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enilria
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Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:34 pm

Down in Guanacaste. Assume it is a DHC6. Twin Otter.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wir ... a-52072212
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:04 pm

https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-e ... -avioneta/ (Spanish only)

The head of the firefighters released the names of the people, plus the manifest itself can be seen. Most of the victims appeared to be from the same family. Except for the flight crew, which was Costa Rican, everyone on board were foreigners. Also, the registration of the aircraft is TI-BEI, it's a Cessna Grand Caravan.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
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enilria
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:18 pm

LTU932 wrote:
https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-es-la-lista-oficial-de-fallecidos-tras-accidente-de-avioneta/ (Spanish only)

The head of the firefighters released the names of the people, plus the manifest itself can be seen. Most of the victims appeared to be from the same family. Except for the flight crew, which was Costa Rican, everyone on board were foreigners. Also, the registration of the aircraft is TI-BEI, it's a Cessna Grand Caravan.

The Wiki says they don't have Caravans. Is it out of date?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nature_Air#Fleet
 
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enilria
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:20 pm

LTU932 wrote:
https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-es-la-lista-oficial-de-fallecidos-tras-accidente-de-avioneta/ (Spanish only)

The head of the firefighters released the names of the people, plus the manifest itself can be seen. Most of the victims appeared to be from the same family. Except for the flight crew, which was Costa Rican, everyone on board were foreigners. Also, the registration of the aircraft is TI-BEI, it's a Cessna Grand Caravan.

Also, the airplane typically seats nine passengers with a single pilot, although 12 are dead. Two pilots plus another person?
 
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enilria
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:21 pm

Not too classy of them to publish the passenger manifest. Looks like a family with 3 kids. :(
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:33 pm

enilria wrote:
Also, the airplane typically seats nine passengers with a single pilot, although 12 are dead. Two pilots plus another person?
According to the manifest, it was 10 passengers, plus pilots Emma Ramos and Juan Manuel Retana, who's a cousin of former president Laura Chinchilla. The former president pubilcly acknowledged today's events in a tweet.

https://twitter.com/Laura_Ch/status/947571486239444992
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
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enilria
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:15 pm

LTU932 wrote:
enilria wrote:
Also, the airplane typically seats nine passengers with a single pilot, although 12 are dead. Two pilots plus another person?
According to the manifest, it was 10 passengers, plus pilots Emma Ramos and Juan Manuel Retana, who's a cousin of former president Laura Chinchilla. The former president pubilcly acknowledged today's events in a tweet.

https://twitter.com/Laura_Ch/status/947571486239444992

I read in the USA you need a waiver to carry that many people. Weight issue or contributing factor?
 
MO11
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:37 pm

enilria wrote:
LTU932 wrote:
https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-es-la-lista-oficial-de-fallecidos-tras-accidente-de-avioneta/ (Spanish only)

The head of the firefighters released the names of the people, plus the manifest itself can be seen. Most of the victims appeared to be from the same family. Except for the flight crew, which was Costa Rican, everyone on board were foreigners. Also, the registration of the aircraft is TI-BEI, it's a Cessna Grand Caravan.

The Wiki says they don't have Caravans. Is it out of date?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nature_Air#Fleet


The Wiki also said United was buying Allegiant.

Nature Air has had Caravans since 2011, leasing from the parent company of Grand Canyon Airlines. TI-BEI arrived in November.
 
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enilria
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:07 am

Media is now reporting all 10 passengers were Americans.
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:16 am

enilria wrote:
I read in the USA you need a waiver to carry that many people. Weight issue or contributing factor?
I dunno about the regulatory side of things, so we need to wait for the investigation to start. I suppose DGAC tries to apply regulations in the same or similar way as the FAA does.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:25 am

enilria wrote:
The Wiki says they don't have Caravans. Is it out of date?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nature_Air#Fleet

Yes, Wikipedia is often out of date.

