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New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:07 am

Welcome to New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018, please continue to add your comments below

Link to the February edition

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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:36 pm

Here’s the link to the new Air NZ Antarctic safety video:

https://youtu.be/TEsHqdA9dV0
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mariner
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:04 pm

NZ1 wrote:
Here’s the link to the new Air NZ Antarctic safety video:


I think it's a good one, a return to the more serious nature of safety videos without in any way getting heavy. And of course, it looks beautiful.

mariner
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Kiwirob
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:43 pm

Can’t see any reason why anyone could have an issue with this one. A really good video.
 
bevan7
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:18 pm

I quite like this video. A couple of interesting facts thrown in. First one I actually wanted to watch the whole way through.
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:15 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Can’t see any reason why anyone could have an issue with this one. A really good video.

I personally like it, as do ~90% of the people commenting on NZ's Facebook, though I note that there has been some criticism of it around the web this morning:

- "Shame we couldn't find a new Zealand song for it"

- "... the way he says "Antarctica" is gonna drive me INSANE"

- "We have so much kiwi talent that is internationally recognized more than these has been American actors, why don't we use them instead?"

- "I like the line about “Air NZ is committed to creating a better tomorrow for our planet”. You can do this by changing your single-use plastic cups and trays to compostable cardboard ones and use wooden cutlery."

There is also a scathing article on Stuff.co.nz, taking aim at Adrian Grenier's "Wow" comments as being "eye-opening and enlightening" (sarcasm intended).

See: https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/101 ... -of-cringe.

Cheers,

C.
 
NZ6
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:39 am

Any criticism re the use of Antarctica now the video is published?

Personally I love it, it's also a step away from comical safety videos which were becoming tired in my opinion. Yet this one still uses marketing approach which draws users into watching it voluntarily . Thus giving the airline marketing exposure into foreign markets without having to buy TV, digital or print advertising space.
 
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mariner
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:21 am

NZ6 wrote:
Any criticism re the use of Antarctica now the video is published?


Oh, some, yes. the people who were outraged by the idea of it and now feel that others aren't as outraged as they should be. The media is trying to whip up a controversy, of course, but they haven't got a lot to work with.

I'm pleased to see the safety video, mostly because I think it's good, but also a part of me feels that Antarctica is no longer off-limits to NZ.

mariner
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planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:26 am

If I were to pick out something with the video that I think could be changed, it would be the lacking of 'Brand New Zealand':

- Actor: Why Adrian Grenier, and not one of our own local New Zealander actors-turned-environmentalists, like Sam Neil?
- Music: Why UK group Keane's "Somewhere Only We Know", and not local Grammy successes Brooke Fraser or Lorde?

mariner wrote:
I'm pleased to see the safety video ... a part of me feels that Antarctica is no longer off-limits to NZ.

I assume you mean no longer off-limits in terms of discourse, as opposed to anything further, like commercialised flights?

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:05 am

planemanofnz wrote:
I assume you mean no longer off-limits in terms of discourse, as opposed to anything further, like commercialised flights?


Whichever context you want to put on it, remembering that Air France, for example, did not exclude the South Atlantic from all its forward schedules and planning because of flight 447 and that IF Norwegian ever does fly EZE-PER, then GCM gives the shortest route as being (virtually) over the South Pole.

Antarctica has been a sort of no-go area for NZ aviation since Erebus, so mostly, I think Antartica had to be normalised in our minds.

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planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:23 am

Following the critical Stuff.co.nz article posted above, the New Zealand Herald has now also posted a critical piece on the new video:

"This is a rare and very distasteful mis-step on the marketing front for an airline that usually manages its messages very well."

See: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/travel/news/a ... d=12004471.

Notably, the poll in the article showed that a majority of readers support the video being shot in Antarctica, in line with other feedback.

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:35 am

planemanofnz wrote:
If I were to pick out something with the video that I think could be changed, it would be the lacking of 'Brand New Zealand':

- Actor: Why Adrian Grenier, and not one of our own local New Zealander actors-turned-environmentalists, like Sam Neil?


