LatinPlane
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Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 9:13 am

Avensa's new European schedule.

Flight

1000 Madrid - Mon, Wed, Fri, Sat, Sun
1004 Santiago de Compostela -Thur
1006 Tenerife -Thur
1007 Lisbon - Fri


Tenerife and Santiago de Compostela are new routes. Milan, Rome, and Porto were not ressumed.

 Smile LatinPlane

Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Guest

RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 9:33 am

Great news  Smile

I Assume Santiago de Compostela don't have International Long-Haul flight. Is that correct?
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 9:39 am

Jiml1126:

Venezuelan airlines always has served Santiago de Compostela. First with VIASA and now with Avensa.

LAtinplane:

The news flights to Europe are in codeshare with Aeropostal, the other venezuelan airline?

RJ_Delta.
 
chepos
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 10:45 am

Please someone explain me why they fly to Santiago de Compostela. I quite didn't understand why Viasa used to fly into Santiago de Compostela and I dont understad now why Avensa flies there.
Chepos
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
LatinPlane
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 10:51 am


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Santiago de Compostela was served for many years by Viasa up until 1997, right before Viasa ceased operations. Santiago de Compostela was served a 1x weekly basis via Lisbon.

RJ_Delta:

I don't know. This used to be the case before Avensa stopped flying into Madrid earlier this year. It was announced that Aeropostal would codeshare with AirEuropa's 767s instead of Avensa's DC-10. In any case, I'm glad to see that Avensa is overcoming their problems and expanding to serve more European routes.

 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
767-332ER
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 11:28 am



I was in Madrid and we were leaving on a tuesday this past month and I saw the Avensa DC-10 there departing.
Twinjets...if one fails, work the other one twice as hard!!!
 
aio86
Posts: 910
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Wed Sep 05, 2001 2:03 pm

So they´re flying the DC-10? Where were these aircraft before they started these services?

Congrats to them.

-aio86
 
LatinPlane
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Chepos

Thu Sep 06, 2001 3:05 pm


Chepos:

I know, It's quite difficult to imagine a transatlantic flight once a week to such a small destination in Europe. Not even the American carriers serve such small destinations in the E.U.

The reason why Viasa and now Avensa fly to Santiago de Compostela is due to the fact that many Spaniards from the state of Galicia migrated during the early and middle part of 20th century to South America. This when when Spain was one of the poorest countries in Europe.

Most migrated to the bottom of of S. America such as Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil while Venezuela and Colombia also received a good portion of these migrants. Therefore making Santiago de Compostela a friends/family destination. Another reason is that Santiago de Compostela is a pilgrimage destination that receives many visitors for religious holidays. I'm pretty sure that there is also people in this part of Spain that would like to travel to sunny Venezuela for a nice long holiday. However, have all the above reasons justify for a weekly transoceanic DC-10 flight? Lets wait and see if it becomes a success.


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 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
samspain
Posts: 116
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Thu Sep 06, 2001 5:21 pm

Hi: Not oly Viasa flew that route. Iberia did for a while in the 80's, as well as the Santiago de Compostela-JFK route.
The Santiago-CCS leg and Tenerife-CCS are huge money makers not only because the ethnic and touristic markets, but because many of these spaniards have import-export companies attached to the Canaries and Galicia. Also, Tap AIr Portugal has non stop flights from CCS to Porto.. and because of Porto's airport close location to several Galician cities their CCS flights are always packed.

just my two cents
 
Varghel
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Thu Sep 06, 2001 9:27 pm

That's true. Santiago de Compostela and Tenerife are served more because of their family/friend relations between the Galician and Canarians emigrants in Venezuela and their relatives in Spain.

In fact, you may notice that Avensa has never got to Barcelona or Valencia who are quite important destinations. But they are touristical destinations...
By the way, does somebody remember if Viasa flew to Barcelona in Spain? I really don't think so.

Varghel
Varghel
 
LatinPlane
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Thu Sep 06, 2001 10:10 pm

Varghel:

I don't think Viasa ever flew to Barcelona in Cataluñia. They did serve Barcelona (the one in Venezuela) domestically.

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At the time of it's demise Viasa served:

Frankfurt 2x weekly
Amsterdam 2x weekly
London 2x weekly
Paris 2x weekly
Zurich 2x weekly
Rome 2x weekly
Milan 2x weekly
Madrid 3x weekly
Lisbon 2x weekly
Porto 2x weekly

Santiago de Compostela was dropped in 1996. All flights into Europe involved two destinations per flight. Iberia operates once a week on the Tenerife-Caracas route, which is a segment on it's Madrid service.

 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Varghel
Posts: 74
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 3:58 am

RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Thu Sep 06, 2001 10:23 pm

Thanks.
I thought it was so, because I have never heard talking about Viasa in Barcelona (Spain).
I do remember Viasa In Madrid, Santiago de Compostela and Tenerife.

By the way, I used to fly Viasa on the Milan-Caracas route, that on summer didn't pass thorough Rome: there two separate flight to the two Italian cities. I can't remember, but I really don't think that there were just two flight per week: they were probably 3, even one more in summer.

Anyway, what do you thinl about Avensa? They are full of debts and they drop many destinations inside Venezuela: Avensa doesn't fly the Caracas - Maracaibo anymore.
The just go to Barcelona and San Antonio for what I do know.
They again have two DC10's just for Spain and the Government seems to have plans...
I hope the best.

Varghel

Varghel
 
AFa340-300E
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RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Fri Sep 07, 2001 12:28 am

Hello,

And what kind of route network do they have in Latin America please? Is there any website with some more information about them please?