If you look at the Fleet table, it starts with the line "The fleet of Nature Air consists of the following aircraft" and follows this with a small boxed 6, like this [6]
If you place the cursor on that link, it will say "Our Planes - Nature Air; retrieved 26 March 2016"
In a fast moving environment such as aviation, Wikipedia is often out of date to some extent.

Having said that, as I write this, the Wikipedia page has already been updated in response to today's events.
It now reads;
Wikipedia wrote:
"As of December 2017, Nature Air is operating three Cessna 208B Grand Caravans with registrations TI-BAJ, TI-BBC, and TI-BEI (which crashed on 31 December 2017). It is unclear whether the airline still operates its DHC-6s and L-410s"


The moral of the story is; use Wikipedia - it is a great resource - but check the small print too. :D
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mabadia71
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:35 am

enilria wrote:
I read in the USA you need a waiver to carry that many people. Weight issue or contributing factor?


Wouldn't think so, since both Nature Air and Sansa have operated fleets of Caravans with that configuration for many years, plus a couple air charters companies that also operate the aircraft. Rumors are starting to surface about a possible engine failure or loss of power, which appears to be backed up by the final location of the aircraft a few hundred yards of the departure end of the runway at a hill.
mabadia71
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:42 am

enilria wrote:
LTU932 wrote:
https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-es-la-lista-oficial-de-fallecidos-tras-accidente-de-avioneta/ (Spanish only)

The head of the firefighters released the names of the people, plus the manifest itself can be seen. Most of the victims appeared to be from the same family. Except for the flight crew, which was Costa Rican, everyone on board were foreigners. Also, the registration of the aircraft is TI-BEI, it's a Cessna Grand Caravan.

Also, the airplane typically seats nine passengers with a single pilot, although 12 are dead. Two pilots plus another person?


A Part 23 waiver can permit a capacity up to 14. As for publishing the manifest, given that an entire family was wiped out, I suspect that was done so that next of kin would know.
 
tealnz
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:51 am

I'd thought the Caravan was pretty safe. But from a quick look at Wikipedia (yeah I know...) there have been 205 hull-loss accidents in a fleet of around 2500 (as of 2015). That's a sobering statistic. Does this just reflect the nature of the operations the Caravan is used for? (Small airlines, operating in areas with limited infrastructure and maintenance support, poor-quality strips, VFR operations etc). Or...?
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:07 am

Condolences to the families, friends and collegues of the victims.
 
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usxguy
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:55 am

Many operators outside the US fly their Caravans configured to 12 or 14 passengers. I even had this in Belize with Tropic & Maya Island Air. Its not very roomy, to say the least. And, it could also be the reason most of the Caravan deaths are by non-US scheduled operators as well. A 208B with 9 pax and bags can max out on weight quickly depending on fuel, so adding in an extra 3-4 passengers + bags could be pushing the envelope on this plane a bit.
xx
 
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TWA302
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:05 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
enilria wrote:
LTU932 wrote:
https://www.crhoy.com/nacionales/esta-es-la-lista-oficial-de-fallecidos-tras-accidente-de-avioneta/ (Spanish only)

As for publishing the manifest, given that an entire family was wiped out, I suspect that was done so that next of kin would know.


Doubt that is the reason they published the manifest. Regardless, a very tragic evening for these passengers and crew.
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:29 pm

TWA302 wrote:
Doubt that is the reason they published the manifest. Regardless, a very tragic evening for these passengers and crew.
Costa Rica always had kind of an open information policy, though I am surprised myself about that manifest. Either way, sometimes the media even reports when certain VIPs enter the country (without disclosing their exact address), because they get these reports directly from DGME (Costa Rican immigration).
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
EarlyLateORD
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:35 pm

I didn't realize Nature Air flew Cessna's, my only flight with them was on a Twin Otter. Nice airline flying to some very remote places. My first time landing commercially in a field!
 
32andBelow
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:20 pm

tealnz wrote:
I'd thought the Caravan was pretty safe. But from a quick look at Wikipedia (yeah I know...) there have been 205 hull-loss accidents in a fleet of around 2500 (as of 2015). That's a sobering statistic. Does this just reflect the nature of the operations the Caravan is used for? (Small airlines, operating in areas with limited infrastructure and maintenance support, poor-quality strips, VFR operations etc). Or...?