Perhaps Sam Neil was busy?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/961380 ... l-campaign

Sam Neill the voice of Air New Zealand's global campaign

mariner
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wstakl
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:37 am

Receive some negative feedback in regards to bag fees and some fares increasing after announcing a mega profit......release a 'hip' and 'trendy' new safety video and all is forgiven. How very NZ.
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:11 am

mariner wrote:
Perhaps Sam Neil was busy?

Then find another New Zealander fit to feature in the video - there are heaps who have been involved in environmentalism, like Cliff Curtis, Keisha Castle Hughes, Lucy Lawless, and various others.

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:42 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Then find another New Zealander fit to feature in the video - there are heaps who have been involved in environmentalism, like Cliff Curtis, Keisha Castle Hughes, Lucy Lawless, and various others.


I'm all in favour of locals being employed, but - for my money - the fact that Mr. Grenier is a UN Ambassador for the Environment adds to his credentials for this video in this location.

Each to their own, of course.

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Gasman
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:12 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Following the critical Stuff.co.nz article posted above, the New Zealand Herald has now also posted a critical piece on the new video:

"This is a rare and very distasteful mis-step on the marketing front for an airline that usually manages its messages very well."

See: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/travel/news/a ... d=12004471.

Notably, the poll in the article showed that a majority of readers support the video being shot in Antarctica, in line with other feedback.

Cheers,

C.

This time the Herald got it right. I completely agree.

The message this video will send to the Erebus families is clear. "Ok, so one of our pilots flew your loved one into the ground; but it was nearly 40 years ago and we at NZ have decreed it's time you moved on. So here's a light hearted (but informative!) safety video featuring the place where it all happened".

It reeks of arrogance. Air New Zealand should be the very, very last people to assume the Erebus families have forgiven and healed.
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:25 am

mariner wrote:
I'm all in favour of locals being employed, but - for my money - the fact that Mr. Grenier is a UN Ambassador for the Environment adds to his credentials for this video in this location.

Perhaps, but he's done no work in Antarctica or New Zealand, so to hold up his credentials for a video set in "this location", IMHO, is questionable. Also, he was only appointed to his role in 2017 - relying on the role as justification holds less weight than for others.

Separately, NZ had also said that "Minimising any potential environmental impact of the shoot was a key priority" - IMHO, using an individual based in New Zealand to lead the video would have been much more aligned with this (with a lower overall carbon footprint).

Cheers,

C.
 
Qantas16
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:28 am

planemanofnz wrote:
mariner wrote:
I'm all in favour of locals being employed, but - for my money - the fact that Mr. Grenier is a UN Ambassador for the Environment adds to his credentials for this video in this location.

Perhaps, but he's done no work in Antarctica or New Zealand, so to hold up his credentials for a video set in "this location", IMHO, is questionable. Also, he was only appointed to his role in 2017 - relying on the role as justification holds less weight than for others.

Separately, NZ had also said that "Minimising any potential environmental impact of the shoot was a key priority" - IMHO, using an individual based in New Zealand to lead the video would have been much more aligned with this (with a lower overall carbon footprint).

Cheers,

C.


I think we all need to take a deep breath and realise we are making way to big a deal out of something very minor.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:40 am

planemanofnz wrote:
mariner wrote:
I'm all in favour of locals being employed, but - for my money - the fact that Mr. Grenier is a UN Ambassador for the Environment adds to his credentials for this video in this location.

Perhaps, but he's done no work in Antarctica or New Zealand, so to hold up his credentials for a video set in "this location", IMHO, is questionable. Also, he was only appointed to his role in 2017 - relying on the role as justification holds less weight than for others.

Separately, NZ had also said that "Minimising any potential environmental impact of the shoot was a key priority" - IMHO, using an individual based in New Zealand to lead the video would have been much more aligned with this (with a lower overall carbon footprint).


As I said - each to their own.

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planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:50 am

mariner wrote:
As I said - each to their own.

For sure - nevertheless, I think that the video itself was well done. Separately, it's great to see the video getting some coverage overseas:

- Argentina (see: http://www.latitud2000.com/node/35719).
- Australia (see: https://mashable.com/2018/02/28/air-new ... mGKhcpviq2).
- Germany (see: https://www.presseportal.de/pm/107434/3879674).
- The USA (see: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/f ... 380903002/).

