n7371f
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DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:46 pm

Standby for another DL expansion announcement out of SEA for the summer and the fall. It's coming either Tuesday or early Wednesday this week. No international additions although DL would like to add 1-2 but because the airport is stuffed, won't do it.

Delta will have finished with gate realignment on B and S giving them 4-5 extra gates for E75's. SkyWest will have taken most of its 19 E7W order for DL and those are going out of SEA.

One other note, the bumbling Port of Seattle is already 1 year late on the new IAF at SeaTac. Still no shovel in the ground but promising airlines it'll happen next month.
 
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modernArt
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:46 pm

Hmmm, Austin, Houston and/or Dallas? Maybe San Antonio, but doubtful.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:09 pm

Maybe they'll move some of the E75's and CRJ's to the realigned gates and move in more mainline to the remaining gates.
 
commavia
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:09 pm

ORD and DFW seem like two of the most obvious gaps Delta needs to fill - both in terms of relevance for local SEA O&D, and for connectivity with Asia.
 
steex
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:12 pm

n7371f wrote:
No international additions although DL would like to add 1-2 but because the airport is stuffed, won't do it.


Not intending to be snarky or question your knowledge, but this sounds exactly like the kind of PR spin I'd use if I didn't want to add any international flights.
 
DeSpringbokke
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:32 pm

n7371f wrote:
Standby for another DL expansion announcement out of SEA for the summer and the fall. It's coming either Tuesday or early Wednesday this week. No international additions although DL would like to add 1-2 but because the airport is stuffed, won't do it.

Delta will have finished with gate realignment on B and S giving them 4-5 extra gates for E75's. SkyWest will have taken most of its 19 E7W order for DL and those are going out of SEA.

One other note, the bumbling Port of Seattle is already 1 year late on the new IAF at SeaTac. Still no shovel in the ground but promising airlines it'll happen next month.


So no SEA-TPE.... yet. Isn't a surprise with the end of the remaining Alaska codeshares. I bet Delta is getting annoyed with the IAF delay. I wonder if they'd seriously consider a few red eyes to Asia and early morning arrivals into SEA to compensate for congestion.
 
papatango
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:26 pm

Columbus Ohio. PLEASE!
 
compensateme
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:28 pm

commavia wrote:
ORD and DFW seem like two of the most obvious gaps Delta needs to fill - both in terms of relevance for local SEA O&D, and for connectivity with Asia.


With AA (6x738 -> 3x738) and UA (2x320, 738, 739, 2x753 -> 2x738, 2x753) mutilating capacity ORD/SEA this summer, now may be the perfect time for DL to launch service.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
paulsea
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:31 pm

Any chance of IAD or (long-shot) DCA?
 
BroadwayLimited
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:32 pm

I wonder if the IAF delay is on purpose as a favor to AS? Hmmm...
 
hiflyeras
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:34 pm

AS going to 4x daily SEA-ORD in March.
 
bfitzflyer
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:58 pm

I would guess, Oakland, Burbank and a couple of Midwestern cities, Indianapolis and Chicago...
 
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flymco753
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:03 pm

DL at SEA doesn't do seasonal flying to RSW or TPA yet, I assume these will come in due time along with their current seasonal flights to MCO and FLL. They could make it work once daily on a 757 during peak and the 737-800 or -900 during slower times, than leave the flight for the late summer when travel to FL isn't as high.
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BigGSFO
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:31 pm

paulsea wrote:
Any chance of IAD or (long-shot) DCA?

Re DCA: they would have to reallocate a current beyond-perimeter slot (that is able to be reallocated) from SLC to add SEA-DCA. I am not sure they would want to do that given SLC is a hub.
 
steex
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:38 pm

BigGSFO wrote:
paulsea wrote:
Any chance of IAD or (long-shot) DCA?

Re DCA: they would have to reallocate a current beyond-perimeter slot (that is able to be reallocated) from SLC to add SEA-DCA. I am not sure they would want to do that given SLC is a hub.


They've actually already reallocated that slot pair to new LAX service beginning in April, reducing SLC to one daily. DL obviously sees LAX as a more lucrative opportunity than SEA, so I don't think they would add SEA unless given the opportunity for additional perimeter exceptions.
 
flyboy80
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:43 pm

I'm hoping SEA gets one or two mainline markets at least and perhaps some mainline flights taking over some of the many connection frequencies.
Last edited by flyboy80 on Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
ty97
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:43 pm

Might some of the adds be cities be northwest cities that AS currently operates which DL is losing codeshares on? I would expect this may be the case.
 
AaronPGH
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:45 pm

I hope this is finally the moment PIT gets SEA service back.
 
DFW789ER
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:47 pm

commavia wrote:
ORD and DFW seem like two of the most obvious gaps Delta needs to fill - both in terms of relevance for local SEA O&D, and for connectivity with Asia.


