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SQ22
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Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:23 pm

Happy new year.

Please continue your discussion and to post your updates here.

Link to previous thread of 2017:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1353201&p=19307471#p19307471
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:21 am

Well Happy New Year to everyone, what a 2017 it was for BOS and 2018 looks to continue the continued shoehorning of new service into our wonderful airport.
Confirmed Changes at this time:

Jan 18
TACV (FI in disguise) return from PVD
B6 adds SYR - Daily (1/4)
S4 switches to A321Neo (1/12)
B6 changes 2x daily BOS-LAS to MINT equipped 321's (1/4)
DL changes BOS-MSP (6x weekly) to 752 lie-flat option

Feb 18
CM moves up to 11 weekly to PTY (2/2)
B6 changes 2x daily BOS-SEA to MINT equipped 321's (2/15)
DL add BOS-MSY 2x weekly (6,7) - using Republic E175's

March 18
AA - BOS-CDG Cancelled
IB (Level)- BOS-BCN begins ((3/28 - 2 weekly) - 3 weekly from 8/6)

April 18
Nothing specifc

May 18
PF - BOS-STN begins (5/18 - 4 weekly)
DY - BOS-CDG begins (5/2 - 3 weekly - possibly 4 weekly)
DY - BOS-LGW moves from 4 to 7 weekly, however BOS-CPH and BOS-OSL are currently cancelled as a result.
B6 - BOS-MSP begins (5/3 - 3x daily)

June 18
PF - BOS-BHX begins (6/22 - 4 weekly)
PF - BOS-CDG begins (6/21 - 3 weekly)

July 18

JJ - BOS-GRU begins (7/1 - 4 weekly)

Continuing
VS Continue with BOS-MAN in S18
UX continue with BOS-MAD in S18

I am sure I missed others, but these are the ones i have note of. Looks like 2017 will end up around 38m+ and there's a good chance of 40m in 2018, especially if the Caribbean and Middle East numbers rebound, however I think the other markets are going to have to pick up the slack of those.

Thanks to everyone involved in the 2017 thread for the conversation, banter and information provided this year, here's to an excellent 2018 for everyone.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:52 am

Thanks VS4ever. Few other adds.

AC BOS-YVR resumes July-01 through September end.
DL BOS-CHS March-03
DL BOS-SAV March-03
DL BOS-AUA June-2018 - 1x weekly - I think it will be a weekend flight

Wish everyone a happy new year! Wishes to BOS to catch-up to 40+ million pax and catch-up with IAH as the next target.
Last edited by iyerhari on Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:52 am

I think you meant BOS-MSP is 6 daily instead of 6 weekly. Another uptick comes with BA operating 4x on the three A380 Days whereas it was only 3x last year. The number of BOS-London seats continues to climb.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:07 am

chrisnh wrote:
I think you meant BOS-MSP is 6 daily instead of 6 weekly. Another uptick comes with BA operating 4x on the three A380 Days whereas it was only 3x last year. The number of BOS-London seats continues to climb.


too much dealing with the stupidly cold weather today affecting my brain. Thanks to you and iyerhari for seeing me right.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:21 am

One more addition WN BOS-MSY which runs a Saturday flight for most of March.

Also - there's been summer increases on BOS-PAP (up to 4 weekly) and BOS-SMF (now daily from June 17 to August 18).

iyerhari wrote:
DL BOS-AUA June-2018 - 1x weekly - I think it will be a weekend flight


Not bookable at Delta.com or on ITA but Amadeus has it as a Saturday only running from June 9 - August 25. Nothings coming up after that as of now.

BOS-AUA 9:27-14:05
AUA-BOS 15:05-19:54

Amadeus doesn't have plane type yet. I wonder if it will be high density 757.
Easy addition for DL to make due to preclearance in AUA so no crowded Terminal E to worry about.


Happy 2018!!!
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:44 am

chrisnh wrote:
I think you meant BOS-MSP is 6 daily instead of 6 weekly. Another uptick comes with BA operating 4x on the three A380 Days whereas it was only 3x last year. The number of BOS-London seats continues to climb.