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:18 am

Gasman wrote:
planemanofnz wrote:
Following the critical Stuff.co.nz article posted above, the New Zealand Herald has now also posted a critical piece on the new video:

"This is a rare and very distasteful mis-step on the marketing front for an airline that usually manages its messages very well."

See: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/travel/news/a ... d=12004471.

Notably, the poll in the article showed that a majority of readers support the video being shot in Antarctica, in line with other feedback.

Cheers,

C.

This time the Herald got it right. I completely agree.

The message this video will send to the Erebus families is clear. "Ok, so one of our pilots flew your loved one into the ground; but it was nearly 40 years ago and we at NZ have decreed it's time you moved on. So here's a light hearted (but informative!) safety video featuring the place where it all happened".

It reeks of arrogance. Air New Zealand should be the very, very last people to assume the Erebus families have forgiven and healed.

Would you be equally opposed to a safety video filmed in the North Island (there's been at least one) because an NAC DC-3 crashed in the Kaimai Ranges (a mountain range in the North Island) 55 years ago, with the loss of 23 lives? Or perhaps only Waikato and Bay of Plenty should be off limits? If we are being region specific, you would need to add Auckland to your video-ban, since it has been the site of Air New Zealand's other fatal accidents, with a DC-8 and an F27.

My Antarctic geography isn't at a professional level, but I'm pretty sure Mt Erebus and its immediate surrounds weren't highlighted in the video.

planemanofnz wrote:
"... the way he says "Antarctica" is gonna drive me INSANE"

:checkmark: That first c is not supposed to silent! I would be intrigued to hear how "arctic" is pronounced.

Personally I still think "Summer of Safety" has been the best effort, and I would love to see more in a similar vein highlighting different parts of the country. In my book, this Antar(c)tica one is a still good effort; certainly better than the Mystical Journey (which was a cool idea in principle, but the music became grating after the 20th time seeing the darn thing, and which was replaced by the previous Summer of Safety late last year), the Men in Black, Betty White, Swimsuits, that 1980s exercise chap, and the weird one with a thousand and one Hollywood tropes which fell flat on its face.

Speaking of Hollywood, I wonder if the regular use of American actors has anything to do with NZ's niche as the airline of choice from LA to London for the B-list set?

V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens. —Bahá'u'lláh
 
NZ321
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:26 am

Well, I thought the video was very well conceived. NZ is an international airline. International presence in their safety videos is consistent with what we have come to expect and I have no problem with it here. It engaged me, was short on the sort of details evident in some airline safety presentations but got the essential information over in an easy to follow and very engaging format in a beautiful landscape. Like the values espoused in the video. Don't accept it is in ill taste - It would be if it were Lufthansa or an airline from a country with presence in or responsibility to to Antarctica. But that's not New Zealand. We have this connection / responsibility and duty of care to Antarctica so it is part of our culture and heritage and this video is awareness raising. I am all for it and think it is considerably better than most of the previously mentioned examples.
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planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:31 am

VirginFlyer wrote:
Speaking of Hollywood, I wonder if the regular use of American actors has anything to do with NZ's niche as the airline of choice from LA to London for the B-list set?

Is there actual evidence to support the existence of that niche, or was it just a rumour-turned-fact within the forum? Either way, I don't see NZ's casting as influenced by what is a single route, within a very big international network.

NZ has done market-specific safety videos in the past, such as a Chinese language romance-themed one for PVG. I'd love to see more of this for China and Japan - if not in a local language, then at the very least with local actors from Asia.

See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdQYdCuF7HQ.

Cheers,

C.
 
Gasman
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:26 pm

VirginFlyer wrote:
Would you be equally opposed to a safety video filmed in the North Island (there's been at least one) because an NAC DC-3 crashed in the Kaimai Ranges (a mountain range in the North Island) 55 years ago, with the loss of 23 lives? Or perhaps only Waikato and Bay of Plenty should be off limits? If we are being region specific, you would need to add Auckland to your video-ban, since it has been the site of Air New Zealand's other fatal accidents, with a DC-8 and an F27.


They are all ludicrous analogies. A better one would be KLM filming a safety video in Tenerife. And yes, I'd oppose that too.

There are some for whom the mere mention of Air New Zealand and Antarctica in the same sentence will cut like a knife. It wasn't necessary to make this video. But I'm less opposed to the video itself than I am the fact that NZ decided it was okay for them to produce it.
 
