EGGD
Topic Author
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Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:29 am

Odd question...

I assumed that ALL runways were flat, it never occured to me that they might not be. But the first time I went spotting at my home airport, I noticed there is a huge difference in elavation. The rwy27 threshold is level with the terminal area, then it dips down to about 5m below, and then rises to about 5m above, and then stays at that height until the rwy9 threshold. Doesn't sound much, but BELIEVE ME, the runway is one of the worst i've seen (you can't see an aircraft on the rwy9 threshold from the rwy27threshold).

I thought that we were a one off, but the airport closest to me (Filton), is on a camber, much like MAN's main runway, 24R/6L. Where it peaks in height in the middle. Also, BHX is much like Bristol, in fact they are pretty similar apart from EGBB's is longer.. (we are not talking about users' thingy.....nevermind).

Also, I know of Jersey, Munich, Courcheval all have runways that are by no means flat.

So how flat is the runway near you? Anyone have any strange shape ones? Is there a legal limit to how steep a runway can be?

Thanks

Dan
 
DIA
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:32 am

All I can tell you is DIA's runways look like pancakes compare to old Stapleton's. Those looked like roller coasters, especially the old east-west runways!

Cheers, DIA
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juanchito
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:33 am

Here in La Aurora International, the runway isn't flat.


Juanchito
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QANTAS747-438
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:35 am

Here's a dip in the runway at ATL!


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dripstick
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:36 am

Flat runways are fairly rare. The only seemingly "flat" strip I can recall was Amsterdam. Most terrain has slight grades to deal with. If a runway was totaly level, think of the drainage problems. Would bring a whole new meaning to the term hydroplaning.
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Guest

RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:39 am

Telluride(KTEX) has a large dip in it. But then again it's on a plateau, and the highest commercial airport in the US, so what do you expect?

"Some fly at 9,078'. We land.
 
dripstick
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:46 am

I just looked up Telluride(KTEX). Now you're talking terrain! How long is the main runway?

http://www.sancarlospilots.org/telluride.jpg
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flightsimfreak
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:55 am

Where the GA runway crosses the big one at my airport, there is a big bump... I guess it's for drainage on the big one. Sometimes, if you're right at rotation, it can catapult you into the air... kinda fun.
 
HAL
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:06 am

The runways at Honolulu, including the reef runway are completely flat. At Seattle however, it is pretty straight (without bumps) but the north end is almost 80 feet higher than the south end.

HAL
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ammunition
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:07 am

how does this effect take off performance? or doesit even effect it?
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Big777jet
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 12:10 pm

Worse steep runway in the U.S.A. is Cape Newenham, Alaska. Rwy 14 elev is 230 feet and Rwy 32 elev is 541 feet almost 311 feet down the runway 34 for take off only and up the runway 14 landing only. The miss approach is inprobable!!!! Ahhhh!!! BTW, the runway is gravel at 3,950 feet length! I found the picture of airport! Here is http://www.firebirds.org/menu10/mn10_p61.htm

Big777jet

 
gmanmn
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 12:34 pm

Most commercial aircraft have a limitation of + or - 2% runway slope. That is measured from threashold to threashold. This data is published in most countries aeronautical publications for the airport data. Hope this helps...

Chow.
 
Guest

RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:37 pm

I was in Alpe-Du-huez. It is a ski resort in France south east of Lyon, and the airport there is anything but flat. It is practiaclly built up the mountain. I did some spotting and the planes (single engine props) would roll over the crest of the hill and plunge down the side of the mountain and then gadually lift off the runway. The planes landed opposite. Landed while flying positive fpm!! Then would coast to the runway and tehn add power and climb upward and touchdown on the runway! It was soo cool to watch  Big thumbs up

Kind of like the airport in TOMMOROW NEVER DIES 007
DeltaASA16
 
Guest

RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:43 pm

Seems like large dips, like the one in the ATL picture would cause a major water drainage problem. Wouldn't all just collect there? How are airplane tires with regard to water removal?
 
