a picture of Muhammad is a sign of respect, it is a sign of fear of your brutalist ways, you are not respected for your backward ways.

Fred


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bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:48 pm

You made an assumption which is flat out wrong.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:53 pm

bennett123 wrote:

I am and will remain a Catholic and view your attempt to allege that I support child rape as an out and out lie.

If the pope said that you can only remain a catholic if you kill your first born is that what you’d do? Would you still remain a catholic whilst priests carried out this act?

Fred



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flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:54 pm

bennett123 wrote:
You made an assumption which is flat out wrong.

Which was? I’m always happy to learn new things...


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DIRECTFLT
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 4:51 am

So the Church wants to blame hot pants, bell bottoms, and log side burns for a rise in young boys being abused??
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BN747
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 5:21 am

flipdewaf wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

That's a pretty awful thing to say. There are hundreds of millions of decent Catholics in this world. Blanket, illogical assertions like that are ugly...are you also in that "all moozlems are terrorists" camp?

No, I’m not in that camp as you are making a false comparison. If I had said that all catholic’s are child rapists then you would have been correct, I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

It is not an illogical statement at all.


C'mon, flip...ALL?

You know ALL the Muslims???

BN747
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bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:13 am

Flipdewaf

‘If you are Catholic and don’t leave this cult then one can only assume you think that child rape is OK’

Your words

I am telling you that this is untrue.

As for killing my first born, I have no idea where you got that from.
 
BN747
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:18 am

bennett123 wrote:
Flipdewaf

‘If you are Catholic and don’t leave this cult then one can only assume you think that child rape is OK’

Your words

I am telling you that this is untrue.

As for killing my first born, I have no idea where you got that from.


I'm guessing the 'Buy Bull'..

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
flipdewaf
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New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:19 am

bennett123 wrote:
Flipdewaf

‘If you are Catholic and don’t leave this cult then one can only assume you think that child rape is OK’

Your words

I am telling you that this is untrue.

As for killing my first born, I have no idea where you got that from.

If someone were to tell you they gave money to NAMBLA because they had a good sense of community and made nice Christmas cards would you think their support was moral?

As for the killing the first born piece, I wasn’t trying draw something from the bible I was simply trying to judge what level of moral disgrace the church would actually have to stoop to before your support would be lost, child abuse is evidently ok and I was trying to find something that may be worse (not sure there is anything really).

Fred


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bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:13 am

No I would not support NAMBLA.

I have also said child abuse is not OK.

I do not know what your agenda is, but suggest you stick to the facts.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:55 am

bennett123 wrote:
No I would not support NAMBLA.

I have also said child abuse is not OK.

I do not know what your agenda is, but suggest you stick to the facts.

The difference is one of the organisations is not vociferous in its intention of child rape whilst the other uses fear tactics to silence its victims. Both equally vile. What is it about the Catholic Church that cannot be believed or acted upon without supporting the organisation as a whole?

You can believe that bread is the body of a magician if you want.

You can believe that a Jewish minx became pregnant by god if you want.

You can believe any part of the bible and interpret it however you like.

You can go and do any charity work in the name of whoever you want.

You can even believe that someone who isn’t baptised is going to burn in hell if you want.

None of these things require your approval of the organisation that protects child rapists but yet you choose that.

Fred


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bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:41 am

Fred,

I do not know anything about your life history or what your beliefs are.

All I do know is that the level of hatred in your heart is not healthy.

I hope that you have a good day.
 
flyguy89
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:08 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:27 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.

Bigotry is about opinions, what I have been talking about is faith based belief systems that use socially coercive practices to remove arguments based on reason that go against their wishes.

I wouldn’t want to ban religions, I just want people to understand the truth. Make an argument, not a pronouncement about how you may feel aggrieved by what I say.

Would you give money to NAMBLA if they made good cakes and tried to have a sense of community? I fail to see how this example is materially different than the Catholic Church. If you can and you can explain it then I’m all ears but if the only responses are that I’m a bigot or that I’m a horrible person then at e risk of sounding like a member of the foil hat brigade then maybe they got to you first.

Fred


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flyguy89
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:10 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.

Bigotry is about opinions, what I have been talking about is faith based belief systems that use socially coercive practices to remove arguments based on reason that go against their wishes.

I wouldn’t want to ban religions, I just want people to understand the truth. Make an argument, not a pronouncement about how you may feel aggrieved by what I say.