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Astrojet727
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:03 pm

Hopefully this is an easy one for you all: I just got a diecast Air New Zealand 777-200ER with the registration ZK-DKG. I see that all current ANZ 777-200ER registrations start with ZK-OKx. What as DKG re-registered as? Did they simply change the D to an O?

http://cdn.feeyo.com/pic/20090109/20090 ... 115235.jpg
 
DavidJ08
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:20 pm

Astrojet727 wrote:
Hopefully this is an easy one for you all: I just got a diecast Air New Zealand 777-200ER with the registration ZK-DKG. I see that all current ANZ 777-200ER registrations start with ZK-OKx. What as DKG re-registered as? Did they simply change the D to an O?

http://cdn.feeyo.com/pic/20090109/20090 ... 115235.jpg

I believe they've been registered OKx since they were new, i.e. there never was a ZK-DKG. I would propose a more likely story that the makers of the model mistook the O for a D.

Did a quick google search for ZK-DKG, and turned up only three results - two of the three images had blurry rego (one of which was your link - from a Chinese forum relying on the photographer identifying the rego), and the last one was a flickr image labelled "ZK-DKG" even though the rego was visible as "ZK-OKD" :roll: . It doesn't help that Air NZ's O is a fairly square O which is prone to being mistaken for a D.

If you search on A.net you'll find that there are no photos for "ZK-DKG" because it never existed ;) I'm attaching a photo of ZK-OKG so you can see how the O could easily be mistaken for a D.

 
zkncj
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:26 pm

Astrojet727 wrote:
Hopefully this is an easy one for you all: I just got a diecast Air New Zealand 777-200ER with the registration ZK-DKG. I see that all current ANZ 777-200ER registrations start with ZK-OKx. What as DKG re-registered as? Did they simply change the D to an O?

http://cdn.feeyo.com/pic/20090109/20090 ... 115235.jpg


ZK-DKG is currently not allocated you can check at caa.govt.nz

NZ's Fleet is:

Q300s - ZK-NE*
ATR 72-500 - ZK-MC*
ATR 72-600 - ZK-MV*
A320 (non skarklet) - ZK-OJ*
A320 (sharklet) ZK-OX*
789 - ZK-NZ*
77E/77W - ZK-OK*
 
Mr AirNZ
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:54 pm

For all those who last year hypothesised the 77E fleet must be heading for early retirement, OKB departs tomorrow morning for SIN kicking off the next round of heavy maintenance and repaints. She will return in April in the new livery.
 
A350OZ
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:54 pm

Regarding the new safety video, I absolutely love it. A very good effort and beautifully made. Not as cheesy as some more recent ones, but informative and yet still funny in a distinct Kiwi way.

And yes, one can have an issue with a US actor rather than someone local (but it doesn't make it any worse for me), and yes, the music could have been a local song too (but what's wrong with "Somewhere only we know", it's a beautiful song and very fitting to the theme). And regarding Erebus, I do not see the connection to be honest. They are not promoting to fly to Antarctica, they are promoting a global environmental initiative, as they should. It has nothing to do even with "moving on" for me, it is completely unrelated, other than both happening on the same continent. But granted I wasn't affected by the Erebus crash, I wasn't even born then.
 
Gasman
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:08 pm

A350OZ wrote:
But granted I wasn't affected by the Erebus crash, I wasn't even born then.

........... which kind of nullifies everything else you said.

This shouldn't be about pack mentality. If 99.99% of people don't give a rat's about the AntarCtica (!!) / Erebus connection; that doesn't clinch the argument. It's about the 0.01% for whom NZ changed their lives forever in Nov 1979. And it was presumptuous and tone deaf of NZ to assume they'd be their own best judge of the appropriateness of going (in a marketing sense) back to Antarctica at this point in time.
 
AMSAKL
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:34 pm

I liked the video, big fan of Entourage, wasn't offended by anything.

Well done NZ :thumbsup:
 
A350OZ
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:35 pm

Gasman wrote:
A350OZ wrote:
But granted I wasn't affected by the Erebus crash, I wasn't even born then.

........... which kind of nullifies everything else you said.