Eh. This aircraft flies a lot in Alaska, Northern Canada, etc. A lot of these crashes aren't going to be the planes fault.
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:00 pm

EarlyLateORD wrote:
I didn't realize Nature Air flew Cessna's, my only flight with them was on a Twin Otter. Nice airline flying to some very remote places. My first time landing commercially in a field!
They had Twin Otters, I dunno if they still do, but they do also have L-410s. That being said, didn't the L-410s get grounded for some reason?
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
WIederling
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:36 pm

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
The moral of the story is; use Wikipedia - it is a great resource - but check the small print too. :D


the page also mentions another crash in Sept. of 2017 with 2 killed. !?
https://news.co.cr/nature-air-plane-to- ... red/65270/
( one person must have succumbed later on? )
Murphy is an optimist
 
Vladex
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:43 pm

JetBuddy wrote:
Condolences to the families, friends and collegues of the victims.


I doubt that they are reading this let alone that they would take it to the heart from an internet anonymous. Sorry but this internet emotion outpouring is just trivializing emotions as such.
 
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:03 pm

Vladex wrote:
JetBuddy wrote:
Condolences to the families, friends and collegues of the victims.


I doubt that they are reading this let alone that they would take it to the heart from an internet anonymous. Sorry but this internet emotion outpouring is just trivializing emotions as such.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:33 pm

sassiciai wrote:
Vladex wrote:
JetBuddy wrote:
Condolences to the families, friends and collegues of the victims.


I doubt that they are reading this let alone that they would take it to the heart from an internet anonymous. Sorry but this internet emotion outpouring is just trivializing emotions as such.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:


I doubt they're reading or hearing condolences from anyone but the closest people to them. It doesn't mean everyone else's are meaningless. That being said, I do understand your point.

Back on topic, is there any news on possible causes for the crash? Juding by the pictures, it looks like a high energy impact. What were the weather conditions in the area?
 
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:37 pm

JetBuddy wrote:
Back on topic, is there any news on possible causes for the crash? Juding by the pictures, it looks like a high energy impact. What were the weather conditions in the area?
I read in the press that they're not ruling out an engine failure. Now I'm also reading that heavy gusts may have been responsible, but before making any assumptions, I suggest we wait for the official report. Also, the victims bodies cannot be released at this time because they are having problems identifying them.They may have to identify them through dental records as well.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
djm18
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:56 am

Very sad and what a tragic loss for these families. Our thoughts are with them. I live in Costa Rica and recently flew this route in a Caravan, we were two families and 11 passengers in total. It is a short hop to SJO of about 25 minutes. In general these flights are quite safe and I have always been well impressed by the professionalism of the flight crew.

In this case the pilot was 52 years old and had 15,000 hours as per an article I found. He had recently transitioned from Sansa to Nature Air so perhaps he felt some pressure to complete the flight and not leave the clients stranded. They landed first in Tambor given the gusting winds in Islita and where then told that they could approach the airfield. Now keep in mind that Islita is a very simple air strip without any weather equipment, so there was no one qualified on the ground to make that assessment.

In any case, this is all speculation and we will need to wait for a formal investigation which will take some time. The good news is that given that he is related (cousin) to the ex president there is bound to be a more thorough and efficient follow up. Not to mention the fact that with 10 foreigners (from the US) this is being followed quite closely as the country is very dependent on tourism.

I did speak to a friend who is a pilot and he did say that there was some surprise as to where he crashed and the turn they had made; It seemed somewhat strange to him but they need to get more data. Again, this was a very experienced pilot who had probably landed in this field many times before.

A very sad end to a very good year in aviation. Our thoughts and prayers with theses families.
 