I understood it as the DL lie-flat 752 was operating 6x weekly on BOS-MSP. Or is it operating daily?

Great to see BA going 4x daily even on the days the A380 operates. Now if only the A380 were daily!
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:50 am

chrisnh wrote:
I think you meant BOS-MSP is 6 daily instead of 6 weekly. Another uptick comes with BA operating 4x on the three A380 Days whereas it was only 3x last year. The number of BOS-London seats continues to climb.


Actually I just went back and looked at the original post on airlineroute.net the lie-flat 752 is flying 6 weekly, so wasn't losing my mind on that one :)
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... ton%202018

As an aside, I wonder how DY's exit from CPH could potential increase the possibility for SK on that route, I believe from previous discussions that the current 330 is shared, but could they consider trying to bump that up to stop DY from coming back?
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
tysmith95
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:23 am

TK currently flies from BOS to IST 4 times a week. I'm glad to see that flight retained despite the US Turkish visa spat that lasted a few months. Now that the visa spat looks to be over, I wonder if TK will revert back to daily service.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:48 am

May as well predict some route announcements for 2018

B6 BOS-HAV
B6 BOS-CVG
B6 BOS-ROC
B6 BOS-ANU
AV BOS-SAL
KE BOS-ICN (2019 start)
WN BOS-SAT
Q6 BOS-SJO
DY BOS-FCO (2019 start)
DY BOS-AMS (2019 start)



tysmith95 wrote:
TK currently flies from BOS to IST 4 times a week. I'm glad to see that flight retained despite the US Turkish visa spat that lasted a few months. Now that the visa spat looks to be over, I wonder if TK will revert back to daily service.


Its 5 weekly for winter and daily in summer. Perfect way to run the route in my opinion. The terrorism and coup were more damaging than the visa issue which didn't affect transit.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:49 pm

iyerhari wrote:
Thanks VS4ever. Few other adds.

AC BOS-YVR resumes July-01 through September end.
DL BOS-CHS March-03
DL BOS-SAV March-03
DL BOS-AUA June-2018 - 1x weekly - I think it will be a weekend flight


Sorry one other add that I missed yesterday.
DL BOS-DUB starting June-01

Possible 2018 route announcements?

DL BOS-SDF
Link from Louisville mayor for the flight: https://insiderlouisville.com/metro/com ... r-service/
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:33 pm

VS4ever wrote:
chrisnh wrote:
I think you meant BOS-MSP is 6 daily instead of 6 weekly. Another uptick comes with BA operating 4x on the three A380 Days whereas it was only 3x last year. The number of BOS-London seats continues to climb.


Actually I just went back and looked at the original post on airlineroute.net the lie-flat 752 is flying 6 weekly, so wasn't losing my mind on that one :)
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... ton%202018


You were right and I misinterpreted! There are 6x flights daily, and I guess ONE of them on six of those days is a 757. I checked my summer flight BOS-MSP-ANC for a cruise and we're on a 321 BOS-MSP and a 757 MSP-ANC.
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:26 pm

tysmith95 wrote:
TK currently flies from BOS to IST 4 times a week. I'm glad to see that flight retained despite the US Turkish visa spat that lasted a few months. Now that the visa spat looks to be over, I wonder if TK will revert back to daily service.


This reduction in frequency happens every winter--is not directly related to the visa issue. Still, on the days the flight operates, it is getting very good loads.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, BA, BI, CA, DN, IC, JL, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK*, UA, VS
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:27 pm

For 2018 new routes, I just wonder how long Star Alliance and SkyTeam will stay out of the BOS-[East] Asia market. It is almost shocking to me that given the huge success of CX, JL and HU, no *A or SkyTeam airline has entered the market. For now it appears that both Star Alliance and Sky Team are happy sending their customers thru one of their hubs but that's a risky game to play IMO. I know a UA FF with Platinum status, who chooses to fly JL to NRT from Boston, every month.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:51 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
Not bookable at Delta.com or on ITA but Amadeus has it as a Saturday only running from June 9 - August 25. Nothings coming up after that as of now.

