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zeke
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:27 pm

william wrote:
Quite the opposite, I have read at least three posts that has called this out for what it is, a negotiation ploy to keep Airbus honest, and a CEO doing his job.


That’s what a Boeing fanboy would see it as, it is just another day in the office to me. D7 would be getting at least two visits a year from Boeing pitching everything they have on offer. It’s a sales pitch, Airbus does the exact same.

Normally they do their pitch, they take you out on the corporate credit card shake hands and you are left with a series of marketing material which includes these models an presentations of other aircraft in the your livery.

The OEMs also use it way to extract info from the clients as to what is good and bad about the competitions products, and Boeing would be using the time to try and extract the A339 performance data that Airbus has shared with D7.
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william
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:30 pm

zeke wrote:
william wrote:
The OEMs also use it way to extract info from the clients as to what is good and bad about the competitions products, and Boeing would be using the time to try and extract the A339 performance data that Airbus has shared with D7.


I totally agree,I don't doubt that one bit. One has to think there are some non disclosure statements signed somewhere though.
 
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Polot
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:03 pm

I’m sure airlines leak information that is technically covered under an NDA to manufacturers all the time. It is hard to prove the source of the leak (it is not like they are leaking the info in public) and you better be damn sure before you go damaging your relations with a customer by going after them for violating NDAs.
 
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zeke
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:04 pm

Yes there is, but it would not stop them from asking, now that you have your US flight approvals, what sort of payload out you take from NRT to SEA ? How do you plan to configure the A339 ?
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ericm2031
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:14 pm

The A339 is just 1 model (basically) instead of a family like 787 or even A350. They can stick with just 1 aircraft if they want, but eventually they will need something else if they want to fly farther or bigger.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:48 pm

william wrote:
a negotiation ploy to keep Airbus honest,


Honest about what exactly? Aside from the fact that Air Asia got A330neo at launch price, nobody is going to change a contract that was signed years ago. Are you referring to a potential new order?
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william
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:04 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
william wrote:
a negotiation ploy to keep Airbus honest,


Honest about what exactly? Aside from the fact that Air Asia got A330neo at launch price, nobody is going to change a contract that was signed years ago. Are you referring to a potential new order?


Yes. follow up orders that are sure to come.
 
RobertPhoenix
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:16 pm

I wonder if this and the HA change makes me wonder if Boeing is getting much more competitive on pricing. The question then would be whether they have seriously reduced their production costs already, are confident that they can continue to get further significant reductions in cost, or that they are prepared to operate with lower margin. They also may have determined that they absolutely need more volume to get their costs down.

Perhaps we can get a gauge of this by seeing how much the deferred production cost reduces each quarter, although that might also be reflected in different sales prices as they move out of the initial orders. By the rate at which orders were placed when 787 was first announced one can only assume that initial pricing was extremely competitive (as well as oil prices being high at the time)
 
texl1649
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:18 pm

Not a lot of high level contract negotiation team members on a.net. Talk is indeed very cheap, and I really doubt this means all that much.

My SWAG is that we will wind up seeing a much greater number of 787-A350/A330NEO operators over the next 20 years than are planned today. There's not much wrong with any of these products (other than A338/788).
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:37 pm

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... es-for-now

Air Asia denies interest in 787 for now.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:08 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/65099-airasia-group-denies-interest-in-boeing-widebodies-for-now

Air Asia denies interest in 787 for now.


This is turning into another HA thread. Lol
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juliuswong
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:07 pm

PlanesNTrains wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/65099-airasia-group-denies-interest-in-boeing-widebodies-for-now

Air Asia denies interest in 787 for now.


This is turning into another HA thread. Lol

Gahaa, mirror mirror hanging on the wall, which aircraft best suit my operation for all.. ??"

Joke aside, thanks to thread starter. I could've never imagine my little observation on IG sparked heated debate.

I think all of us need to agree is airlines are free to fish for information with any vendors regarding their products and services. The account, operation and finance folks will crunch their figures to decide which aircraft best suits their operation. A lot of airlines have move away from single OEM to diversify their fleet to match different operational requirement. Additionally, regulatory requirement. AirAsia is swapping some regional A320 flight with A330ceo in order to meet demand. If the plan is approved, soon we will see some widebodies on KUL to SIN, KHH, DMK etc. The Asia Pacific and Australia-New Zealand, AirAsia X main core market, is facing traffic congestion and pilot shortage, AirAsia is exploring many options now.