Vladex
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:53 pm

JetBuddy wrote:
sassiciai wrote:
Vladex wrote:

I doubt that they are reading this let alone that they would take it to the heart from an internet anonymous. Sorry but this internet emotion outpouring is just trivializing emotions as such.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:


I doubt they're reading or hearing condolences from anyone but the closest people to them. It doesn't mean everyone else's are meaningless. That being said, I do understand your point.

Back on topic, is there any news on possible causes for the crash? Juding by the pictures, it looks like a high energy impact. What were the weather conditions in the area?


Internet emotions are more than meaningless, they are misdirected and trivializing of the most important part of human experience. But I understand that this is a cultural issue and not a personality flaw where normal emotions are suppressed by societal pressures
 
richierich
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:59 pm

Vladex wrote:

Internet emotions are more than meaningless, they are misdirected and trivializing of the most important part of human experience. But I understand that this is a cultural issue and not a personality flaw where normal emotions are suppressed by societal pressures


How is saying that you will keep the victims and their families in your thoughts or prayers "misdirected" or trivializing any emotions? I think we all know that it is unlikely any of the victims' families will read these posts, but sometimes we talk about aviation incidents, accidents and crashes and seem to almost forget about the human element tragically tied to these events.

And, for the record, sometimes there ARE people connected to aviation accidents and incidents that read these posts. It may or may not be immediate family, but I can tell you there have been numerous accident threads discussed on a.net where people have known neighbors, distant relatives, co-workers, etc. who have been affected. So yeah, it is more than okay to send some kind words.
None shall pass!!!!
 
djm18
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:49 pm

There are some additional reports which are questioning the pilots decision to take off on runway 03 which puts you into mountainous terrain. It is more common to take off on runway 21 which puts you pretty much over the ocean and gives you more time to climb out and then make your turn back to the east towards SJO.
 
jetwet1
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:25 pm

djm18 wrote:
Very sad and what a tragic loss for these families. Our thoughts are with them. I live in Costa Rica and recently flew this route in a Caravan, we were two families and 11 passengers in total. It is a short hop to SJO of about 25 minutes. In general these flights are quite safe and I have always been well impressed by the professionalism of the flight crew.



Just to echo this, i've flown a few times with Nature and many times with Sansa, this isn't some central American bush operation, everybody and everything has been weighted before boarding the planes, if it's even close to the limit someone is staying behind,
djm18 wrote:
There are some additional reports which are questioning the pilots decision to take off on runway 03 which puts you into mountainous terrain. It is more common to take off on runway 21 which puts you pretty much over the ocean and gives you more time to climb out and then make your turn back to the east towards SJO.
 
Polarisguy
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:17 pm

LTU932 wrote:
JetBuddy wrote:
Back on topic, is there any news on possible causes for the crash? Juding by the pictures, it looks like a high energy impact. What were the weather conditions in the area?
I read in the press that they're not ruling out an engine failure. Now I'm also reading that heavy gusts may have been responsible, but before making any assumptions, I suggest we wait for the official report. Also, the victims bodies cannot be released at this time because they are having problems identifying them.They may have to identify them through dental records as well.


Seems like a lot of souls aboard for a Caravan. Don’t know if they were sightseeing or traveling to San Jose to catch a flight. If it was to San Jose I would imagine you would have to add the luggage to the weight and balance calculation. Plus, you have to get over the mountains. All in all, sounds about right to me. Feel sorry for the Families
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richierich
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:52 pm

So far - and of course nothing is confirmed - it appears this plane hit the ground at a very high rate of descent based on the wreckage. Eyewitnesses also have said a wing appeared to dip sharply before it crashed, and indeed the whole plane may have been struggling to gain altitude. Doing what a.netters do best, I have an armchair investigation theory.