BOS-AUA 9:27-14:05
AUA-BOS 15:05-19:54

Amadeus doesn't have plane type yet. I wonder if it will be high density 757.


Now bookable and it is showing as 737-800
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:08 pm

That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:50 pm

VS4ever wrote:
http://kticradio.com/abc_business/united-airlines-flight-almost-crosses-into-path-of-landing-jetblue-flight-at-boston-logan-airport-abcid36018152/



Seems a little bit sensationalist.

"Safety fallbacks all work perfectly as intended"

Interesting to note that despite getting more snow, Boston is operating pretty much back to full capacity, while JFK seems to be struggling along. (Though of course JFK is a totally different animal)
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:28 pm

It will be nice to see the work on the Terminal B expansion progress and hopefully Massport will release more concrete plans on the Terminal E expansion.
 
jsteeves3
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Jan 07, 2018 4:59 pm

BOS layout stinks for a hub airline. It is made for decent sized operations from many carriers. It is not meant for a hub airline, sadly. Terminal A is already almost at capacity. Every time I am in there the place is a zoo and check-in and security are flooded with people. When WN moves out, ya that will create some space but the space is not mean't for heavy's. BOS could support more TATL and asian flights but they don't have the room. It stinks because delta could build up Boston into a LGA size and destination hub, but what really needs to happen is the international routes. There is barely any space for expansion at BOS. The only way BOS could accommodate an airline hub is by switching around airlines terminals. Delta could take over most if not all B while ua and aa shrink and take over a along with wn. Every airline at BOS uses there gates at their upper capacity level except ua. Ua has around 10 gates at BOS. I could see them shrinking down to 5 at BOS and operating out of half of A-SAT, maybe a couple gates on the other side. AA takes over the main Terminal A and WN stays where they are now. NK will remain where they are. Lol this is so confusing lot of info to get out from a 14 year old :)
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Jan 07, 2018 5:28 pm

It's a good point, and I know massport is pretty much perpetually looking into how they can expand. Problem is the footprint of the airport. There's really no where to go. The only "open" space is North cargo, which is usually full of parked terminal E aircraft during daytime, or the domestic RONs.

Adding to that, the only international time that really could be taken advantage is morning. Doesn't really work for Europe, but perhaps some middle eastern or Asian carriers could be interested

Last night was interesting though. 3 JAL aircraft on the ground at once. Ouch.

Haven't heard any exciting new rumors lately. Been too cold out there to stand around and share info like usual.
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Jan 07, 2018 5:37 pm

FGITD wrote:
It's a good point, and I know massport is pretty much perpetually looking into how they can expand. Problem is the footprint of the airport. There's really no where to go. The only "open" space is North cargo, which is usually full of parked terminal E aircraft during daytime, or the domestic RONs.

Adding to that, the only international time that really could be taken advantage is morning. Doesn't really work for Europe, but perhaps some middle eastern or Asian carriers could be interested

Haven't heard any exciting new rumors lately. Been too cold out there to stand around and share info like usual.

In the Central American thread, there was an interesting post about Avianca El Salvador. In the January 2018 Catalog, when discussing plans for this year by the President and CEO of Avianca it said "Inciaremos operacion de San Salvador a Boston y Orlando", so clearly there are plans to launch SAL-BOS this year from AV. Closest we've come to an official announcement of the route.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:14 pm

NickolayAv wrote:
FGITD wrote:
It's a good point, and I know massport is pretty much perpetually looking into how they can expand. Problem is the footprint of the airport. There's really no where to go. The only "open" space is North cargo, which is usually full of parked terminal E aircraft during daytime, or the domestic RONs.

Adding to that, the only international time that really could be taken advantage is morning. Doesn't really work for Europe, but perhaps some middle eastern or Asian carriers could be interested

Haven't heard any exciting new rumors lately. Been too cold out there to stand around and share info like usual.

In the Central American thread, there was an interesting post about Avianca El Salvador. In the January 2018 Catalog, when discussing plans for this year by the President and CEO of Avianca it said "Inciaremos operacion de San Salvador a Boston y Orlando", so clearly there are plans to launch SAL-BOS this year from AV. Closest we've come to an official announcement of the route.