Agreed. Sooner or later they are going to have to connect some of the major cities (non-hubs) east of the Rockies. These two seem obvious.
 
flyboy80
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:47 pm

ty97 wrote:
Might some of the adds be cities be northwest cities that AS currently operates which DL is losing codeshares on? I would expect this may be the case.


They already announced EUG a bit ago which makes sense for the connections SEA is after. I'm not sure how much benefit there would be to adding places like MFR or RDM as they're demographic is probably well connected via SLC.
 
masgniw
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:49 pm

Definitely agree with adding SEA-ORD. I'm wondering too if they will try to compete with AS on SEA-BUR.
 
deltal1011man
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:50 pm

steex wrote:
n7371f wrote:
No international additions although DL would like to add 1-2 but because the airport is stuffed, won't do it.


Not intending to be snarky or question your knowledge, but this sounds exactly like the kind of PR spin I'd use if I didn't want to add any international flights.

I wouldn't call it spin, DL has been saying this for the last two years. Till the new IAF is done no more international adds. LAX is going to get all the international love for the next few years out west.

However I would put money on SEA-TPE once the new facility is done.
commavia wrote:
ORD and DFW seem like two of the most obvious gaps Delta needs to fill - both in terms of relevance for local SEA O&D, and for connectivity with Asia.

ORD is going to be an issue on the ORD side due to gates. DL wants to add both LAX and SEA but space is an issue.
I don't understand why this site even has moderators anymore.
 
Americanp
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:56 pm

Overall, I think that ORD won't happen because of the gate space issue at ORD. I could see IND or COS. ORD and DFW are both highly competitive routes, but I don't think that will stop Delta.
 
dc10lover
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:10 pm

I think DL will add more Seattle - California routes. Will E175's work in LGB? On one forum they mentioned DL asking for LGB slots.
Ever Wish You Can Go Back In Time And Live In An Earlier Era Of Aviation?
 
deltal1011man
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:37 pm

dc10lover wrote:
I think DL will add more Seattle - California routes. Will E175's work in LGB? On one forum they mentioned DL asking for LGB slots.

If DL can get slots yes. They will be hard to come by.
But the only aircraft with F DL has that fits under the commuter slot weight limit is the CR7. Plenty of commuter slots IIRC.
I don't understand why this site even has moderators anymore.
 
compensateme
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:42 pm

Americanp wrote:
Overall, I think that ORD won't happen because of the gate space issue at ORD. I could see IND or COS. ORD and DFW are both highly competitive routes, but I don't think that will stop Delta.


While I'm skeptical (and would be surprised by) of SEA/ORD service, it won't because of lack of gates - I wouldn't believe everything certain posters persist. DL operates four additional flights (one each to ATL, DTW, MSP & JFK) during the warmer months; the additional flights are woven throughout the day, as opposed to being RON adds. DL could maintain capacity via upgaguging - the logistics of adding SEA are certainly there.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
fsafsx
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:44 pm

I hope CMH is high on the list, Im pretty sure Delta can fill a stretch 737.
 
crazytoaster
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:45 pm

Americanp wrote:
Overall, I think that ORD won't happen because of the gate space issue at ORD. I could see IND or COS. ORD and DFW are both highly competitive routes, but I don't think that will stop Delta.


No way on IND. AS is adding SEA-IND in May. I don't think there is room for 2 carriers, at least not yet.
IND homebase, soon to be DEN
 
carljanderson
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:51 pm

dc10lover wrote:
I think DL will add more Seattle - California routes. Will E175's work in LGB? On one forum they mentioned DL asking for LGB slots.


When would they have asked for slots? Last year, LGB went from 41 to 50 due to the noise study, and those slots went 4 to WN, 3 to B6, and 2 to DL.

As deltal1011man said, the E170/175 will not fit as a "commuter" slot. A commuter slot is defined as having a MTOW below 75K lbs, and the CRJ7 fits. 

deltal1011man wrote:
dc10lover wrote:
I think DL will add more Seattle - California routes. Will E175's work in LGB? On one forum they mentioned DL asking for LGB slots.

If DL can get slots yes. They will be hard to come by.
But the only aircraft with F DL has that fits under the commuter slot weight limit is the CR7. Plenty of commuter slots IIRC.


I think all 25 are still open. DL gave up theirs when they received the 2 additional slots.

I don't see WN or B6 giving up any slots right now, have they?
 
compensateme
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:57 pm

IMO, only on a.net would SEA/LGB be high on DL's wish list...
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
usflyer123
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:08 pm

I can see RDM, ALW,FAT,MFR and MCI happening.
for most people the sky is the limit. for those who love aviation, the sky is home...
 
deltal1011man
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:13 pm

compensateme wrote:
Americanp wrote:
Overall, I think that ORD won't happen because of the gate space issue at ORD. I could see IND or COS. ORD and DFW are both highly competitive routes, but I don't think that will stop Delta.