No it doesn't. Just because I personally was not affected by the Erebus catastrophe, I am not allowed to have an opinion on this video? Probably 99.99% of today's NZ pax will be in the same boat, either not born back then, not having lived in NZ back then or today, or not have been directly or indirectly affected by the catastrophe. I do not see the need for NZ (or any other corporation for that matter) to base every decision for all time in the future on this one terrible event.

I understand some people including you rightly feel very strongly about this, and I respect that.
 
NZ6
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:50 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
If I were to pick out something with the video that I think could be changed, it would be the lacking of 'Brand New Zealand':

- Actor: Why Adrian Grenier, and not one of our own local New Zealander actors-turned-environmentalists, like Sam Neil?
- Music: Why UK group Keane's "Somewhere Only We Know", and not local Grammy successes Brooke Fraser or Lorde?

mariner wrote:
I'm pleased to see the safety video ... a part of me feels that Antarctica is no longer off-limits to NZ.

I assume you mean no longer off-limits in terms of discourse, as opposed to anything further, like commercialised flights?

Cheers,

C.


Perhaps there's a reason for using a known American actor? Maybe that reason is long the same lines as the why believe NZ is using Obama for an announcement. :duck:
 
NZ6
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:53 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
mariner wrote:
I'm all in favour of locals being employed, but - for my money - the fact that Mr. Grenier is a UN Ambassador for the Environment adds to his credentials for this video in this location.

Perhaps, but he's done no work in Antarctica or New Zealand, so to hold up his credentials for a video set in "this location", IMHO, is questionable. Also, he was only appointed to his role in 2017 - relying on the role as justification holds less weight than for others.

Separately, NZ had also said that "Minimising any potential environmental impact of the shoot was a key priority" - IMHO, using an individual based in New Zealand to lead the video would have been much more aligned with this (with a lower overall carbon footprint).

Cheers,

C.


Again, you have absolutely no idea on the rational regarding WHY certain people were used and you're making bold criticisms without even considering the marketing strategy. You've just got a bee in the bonnet with one detail and that's it. You've made you view clear. That's you're view and we'll respect it but there's a reason NZ did what they have, agree or not but they have.

Moving on. It's such a small matter.
 
DavidByrne
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:36 am

No different from the usual A-net approach to analysis of civil aviation issues! Take a single piece of information, analyse it to death and then make bold statements and predictions on the back of that single fact. Forgetting, of course, that the relevant airline's marketing people, technical people, commercial people and strategic people have FAR better insights into what is really happening under the surface, and have to take into account many, many factors that A-netters are completely ignorant of. Personally, I'm of the view that in almost every situation, the airline probably DOES know best, and it's my ignorance that makes their rationale seem somewhat obscure. In NZ's case, they've made precious few mis-steps (not even 10-abreast Y . . . :stirthepot:) in the last while, and this gives me great confidence that they DO know what they're doing.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:39 am

There is a neat little article on anna.aero today about WLG's recent performance and trends.

It shows that CV, FJ, JQ, S8 and VA all cut WLG capacity in 2017, with CV leading by -17%!

See: http://www.anna.aero/2018/03/01/welling ... e-network/.

Does anyone know what forced the steep decline from CV? Less fleet to spare, given WAG?

It'd be great to see new international services at WLG in 2018, like OL to APW or SB to NOU.

Cheers,

C.
 
DavidByrne
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:49 am

planemanofnz wrote:
NZ had also said that "Minimising any potential environmental impact of the shoot was a key priority" - IMHO, using an individual based in New Zealand to lead the video would have been much more aligned with this (with a lower overall carbon footprint).

Not forgetting, also, that getting people to and from the ice is done only with the goodwill of the NZ and US military. There are very, very few available seats each year that are not already spoken for with logistics and scientific people. Having made that flight myself, also, there's a lot of rigmarole to go through and the standard of comfort is . . . well, lacking. It's not the sort of place that you can suddenly decide to take a classroom full of schoolkids down to (as someone suggested) and call up the US Navy for a Herc flight next week. At all. In fact, schoolkids would be a complete and utter liability in that environment.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:51 am

A350OZ wrote:
They are not promoting to fly to Antarctica, they are promoting a global environmental initiative, as they should.

There is a valid argument that the video "portrays Antarctica as the next great adventure playground", which it is not.

Ironically, while the video attempts to promote conservation efforts, it may only encourage more people to visit there.