AV's in-flight magazine is online with the CEO message in both Spanish and English on page 6. You may need flash or some other browser plug-in to read it.
https://www.aviancaenrevista.com/edicio ... ion56.html

My guess its a June start. Here's a list of possible logical connections one could make in SAL.BOS-SAL connections
on gcmap.com
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
33lspotter
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:03 pm

In addition to VS's BOS-MAN service returning, MT also returns on that route starting 5/25.
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:00 am

About the TACV route that will start on 1/19 it arrives on Friday and departs on Monday, is there any further information of where it will go during the downtime between those two dates?
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:22 am

NickolayAv wrote:
About the TACV route that will start on 1/19 it arrives on Friday and departs on Monday, is there any further information of where it will go during the downtime between those two dates?


Last I heard is that it will be an FI aircraft that runs Apple Vacations charters over the weekend
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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mikegigs
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:37 am

jsteeves3 wrote:
BOS layout stinks for a hub airline. It is made for decent sized operations from many carriers. It is not meant for a hub airline, sadly. Terminal A is already almost at capacity. Every time I am in there the place is a zoo and check-in and security are flooded with people. When WN moves out, ya that will create some space but the space is not mean't for heavy's. BOS could support more TATL and asian flights but they don't have the room. It stinks because delta could build up Boston into a LGA size and destination hub, but what really needs to happen is the international routes. There is barely any space for expansion at BOS. The only way BOS could accommodate an airline hub is by switching around airlines terminals. Delta could take over most if not all B while ua and aa shrink and take over a along with wn. Every airline at BOS uses there gates at their upper capacity level except ua. Ua has around 10 gates at BOS. I could see them shrinking down to 5 at BOS and operating out of half of A-SAT, maybe a couple gates on the other side. AA takes over the main Terminal A and WN stays where they are now. NK will remain where they are. Lol this is so confusing lot of info to get out from a 14 year old :)


I agree with you there. I dropped someone off at A last week around 3:30 am and it was already getting busy. All of A was PACKED with RON's. I didn't see one open gate. The only thing that I can think of is DL simply having a higher gate utilization during the day. I feel like WN packs more flights in per gate per day. Too bad... I've always wanted BOS to be somebody's true hub...
Airports: BOS, JAX, JFK, EWR, LGA, CVG, ATL, CLT, DCA, IAD, STT, PVD, ALB, MCO
Aircraft: 733, 735, 73G, 738, 752, 717, A319, A320, MD-88, E190, E175, E145, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, Q400
Airlines: B6, CO, DL, US, NW, WN, DH
...a good start but a looong way to go!
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:19 am

mikegigs wrote:
jsteeves3 wrote:
BOS layout stinks for a hub airline. It is made for decent sized operations from many carriers. It is not meant for a hub airline, sadly. Terminal A is already almost at capacity. Every time I am in there the place is a zoo and check-in and security are flooded with people. When WN moves out, ya that will create some space but the space is not mean't for heavy's. BOS could support more TATL and asian flights but they don't have the room. It stinks because delta could build up Boston into a LGA size and destination hub, but what really needs to happen is the international routes. There is barely any space for expansion at BOS. The only way BOS could accommodate an airline hub is by switching around airlines terminals. Delta could take over most if not all B while ua and aa shrink and take over a along with wn. Every airline at BOS uses there gates at their upper capacity level except ua. Ua has around 10 gates at BOS. I could see them shrinking down to 5 at BOS and operating out of half of A-SAT, maybe a couple gates on the other side. AA takes over the main Terminal A and WN stays where they are now. NK will remain where they are. Lol this is so confusing lot of info to get out from a 14 year old :)


I agree with you there. I dropped someone off at A last week around 3:30 am and it was already getting busy. All of A was PACKED with RON's. I didn't see one open gate. The only thing that I can think of is DL simply having a higher gate utilization during the day. I feel like WN packs more flights in per gate per day. Too bad... I've always wanted BOS to be somebody's true hub...