While I'm skeptical (and would be surprised by) of SEA/ORD service, it won't because of lack of gates - I wouldn't believe everything certain posters persist. DL operates four additional flights (one each to ATL, DTW, MSP & JFK) during the warmer months; the additional flights are woven throughout the day, as opposed to being RON adds. DL could maintain capacity via upgaguging - the logistics of adding SEA are certainly there.

I agree. Much better to believe the poster who thinks IAE has dropped support for an engine (V2500) they are still currently producing. That is definitely who I would believe. :lol: :lol:


(or just look at Delta's schedule and the amount of gates they have at ORD. It isn't rocket science to figure out that, at peak times, the space just isn't there. Of course DL could reduce frequency, because that is exactly what trends of HVCs have shown. :roll: )
I don't understand why this site even has moderators anymore.
 
masgniw
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:25 pm

fsafsx wrote:
I hope CMH is high on the list, Im pretty sure Delta can fill a stretch 737.


"Pretty sure"? How so?
 
olddominion727
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:36 pm

I think MCI, STL, AUS, DFW, RDU tech cities to tech cities. I say RDU because there must be a need from the West Coast. AA added it from SJC for the last 3 years over the summer, DL has it from LAX, UA has it to SFO. DL is quite large at RDU. They offer service to CDG now, maybe they're trying to give their pax more one-stop connections to Asia from RDU?
 
DFW789ER
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:37 pm

usflyer123 wrote:
I can see RDM, ALW,FAT,MFR and MCI happening.


I can't. Small markets, though MCI is larger. All already served by AS (MCI also by WN). Even though they've shown they don't mind dipping into AS cities, I can't see where the traffic would come from. Given a very tight gate situation at SEA, DL ought to be focused on larger cities, and potential connections to their TPAC routes.
Last edited by DFW789ER on Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
compensateme
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:38 pm

deltal1011man wrote:
(or just look at Delta's schedule and the amount of gates they have at ORD. It isn't rocket science to figure out that, at peak times, the space just isn't there. Of course DL could reduce frequency, because that is exactly what trends of HVCs have shown. :roll: )


DL adds frequency during the peak summer months; in the case of ATL, DTW & MSP, historically capacity remains stagnant - it's just spread across fewer flights. This isn't done for the benefit of HVC.

DL isn't going to inaugurate ORD with more than a few flights; the logistics of operating the service are there. You can insist that gate constraints are the reason DL isn't able to add SEA and LAX to ORD, but it fails the rationally argument.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
Jshank83
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:24 pm

olddominion727 wrote:
I think MCI, STL, AUS, DFW, RDU tech cities to tech cities. I say RDU because there must be a need from the West Coast. AA added it from SJC for the last 3 years over the summer, DL has it from LAX, UA has it to SFO. DL is quite large at RDU. They offer service to CDG now, maybe they're trying to give their pax more one-stop connections to Asia from RDU?


I doubt STL. Although there is a big Boeing facility here, I think most of them take the AS flights (2 a day, but they are in the process of downgrading one from mainline to RJ175 in May) and WN has one a day already. This makes me doubt they add that route here. I would love to have more DL options though.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:33 pm

If DL really wanted to add to the Pacific or ORD, they can make it work. It's simply an excuse to say otherwise. DL is off their Pacific peak, and they could easily shift some things around at ORD. They just can't or don't want to compete more in those venues. Simple as that.

With more ERJ gates available, my expansion guesses would be any city within their range with AS service.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:37 pm

DL has previously announced SEA-RDU 738 service starting in June 2017.

If they are adding west coast / mountain west markets, then frequency matters and connectivity to TPAC flights becomes more relevant.

If they are adding midwest, east coast, and southeast markets, then its likely to be 1x daily flights that appeal to O&D and connect to Hawaii/Alaska flights. TPAC connectivity is secondary and not as relevant since these markets are primarily connected over DTW
 
SurfandSnow
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:22 pm

With the AS/DL partnership officially coming to an end I have to think popular longtime AS destinations like BLI, BUR, DFW, MFR, OAK, ONT and RNO are strong contenders here, although newer stuff like AUS, LIH and MCI certainly wouldn't come as a surprise either. I don't think they will try ORD until securing more gate space there - given all the congestion and weather issues that that airport has, it's important to have some slack in the gate scheduling...
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
MaxTrimm
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:25 pm

usflyer123 wrote:
I can see RDM, ALW,FAT,MFR and MCI happening.

