cpr05
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Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:11 pm

Envoy is bringing back 58 aircraft. What goes into reactivation?


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dbo861
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:27 pm

Do they have pilots to fly those aircraft?

AA must see growth opportunity with the strong economy and this is a quick way to add to their fleet. That’s a lot of jets to add back, granted small RJs, but I’m curious where they’ll send them.
 
SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:24 pm

How many of them will be in the old American Eagle livery?
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bmibaby737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:33 pm

cpr05 wrote:
Envoy is bringing back 58 aircraft. What goes into reactivation?


When was it announced that all the E140s would be coming back into service? The airline took delivery of 59 140s.
 
usairways85
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:43 pm

dbo861 wrote:
Do they have pilots to fly those aircraft?

AA must see growth opportunity with the strong economy and this is a quick way to add to their fleet. That’s a lot of jets to add back, granted small RJs, but I’m curious where they’ll send them.

It's not really growth. PDT recently retired the last DH8 and AA loses the AWI flying in Feb.
 
dc10lover
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:45 pm

I guess they are not too expensive to fly? Larger regional jets are of course more economical to fly.
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of.
 
dc10lover
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:51 pm

dbo861 wrote:
Do they have pilots to fly those aircraft?

AA must see growth opportunity with the strong economy and this is a quick way to add to their fleet. That’s a lot of jets to add back, granted small RJs, but I’m curious where they’ll send them.

They will probably use them to serve smaller cities / smaller markets. Pasco / Tri - Cities airport in Washington State still wants non - stop service to Los Angeles. These smaller regional jets would be great in smaller markets.
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of.
 
dc10lover
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:57 pm

All to be reactivated by 2Q 2018. Most are stored at Mathis Field in "Near-Flying" condition on month to month lease of ramp space.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envoy_Air
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of.
 
bmibaby737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:09 pm

dc10lover wrote:
All to be reactivated by 2Q 2018. Most are stored at Mathis Field in "Near-Flying" condition on month to month lease of ramp space.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envoy_Air


Wikipedia is hardly reliable?
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:10 pm

dc10lover wrote:
All to be reactivated by 2Q 2018. Most are stored at Mathis Field in "Near-Flying" condition on month to month lease of ramp space.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envoy_Air


Where exactly on the field? I was just checking on Google Earth and not only are there precisely zero E-jets there, but the largest aircraft is pretty much a solo A-10.
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Jshank83
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:20 pm

Spacepope wrote:

Where exactly on the field? I was just checking on Google Earth and not only are there precisely zero E-jets there, but the largest aircraft is pretty much a solo A-10.


Here is an image from November. I still would like to see a source beside wikipedia though.

Image
 
FSDan
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:39 pm

Wow, I didn't realize they were bringing so many back! There are already a handful back in operation, some in the new colors and some in the old.
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airtran737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:52 pm

cpr05 wrote:
Envoy is bringing back 58 aircraft. What goes into reactivation?


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They are ferried from SJT to ABI and undergo a check. If it’s time for a heavy check, then they get new interiors, updated FMS’ and a paint job. If it’s not time for a heavy check, then they are returned to service in the old colors and will fly like that until they are due to go back for a heavy. We are now also using a MRO in Quebec to help with the re-activation.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
 
AAtakeMeAway
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:56 pm

bmibaby737 wrote:
dc10lover wrote:
All to be reactivated by 2Q 2018. Most are stored at Mathis Field in "Near-Flying" condition on month to month lease of ramp space.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envoy_Air


Wikipedia is hardly reliable?


It can be reliable if you check the citations included therein that are typically reliable:

http://sanangelolive.com/news/business/ ... this-field
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:41 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
Spacepope wrote:

Where exactly on the field? I was just checking on Google Earth and not only are there precisely zero E-jets there, but the largest aircraft is pretty much a solo A-10.


Here is an image from November. I still would like to see a source beside wikipedia though.

Image

Excellent! Thank you.
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mtnwest1979
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:56 pm

Glad to see the planes gping back to usefulness.
Stopped by SJT last April and saw the numerous planes there (and all the SF340s at Abilene) looking a bit dogged lol.
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
 
Jshank83
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:28 pm

AAtakeMeAway wrote:
bmibaby737 wrote:
dc10lover wrote:
All to be reactivated by 2Q 2018. Most are stored at Mathis Field in "Near-Flying" condition on month to month lease of ramp space.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envoy_Air


Wikipedia is hardly reliable?