On a side note, one should note AirAsia Group net debt gearing is very high despite profits almost every quarter. Malaysia and Thailand operation are in good hand, Philippines is improving and Indonesia is struggling to make money. Although they have a lot of financial backers, I don't think they are willing to sink in more money to allow Air Asia to buy shiny new expensive B787-10. This of course will change is Boeing can swing some EXIM credit.

Oh yes, btw Tony has sold its aircraft leasing subsidiary for one billion. Guess the money could be used to par down debt hearing and shop for new aircraft??

Take note though, Tony had some very kind words for C-Series, much publicised event but at the end nothing came out. God forbid, they have 28" seat pitch and 16" seat width!!
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flee
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:00 am

william wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
william wrote:
a negotiation ploy to keep Airbus honest,

Honest about what exactly? Aside from the fact that Air Asia got A330neo at launch price, nobody is going to change a contract that was signed years ago. Are you referring to a potential new order?
Yes. follow up orders that are sure to come.

Yes, Airasia X ordered the A339 at launch customer prices - so the scope to go even lower than that will be more or less zero.

There are 66 A339s on order and that will mean that the airline will have a fleet of over 100 A330s altogether (if they do not retire any of their current fleet). By then, having another aircraft type should not be an economic issue anymore. So it is a question as to whether they should go for the A359 or B78X.
 
superbizzy73
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:04 am

...just like like everyone that was totally certain that Hawaiian Airlines would never order the 787? Don't count anything out until the dust settles, and the ink is dry.
 
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flee
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:45 am

superbizzy73 wrote:
...just like like everyone that was totally certain that Hawaiian Airlines would never order the 787? Don't count anything out until the dust settles, and the ink is dry.

Well the Airasia X order for 66 A330Neos was signed in 2014. So the ink is well and truly dry!

I suspect that they may now be trying to make modifications to that order. That opens the door for Boeing to creep in...
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:54 am

superbizzy73 wrote:
... Don't count anything out until the dust settles, and the ink is dry.

This statement........wins! Change is only thing that is constant nowadays....
- Life is a journey, travel it well -
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:46 am

superbizzy73 wrote:
...just like like everyone that was totally certain that Hawaiian Airlines would never order the 787? Don't count anything out until the dust settles, and the ink is dry.


If you want to be accurate, there is only a LOI for the 787, no firm order yet.
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:56 pm

Not sure this rumor will go away, regardless of what airline says.

Per a daily news summary I receive:

AirAsia Group (Malaysia) may order the B787 at Farnborough in July 2018. Both Tony Fernandes and Benyamin Ismail were in Seattle recently being pitched the -10.
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:09 pm

ericm2031 wrote:
The A339 is just 1 model (basically) instead of a family like 787 or even A350. They can stick with just 1 aircraft if they want, but eventually they will need something else if they want to fly farther or bigger.


ROFL:

A319NEO A320NEO A321NEO A321LR A338 A339 A359 A3510 A380
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:24 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
superbizzy73 wrote:
...just like like everyone that was totally certain that Hawaiian Airlines would never order the 787? Don't count anything out until the dust settles, and the ink is dry.


If you want to be accurate, there is only a LOI for the 787, no firm order yet.

If Boeing makes a sale and you don't piss on it, did they really make a sale? ;)

But don't worry, AirAsia X will remain "Proudly All Airbus". There will be no Boeing airplanes in that livery.
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:29 pm

I have to wonder how much of this has been caused by Airbus announcing that its A330-900neo will now have a 251t variant. That now puts pressure on Boeing to perhaps increase the MTOW of its B787-10 to compete with the A330-900neo on range in the 300-350 seat market with a sub-280t frame (I know that D7 flies its A333s in a W12Y365 configuration) or cede that market to the A350-900XWB. (I consider the B789 as really a plane for the 250-300 seat market, even though there are configurations as dense as W32Y+18Y209 for Neos).
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:06 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
I have to wonder how much of this has been caused by Airbus announcing that its A330-900neo will now have a 251t variant. That now puts pressure on Boeing to perhaps increase the MTOW of its B787-10 to compete with the A330-900neo on range in the 300-350 seat market with a sub-280t frame (I know that D7 flies its A333s in a W12Y365 configuration) or cede that market to the A350-900XWB. (I consider the B789 as really a plane for the 250-300 seat market, even though there are configurations as dense as W32Y+18Y209 for Neos).