Would you give money to NAMBLA if they made good cakes and tried to have a sense of community? I fail to see how this example is materially different than the Catholic Church. If you can and you can explain it then I’m all ears but if the only responses are that I’m a bigot or that I’m a horrible person then at e risk of sounding like a member of the foil hat brigade then maybe they got to you first.

Fred


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Do you give money to governments that have committed equally awful if not more awful atrocities? Does that mean you support slavery, genocide, racial persecution, massacres, etc? No, of course not because any logical person can unpack that one supports a civil society governed by law and order without meaning that you transitively support atrocities bad actors have committed under cover of said government. This is no different from the Catholic church (or any religion)...you have hundreds of millions of Catholics who remain faithful to church doctrine (i.e. the teachings of Jesus Christ) while rejecting and working to reform the failures of the church bureaucracy.

As to your NAMBLA comparison, the core beliefs/doctrine/raison d'etre of that organization are pedophilia; Catholic doctrine is not. While failures in church bureaucracy have enabled abuse, one cannot in any rational sense claim that Catholicism or Christianity as a belief is about pedophilia.
 
johns624
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:50 pm

The relationship that American Catholics have with their parish priest is the same one that they have with their congressional representatives. It might best be described as "MY guy is good, it's all the rest that are stinking liars and cheats". While I don't totally agree with what Flipdewaf is saying, basically it's "If you continue to monetarily support the Church, then you also are supplying the money so that they can continue to pay off victims and hide their child molesters". They say they've changed, but have they yet turned over to authorities priests who have molested whose statute of limitations hasn't run out yet? He's also saying that if you live a good, moral life, you don't have to be a member of an organized religion to be a good person.
Let me give you a local example. A local priest was convicted, along with the parish bookkeeper, of embezzlement. His brother, also a priest, was accused of the same crime, without evidence. The Church immediately informed the local news media and called in the FBI. It took many months before they announced that they had cleared his name. That shows what's really important to the Church. "Abuse little children all you want, but if we think that you may be messing with our MONEY, we'll come down on you like a ton of bricks".
Here's a link... https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/ ... /29049579/
 
bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:05 pm

No one doubts that you can be a good person without being part of an organised religion. Actually, you can be a good person without being a member of any religion.
 
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Aesma
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:42 pm

Coming out of years of silence to say this, man, this guy is the definition of out of touch !

He's also shooting himself in the foot, by saying that people who studied for years and were supposed to teach to others the church's views on sexuality were not practising it, he's admitting that those views are worthless.
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BestWestern
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:04 am

We all know from Northern Ireland the Protestants hate Catholic’s and Vice-versa. This thread is a great example of this.

It reminds me of the people’s liberation front of Jueda. ‘Splitters’
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luckyone
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:17 am

All religions have goofy paradoxes. One of the whoppers of the Catholic Church is that (ostensibly) celibate old men get to tell everybody else about sex and how it should be done properly. I cannot be the first person to point this out. There is the counter argument “you don’t have to bite the donut to know that it’s sweet,” but I still need a concept of sweet, etc etc.
 
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johnboy
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:42 am

bennett123 wrote:
Flipdewaf

‘If you are Catholic and don’t leave this cult then one can only assume you think that child rape is OK’

Your words

I am telling you that this is untrue.

As for killing my first born, I have no idea where you got that from.


It certainly is in the Bible. Maybe your beef is with your god.
 
slider
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:31 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.



Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".
 
slider
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:36 pm

luckyone wrote:
All religions have goofy paradoxes. One of the whoppers of the Catholic Church is that (ostensibly) celibate old men get to tell everybody else about sex and how it should be done properly. I cannot be the first person to point this out. There is the counter argument “you don’t have to bite the donut to know that it’s sweet,” but I still need a concept of sweet, etc etc.


Very good point…and there are some in this thread, and a few others that come from people’s various degrees of zealotry on the issue, from devout Catholics to devout atheists.

However, this is just one stellar example of the hypocrisy and man-made dogmatic bullshit that rankles me about Catholicism…this pious puritanical ownership of sex, of what it is, how it should be addressed, etc, all while the same pontificating asshole priests are diddling the altar boys and worse. There is SO much systemic complicity in it that’s being revealed that I would encourage all Catholics to bail.

How do you change it? Easy. Starve them out with money. Stop throwing it in the collection basket. Support other private charities that do good works. But to support a corrupt Vatican, with a Marxist Pope, who lives behind a wall whilst chiming in inappropriately on all matters of politics, and still won’t take the actions needed to correct the sins of the past/present in his own organization, is the height of stupidity.
 
bennett123
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:57 pm

Your choice of course.