It can be reliable if you check the citations included therein that are typically reliable:

http://sanangelolive.com/news/business/ ... this-field


Nothing in this says they are being reactivated though. It only talks about them being stored.
 
cheapgreek
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:43 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
AAtakeMeAway wrote:
bmibaby737 wrote:

Wikipedia is hardly reliable?


It can be reliable if you check the citations included therein that are typically reliable:

http://sanangelolive.com/news/business/ ... this-field


Nothing in this says they are being reactivated though. It only talks about them being stored.


Date of article, "By Joe Hyde | Apr. 9, 2015 8:30 am". Almost three years ago, a lot has happened since then.
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:46 pm

cheapgreek wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
AAtakeMeAway wrote:

It can be reliable if you check the citations included therein that are typically reliable:

http://sanangelolive.com/news/business/ ... this-field


Nothing in this says they are being reactivated though. It only talks about them being stored.


Date of article, "By Joe Hyde | Apr. 9, 2015 8:30 am". Almost three years ago, a lot has happened since then.


The point is, one can't cite wikipedia as a reference, claim that the citations within Wiki are accurate, and use that as justification since the citation itself doesn't corroborate the claim. There is no citation on the Wikipedia article that says the planes are being reactivated.
The plural of Airbus is Airbuses. Airbii is not a word.
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wedgetail737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:50 pm

Wasn't AA Eagle on of the very few airlines that actually ordered the E-140's? I flew on them regularly out of ICT when I was commuting between the PNW and Kansas.
 
cheapgreek
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:55 pm

usairways85 wrote:
dbo861 wrote:
Do they have pilots to fly those aircraft?

AA must see growth opportunity with the strong economy and this is a quick way to add to their fleet. That’s a lot of jets to add back, granted small RJs, but I’m curious where they’ll send them.

It's not really growth. PDT recently retired the last DH8 and AA loses the AWI flying in Feb.


The 11 Dash-8-300's will be flying till June 2018.
 
RJNUT
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:20 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
Wasn't AA Eagle on of the very few airlines that actually ordered the E-140's? I flew on them regularly out of ICT when I was commuting between the PNW and Kansas.

I thought they went to AX (Trans States originally)
 
Flighty
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:25 pm

Given the Air Wisconsin exit, there is really no way they can maintain their network unless they add some small RJs next month. This is a plausible story on that basis.
 
drdisque
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:39 pm

I'm guessing these will be PDT crews and operate former AWI CRJ and PDT Dash 8 routes out of PHL?
 
airtran737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:05 pm

drdisque wrote:
I'm guessing these will be PDT crews and operate former AWI CRJ and PDT Dash 8 routes out of PHL?


PDT is taking a lot of the PHL flying, but PSA and arepublic are in there as well. Envoy will soon be operating into PHL via JFK 6 times a day.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
 
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ODwyerPW
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:13 pm

Wow,
I thought those were stored in Kingman AZ. Learn something new each day.
learning never stops.
 
bmibaby737
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:14 pm

ODwyerPW wrote:
Wow,
I thought those were stored in Kingman AZ. Learn something new each day.


Those are the E135s
 
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gdg9
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:44 pm

So at this point this is still a rumor.
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cvgComair
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:35 am

I just removed it from the article, there is no sourcing to support this.
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N383SW
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:43 am

RJNUT wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
Wasn't AA Eagle on of the very few airlines that actually ordered the E-140's? I flew on them regularly out of ICT when I was commuting between the PNW and Kansas.

I thought they went to AX (Trans States originally)

IIRC you’re thinking of the ones that were flown by CHQ as American Connection back in the 00’s. If memory serves correctly those were owned by AA. Trans States did fly some 145’s that were owned by AA and originally with Eagle but those went back to Eagle (well Envoy now), I suppose it’ll always be Eagle to me but that’s old school lol. Anyway those frames flown as American Connection were originally from the STL days then went up to ORD once STL was pulled down.. hope I got all of this straight, it’s all on memory so please be easy lol.

On a side note, does anyone recall where those 140’s went that originally flew under Connection?
 
jgcotter
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:57 pm

Based strictly upon aircraft movement, I now show 16 E140s back in service with Envoy. Of these 16, I show 12 having spent a week at AMA, which is a paint facility, and a week is about right for paint.
 