The 787-9 is effectively the same size as the A339-NEO and goes further. The 787-10 is significantly larger and doesn’t go as far.

Frankly for Air-Asia X, if you don’t consider commonality and conversion cost, it’s hard to see how the 787-9/10 don’t make the most sense for them. The 787-10 should offer significantly lower CASM than the 787-9 and A339neo. Then if you want to go further than 787-9 and A339neo would both be fine. The 789 is a bit more efficient operating wise and the A339neo is supposed to be cheaper to buy.

I doubt they switch but I think from a pure optimal family for what they do the 787-9/10 fits them the best.
 
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zeke
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:02 pm

It’s doesn’t work that way with Asian LCCs, the A339 has the same exit limit as the 787-10 (440 seats), and more seats than the 797-9 (420 seats max).

I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.
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B764er
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:55 pm

Can't wait to see the 787-10 flying for the airlines.
Btw I can't wait to see the 737-10 as well.
 
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Polot
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:36 am

zeke wrote:
It’s doesn’t work that way with Asian LCCs, the A339 has the same exit limit as the 787-10 (440 seats), and more seats than the 797-9 (420 seats max).

I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.

Yes, but to get to that exit limit Air Asia X has to go to all Y, which they are doing with their incoming leased A330s. But if they want more seats while retaining their premium cabin (or increase their premium cabin size) for certain markets they need to look at a physically larger aircraft (78X or use A359s on those shorter routes).
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:00 am

zeke wrote:
It’s doesn’t work that way with Asian LCCs, the A339 has the same exit limit as the 787-10 (440 seats), and more seats than the 797-9 (420 seats max).

I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.


But Air Asia isn't cebu pacific, their a330s 'only' have 377 seats with 9-abreast Y because they have some angle-flats up front. The A359 order makes no sense if they are stuffing seats to exit limits on the A339s anyways. Hence, the desire for larger aircraft still exists.
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:00 am

zeke wrote:
I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.


Agreed, but even most LCC's aren't going to stuff 436 seats into a 333/339. Once your A330 configuration is at or under 400 seats, the 787-10 can probably match or beat it on CASM at equal pitch.
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:01 am

seabosdca wrote:
zeke wrote:
I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.


Agreed, but ezven most LCC's aren't going to stuff 436 seats into a 333/339. Once your A330 configuration is at or under 400 seats, the 787-10 can probably match or beat it on CASM at equal pitch.


You still have to fill those additional seats to make the 787-10 work.
 
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zeke
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:08 am

seabosdca wrote:
Agreed, but even most LCC's aren't going to stuff 436 seats into a 333/339.


From what I understand they are going above 400 seats on the A330 arriving this year.
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zeke
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:12 am

marcelh wrote:
You still have to fill those additional seats to make the 787-10 work.


And also to buy/lease for the same price, and operate it at the lower weights to pay the same enroute and airport charges.
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:24 am

seahawk wrote:
The lower price of the A330NEO might no longer be an advantage, if you consider the deal HA must have gotten. If switching to the 787 made sense although their will be cancellation costs with Airbus and RR, the effective price for the 787s might have been less than the A330NEOs.


I don't see how Airbus could charge much of a cancellation fee since they already broke the contract to a large extent by not delivering HA the A358 that they ordered.
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:47 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
william wrote:
a negotiation ploy to keep Airbus honest,


Honest about whatr exactly? Aside from the fact that Air Asia got A330neo at launch price, nobody is going to change a contract that was signed years ago. Are you referring to a potential new order?

Contracts are changed all the time.

Boeing has significantly cut 787 production costs from 5 years ago. If the industry scuttlebutt is to be believed, Boeing would offer a 789 for $10 million or so less.

Airbus is late. That opens up nasty clauses in any aircraft purchase contract. Airbus is going to have to negotiate those late clauses in all the contracts.