As for the Pope getting involved with politics, frankly better than living in an Ivory Tower.

Also think how much his room for manoeuvre would be limited.

I note that you refer to him as Marxist which is another joke.

Strange that you feel that charities can be non political, unless you simply accept the status quo.
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:46 pm

The current pope very definitely is not a Marxist. Popes from the 19th century on have challenged unbridled capitalism, and the materialism it engenders. Christianity (but not Christendom) does confess a certain preference in favor of the poor. Most major religious and ethical systems do too.

ps - I am not a Roman Catholic, but do fairly intensely follow it and other major religious and ethical systems.
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MaverickM11
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:20 pm

slider wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
I do however think that all Muslims do effectively support the terrorist acts.

...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.



Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
slider
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:41 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
slider wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
...and there we have it. Bye Felicia, your bigotry is not welcome here.



Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"



Ooooh!! Mav, it's my favorite game!! We can play this for hours. You just fell into the trap. My friend, let me reintroduce you to the concept of abrogation. You see, the Old testament was replaced by the New Testament...you know, Jesus was the pledge of the New Covenant and all that. Not a vengeful God, not an angry prophet nor certainly not someone who murdered people. Islam, however, has no such distinction. If anything, Muhammed doubles down because Islam is based on his infallibility, that his words are directly from Allah. This is also why Islam cannot be reformed--because it would destroy all of it.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:10 pm

slider wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
slider wrote:


Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"



Ooooh!! Mav, it's my favorite game!! We can play this for hours. You just fell into the trap. My friend, let me reintroduce you to the concept of abrogation. You see, the Old testament was replaced by the New Testament...you know, Jesus was the pledge of the New Covenant and all that. Not a vengeful God, not an angry prophet nor certainly not someone who murdered people. Islam, however, has no such distinction. If anything, Muhammed doubles down because Islam is based on his infallibility, that his words are directly from Allah. This is also why Islam cannot be reformed--because it would destroy all of it.

So god got it wrong in the Old Testament? What’s to say he didn’t get it wrong in the New Testament? He’s not infallible after all. If only we had a mechanism for determining truth without the need for religion.

Oh well!

Fred


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MaverickM11
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Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:16 pm

slider wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
slider wrote:


Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"



Ooooh!! Mav, it's my favorite game!! We can play this for hours. You just fell into the trap. My friend, let me reintroduce you to the concept of abrogation. You see, the Old testament was replaced by the New Testament...you know, Jesus was the pledge of the New Covenant and all that. Not a vengeful God, not an angry prophet nor certainly not someone who murdered people. Islam, however, has no such distinction. If anything, Muhammed doubles down because Islam is based on his infallibility, that his words are directly from Allah. This is also why Islam cannot be reformed--because it would destroy all of it.

Yes that's why christians only carry around half a bible. :roll: Some trap! Old #fakenews replaced by new #fakenews: a perfect and loving god replacing the exact opposite thanks to a literary sleight of hand--don't ask any questions because then the whole house of cards pancakes. With Christians--particularly the dominionists infecting our government--it's always been old testament for you, new testament for me--as applicable and subject to my own interpretation of what's in the bible vs what is convenient to support my own behavior.

flipdewaf wrote:
slider wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"



Ooooh!! Mav, it's my favorite game!! We can play this for hours. You just fell into the trap. My friend, let me reintroduce you to the concept of abrogation. You see, the Old testament was replaced by the New Testament...you know, Jesus was the pledge of the New Covenant and all that. Not a vengeful God, not an angry prophet nor certainly not someone who murdered people. Islam, however, has no such distinction. If anything, Muhammed doubles down because Islam is based on his infallibility, that his words are directly from Allah. This is also why Islam cannot be reformed--because it would destroy all of it.

So god got it wrong in the Old Testament? What’s to say he didn’t get it wrong in the New Testament? He’s not infallible after all. If only we had a mechanism for determining truth without the need for religion.

Oh well!

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You can't ask questions like that! Just accept it and move on.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
BestWestern
Posts: 8174
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 8:46 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:30 am

You had me worried for a moment Maverick.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
BN747
Posts: 6033
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:15 am

slider wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
slider wrote:


Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Oooh I love this game! Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death"



Ooooh!! Mav, it's my favorite game!! We can play this for hours. You just fell into the trap. My friend, let me reintroduce you to the concept of abrogation. You see, the Old testament was replaced by the New Testament...you know, Jesus was the pledge of the New Covenant and all that. Not a vengeful God, not an angry prophet nor certainly not someone who murdered people. Islam, however, has no such distinction. If anything, Muhammed doubles down because Islam is based on his infallibility, that his words are directly from Allah. This is also why Islam cannot be reformed--because it would destroy all of it.


