baec777
Posts: 1232
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 5:01 am

Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 11:26 am

Will Boeing build a Boeing 777-400...??

We Have a B777-200 & B777-300.... What about a B777-400.

Like the Boeing 767 fleet in -200/-300/-400.

baec777
 
iluvwestjet
Posts: 116
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2001 5:18 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 12:46 pm

It'll depend on whether there's a need for a stretch or shortening of the 777 series. It's really hard to say at this point. The 777-300s are still fairly new; I don't think there's an adequate response on whether significant changes are needed on the current 777 series to warrant a 777-400.
 
Jean Leloup
Posts: 1953
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 10:46 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 12:51 pm

Airbus certainly hopes not!

in all seriousness, I've heard that the 777 design platform is very much capable of being stretched further. However, if a 774 came out, it would probably hold pretty much exactly the same number of people as a 744, wouldn't it? If it would, then it wouldn't have much of a future, because I guess it'd have considerably less range than a 744. i guess it might possibly have better economics, but i still don't see much of a market for it. Interesting question!
Next flight.... who knows.
 
B808/A400
Posts: 81
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:06 pm

Does anyone know if adding another pair of engies would be an option?

Is the 777 platform scalable in that respect?
 
Jean Leloup
Posts: 1953
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 10:46 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:10 pm

i think they'd have to re-desing the wing for that... big $$$. And if they stretched it and put 2 more engines on it, then they'd REALLY be killing the 747. they might as well just put hump on it.

A Tri-jet 777, perhaps?  Smile
Next flight.... who knows.
 
Dash8King
Posts: 2657
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:13 pm

The 747 is pretty much dead. Nobody wanted the 500 let it go. I love the 747 but its time to let it rest before
 
Jean Leloup
Posts: 1953
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 10:46 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:17 pm

King, before what?
Boeing intends to keep the 747 in production for a LONG time. Whether or not this will involve a stretched variant is debatable, but they will certainly continue to make little improvements. This is still a very popular plane and I doubt they intend to "let it go". If they do, they won't be able to compete with Airbus at ALL on the higher end of the size scale.
Next flight.... who knows.
 
Dash8King
Posts: 2657
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2001 8:45 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:20 pm

You can only make little improvments for a short time. I am not saying drop the line tomorrow but they need to focus on a new line such as an boeing design like the A380 or stretching the 777 but I don't think there will be a newer model. I say it will be dropped within 10 years or so.
 
baec777
Posts: 1232
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 5:01 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:30 pm

"Triple-7-Four" trijet !!  Smile there you go !!

baec777
 
B808/A400
Posts: 81
Joined: Sat May 05, 2001 8:22 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 1:43 pm

Someday engines will be so small and so powerful, that they'll fit inside the
fuselage and only one will suffice  Smile
 
na
Posts: 9129
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 9:03 pm

If you mean a even longer 777 than the 773 it would be a serious contender for the title "The ugliest widebody airplane".
I heard that the 773 even has to be flown carefully to avoid tailstrikes so what about an even longer sausage? I heavily doubt Boeing is so stupid building a 744 contender with such a strange stretch.
 
The Coachman
Posts: 1192
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2001 9:57 pm

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 9:24 pm

Maybe a short version of the -200...to replace the B767-300ER? It might be able to produce commonality savings. BA is a case in point.

The Coachman
M88, 722, 732, 733, 734, 73G, 73H, 742, 743, 744, 752, 762, 763, 772, 773, 77W, 320, 332, 333, 345, 388, DH8, SF3 - want
 
boeing767-300
Posts: 621
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 11:23 pm

Re Dash8King

Mon Dec 17, 2001 9:47 pm

"The 747 is pretty much dead. Nobody wanted the 500 let it go. I love the 747 but its time to let it rest before"

Did you forget to finish your post...before what. A fairly brave statement but I think you will find the 747 being produced for some time yet.

A 777-400 would be TOO LONG and would probably suffer from tail strike.

The 747 is a classic aircraft that changed aviation forever and if the A380 is half as successful as the 747 it will be doing OK.

However I suspect the demand for the A380(initial orders excluded) will be less than anticipated and the ongoing demand for the 747 will be better than expected.

Unless Airbus give them away the economics of the 777 or 744 or A346 will probably be more economically viable, just like airlines now are parking 744s that can't be filled for 777/A340s that run full.

The 747 is a truly beautiful classic looking aircraft that despite being smaller actually looks bigger than the A380 which is rather ugly especially with the Cockpit on the lower level. Check out this SIA 744-412 and you will see what I mean!!!!

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Andrew Hunt



 
Flying-Tiger
Posts: 3923
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 1999 5:35 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 9:56 pm

Boeing did raise the topic "B777-100" as a potential B767/A310 replacement but carriers asked to evaluate the plane weren´t really happy about it, mainly because it was too heavy for their missions.

A 777-400 is something I can´t imagine, the B773 is already nearly 80 meters long and the 80x80 meter box is THE important figure for both airports and manufacturers. And If I´m informed correct the -300 has already an updated software to avoid tailstrikes.