Thank you,

Best regards,
Alain Mengus

 
Varghel
Posts: 74
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 3:58 am

RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Fri Sep 07, 2001 5:59 am

Avensa flies now to Miami bu did fly even to Lima, Quito and Bogotà. But I can't find any more information about that.
Anyway Servivensa flies to Lima, Quito Bogotà and Miami.

The wb site is closed since months: www.avensa.com.ve
Varghel
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2471
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Correction On Viasa

Fri Sep 07, 2001 8:24 am

Varghel:

Yes, you are correct. I just looked at Iberia's 1997 timetable, which still includes Viasa's international routes. by the way, Amsterdam was no longer operated by 1996.

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Photo © Prem Andreas


Viasa's last European schedule looked like this:

Madrid - 4x weekly
Lisbon - 2x weekly
Porto - 2x weekly
London - 2x weekly
Paris - 2x weekly
Zurich - 2x weekly
Frankfurt - 3x weekly
Milan - 4x weekly
Rome - 4x weekly


VA706 Caracas-Porlamar-Frankfurt (1x weekly)
VA708 Caracas-Zurich-Frankfurt (2x weekly)
VA722 Caracas-Rome-Milan (4x weekly)
VA714 Caracas-Oporto-Lisbon (1x weekly)
VA730 Caracas-London-Paris (2x weekly)
VA740 Caracas-Madrid (2x weekly)
VA742 Caracas-Lisbon-Madrid (1x weekly)
VA744 Caracas-Madrid-Oporto (1x weekly)

Don't you miss Venezolana Internacional de Aviacion?


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Photo © Marco Mittini



Well, I'll give you my opinion on Avensa. I really like the airline (although I've never flown them) I really hope they make it, I don't want to see them end up like Viasa. I like the expansion they are doing in Europe and everything about them.

However, they have added and withdrawn European destinations since they started transatlantic services. I don't blame them, the floods of 2000 took their toll on the airline but on the other hand they don't show consistency in their route structure. It's a poorly run airline. These days you can't really fly long distance destinations with 1 or 2 flights per week. Even though I like the idea of having Venezuela's flag flying over Santiago de Compostela, Lisbon and Tenerife, business wise I believe it could be a wrong move. Having a destination with only once a week service is terribly expensive and only guarantees low yields as the routes don't attract any business travelers.

I really hope it works and I also wish that the Venezuelan gov. helps out the airline by injected the $100 million it has promised to pay. If I had the money, I wouldn't mind flying from Caracas to Santiago de Compostela just to sample such exotic route.

 SmileLatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
chepos
Posts: 5938
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Fri Sep 07, 2001 9:53 am

I think Avensa should first concentrate on regional routes and getting their airline well organized and later on when they are really prepared to fly into Europe with a solid schedule start flying into Europe.
Chepos
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
Guest

RE: Avensa Returns To Europe

Fri Sep 07, 2001 11:30 am

Wouldn't be more profitable for Avensa flying to London, Paris and Frankfurt instead of Lisbon, Tenerife and Santiago de Compostela????

As I know, Lisbon is not a huge business center...
Tenerife is a holiday center but mainly for Europeans
And Santiago de Compostela is far less important in Spain than Barcelona, Sevilla or Bilbao

And about that thing that a lot of Galicians went to Venezuela is not a good argument, as a lot of germans came to Chile...and there are no flights from Santiago to Munich or Stuttgart...and also a lot of italians went to Argentina, and Aerolineas Argentinas never flew to Napoli,Torino or Bologna...

It's a weird venezuelan decission.
 
Varghel
Posts: 74
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Have A Think About Venezuela...

Fri Sep 07, 2001 8:34 pm

It's true that flying to destinations usually unprofittable is a specifical Venezuelan case.
In my opinion all this comes from the Venezuelan culture that, because of its position (close to USA and not unreaccheable from Europe), had never had big problems to get around the world.

Consider some indicating facts.
- Why the French decided to come to Venezuelan after First War Mondial to instal the Postal Service?
It was (I guess) the country with good population and in a strategical position: not next to the USA (as Mexico) and not far as Brazil.
- Why Pan Am decided to make business in Venezuela founding Avensa in 1943? Because Venezuela was close to USA: New York was reached by Linea Aeropostal Venezolana-Aeropostal during the 1960's by the Locheed Super Constellation in 6 hours. Even today from Argentina, an Aereolineas Argentinas 747 token 10 hours!!!

During the 60's and the 70's Venezuelan was a country with a good economy and travelling was not uncommon. That's why Pan Am arrived to send even more than two 747 per day or Air France sended the Concorde to Caracas from 1976 to 1982.
Viasa flew to many destinations as well and with good planes.

Now, because of the changed times, there is less people travelling. But there still is.
And it must be considered the situation of Avensa, because from this depends most of the thing: they do have to DC10's flying to destinations surely profittable for them and, with the very delicate position in wich the airline is now, it is better to consolidate them.
I don't know about the future (will Avensa survive?), but I guess it could be like this:
- the Venezuelan Governament will inject money into Avensa, probably to pay the more important debts.
- the airline will continue to fly to the safe destinations of Madrid, Santiago de Compostela, Tenerife and Lisbon.
- once payed the debts, the airline will have to decide if to consolidate the situation or if to expand some more. I think they will choose the second choice.
- the airline will open the routes to Oporto, and the Rome-Milan.
- new routes thorough Margarita Island: Caracas-Margarita-Madrid and Caracas-Margarita-Milan.
These will be touristical flights.

Varghel
Varghel

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