To me, it sounds a lot like the aircraft stalled. Whether that was due to being overloaded, or perhaps engine failure, or some kind of weather anomaly, that's what the people involved with the investigation will need to look at and figure out. Does anybody know if there was a flight recorded or CVR on this plane? I can't imagine it was required to have a CVR but I do not know Costa Rican aviation rules.
None shall pass!!!!
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:51 pm

Per recent reports, the OIJ has started identifying the bodies through dental records. Also, the NTSB is going to be assisting in the accident investigation plus Pratt & Whitney Canada will be along.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
awthompson
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:24 am

richierich wrote:
So far - and of course nothing is confirmed - it appears this plane hit the ground at a very high rate of descent based on the wreckage. Eyewitnesses also have said a wing appeared to dip sharply before it crashed, and indeed the whole plane may have been struggling to gain altitude. Doing what a.netters do best, I have an armchair investigation theory.

To me, it sounds a lot like the aircraft stalled. Whether that was due to being overloaded, or perhaps engine failure, or some kind of weather anomaly, that's what the people involved with the investigation will need to look at and figure out. Does anybody know if there was a flight recorded or CVR on this plane? I can't imagine it was required to have a CVR but I do not know Costa Rican aviation rules.


Engine failure cannot stall an aircraft. The only thing that stalls an aircraft is the pilot, by using too much back pressure on the stick/control column. He/she may be reacting / overreacting (incorrectly) to an engine failure or other event of course.
 
crownvic
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:43 am

I agree with the overused term "my thoughts and prayers are with so and so"..This was a horrific accident that took two entire families lives as well as the pilots and it is really sad. But like all fatal accidents there will always be those internet users trying to score points with the standard my thoughts and prayers are with the victims. I can guarantee you when they go to bed that night, no prayer is said and the next day those same people are no longer in the spokespersons thoughts and or prayers and their lives go on as normal.....
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:35 am

richierich wrote:
Vladex wrote:

Internet emotions are more than meaningless, they are misdirected and trivializing of the most important part of human experience. But I understand that this is a cultural issue and not a personality flaw where normal emotions are suppressed by societal pressures


How is saying that you will keep the victims and their families in your thoughts or prayers "misdirected" or trivializing any emotions? I think we all know that it is unlikely any of the victims' families will read these posts, but sometimes we talk about aviation incidents, accidents and crashes and seem to almost forget about the human element tragically tied to these events.

And, for the record, sometimes there ARE people connected to aviation accidents and incidents that read these posts. It may or may not be immediate family, but I can tell you there have been numerous accident threads discussed on a.net where people have known neighbors, distant relatives, co-workers, etc. who have been affected. So yeah, it is more than okay to send some kind words.


I'll go one step further and state that we have members on this forum who have been in incidents/accidents that are discussed here. AF358 comes to mind.

crownvic wrote:
I agree with the overused term "my thoughts and prayers are with so and so"..This was a horrific accident that took two entire families lives as well as the pilots and it is really sad. But like all fatal accidents there will always be those internet users trying to score points with the standard my thoughts and prayers are with the victims. I can guarantee you when they go to bed that night, no prayer is said and the next day those same people are no longer in the spokespersons thoughts and or prayers and their lives go on as normal.....


You have no way of knowing what people do or why. I'm quite certain that many people make these thoughts and prayers statements and don't follow through. I'm also quite certain that some absolutely do. I live with a prayer warrior - when they say "thoughts and prayers" they mean it.

I guess I don't understand why it bugs people so much. I'd be much more disturbed by "good riddance" or some such than comments of care or concern or the like. It's pretty easy to just gloss over them if they bother you so much.
-Dave


”Yet somewhere in Iceland a great anger stirred in the soul of a troubled individual...” - Revelation
 
djm18
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:39 pm

An engine failure by itself may not produce a stall but it then depends how the crew responds. If for example a pilot tries to turn steeply to go back to the airfield then that could easily produce a stall.
 
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LTU932
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:10 pm

djm18 wrote:
An engine failure by itself may not produce a stall but it then depends how the crew responds. If for example a pilot tries to turn steeply to go back to the airfield then that could easily produce a stall.
Let's not forget the currently strong winds. A strong gust causing this crash cannot be ruled out, especially if there's also an engine failure.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
djm18
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:14 pm

And also the fact that if the crew indeed took off on runway 03 then they would have had very limited options, if any, in case of an engine failure on a single engine aircraft.
 