Regards
Flying-Tiger
http://fly.to/rorders


Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
 
racko
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Mon Dec 17, 2001 11:04 pm

you can make every aircraft looking big if you take your photo with the right angle
 
boeing767-300
Posts: 621
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 11:23 pm

RE: Re Dash8King

Tue Dec 18, 2001 12:44 am

A 744 looks big from ANY angle as if you didn't know!!
 
DeanBNE
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 1:06 am

A Boeing 777-300 stretch? Only a slight strectch would be possible, due to tail strike, MTOW and ground handling issues.
A 777-300 with boosted MTOW? Boosting the MTOW would be quite limited, due to *current* powerplant limitations and the 777's twin bogey pavement loading limitations (not so much of a problem for the A340NGs with 3 bogey config).
OT: Future of the 747? The next 5 years will tell.
OT: Future of the A380? The next 20 years will tell.

Cheers,
DeanBNE
 
baec777
Posts: 1232
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 5:01 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 2:26 am

I may say the B774 will be a smaller version of the -200 if there wasn't any B777-100 built. very small Range just like Boeing 744 Domestic is only 1805NM. Do you believe that...? So I think Boeing can make the B774 same as Domestic B744 series. If BOEING approves it or not...!!

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/747-400d/product.html




mixed class
568 passengers
first class
24 passengers 39-inch pitch
economy class
544 passengers 32-inch pitch



baec777  Smile
 
david b.
Posts: 2894
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2001 7:18 pm

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 2:29 am

I personally would like to see a jet like that of a blended wing design. Really cool. Engines in the fuselarge like that of a trijet. Concorde like nacelles.
That should look really cool.  Smokin cool
Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
 
Dash8King
Posts: 2657
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2001 8:45 am

RE: Re Dash8King

Tue Dec 18, 2001 2:42 am

I agree with you about the A380 I mean in other post I have posted that the A380 is to large. But what else can they do with it I mean I guess they could start making an 747NG with the older models. Just becuase something is a milestone and is a huge part of history doesn't mean boeing is gonna keep the 747 forever.
It would be nice to see a new model but like I said I think the line will be cut within 10 years.

ps I would really like to see a 747SP-NG
 
ILS
Posts: 2291
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 2:48 am

A further stretch of the 777--perhaps a 777-400--would create a very cost-effective aircraft. Although Boeing denies it is seriously considering this option, a second 777 stretch would offer a lower-cost, "almost-as-capable" option for airlines eyeing the A380. Unless a carrier could fill the A380 with an 85% load and fly it at the outer end of its range, a 777-400 would be much more cost effective. The 777-400, would, in short, take much of the 747-400 replacement demand away from the A380.

 
Jean Leloup
Posts: 1953
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 10:46 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 2:51 am

And you copied that from where???

King, 744 production is not going to continue because people think it is a "milestone". It is going to continue because it is a very efficient aircraft that has a whole market to itself. Boeing has said that they will continue production for a long time. it's not something people here are making up just because they like them!
Next flight.... who knows.
 
Dash8King
Posts: 2657
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RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 3:45 am

Jean I think your taking my opinions way to personally here. Boeing has said that yes, but its all what the customers want. The only else that you can do with it is make it a full double decker like I said.
 
Dash8King
Posts: 2657
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2001 8:45 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 3:55 am

I am gonna stop posting about the 747 anyways as this was not the topic. Sorry Baec777 for bringing up another topic into your topic.
 
baec777
Posts: 1232
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 5:01 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 4:21 pm

Dash8King, No Problems Big grin I was also thinking about the Boeing 744s.

No Worry.

baec777
 
Jean Leloup
Posts: 1953
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 10:46 am

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 5:06 pm

King, for the record, i don't even LIKE the 747, so it's not about personal attachments! I just disagree with your assertion that the 747 will not last much longer: I don't think Boeing has anything on the table to replace it, be it a 777-400 or otherwise!

You are certainly right that it is what the customers want that is most important. However, i don't think that customers have lost interest in the 747. when they do, I suppose boeing might be in trouble, but I don't think this is the case yet.

As for making it a full double-decker, that is not possible without a new wing, new undercarriage, new engines, etc. in other words, it is not possible with the 747, meaning that, as we agreed earlier, the 747 will not likely develop into anything a whole lot bigger any time soon.
Next flight.... who knows.
 
lutfi
Posts: 687
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 6:33 pm

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 5:58 pm

If Boeing used sonic cruiser technology (engines and composites) to re wing and re engine the B777-300, it would have incredible seat/ mile costs. As good or better as the A380, but in a smaller package. This would be a B744/A380 killer. However they are unlikely to do this, because it would mean throwing away the B777-300ER as well.
 
Joni
Posts: 2613
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2000 11:05 pm

RE: Will There Be A Boeing 777-400...?

Tue Dec 18, 2001 7:59 pm


Lutfi,

What do you base your assumptions on? A large part of costs are various people costs, which scale with size so it would be very difficult for the 773 to match the costs of A380. Besides, "Sonic Cruiser technology" at this point, for all we know, is just something nice people do with Powerpoint. The SC design has undergone some quite dramatic changes that have increased its costs, and the entire issue of where it will settle or will it eventually settle is still open.

The SC design is optimized for a different kind of product than 773. 773 is optimized for cost, SC for speed.

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