Unfortunately, BOS will never be able to expand physically in size because of neighborhoods on one side and the ocean on the other, and filling in more ocean won't be allowed by people. I do believe BOS could utilize the space it has more efficiently, but that would require a reconstruction similar to the one being done at EWR which would wreak havoc on the airport during reconstruction. I do like not having BOS be an airline's true hub because this results in a lot more airlines flying to BOS. This is great from the perspective of both a plane spotter and as consumers we have a greater choice of airlines and products instead of always having to fly on one airline.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:35 am

This was posted on archboston.org There was another Massport Route Development presentation over the summer right before the Primera Air announcment.
https://res.cloudinary.com/simpleview/i ... 77c267.pdf

What is interesting to me is slides 10 and 11 which we have seen other versions of in the past.

Slide 10 is the wishlist
Slide 11 is the route map but with "Future Destinations" of GRU, BCN, HAV, ICN and "DEL or BOM" - This isn't the entire wishlist.
2 of these as we know have already been announced, 1 would be if it wasn't for DOT dragging HAV awards out.... so that leaves the following question: Are ICN and an Indian route coming sooner rather than later???
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:22 am

Thank you. DEL and BOM are the most interesting unless Massport has been able to convince AI to start the nonstop direct flight. That would be really cool for India bound passengers! Looks like ICN is a sure shot
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:31 am

Just came across this article from 2015 stating BR was considering launching BOS in 2017. Wonder if maybe it was delayed until the 789's arrive?

https://centreforaviation.com/insights/ ... air-258894
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:46 am

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Just came across this article from 2015 stating BR was considering launching BOS in 2017. Wonder if maybe it was delayed until the 789's arrive?

https://centreforaviation.com/insights/ ... air-258894

I think that Taipei, Taiwan is probably the second largest unserved Asian destination from BOS after ICN, and I know both BR and CI have considered BOS as a possible route.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:46 am

adamh8297 wrote:
This was posted on archboston.org There was another Massport Route Development presentation over the summer right before the Primera Air announcment.
https://res.cloudinary.com/simpleview/i ... 77c267.pdf

What is interesting to me is slides 10 and 11 which we have seen other versions of in the past.

Slide 10 is the wishlist
Slide 11 is the route map but with "Future Destinations" of GRU, BCN, HAV, ICN and "DEL or BOM" - This isn't the entire wishlist.
2 of these as we know have already been announced, 1 would be if it wasn't for DOT dragging HAV awards out.... so that leaves the following question: Are ICN and an Indian route coming sooner rather than later???


Well let's see, GRU/BCN have been announced. ARN and MXP suggest DY or SK in the case of ARN, maybe filling in the 3x weekly gap from CPH, especially since DY just started up their first route from that airport. EDI/GLA are wild cards with PVD-EDI already in existence i don't think BOS is going to get a shot at that and I suspect GLA would go the same way, that's going to be tough to support a route like that into BOS and it might do better into PVD, but you never know. ICN I think is the low hanging fruit that's just a matter of time and getting a non-stop to DEL or BOM could potentially explain why EK (although they have noises that they will resume the 2nd daily), have not done so as of yet... I think we are reaching the end of the current expansion phase, because simply there is very little room at the peak times to add any more. Anyone else is going to have to accept off peak or they are going to have to find places that work with a morning/early afternoon schedule for their flights. Always good to see this info, as we can :)..
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
bagoldex
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:27 am

VS4ever wrote:
EDI/GLA are wild cards with PVD-EDI already in existence i don't think BOS is going to get a shot at that and I suspect GLA would go the same way, that's going to be tough to support a route like that into BOS and it might do better into PVD.


Edinburgh might be a good 757 route for Delta. There’s probably a good amount of premium demand from the financial services and life sciences sectors plus it’s taken off as a tourist destination(though that’s not necessarily a good thing from the perspective of the people of Edinburgh).
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:21 pm

I would like to see OPO-BOS. TP might do it seasonally with an A321. They already fly to EWR and UA is introducing IAD-OPO.
 
