kwbl
Posts: 425
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 11:55 am

AA In Pdx?

Wed Mar 06, 2002 1:43 pm

Here is a question for any who might know. AA has been in Portland since around 1980. In that time, they have merged with 3 airlines (Aircal, Reno Air, and TWA). In all 3 instances most of the flights operated by those carriers were immediately slashed or completely eliminated. AirCal had a fairly significant share of the market, yet American couldn't (or wouldn't) make it work. My question is simply why? They have not added a route since the early 80's when they started going to ORD. They have basically a minor presence in the market. Are they just not able to penetrate this market? It seems they should be able to add JFK at minimum yet it seems all other west coast airports take priority over PDX which is a sizeable market. Any input would be appreciated.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24723
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: AA In Pdx?

Wed Mar 06, 2002 1:57 pm

You might see MIA-PDX or JFK-PDX down the line, as that is were AA will be introducing the bulk of thier new routes in the next few years, but it's still a big maybe.
a.
 
flashmeister
Posts: 2671
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 4:32 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Wed Mar 06, 2002 1:59 pm

Agreed, Kwbl. AA has kept the ex-TWA runs to STL, as far as I know, but they're underestimating PDX's potential from NYC.

The market is there: pre-9/11, US was to start PHL-PDX, DL had at least some good luck with JFK-PDX (although that route is no more), and CO has very good luck with EWR-PDX. I think that the market could support a run to JFK.

That being said, PDX has fairly good service to the east coast when connections come into play, considering that they don't really have an incumbent carrier (apart from Alaska/Horizon)... but I think that AA could make some inroads here.
 
doug_or
Posts: 3138
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Wed Mar 06, 2002 3:00 pm

the good old delta days supported their flights to asia. Why they made our little podunk town an international gateway I'll never figure out, but those days are sadly long gone. I'm suprised USair doesn't fly here (i believe they used to a llllong time ago, but could be wrong). At any rate, AA keeps getting crazy ideas about west coast expansion, then gets lazy. The west coast corridor is brutal on fare, though the number of competitors has been dropping (Reno, Morris, Shuttle). So, they don't really ant to get involved in that (its mostly point to point anyeway), and they already can feed us into their hubs.
I think the problem getting transcon flights lies with the amount of point to point traffic we could generate. Sure a bunch of people need to go to the east coast, but not all the same city, and hubbing us in the mid-west is a lot easier than hubbing us on the east coast.
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
doug_or
Posts: 3138
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Wed Mar 06, 2002 3:05 pm

the good old delta days supported their flights to asia. Why they made our little podunk town an international gateway I'll never figure out, but those days are sadly long gone. I'm suprised USair doesn't fly here (i believe they used to a llllong time ago, but could be wrong). At any rate, AA keeps getting crazy ideas about west coast expansion, then gets lazy. The west coast corridor is brutal on fare, though the number of competitors has been dropping (Reno, Morris, Shuttle). So, they don't really ant to get involved in that (its mostly point to point anyeway), and they already can feed us into their hubs.
I think the problem getting transcon flights lies with the amount of point to point traffic we could generate. Sure a bunch of people need to go to the east coast, but not all the same city, and hubbing us in the mid-west is a lot easier than hubbing us on the east coast.
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
AAR90
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2000 11:51 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:03 am

>My question is simply why?

In its most basic form: not enough new revenue potential to support daily flights--remember, much of the PDX-JFK flight's revenue would come from current connecting traffic.

>They have basically a minor presence in the market.
>Are they just not able to penetrate this market?

Depends upon what "market" you are talking about.

>It seems they should be able to add JFK at minimum yet it seems
>all other west coast airports take priority over PDX which is a sizeable market.

PDX is not "sizeable" compared to the LAX basin, SFO bay area, and metropolitan SEA. Add to the equation the "economic cost" of not utilizing the aircraft in a different market where it will earn even greater revenue and you'll quickly figure out that PDX is not that large a market in AA's route map --at the present time. As noted earlier, you may see MIA-PDX or increased hub frequencies in the future, but that'll probably be more to strengthen the hubs rather than going for increased PDX market share.
*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
 
SESGDL
Posts: 2621
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:25 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:17 am

Delta still operates PDX-JFK. Once daily with a 767-300.
 
Trvlr
Posts: 4251
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2000 9:58 am

RE: AA In Pdx?

Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:23 am

The DL flight is a one-stop, however. UA, AA, NW probably operate one-stops to either JFK, EWR, or LGA. The only nonstop from PDX to the New York area is on CO, I believe.

I think the best hope PDX has for more east coast expansion is Alaska. If AS' recent expansion from SEA to the East Coast works (which I think it will), we could see PDX-JFK, or maybe even PDX-BOS and PDX-IAD.

Aaron G.
 
scottysair
Posts: 6442
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 4:07 pm

RE: AA In Pdx?

Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:38 am

Yes, that was one-stop from JFK-SEA-PDX flight on DL by the flight #98/99. That is as for 1 daily roundtrip flight. I was look it up on the www.delta.com pages and find out as for flight status about with stop in Seattle get a more passengers on the plane way to JFK. Thanks!!

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