WWads
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:02 pm

jgcotter wrote:
Based strictly upon aircraft movement, I now show 16 E140s back in service with Envoy. Of these 16, I show 12 having spent a week at AMA, which is a paint facility, and a week is about right for paint.


Darn I liked the old livery. Guess this means they'll be in service for a while.
 
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diverdave
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:32 pm

cvgComair wrote:
I just removed it from the article, there is no sourcing to support this.


This are some references to reactivating these aircraft in this thread:

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2493893-post6435.html

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/2493923-post6441.html
 
vfw614
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:41 pm

Quick question re the E140:

What was the point of developing that subtype? As only a relatively small number was produced for just a single customer, wouldn't it have been more sensible to simply use the E145 airframe and leave out two rows CRJ440-style - and "invest" the saved development and certification costs in discounting E145 for said customer? Was the additional range of the E140 needed or did it significantly save operating costs compared to the E145 that also offset the - I assume - rather poor residal value of the E140?
 
MO11
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:51 pm

vfw614 wrote:
Quick question re the E140:

What was the point of developing that subtype? As only a relatively small number was produced for just a single customer, wouldn't it have been more sensible to simply use the E145 airframe and leave out two rows CRJ440-style - and "invest" the saved development and certification costs in discounting E145 for said customer? Was the additional range of the E140 needed or did it significantly save operating costs compared to the E145 that also offset the - I assume - rather poor residal value of the E140?


Eagle was contractually maxed out on 50-seaters. The ERJ 140 had 98% parts commonality with the ERJ 135. Eagle launched the type with a 130 airplane order, with a follow-on order for 9 more, but as things turned out, the last 80 were converted to ERJ-145s. Remember that there was a non-AA customer, Skyway, that ordered but never took delivery.
 
vfw614
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:14 pm

Sure, I am aware of this. But why did it make more sense for Embraer and AE to develop and pay for a new sub-type - instead of simply using 44 seat E145s, just like others did with the CRJ200/440. In contrast to the CRJ440, the E140 cannot be converted to a 50 seater and, as a result, is a rather exotic type with probably much less residual value than a E145 (well, at least 10 years or so ago).
 
alasizon
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:09 pm

vfw614 wrote:
Sure, I am aware of this. But why did it make more sense for Embraer and AE to develop and pay for a new sub-type - instead of simply using 44 seat E145s, just like others did with the CRJ200/440. In contrast to the CRJ440, the E140 cannot be converted to a 50 seater and, as a result, is a rather exotic type with probably much less residual value than a E145 (well, at least 10 years or so ago).


Realistically, with the E140s being reactivated, when they are retired again, there won't be much residual value left other than parts. The aircraft are already paid off and a fleet of almost 60 makes for pretty decent economies of scale.
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DiamondFlyer
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:18 pm

vfw614 wrote:
Sure, I am aware of this. But why did it make more sense for Embraer and AE to develop and pay for a new sub-type - instead of simply using 44 seat E145s, just like others did with the CRJ200/440. In contrast to the CRJ440, the E140 cannot be converted to a 50 seater and, as a result, is a rather exotic type with probably much less residual value than a E145 (well, at least 10 years or so ago).


AA may have felt they couldn't just paper limit the seating of the aircraft, without a fight from APA.
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MO11
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:52 am

N383SW wrote:
On a side note, does anyone recall where those 140’s went that originally flew under Connection?


One went to JETGO, several went to SA Airlink, the remainder weren't placed.
 
cheapgreek
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:58 am

vfw614 wrote:
Sure, I am aware of this. But why did it make more sense for Embraer and AE to develop and pay for a new sub-type - instead of simply using 44 seat E145s, just like others did with the CRJ200/440. In contrast to the CRJ440, the E140 cannot be converted to a 50 seater and, as a result, is a rather exotic type with probably much less residual value than a E145 (well, at least 10 years or so ago).


I believe the 140 is quite a bit better off short runways and only lose 6 seats.
 
jgcotter
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:59 pm

7 of the 21 E140s currently in service with Envoy are out of LGA. The remainder are out of DFW. Not sure if any will go to MIA or ORD, but I’m hearing some will go to CLT. This would mean MQ will open a CLT base.
 
kcrwflyer
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:08 pm

jgcotter wrote:
7 of the 21 E140s currently in service with Envoy are out of LGA. The remainder are out of DFW. Not sure if any will go to MIA or ORD, but I’m hearing some will go to CLT. This would mean MQ will open a CLT base.