KAUSpilot
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:56 pm

There are almost no truly flat runways. Just pick up an airport facility directory, every runway has a slope grade in its information.

Galilee: The runways are humped in the middle, so the water drains off to each side. It's not a lot, but the center line of the runway might be maybe a foot higher than either edge. This is an approximation, it may be less, may be more.
 
gmonney
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:56 pm

YYZ has some dips in rwy 33R and L, hope that helps, I don't think you will find terain that is completly flat for that amount of space.

Grant
Drive it like you stole it!
 
Guest

RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:02 pm

All runways are flat. Now, if you mean sloped, thats a different story.
 
Boeing Nut
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:05 pm

duh.............
I'm not a real aeronautical engineer, I just play one on Airliners.net.
 
PUnmuth@VIE
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:39 pm

Here @ VIE the RWY 11/29 is far away from being flat. Click here and here to see it.
Peter
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RoyalDutch
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:52 pm

When the bus goes by the end of RW 22 here in Prague, you can see that it looks like its got huge waves in it....I always wondered about that too, as i've never seen anything actually use 22...
 
Goldenshield
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:54 pm

Catalina Island, CA, (AVX) has a BIG hill in the middle of the runway, so a/c on both sides cannot see each other. It is a 3000 foot runway that it 1000 feet MSL, with a cliff at both ends just feet from the runway. Imagine a mountain with the top chopped off.
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AWspicious
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 3:47 pm

I figured YYZ's runways were built like that intentionaly.
Great shots by the way, Peter.
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Demoose
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:32 pm

At Manchester runway 24R/6L has a hump in the middle. I've watched aircraft take off from 6L from the far end of the runway and you can only see half the runway, then out of nowhere a jet emerges over the runway horizon and flies right over, great to watch.

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The new runway 24L/6R on the other hand is pretty much completely flat with a slight dip in the center...

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DEM
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ThirtyEcho
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 12:16 am

Can't recall ever seeing a flat runway.
 
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nighthawk
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 12:37 am

i remember hearing that cape canaveral is the flattest runway in the world, with a difference of something like 2mm between elevation at each ends. Apparently it is so flat that it conforms to the curviture of the earth
 
EGGD
Topic Author
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 1:28 am

Kai Tak was pretty damn flat, If I remember rightly...

Demoose, as I said before, the main rwy does have that odd hump:

http://www.planepictures.net/netshow.cgi?1010413585:MAN

I think I might upload that to A.net, pretty cool.
 
schreiner
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 1:51 am

R/W atr AMS/SPL is as flat as a dubbeltje (dime)
(all 5 of them)
Gr,
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wjv04
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 2:42 am

guys, its pretty odd to think that a runway would be flat

you take a 10000ft long road, how flat would that be?
 
dripstick
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Feb 23, 2002 8:51 am

Schreiner...don't you mean as flat as a euro-dime?

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VapourTrails
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?

Fri Mar 08, 2002 4:03 pm

I was going to ask a question about runway surfaces! Smile/happy/getting dizzy On the new video Concorde: The New Era the runway at Exeter Airport that Concorde is departing from is like a roller coaster!  Wow! I didn't know they could be like that. All the ones I've seen [not that many mind] are always flat.

EGGD thanks for posting.


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PW100
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Mar 09, 2002 4:04 am

Indeed, Schiphol (AMS) runways are very flat [level]. All 5 runways have less than one feet elevation difference from the beginning to the end of thw runway. Mind you they are all something like 12 ft BELOW seal level...

PW100

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jwenting
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Mar 09, 2002 4:10 am

Depends on which end you start, PW100. It's -11 feet on the high end  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
No using the slope of the runway to slow down here...
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tguman
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RE: Is The Runway At Your Airport Flat!?!?!

Sat Mar 09, 2002 8:47 am

here's is a picture of the shape of La Aurora's runway.
The runway here in TGU is flat but it slopes downward the whole way from runway1 to 19


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