gf-a330
Posts: 1604
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2001 10:09 pm

PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Thu Oct 11, 2001 7:46 pm

PK 723

dep: MANCHESTER TORONTO 743 12:30
arr : MANCHESTER TORONTO 743 14:45

Just visited the PIA website, it seems as though this route has started again.

Anyone, know the reason. Is it due to the fact that Birmingham is suspended ?
 
BlueShamu330s
Posts: 2569
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2001 3:11 am

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Thu Oct 11, 2001 11:06 pm

Don't know the answer to that one, but there was a PIA 742 get airborne to ISB this morning ex MAN also.
So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
 
airmale
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Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:48 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 2:59 am

I think its about time they painted the 747-300s in their full livery, maybe even colour the engines Green to enhance it, what do you think Shabaz Smile

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Andy Martin

.....up there with the best!
 
gf-a330
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 3:30 am

Couldn't agree with you any less.

The current scheme of the 747-300, is very bland and boring. The current livery, gives the airline, the look of a cargo carrier, due to its plain fuselage.

I would like them to adopt the floral design. Why didn't they just stick to it. Why take it off ?

Or else, the silver fuselage, which you have mentioned.

I think Ahmed Saeed MD, needs a little more persuasion. I think i'll put a word in also.

If the 777 story is true, then PIA, will definately have to adopt a new corporate identity. To reposition itself in the region.
 
airmale
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 4:09 am

Did you get my mail, regarding the livery Confused
.....up there with the best!
 
gf-a330
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 6:41 am

Yes, it said PIA livery in the subject, but it was blank after that !
 
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yyz717
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Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:26 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 7:28 am

I've always liked the various PIA liveries. I always thought that they were modern, crisp & clean.

This is my favourite PIA scheme:


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Frank Schaefer



Neil/Toronto
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
khi747
Posts: 1532
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2000 6:30 am

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 8:30 am

Speaking of PIA livery....i do think they should remove the PIA acronym from the tail and replace it with some Pakistani or Islamic symbol. Also i think there should be more Urdu written on the plane....if you look at airlines of Arab countries, the arabic on the plane looks beautiful....Urdu would look just as good......infact the only Urdu on PIA planes is infact the acronym PIA itself....!! And that too is soo tiny and little.....What do you guys think?
 
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yyz717
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 8:43 am

I disagree with more Urdu script. PIA already has the Pakistani market wrapped up....but it has problems attracting Western customers....as does Air-India. The PIA flights for instance out of YYZ (Toronto) are almost exclusively ethnic Pakistani traffic...despite having FFR thru cities such as MAN, JFK, FRA. PIA just does not seem to be a flying option for non-Pakistanis.

More Urdu script would not attract any more Pakistani customers. Maintaining/re-emphasizing the English PIA script will help attract a wider customer base.

Other national carriers from countries with non-Roman alphabets commonly use English script only.....examples include Korean Air, JAL, Cathay, China AL, Thai, Singapore,....there are many examples.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
airmale
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 10:54 pm

I agree with KHI747 that the PIA acronym should be dropped and with Yyz717 regarding attracting more non-Pakistani customers, but since the airline is financially constrained its bets that they stick with either the present look, upgrade it a bit by painting the engines Green too, adjust the size of the "Pakistan" title as some 742 and the 743 are wearing larger versions with a thicker font while the rest of the fleet has still got the older thinner font style as can be seen in the photos of the A310 and the 747 in the posts above, also the Urdu logo on 747s should be brought down to the below window level like on the other aircraft and again the size adjusted accordingly.

GF-A330 my mail was for you to write a letter to Ahmed Saeed requesting him to have all of the planes in PK's fleet painted in their full livery as the two distinct versions being worn at present really look bad, being a businessman he should know that a good image counts, so if you can then please write to him, not email, but write or type a letter to send they never respond to emails, heres teh link to my post about the floral tail on silver, Air Orange was kind enough to do it but with his own floral version as he could not download PIA's one on the Adobe Illustrator http://airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/561596/4/ Smile
.....up there with the best!
 
gf-a330
Posts: 1604
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 11:28 pm

Whats the address by the way ??

What if I print Air Orange, design and send it as an idea. I will mention, that it is his idea. Thats ofcourse, if Air Orange, allows this.