BENAir01
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Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:53 am

Vladex wrote:
JetBuddy wrote:
Condolences to the families, friends and collegues of the victims.


I doubt that they are reading this let alone that they would take it to the heart from an internet anonymous. Sorry but this internet emotion outpouring is just trivializing emotions as such.

Really? That is very rude.

This was a very tragic incident. One of the American families who was in this plane lived in the same town as me, and although I did not personally know them, many of their friends and family go to the same synagogue as I do and are friends with me and my family. Our community has been helping them as best as we can, as these times are very hard for them.
It is a horrible time for these families. I hope the real reason of this accident comes out soon.
And to all you saying "saying thoughts and prayers are with you is meaningless" it isn't. Its better if true, but it still is a nice thing to say.
Why is flying so expensive? And why is flying well so much more?
 
User avatar
JetBuddy
Posts: 2011
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2013 1:04 am

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:37 pm

I understand those who said my post was trivializing. I do believe that's a far too cynical point of view though.

When I read about what had happened, I was deeply saddened. I felt for the families, friends and collegues of the victims involved in this crash. This is a very small airline, in a relatively small community, and it happened around Christmas and New Year's time. It's a deeply tragic situation. I did wonder if there was any point in saying anything, but I decided to write my condolences anyway. They were heartfelt and genuine. I did not write anything about sending prayers, because I'm not that type of religious person.

This is a discussion that has completely sidelined the actual topic of this thread. At the same time I think it's a sound discussion to have. But any further discussion of sending condolences or prayers would probably be better suited in another thread. So out of respect for the victims, let's stay on topic. I understand those who criticized my post, although I disagree. And I thank those who support my point of view.
 
djm18
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:19 pm

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:27 pm

here is a video which many of you may find of interest. it is a final approach into islita in a cesna 182. the pilot is coming in from the ocean into runway 03. you can see why a departure on runway 03 is not ideal given the mountainous terrain just beyond the runway.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X4x6athddKg
 
djm18
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:19 pm

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:35 pm

here is another video from a wing cam with a little better quality. again it is an approach into runway 03. if you wait until the end (only two minutes) you get a sense of what the departure would look like using runway 03.

i am talking to friends very active in aviation in costa rica to better understand if it has been confirmed that they indeed took off on runway 03 and if there is any new information in the ongoing investigation.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uCLBMSUamXo
 
djm18
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:19 pm

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:59 am

Costa Rica suspends airline amid probe of fatal plane crash

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cost ... SKBN1F202L
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13552
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:59 pm

djm18 wrote:
Costa Rica suspends airline amid probe of fatal plane crash

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cost ... SKBN1F202L
The head of airline safety of 5C is on sick leave, and the head of pilot training has died and there's no replacement for him yet. That's one of the reasons why the suspension was issued. I still feel it's the beginning of the end for 5C.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
djm18
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:19 pm

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:14 pm

I can't imagine the airline will recover from this, so I would say this is the end of the end. The public has lost confidence in them and currently travel agencies here in SJO are putting their traffic on Sansa. And I would have to assume that they have lost all traffic from international tour operators who used them in the past to shuttle their clients around the country.
 
User avatar
TWA302
Posts: 437
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 12:17 am

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:27 pm

Looks like they will be back in the air on 2/5 but took a pretty big financial hit in January.

http://www.ticotimes.net/2018/02/02/costa-rican-airline-nature-air-to-resume-operations
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13552
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

Re: Nature Crashes in Costa Rica, 12 Dead

Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:11 pm

5C is as good as done. And I'm positive that somehow, the President may have had a hand on this. Just a day before DGAC lifted their suspension, there was talk about 5C requesting a meeting with the President and mention that if they don't lift the suspension, they'll have to resort to the L word. Given that the President is three months away from ending his term, having to deal with another Costa Rican company that has to lay off 80+ employees may seem like the tip of the ice berg, but in the end, he wants to end his presidency on high notes.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208

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