My goodness...I'm impressed (talking to an perennial A.net foe here)
I could have used that gem (Quran quote) week before last when I was shredding Islam with this Arab bro from Dubai.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
slider
Posts: 7266
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:06 pm

With each passing day, I learn more about how BN747 views the world. His zealotry is verified further when referencing an "a.net foe"...such a shame that's how you view every issue, every argument, every discussion. Too bad that everything has to be linear, black and white, and so on in your world. Carry on.
 
User avatar
DL717
Posts: 1254
Joined: Wed May 23, 2018 10:53 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:24 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
""It could be said," Benedict writes, "that in the 20 years from 1960 to 1980, the previously normative standards regarding sexuality collapsed entirely.""

https://www.npr.org/2019/04/11/71240911 ... se-scandal

No word on what was behind the mass graves of children at Catholic orphanages in the first half of the 1900s...


The more things change, the more they stay the same. Luther even nailed this during Reformation:

https://www.bookofconcord.org/defense_22_marriage.php
Welcome to Nothingburgers. May I take your order?
 
BN747
Posts: 6033
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:37 am

slider wrote:
With each passing day, I learn more about how BN747 views the world. His zealotry is verified further when referencing an "a.net foe"...such a shame that's how you view every issue, every argument, every discussion. Too bad that everything has to be linear, black and white, and so on in your world. Carry on.


Good! There's much more to learn if you can disable whatever mental roadblock that blinds in true ' black and white' conflicts.

But I will give you credit in a beyond average grasp of the 'Catholicism problem'...

In 'real news'..

More Americans are rejecting organized religion than belong to the Catholic Church: report

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/04/americ ... ch-report/

...there is hope for humanity yet.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
slider
Posts: 7266
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 12:12 pm

BN747 wrote:
slider wrote:
With each passing day, I learn more about how BN747 views the world. His zealotry is verified further when referencing an "a.net foe"...such a shame that's how you view every issue, every argument, every discussion. Too bad that everything has to be linear, black and white, and so on in your world. Carry on.


Good! There's much more to learn if you can disable whatever mental roadblock that blinds in true ' black and white' conflicts.


BN747


Congrats, you missed the point again. You DO see things in black and white--friend and enemy. Anyone who disagrees with you is an enemy, that's your tack. Own it, stand by it. At least the rest of the forum knows.
 
User avatar
DL717
Posts: 1254
Joined: Wed May 23, 2018 10:53 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 12:21 pm

BN747 wrote:
slider wrote:
With each passing day, I learn more about how BN747 views the world. His zealotry is verified further when referencing an "a.net foe"...such a shame that's how you view every issue, every argument, every discussion. Too bad that everything has to be linear, black and white, and so on in your world. Carry on.


Good! There's much more to learn if you can disable whatever mental roadblock that blinds in true ' black and white' conflicts.

But I will give you credit in a beyond average grasp of the 'Catholicism problem'...

In 'real news'..

More Americans are rejecting organized religion than belong to the Catholic Church: report

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/04/americ ... ch-report/

...there is hope for humanity yet.

BN747


My own view of the office of the papacy being that it is the Antichrist aside, religion falls as civility toward others dies. Your distain and mocking for anyone being religious a prime example.
Welcome to Nothingburgers. May I take your order?
 
FlapsOne
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:13 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:05 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
So basically the Catholic Church and it’s leaders are trying to blame others for the systematic rape of children perpetrated by the members of this cult and driven by the privileged access gained by oppressive tactics and fear of hell.

If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

It’s sometimes a shame that he’ll doesn’t exist because this is exactly where child rapists and their supporters deserve to go.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Really? A cult? Catholicism is a cult? If you said that about Muslims your post would be taken down, you’d incite mass rage and would likely be given a ban. A.net doesn’t even pretend to maintain and air of neutrality these days.

It’s funny. When there’s yet another Muslim terror attack it’s a case of it being a ‘lone wolf’ or ‘not all Muslims’ or ‘mental illness’. System historic abuse by a small amount of clergymen is uncovered and suddenly we are child rape apologists because of our faith? Wow! Wasn’t Mo a paedophille?
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 17069
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:24 pm

FlapsOne wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
So basically the Catholic Church and it’s leaders are trying to blame others for the systematic rape of children perpetrated by the members of this cult and driven by the privileged access gained by oppressive tactics and fear of hell.