In the case of HA, they cancelled. No airline is required to buy aircraft that are too late or do not meet contract specifications.

Take QR, they obviously had a hot take off requirement in their A320 contract they used to switch from Pratt to CFM. EY had one A346 demolished where Airbus probably would have preferred to make a replacement, but that replacement wouldn't have met contract delivery timelines.

Delta has wiggled out of their 788 contract and bought the A330NEO.

AirAsia has a chance to save money, or as we Americans say, "be kept honest." If they don't negotiate, that is bad business on both parties.

I've personally seen about 20% of contracts renegotiated in any given year. For example, Indigo is always accelerating deliveries.

AirAsia will have another out: financing. Widebody financing is being done under far worse conditions for the airlines than even two years ago. To achieve the same per flight costs, AirAsia will need a lower purchase price.

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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:55 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Not sure this rumor will go away, regardless of what airline says.

Per a daily news summary I receive:

AirAsia Group (Malaysia) may order the B787 at Farnborough in July 2018. Both Tony Fernandes and Benyamin Ismail were in Seattle recently being pitched the -10.

May is not definite.

I simply assume that the 787 production ramp, 787 production cost reduction, and A339 delays puts everything in play.

Boeing was on the defensive on the 787 from 2008 through about 2012. Airbus during that time frame did very well. Now due to delays, the A339 is on the defensive exactly when Boeing is ramping production and has tackled the backlog.

With a huge order on the line, I see major negotiations occurring.

What I want to know is:
1. Will AirAsia take the A339? I think at least some, but I also believe the size of the order is at risk.
2. Will AirAsia take 787s?

In my opinion this is the make or break order of 2018.

As others noted, we had many posts on how previous airlines would never switch. But we've seen a back and forth between both vendors. HA, U2, DL, AA, UA, and others made orders many (most?) Thought they wouldn't.

D7 is in play. That is exciting.

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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:28 pm

Do note that whatever they take, their policy is to only operate one type. As such, they either take the A339 or the A359 from Airbus. Alternatively, they will take the B789 from Boeing. They won't have both types. And once the new aircraft arrive, a programme will begin to phase out the A333s. This is one of the methods they use to keep their costs low - simple fleet.
 
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william
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:34 pm

flee wrote:
Do note that whatever they take, their policy is to only operate one type. As such, they either take the A339 or the A359 from Airbus. Alternatively, they will take the B789 from Boeing. They won't have both types. And once the new aircraft arrive, a programme will begin to phase out the A333s. This is one of the methods they use to keep their costs low - simple fleet.


Which is funny, because many on this site seem to think one type thing is overrated.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:36 pm

flee wrote:
Do note that whatever they take, their policy is to only operate one type. As such, they either take the A339 or the A359 from Airbus. Alternatively, they will take the B789 from Boeing. They won't have both types. And once the new aircraft arrive, a programme will begin to phase out the A333s. This is one of the methods they use to keep their costs low - simple fleet.

Airlines adapt. AS had a Boeing only policy, but is accepting A321NEO.

It costs less today to have multiple types than 15 years ago. I won't bet on one type. With good software it is possible to operate two types economically.

It is possible to go with one. There is a cost for each strategy.

Game theory. Let us say Boeing offers the 787 that will save say $10 million net over a lifetime per airframe. If AirAsia is looking to buy say 25 more, do they say no? It cannot cost more than $30 million more to have two fleets over a lifetime.

Same scenario with A359s or...

Airbus has the incumbent advantage.

If AS can opperate two types, anything can happen.
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flee
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:40 pm

william wrote:
flee wrote:
Do note that whatever they take, their policy is to only operate one type. As such, they either take the A339 or the A359 from Airbus. Alternatively, they will take the B789 from Boeing. They won't have both types. And once the new aircraft arrive, a programme will begin to phase out the A333s. This is one of the methods they use to keep their costs low - simple fleet.
Which is funny, because many on this site seem to think one type thing is overrated.

Everyone will have their opinions but it is D7's opinion that matters most. Right now, they operate a single type and their top management has also reiterated that policy not too long ago. That is why they are taking a long time to confirm anything. It is not a simple decision.
 