Some of them are already showing up in CLT in the next few months. It looks like they're all being routed through cities that also have LGA service.. so if they rotate the planes in that way there's no real need to open any kind of base in CLT.
 
mcg
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:34 pm

Is Envoy hiring new pilots to operate these aircraft? It would seem that the addition of 58 airplanes would require 500+ new pilots.
 
MO11
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:44 pm

jgcotter wrote:
7 of the 21 E140s currently in service with Envoy are out of LGA. The remainder are out of DFW. Not sure if any will go to MIA or ORD, but I’m hearing some will go to CLT. This would mean MQ will open a CLT base.


I show 17 in service, 6 others pulled from storage, one of which is scheduled to be ready today. Did I miss something?
 
alasizon
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:56 pm

mcg wrote:
Is Envoy hiring new pilots to operate these aircraft? It would seem that the addition of 58 airplanes would require 500+ new pilots.


E145s are being transitioned to Piedmont and the CR7s have begun being transitioned to PSA again. The LGA base was always billed as temporary to most and put forward as basically a long term TDY.
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SCOOBYD75
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:17 pm

I know starting May 1st they will be using them JFK-PHL 6 times a day.
 
FSDan
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:34 pm

kcrwflyer wrote:
jgcotter wrote:
7 of the 21 E140s currently in service with Envoy are out of LGA. The remainder are out of DFW. Not sure if any will go to MIA or ORD, but I’m hearing some will go to CLT. This would mean MQ will open a CLT base.


Some of them are already showing up in CLT in the next few months. It looks like they're all being routed through cities that also have LGA service.. so if they rotate the planes in that way there's no real need to open any kind of base in CLT.


Taking a look at the April schedules (currently the farthest-out schedules that appear to be finalized), there are 11 ERD departures from CLT to SGF, LEX, GSO, FAY, HTS, ROA, and CHO. Aircraft are bridged between CLT and LGA via CHO, and possibly GSO (which has 2 RON aircraft from CLT and 1 from LGA). The CLT flying looks like it only requires 3 frames.
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Deltabravo1123
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:42 pm

Is there any hope at all that some of these E140s will go to Piedmont, to compliment their E145s? Or are all of these already back in service with Envoy?
 
jgcotter
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:52 pm

Deltabravo1123 wrote:
Is there any hope at all that some of these E140s will go to Piedmont, to compliment their E145s? Or are all of these already back in service with Envoy?

I don’t believe any E140s are scheduled to go to Piedmont at this time. I currently show 36 x E140 in service with Envoy and another 7 in refurb, 2 at BNA and 5 at ABI, of the 49 being returned to service.
 
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bluefltspecial
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Re: Envoy Reactivating ERJ-140

Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:02 pm

FSDan wrote:
kcrwflyer wrote:
jgcotter wrote:
7 of the 21 E140s currently in service with Envoy are out of LGA. The remainder are out of DFW. Not sure if any will go to MIA or ORD, but I’m hearing some will go to CLT. This would mean MQ will open a CLT base.


Some of them are already showing up in CLT in the next few months. It looks like they're all being routed through cities that also have LGA service.. so if they rotate the planes in that way there's no real need to open any kind of base in CLT.


Taking a look at the April schedules (currently the farthest-out schedules that appear to be finalized), there are 11 ERD departures from CLT to SGF, LEX, GSO, FAY, HTS, ROA, and CHO. Aircraft are bridged between CLT and LGA via CHO, and possibly GSO (which has 2 RON aircraft from CLT and 1 from LGA). The CLT flying looks like it only requires 3 frames.


Oddly enough, I was looking at this a few days ago via flightaware and noticed that the flight times via CHO could be used as a bridge between CLT and LGA. I had been wondering with the CR9 ops last year on CLT-CHO being full if they would upgauge the CHO-LGA flights. Looks like this summer though, they will be down to a few two-cabin aircraft and the rest 50 seaters on the CLT-CHO route.

Slightly off topic, but with so many E140/145 ops going on, with Awac leaving and PDT growing would Envoy consider adding smaller regional bases like PDT used to have? Currently, I think PDT is down to just PHL and ROA, however Envoy - and correct me if I'm wrong, they only have NYC, DFW, ORD, and MIA? While useful during normal ops, I always thought it was a smart idea to give outstations with large number of flights a crew base so when one station is snarled with weather, you have crew that can be positioned in that aren't affected by said weather event...
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