If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

It’s sometimes a shame that he’ll doesn’t exist because this is exactly where child rapists and their supporters deserve to go.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Really? A cult? Catholicism is a cult? If you said that about Muslims your post would be taken down, you’d incite mass rage and would likely be given a ban. A.net doesn’t even pretend to maintain and air of neutrality these days.

It’s funny. When there’s yet another Muslim terror attack it’s a case of it being a ‘lone wolf’ or ‘not all Muslims’ or ‘mental illness’. System historic abuse by a small amount of clergymen is uncovered and suddenly we are child rape apologists because of our faith? Wow! Wasn’t Mo a paedophille?

Uh...what's the difference? These p!ssing contests between religion/cults are always amusing.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
flipdewaf
Posts: 2459
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:28 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:25 pm

FlapsOne wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
So basically the Catholic Church and it’s leaders are trying to blame others for the systematic rape of children perpetrated by the members of this cult and driven by the privileged access gained by oppressive tactics and fear of hell.

If you are catholic and don’t leave this cult because of these abhorrent acts then one can only assume you think child rape is ok.

It’s sometimes a shame that he’ll doesn’t exist because this is exactly where child rapists and their supporters deserve to go.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Really? A cult? Catholicism is a cult?
Yes, a cult.
https://www.thefreedictionary.com/cultic
"A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false"
One might argue that the religions are not demonstrably false as they are not generally established from falsifiable claims but I would say that to all intents and purposes they are false which by the definition shown here (which I don't deem to be particularly different from any other I have seen) would make Catholicism a cult.

FlapsOne wrote:
If you said that about Muslims your post would be taken down, you’d incite mass rage and would likely be given a ban.
Well then you should read further up in the thread and not that I have called out the Islamic faith (even though this thread is about Catholics).

FlapsOne wrote:
A.net doesn’t even pretend to maintain and air of neutrality these days.
Can you cite any examples?

FlapsOne wrote:
It’s funny. When there’s yet another Muslim terror attack it’s a case of it being a ‘lone wolf’ or ‘not all Muslims’ or ‘mental illness’.
I find its more a case of people on one side of the argument feeling oppressed when they come up with these things, a victim complex almost. I personally think religion needs to be called out on its bullshit in all its forms.

FlapsOne wrote:
System historic abuse by a small amount of clergymen is uncovered and suddenly we are child rape apologists because of our faith?
Faith: the excuse used when people cannot use evidence to back up their bull.

FlapsOne wrote:
Wow! Wasn’t Mo a paedophille?
So because one potentially made up person was a pedophile then your guy (who actually exists) gets a pardon. "But please sir, Jonny kicked someone in the face too, why do I get told off"

Do you think "Mo" should be lot off because your guy was.

Fred
Image
 
bennett123
Posts: 8563
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:16 pm

On your definition, all religions are cults.

What exactly did Atheists believe in.
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 17069
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:19 pm

DL717 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
slider wrote:
With each passing day, I learn more about how BN747 views the world. His zealotry is verified further when referencing an "a.net foe"...such a shame that's how you view every issue, every argument, every discussion. Too bad that everything has to be linear, black and white, and so on in your world. Carry on.


Good! There's much more to learn if you can disable whatever mental roadblock that blinds in true ' black and white' conflicts.

But I will give you credit in a beyond average grasp of the 'Catholicism problem'...

In 'real news'..

More Americans are rejecting organized religion than belong to the Catholic Church: report

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/04/americ ... ch-report/

...there is hope for humanity yet.

BN747


My own view of the office of the papacy being that it is the Antichrist aside, religion falls as civility toward others dies. Your distain and mocking for anyone being religious a prime example.

Religious affiliation and violence have dropped almost in lock step in the USA
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
flipdewaf
Posts: 2459
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:28 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:23 pm

bennett123 wrote:
On your definition, all religions are cults.
Well spotted.

bennett123 wrote:
What exactly did Atheists believe in.
That's up to the individual Athiest.
An athiest is someone who doesn't believe in a god/gods, if there was a special name for someone who isn't a plane spotter would you also ask what they believed in?

Fred
Image
 
bennett123
Posts: 8563
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: New Catholic abuse excuse: swinging sixties!

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:27 pm

I will leave you to believe in whatever you choose to believe.

Apparently Atheists know what they don’t believe in, but do not know (as a group) what they do believe.

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