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Polot
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:42 pm

marcelh wrote:
seabosdca wrote:
zeke wrote:
I don’t see a 787-10 beating the CASM on a Cebu Pacific style 436 seats on an A333.


Agreed, but ezven most LCC's aren't going to stuff 436 seats into a 333/339. Once your A330 configuration is at or under 400 seats, the 787-10 can probably match or beat it on CASM at equal pitch.


You still have to fill those additional seats to make the 787-10 work.

That’s true with all the planes we are discussing. That 436 seat A330 needs to be filled to fully realize it’s fantasic CASM as well.

As I said before, the 787-10 (or A359) provides an option to get ~400+ seats while still retaining a small premium section as Air Asia X currently has.
 
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Polot
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:48 pm

flee wrote:
william wrote:
flee wrote:
Do note that whatever they take, their policy is to only operate one type. As such, they either take the A339 or the A359 from Airbus. Alternatively, they will take the B789 from Boeing. They won't have both types. And once the new aircraft arrive, a programme will begin to phase out the A333s. This is one of the methods they use to keep their costs low - simple fleet.
Which is funny, because many on this site seem to think one type thing is overrated.

Everyone will have their opinions but it is D7's opinion that matters most. Right now, they operate a single type and their top management has also reiterated that policy not too long ago. That is why they are taking a long time to confirm anything. It is not a simple decision.

That may be top management’s policy but they also still officially have 10 A359s on order...
 
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:02 pm

Polot wrote:
flee wrote:
william wrote:
Which is funny, because many on this site seem to think one type thing is overrated.

Everyone will have their opinions but it is D7's opinion that matters most. Right now, they operate a single type and their top management has also reiterated that policy not too long ago. That is why they are taking a long time to confirm anything. It is not a simple decision.

That may be top management’s policy but they also still officially have 10 A359s on order...

Absolutely - top management has said that if they take the A359s, the A339 order will disappear and be converted to the A359.
 
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Polot
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:16 pm

flee wrote:
Polot wrote:
flee wrote:
Everyone will have their opinions but it is D7's opinion that matters most. Right now, they operate a single type and their top management has also reiterated that policy not too long ago. That is why they are taking a long time to confirm anything. It is not a simple decision.

That may be top management’s policy but they also still officially have 10 A359s on order...

Absolutely - top management has said that if they take the A359s, the A339 order will disappear and be converted to the A359.

The A359 order predates the A339 order though. Why didn’t they fully cancel the A359 when they first ordered the A339 3 years ago? The A339 is now scheduled to be delivered before their first A359s, is Air Asia now going to defer A339s? I thought it was established here on A.net that Air Asia X has firmly recommitted to their A339 order being pleased with results from flight testing. If they fully made up their mind (as many here suggest they have, in favor of the A330neo dismissing any possibility of the 787), and if they only want to ever operate one type, why is there still that A350 order hanging around.
 
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flee
Posts: 630
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:33 pm

Polot wrote:
flee wrote:
Polot wrote:
That may be top management’s policy but they also still officially have 10 A359s on order...

Absolutely - top management has said that if they take the A359s, the A339 order will disappear and be converted to the A359.

The A359 order predates the A339 order though. Why didn’t they fully cancel the A359 when they first ordered the A339 3 years ago? The A339 is now scheduled to be delivered before their first A359s, is Air Asia now going to defer A339s? I thought it was established here on A.net that Air Asia X has firmly recommitted to their A339 order being pleased with results from flight testing. If they fully made up their mind (as many here suggest they have, in favor of the A330neo dismissing any possibility of the 787), and if they only want to ever operate one type, why is there still that A350 order hanging around.

Do note that in all the discussions on this thread, the company itself did not issue any official statements. So officially, they have 66 A339 firm orders, 10 A359 firm orders and 0 B789 orders.

We will know for sure when the time comes for the first A339 deliveries to take place. Airbus has informed them that it will be in the first half of 2019. That is some six months behind the original schedule. That is why they are leasing six more second hand A333s this year to make up the shortfall in deliveries.
 
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janders
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Re: AirAsia X CEO in Seattle discussing 787-10

Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:28 pm

Well maybe this order is not so far-fetched now that they will not take their A350 order, and could recompete A330NEO order.
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