"This video is very poor taste and it sends the worst message about protecting Antarctica. It's a unique continent, and its not the next recreational playground."

See: https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national ... tic-expert.

VirginFlyer wrote:
I'm pretty sure Mt Erebus and its immediate surrounds weren't highlighted in the video.

That is correct - though, according to the article posted above, it was filmed a "few kilometres away from Mt Erebus".

A UN Environment Patron of Oceans has called that location decision by NZ "deeply disturbing" and of "poor taste".

Cheers,

C.
 
PA515
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:01 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Does anyone know what forced the steep decline from CV? Less fleet to spare, given WAG?

17% is not a 'steep decline'. It would be a reduction of one flight a week if they had six previously. Probably replaced a WLG flight with one to AKL.

PA515
 
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mariner
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:01 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Ironically, while the video attempts to promote conservation efforts, it may only encourage more people to visit there.

"This video is very poor taste and it sends the worst message about protecting Antarctica. It's a unique continent, and its not the next recreational playground."


Mr. Pugh would be better shouting at Qantas who actually have tourist flights over Antarctica:

http://www.antarcticaflights.com.au

"ANTARCTICA IN A DAY SIGHTSEEING FLIGHTS OVER ANTARCTICA FROM AUSTRALIA

We operate one day sightseeing flights over Antarctica departing from Australia every summer.


Presently available from Perth, Hobart and Melbourne. They don't say what will happen if one of those flights has, say, engine trouble and has to land.

mariner
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planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:11 am

mariner wrote:
Mr. Pugh would be better shouting at Qantas who actually have tourist flights over Antarctica ...

As VirginFlyer pointed out previously, the flights from Australia are marketed by a travel agency from Victoria, Croydon Travel, under a brand-name "Antarctica Flights". They charter each flight from QF, who obviously are quite intimately involved with the process, but it would be incorrect to regard this as a QF initiative.

Cheers,

C.
 
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mariner
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:12 am

planemanofnz wrote:
mariner wrote:
Mr. Pugh would be better shouting at Qantas who actually have tourist flights over Antarctica ...

As VirginFlyer pointed out previously, the flights from Australia are marketed by a travel agency from Victoria, Croydon Travel, under a brand-name "Antarctica Flights". They charter each flight from QF, who obviously are quite intimately involved with the process, but it would be incorrect to regard this as a QF initiative.


Qantas provides the plane and the service, the Qantas name and logo are prominently displayed throughout. If Qantas withdrew the planes, the question becomes who would fly them, and would they be in quite such good nick?

mariner
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A350OZ
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:53 am

planemanofnz wrote:
A350OZ wrote:
They are not promoting to fly to Antarctica, they are promoting a global environmental initiative, as they should.

There is a valid argument that the video "portrays Antarctica as the next great adventure playground", which it is not.

Ironically, while the video attempts to promote conservation efforts, it may only encourage more people to visit there.


Yes I give you that, I haven't looked at it from this angle to be honest but understand if some people see it that way. More tourism to Antarctica is the last thing we need.
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:20 am

I know a few here will be extremely pleased to hear this news.

https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/politica ... ture-cards

She said members of the Australia-New Zealand Leadership Forum had raised the matter with her.

Ms Ardern said she would be asking Statistics Minister James Shaw and Customs Minister Meka Whaitiri to start moves on it.

She had already talked to them about removing what she called this "bugbear".
 
Kiwirob
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:34 am

Gasman wrote:
VirginFlyer wrote:
Would you be equally opposed to a safety video filmed in the North Island (there's been at least one) because an NAC DC-3 crashed in the Kaimai Ranges (a mountain range in the North Island) 55 years ago, with the loss of 23 lives? Or perhaps only Waikato and Bay of Plenty should be off limits? If we are being region specific, you would need to add Auckland to your video-ban, since it has been the site of Air New Zealand's other fatal accidents, with a DC-8 and an F27.


They are all ludicrous analogies. A better one would be KLM filming a safety video in Tenerife. And yes, I'd oppose that too.

There are some for whom the mere mention of Air New Zealand and Antarctica in the same sentence will cut like a knife. It wasn't necessary to make this video. But I'm less opposed to the video itself than I am the fact that NZ decided it was okay for them to produce it.