DaufuskieGuy
Posts: 396
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:35 pm

Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:39 pm

jsteeves3 wrote:
BOS layout stinks for a hub airline. It is made for decent sized operations from many carriers. It is not meant for a hub airline, sadly. Terminal A is already almost at capacity. Every time I am in there the place is a zoo and check-in and security are flooded with people. When WN moves out, ya that will create some space but the space is not mean't for heavy's. BOS could support more TATL and asian flights but they don't have the room. It stinks because delta could build up Boston into a LGA size and destination hub, but what really needs to happen is the international routes. There is barely any space for expansion at BOS. The only way BOS could accommodate an airline hub is by switching around airlines terminals. Delta could take over most if not all B while ua and aa shrink and take over a along with wn. Every airline at BOS uses there gates at their upper capacity level except ua. Ua has around 10 gates at BOS. I could see them shrinking down to 5 at BOS and operating out of half of A-SAT, maybe a couple gates on the other side. AA takes over the main Terminal A and WN stays where they are now. NK will remain where they are. Lol this is so confusing lot of info to get out from a 14 year old :)


even if the layout was conducive the geography of BOS (and proximity to NYC) will never allow a feasible hub operation. outside the New England states connecting thru BOS is woefully inefficient
 
DaufuskieGuy
Posts: 396
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:39 pm

jsteeves3 wrote:
BOS layout stinks for a hub airline. It is made for decent sized operations from many carriers. It is not meant for a hub airline, sadly. Terminal A is already almost at capacity. Every time I am in there the place is a zoo and check-in and security are flooded with people. When WN moves out, ya that will create some space but the space is not mean't for heavy's. BOS could support more TATL and asian flights but they don't have the room. It stinks because delta could build up Boston into a LGA size and destination hub, but what really needs to happen is the international routes. There is barely any space for expansion at BOS. The only way BOS could accommodate an airline hub is by switching around airlines terminals. Delta could take over most if not all B while ua and aa shrink and take over a along with wn. Every airline at BOS uses there gates at their upper capacity level except ua. Ua has around 10 gates at BOS. I could see them shrinking down to 5 at BOS and operating out of half of A-SAT, maybe a couple gates on the other side. AA takes over the main Terminal A and WN stays where they are now. NK will remain where they are. Lol this is so confusing lot of info to get out from a 14 year old :)


even if the layout was conducive the geography of BOS (and proximity to NYC) will never allow a feasible hub operation. outside the New England states and Canadian Maritime connecting thru BOS is woefully inefficient
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:56 pm

DaufuskieGuy wrote:
even if the layout was conducive the geography of BOS (and proximity to NYC) will never allow a feasible hub operation. outside the New England states connecting thru BOS is woefully inefficient

We keep hearing this and of course we forget that it already is a hub for 2 different airlines, maybe even 3. The World doesn't end at the U.S. border.
It's not ideal and it will never be very large, but it already is a hub.
 
hinckley
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:15 pm

airbazar wrote:
We keep hearing this and of course we forget that it already is a hub for 2 different airlines, maybe even 3. The World doesn't end at the U.S. border. It's not ideal and it will never be very large, but it already is a hub.


Hmmm . . . If you consider a hub to be any airport with one airline having a large percent of passenger traffic, then BOS would certainly qualify as a B6 hub and maybe a DL hub. If you consider a hub to be an airport that is used to a large extent for connecting traffic, neither B6 nor DL would qualify. I'm in the latter camp.

BOS is an odd airport due to the affluence of the surrounding area (on one hand) and its geography (on the other). Due to its location in one of the corners of the country and its proximity to NY, BOS has never developed into a modern connecting hub for any of the US3, and I doubt very much that it ever will. However, B6 has done a masterful job of building its business in BOS. First, it aggressively went after that affluent O&D traffic and won a huge percent of the majors' business while they weren't looking. Then, a large number of international carriers entered the BOS market (again, while the US majors sat idly by) and B6 leapt again, creating partnerships with a bunch of those carriers and creating a lot of international connecting traffic. Now I don't know the percent of B6's BOS business that connects with international carriers, but my guess is that it significant but not near a majority. But I suppose their international partnership model may qualify BOS as a B6 hub of sorts. Maybe.