FAT, MFR, and MCI? Maybe.
ALW is way too small of a market. QX has 3x daily and that I'm sure is enough. Plus, it's only a 45 minute drive from PSC, which has plenty of service.
RDM as well. Plenty of flights to SEA and PDX, as well as DEN and SLC.
 
ty97
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:29 pm

MaxTrimm wrote:
usflyer123 wrote:
I can see RDM, ALW,FAT,MFR and MCI happening.

FAT, MFR, and MCI? Maybe.
ALW is way too small of a market. QX has 3x daily and that I'm sure is enough. Plus, it's only a 45 minute drive from PSC, which has plenty of service.
RDM as well. Plenty of flights to SEA and PDX, as well as DEN and SLC.


While some of those markets may have ample service now, that doesn't mean that DL can't start service to try to take some of the traffic that other airlines are currently getting. (I am not arguing whether DL will or will not, just saying that this isn't a factor that makes it impossible for them to enter)
 
BoeingGuy
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:32 pm

olddominion727 wrote:
I think MCI, STL, AUS, DFW, RDU tech cities to tech cities. I say RDU because there must be a need from the West Coast. AA added it from SJC for the last 3 years over the summer, DL has it from LAX, UA has it to SFO. DL is quite large at RDU. They offer service to CDG now, maybe they're trying to give their pax more one-stop connections to Asia from RDU?


I think AA does SJC-CLT not SJC-RDU. AA announced SJC-RDU many years ago but never started it.

Personally I'd rather see CI start SEA-TPE rather than DL. I just flew CI and was very impressed with them. Service was excellent; airplanes were spotless; and their safety record has been flawless of late. Hugely improved airline. I can't see three airlines flying SEA-TPE and CI has mentioned possibly resuming SEA with an A350.
 
CMHMarc787
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:36 pm

bfitzflyer wrote:
I would guess, Oakland, Burbank and a couple of Midwestern cities, Indianapolis and Chicago...


papatango wrote:
Columbus Ohio. PLEASE!


I highly doubt BUR would be on their radar. AS already has a good hold on this route, so I just don't see that happening.

As for CMH...Yes, Please!!!!!
 
fsafsx
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:41 pm

masgniw wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
I hope CMH is high on the list, Im pretty sure Delta can fill a stretch 737.


"Pretty sure"? How so?
With Cmh being closely connected to Japan due to the auto industry in Ohio it makes sense to have good connections and for people that want to get to Hawaii and Alaska it just makes sense. 2 very tech savvy cities that could land a premium for tech travel too. The pdew is high enough to sustain 1 daily flight.
 
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tlecam
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:45 pm

I don't know if CMH is in the cards or not, but I wouldn't be surprised. DL has a pretty robust offering there - LGA, JFK, ATL, DTW, MSP, BOS, RDU and LAX. I think SLC is the only hub city without a flight. I bet SEA would do better than SLC.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
compensateme
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:56 pm

tlecam wrote:
I don't know if CMH is in the cards or not, but I wouldn't be surprised. DL has a pretty robust offering there - LGA, JFK, ATL, DTW, MSP, BOS, RDU and LAX. I think SLC is the only hub city without a flight. I bet SEA would do better than SLC.


SLC is a much larger hub with more utility than SEA from CMH. Connecting to just about anywhere domestically via SEA would add significant time vs. SLC (and even MSP) -- and people will notice.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
hiflyeras
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:02 pm

I won't be surprised to see DL add every single city flown by AS/QX out of SEA They won't care about taking away market share from (ahem) someone else or how much money they lose.
 
b6sea
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:07 pm

Seems to me that DL isn't really in the business of inaugurating totally new markets from SEA. They seem to like adding ones that are already flown by someone, so I doubt that they would add totally new routes. It's not impossible, and if they really wanted to put (another) shot across AS' bow then they could do that, but so far that hasn't been something they've really shown interest in.

Sorry to the folks hoping for PIT or CMH, but I think this announcement will be somewhat boring and will likely just fill in more of the differences between AS and DL's route maps.

But I think both of those cities are on AS' list in the not so distant future.
 
b6sea
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Re: DL SEA Domestic Expansion (again)

Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:19 pm

flymco753 wrote:
DL at SEA doesn't do seasonal flying to RSW or TPA yet, I assume these will come in due time along with their current seasonal flights to MCO and FLL. They could make it work once daily on a 757 during peak and the 737-800 or -900 during slower times, than leave the flight for the late summer when travel to FL isn't as high.


TPA wouldn't shock me, but I would be absolutely flabbergasted if RSW ever happened, even 1x/week seasonally. That just isn't really a market from SEA. We don't really make it out to Florida all that much and the areas around RSW just don't really have any name recognition here for tourists or vacation homes. Plus, Florida is a very long trek for us, and I say that as someone who used to travel to Florida at least twice a year from SEA. Puerto Vallarta or Cabo San Lucas are our RSW.

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