Any ideas ??
 
gf-a330
Posts: 1604
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2001 10:09 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sat Oct 13, 2001 11:43 pm

Airmale

Whats the activity like at Karachi airport at the moment.

with the current situation, KHI will proabably be quiet, or is it normal .
 
airmale
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 1:02 am

Yar you can send the idea across to the M.D, but you must mention Air Orange's company name for the credit, just incase they want to contact him to design a new livery, I have mailed you the address, hope you have recieved it by now, as for the activity at the airport, I have no idea, havent been there since the Sept 11th incidenst, but do know that the army is there and you have to check in three hours before departure for all flights, KHI except for some areas is relatively calm, what you see on TV is just pockets of trouble by an extreme minority Smile
.....up there with the best!
 
khi747
Posts: 1532
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2000 6:30 am

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 5:42 am

I do not know how more Urdu can discourage non-pakistanis or even encourage Pakistanis......its just a symbolic thing....infact it is something that alot of people appreciate........Look at GF and EK.......are the only pax travelling on them arabs because they have arabic text on the planes .........??!!!!
 
airmale
Posts: 7125
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:48 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 6:43 am

Actually if its tasefully done then theres no harm, but I definitely do not like the whole Arabic stories written on the planes of some Arab countries, like Syrian Air, Kuwait Airways, it takes away from the livey and design, the only ones I find tolerable are RJ, MS, EK and GF, did you know when PIA was formed they actually carried Urdu titles spelling out "Pakistan International", sorry to say so but it looked hideous and I hope PIA never bring that back Smile
.....up there with the best!
 
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yyz717
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 7:41 am

I don't mind the Arabic or Urdu script...say on one side (with English on the other) or in tandem with English. If the airline has a recognizable livery and reputation, everyone knows who they are.

Just that the elimination of English (w a predomination of Urdu) on PIA (as suggested my someone on this thread) would send a wrong message to the travelling world.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
airmale
Posts: 7125
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:48 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 7:48 am

Pakistan International Airlines in the Urdu laguage would literally translate to "Pakistan Banulakwami Fizai Idara" Smile
.....up there with the best!
 
khi747
Posts: 1532
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2000 6:30 am

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 8:08 am

Ofcourse i mean in tandem........when i said PIA should have what airlines like GF and EK have......that is exactly what i meant.....if you look at the liveries of Emirates, Gulfair and Saudi Arabian.......they have both arabic and english written toghether........i do'nt know how much of a wrong message people have taken by reading "Al-Emarat" on every Emirates plane......not much i'd say its one of the more international carriers.
Just the purpose of the arabic.....Urdu in PIA's case......it just symbolises pride in identity.
 
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yyz717
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RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 8:13 am

Pride in identity?? Why?? Pakistan is a very poor 3rd world country.

It's about attracting passengers, not national pride. PIA already has a lock-step on Pakistani-ethnic traffic....they won't attract addl Western business with a re-emphasis on Urdu script.

Emirates has a very strong reputation for excellent inflight service....they can perhaps afford a stronger focus on their Arabic script/identity now that their reputation is so well established.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
khi747
Posts: 1532
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2000 6:30 am

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Sun Oct 14, 2001 5:14 pm

Relax Yyz717......i dont think that for the vast majority of the pax it even matters whats written on the fuselage.......let alone language. Do you think anything more then 10% of the pax have even an idea what plane they are on...
The Script is just a symbolic thing.....i defines the identity. So what if Pakistan is poor.....Urdu is still its language. And i dont understand whats your point of argument when i have given you so many examples of airlines that do display arabic text on their planes......doesnt scare away no one much the same way it doesnt attract many people necesarrily. It will surely make the planes look better.
 
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yyz717
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Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:26 pm

RE: PIA Have Started MAN-TORONTO Again

Mon Oct 15, 2001 1:37 am

If PIA wants to appeal more to the mainstream world traveller and gain more non-Pakistani customers, a re-emphasis of the Urdu script is not the way to go.

It's an English-speaking world out there for intl travel. PIA has serious image problems wherever it flies.....improving its schedules, on-time record, aircraft interiors....are what's needed. Not focusing on Urdu script that no non-Pakistanis would ever understand.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.

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