Out of the nearly 5 million people living in NZ well over half of them wouldn't have any knowledge of the incident and the numbers who it would cut like a knife probably wouldn't fill a highschool gym.
 
planemanofnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:30 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Out of the nearly 5 million people living in NZ well over half of them wouldn't have any knowledge of the incident ...

Well, if they didn't before, they do now, given the amount of publicity that it's been getting. Any publicity is good publicity, I guess. :scratchchin:

I note that the critical journalism of the video has gone global - one article in particular was re-published many times across Australia:

- http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-up ... dcc964cae3.
- https://www.gladstoneobserver.com.au/ne ... v/3350779/.
- https://m.northernstar.com.au/news/outr ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.dailyexaminer.com.au/news/o ... v/3350779/.
- http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/outrag ... dcc964cae3.
- https://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/n ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.warwickdailynews.com.au/new ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.dailymercury.com.au/news/ou ... v/3350779/.

Such articles were also posted in non-NZ served countries, like South Africa - see: https://www.algoafm.co.za/article/globa ... ive-watch-.

That being said, most readers have responded negatively to these articles - see the Courier Mail's Facebook comments, for example:

- "there isnt 1 thing controversial about it."
- "Really?? Outraged over F all. Get a life."
- "Weekend interns have started their shift."

See: https://www.facebook.com/couriermail/po ... 1124747702.

I wonder if / when Grant Bradley will come out with his own take here - he did a piece on the QF video's 'fumble' less than a month ago.

Cheers,

C.
 
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mariner
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:59 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
I note that the critical journalism of the video has gone global - one article in particular was re-published many times across Australia:

- http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-up ... dcc964cae3.
- https://www.gladstoneobserver.com.au/ne ... v/3350779/.
- https://m.northernstar.com.au/news/outr ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.dailyexaminer.com.au/news/o ... v/3350779/.
- http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/outrag ... dcc964cae3.
- https://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/n ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.warwickdailynews.com.au/new ... v/3350779/.
- https://www.dailymercury.com.au/news/ou ... v/3350779/.

Such articles were also posted in non-NZ served countries, like South Africa - see: https://www.algoafm.co.za/article/globa ... ive-watch-.

That being said, most readers have responded negatively to these articles - see the Courier Mail's Facebook comments, for example:

- "there isnt 1 thing controversial about it."
- "Really?? Outraged over F all. Get a life."
- "Weekend interns have started their shift.".


And for most of those places "Erebus" would have little - if any - meaning, so they need to be told what it was.

It's a safety video which has "Air crash! Antarctica! Hollywood star! Controversy! Penguins!"

It hits the media trifecta and NZ has its name out there in front - proudly - saying this is us. Image

mariner
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Gasman
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:59 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Out of the nearly 5 million people living in NZ well over half of them wouldn't have any knowledge of the incident and the numbers who it would cut like a knife probably wouldn't fill a highschool gym.

Wow. Comments like this really make me weep.

People. It's not about "majority rules", or that somehow the weight of numbers of non offended vs offended make this ok.

Firstly, the argument "I'm not upset by it, and can't see why anyone would be" is just plain thick. People react to things how they will - sometimes in a rational way, often not. It is what it is. Secondly - the other point people just don't seem to be getting is the relevance of NZ making this video. It isn't about some third party making a movie featuring Antarctica, and that triggering some visceral reaction in an Erebus family member. It's about the very company responsible for your husband/father/cousin's death making making a production in the relevant geographical region as if nothing ever happened. For those people (filling a ball park, high school gym or toilet cubicle) it's a twist of knife yet again from NZ.

Not all will feel that way. Maybe no one will. But as NZ doesn't *need* to make a video about Antarctica; why oh why - for their own benefit even - take the risk?
 
Kiwirob
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:07 pm

Disasters haven’t stopped ferries crossing the Cook Strait, or NZ Rail running passenger trains between Auckland and Wellington. The Wahine and Tangiwai disasters resulted in large losses of life, both incidents shocked the nation, both incidents could have been prevented like Erebus, I really don’t understand why Erebus is considered differently.
 
Kashmon
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:18 pm

this just proves that Kiwi's are one of the biggest snowflake populations on earth.

We had an incident in a location "that location is now off limits!!!!"

jeez....
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