Other than that, no airline uses BOS as a major connecting airport. Sure, DL is challenging B6's O&D market, and they're bringing some customers through to connect to AMS, but that doesn't make it a hub imo.

The only way that I can see BOS becoming a true connecting hub is if UA or DL use it as a relief valve for international ops as AA is doing in PHL. But I’m just not seeing BOS as ever having the physical infrastructure to ever be able to handle that.
 
33lspotter
Posts: 413
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:23 pm

hinckley wrote:
airbazar wrote:
We keep hearing this and of course we forget that it already is a hub for 2 different airlines, maybe even 3. The World doesn't end at the U.S. border. It's not ideal and it will never be very large, but it already is a hub.


Hmmm . . . If you consider a hub to be any airport with one airline having a large percent of passenger traffic, then BOS would certainly qualify as a B6 hub and maybe a DL hub. If you consider a hub to be an airport that is used to a large extent for connecting traffic, neither B6 nor DL would qualify. I'm in the latter camp.

BOS is an odd airport due to the affluence of the surrounding area (on one hand) and its geography (on the other). Due to its location in one of the corners of the country and its proximity to NY, BOS has never developed into a modern connecting hub for any of the US3, and I doubt very much that it ever will. However, B6 has done a masterful job of building its business in BOS. First, it aggressively went after that affluent O&D traffic and won a huge percent of the majors' business while they weren't looking. Then, a large number of international carriers entered the BOS market (again, while the US majors sat idly by) and B6 leapt again, creating partnerships with a bunch of those carriers and creating a lot of international connecting traffic. Now I don't know the percent of B6's BOS business that connects with international carriers, but my guess is that it significant but not near a majority. But I suppose their international partnership model may qualify BOS as a B6 hub of sorts. Maybe.

Other than that, no airline uses BOS as a major connecting airport. Sure, DL is challenging B6's O&D market, and they're bringing some customers through to connect to AMS, but that doesn't make it a hub imo.

The only way that I can see BOS becoming a true connecting hub is if UA or DL use it as a relief valve for international ops as AA is doing in PHL. But I’m just not seeing BOS as ever having the physical infrastructure to ever be able to handle that.


I agree with most of this, but, to be fair, DL defines BOS as a hub on its website. We may not consider it a hub, but it (being the carrier) seems to.
 
hinckley
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:29 pm

33lspotter wrote:
I agree with most of this, but, to be fair, DL defines BOS as a hub on its website. We may not consider it a hub, but it (being the carrier) seems to.


Of course that's right, and I'm sure B6 uses a similar term. I was just trying to talk about the generic concept of a hub.
 
BostonBeau
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:04 pm

Does anyone know why Norwegian requires you to purchase 2 separate tickets for a return trip on their BOS-LGW service?
 
iyerhari
Posts: 691
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:14 pm

Does DL website really cite BOS as their hub? If you look at the website, DL lists the word "hubs and key business market". The Delta in-flight magazine airport map does not show BOS as their hub although I have seen websites list BOS as a hub. Wikipedia lists BOS as their hub. There was an investor presentation that was discussed this week and it listed BOS as a focus city. From my experience, I have seen airports such as CMH use BOS for their connections to YYZ, AMS, DUB and LHR. But I agree that the bulk of DL passengers are primarily O&D vs. connections. B6 I agree has done very well using international connections and use BOS as a connection point. Flights from CLE, PIT etc. have many folks connecting to India on EK, QR.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:23 pm

BostonBeau wrote:
Does anyone know why Norwegian requires you to purchase 2 separate tickets for a return trip on their BOS-LGW service?


On their website???? You should be able to book round trip..
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN

2018 Flights: B6 BOS-BGI-BOS, WN BOS-MDW-BOS, B6 BOS-PDX-BOS
 
BostonBeau
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:40 pm

On their website???? You should be able to book round trip..[/quote]


When you do a google search for BOS-LGW, there is a notation that separate tickets are necessary, which should be purchased at the same time. This is only for Norwegian at LGW, not for flights to LHR on other airlines. On the Norwegian website, reference is made to all tickets are one-way. "All fares charged per person, per one way flight and include all mandatory government taxes and charges."
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:44 pm

airbazar wrote:
I would like to see OPO-BOS. TP might do it seasonally with an A321. They already fly to EWR and UA is introducing IAD-OPO.

I'm not sure that would be a great idea for TAP.
1) TAP only flies to Boston 5 times a week so there isn't enough demand from Boston to Lisbon to go daily on this flight. I think this one should go daily before they add more destinations.
2) The people who travel BOS-OPO or OPO-BOS are already most likely to take TAP as they provide the most efficient route there from Boston.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
33lspotter
Posts: 413
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:45 pm

iyerhari wrote:
Does DL website really cite BOS as their hub? If you look at the website, DL lists the word "hubs and key business market". The Delta in-flight magazine airport map does not show BOS as their hub although I have seen websites list BOS as a hub.


I was quite surprised to see it called a "hub" back in 2016, so I took screenshots of it (that I have on Google Drive). Regardless, you can still see the word hub associated directly with Logan (I myself might think it's more of a focus city):

http://news.delta.com/boston-logan-inte ... -airport-0
http://news.delta.com/category/hubs?page=2
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:30 pm

Interesting article in the Globe: http://www.bostonglobe.com/business/201 ... story.html

While the 2nd HQ Amazon headquarters speculation continues, possible that AMZN is gradually building this up?
 
airbazar
Posts: 8514
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:20 pm

hinckley wrote:
Hmmm . . . If you consider a hub to be any airport with one airline having a large percent of passenger traffic, then BOS would certainly qualify as a B6 hub and maybe a DL hub. If you consider a hub to be an airport that is used to a large extent for connecting traffic, neither B6 nor DL would qualify. I'm in the latter camp

That's more like a fortress hub. I don't think there are many airport in the U.S. that meets your criteria of a hub other than maybe, ATL or CLT. Even B6 doesn't call JFK a hub but does anyone really believe that is not a hub?
How many U.S. airports have a larger percentage of connecting vs. O&D?

hinckley wrote:
33lspotter wrote:
I agree with most of this, but, to be fair, DL defines BOS as a hub on its website. We may not consider it a hub, but it (being the carrier) seems to.


Of course that's right, and I'm sure B6 uses a similar term. I was just trying to talk about the generic concept of a hub.

Your generic concept is somewhat limited and subjective. You are looking at it from a single airline point of view. I'm looking at it from a global point of view. B6 does a good amount of connections at BOS to/from it's international partners. So does DL. And so does AA. If you do a fare search for LIS-SFO right now, the top choice is LIS-BOS-SFO with TP/B6.
In the big scheme of things 90% of BOS traffic is said to be O&D but there's plenty of evidence that the 3 big airlines at BOS are all doing a good amount of connections. Massport would have not gone to the trouble and expense of connecting B6's terminal to the International terminal, for no reason.
 
hinckley
Posts: 394
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:46 pm

airbazar wrote:
In the big scheme of things 90% of BOS traffic is said to be O&D but there's plenty of evidence that the 3 big airlines at BOS are all doing a good amount of connections. Massport would have not gone to the trouble and expense of connecting B6's terminal to the International terminal, for no reason.


So let's look at what I think we'd all agree are US airline hubs -
AA - JFK, PHL, CLT, MIA, DFW, ORD, PHX
DL - JFK, ATL, DTW, MSP, SLC, LAX, SEA
UA - EWR, IAD, IAH, ORD, DEN, LAX, SFO

Sincere question - does any BOS airline come close to any of these airline/airport combinations for connecting traffic? As for B6, as I said in my earlier post, their partnership model could make it a connecting hub. But again, a sincere question - do you think that the percent of B6's connection traffic at BOS is as high as any of the above airline/airport combinations?
 
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NickolayAv
Posts: 273
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:53 pm

iyerhari wrote:
Interesting article in the Globe: http://www.bostonglobe.com/business/201 ... story.html

While the 2nd HQ Amazon headquarters speculation continues, possible that AMZN is gradually building this up?

I can see that happening. I would love to see the Amazon 767s in BOS but it's not likely.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
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