Mik
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Boeing SST Mock-Up

Wed Mar 06, 2002 11:33 pm

Does anyone know if the 1:1 Mock-up of the SST plane still exists?

I saw a picture at a museum homepage where the nose section is stored. ( Hiller Aviation Museum)

Boeing did win the US competition of designing a Super Sonic Plane in the 60`s / 70`s, and
then they build a real escale mock-up with complete cockpit and cabin.

There are some pictuers in the net from that mock-up. Look at www.boeing.com history
section.

If anyone knows more...thanks

Peace

Mik  Wow!
 
Greg
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 12:00 am

It's in someone's backyard (field) in Florida. In pieces. At least the nose section.

No lie. I came across a picture of it somewhere. Maybe another poster knows the source? It way about five years ago (?).
 
Mik
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 12:27 am

Look at

http://www.boeing.com/companyoffices/history/boeing/sst.html

Theres a picture of the muck-up

Peace

Mik  Wow!
 
sllevin
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Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 1:57 pm

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 5:04 am

As Greg alluded to, for many years it sat in Florida.

A few years ago Hiller purchased it and moved it to California as a centerpiece to the Hiller Aviation Museum at KSQL (San Carlos, California). They have the nose section indoors and are slowly restoring it.

It's very impressive especially when you realize the size of it (as compared to the Concorde or the B-70)

Steve
 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:05 am

Yes the nose section of the mock-up currently resides at the Hiller Aviation Museum http://www.hiller.org and is in the process of being restored. Here are some photos of it:





Since these photos were taken, a lot of restoration work has been completed. The exterior has a fresh coat of paint and the cockpit is almost completed.

Richard Silagi
 
fanofjets
Posts: 1977
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 11:19 am

Cool photos, Richard. Thanks!

A flight engineer's station - wow, that's a blast from the past! Actually, I'm old enough to remember seeing the black-and-white photo of Boeing's new creation in the newspaper. I also had a Revell kit of the Boeing SST, complete with Pan American markings....
The aeroplane has unveiled for us the true face of the earth. -Antoine de Saint-Exupery
 
IMissPiedmont
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 11:22 am

I'm glad to see a remnant still exists. I saw it many years ago in the museum, now defunct, in Kissimmee Florida.
The day you stop learning is the day you should die.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 1:59 pm

It was briefly called the Boeing 2707.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Mik
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 4:31 pm

Does anyone know if there are pictures of the fuselage out there in the net?

And thanks to all those good infos.

Peace

Mik  Wow!
 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 4:52 pm

Here is a shot of the full mock-up




 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 8:22 pm

great photos
 
Mik
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Thu Mar 07, 2002 11:41 pm

sorry folks I meant pictures of the remaining mock-up from today!

Anyones knows more...or a web site where i can find those?

thanks

Peace

Mik

 Wow!
 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 4:02 am

I remember seeing photos of the mock-up sitting in an overgrown field in Florida years ago. It was a mess. This was before the Hiller brought the nose section to the museum. I am not sure but I think the musuem only acquired the nose section.

 
SuperG
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 5:36 am

The Boeing 2707-300 metal mockup was in a scrapyard near the Kennedy Space Center in Florida. I happened upon it in while visiting there in October, 1998. It was in several large pieces, but was easily identifiable. I don't know if it's still there.
 
Mik
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 6:26 pm

Thanks to all...

Peace

Mik  Wow!
 
cedarjet
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 6:57 pm

The Delta picture is not the same SST design, it looks more like a McDonnell DOuglas proposal. It doesn't have the sexy swing wing design (which was one of the main things that killed the programme, so much $$$). Anyone got any more artists impressions in airline livery? Love to see Pan Am, United, maybe a bit of JAL or Qantas action?
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 7:11 pm

The Boeing 2707-100 was the first design and it had the "swing-wing":



That design was replaced by the 2707-300 which did not have the swing-wing:


 
Guest

RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 7:18 pm

And for seeing SST's in other airlines colors check out this site with Concorde orders:
http://www.concordesst.com/history/orders.html
 
Mik
Topic Author
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 7:23 pm

...found another interesting site with Boeings SST Mock-up Details


http://users.chariot.net.au/~theburfs/URsst.html

Peace

Mik  Wow!
 
SuperG
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Fri Mar 08, 2002 11:30 pm

Flygga,
The first photo is actually the 2707-200. You can tell by the canards on the forward fuselage.
 
4holer
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Sat Mar 09, 2002 12:54 am

Great links!
If Lockheed had gotten the contract to begin with, would their version ever have been placed into production?

Hmmmm.
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
UALPHLCS
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Sat Mar 09, 2002 1:28 am

UAL had a large wooden model of the Boeing SST in UA Livery located in the lobby of EXO back in the 70's when my father worked there. Does anyone know what happen to it? UA must still have it, is it at DENTK now?
A little less Hooah, and a little more Dooah.
 
GDB
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4holer

Sat Mar 09, 2002 9:00 pm

Many were surprised when Boeing got the SST contract in 1966, Lockheed's experience with high-speed flight had made them the front-runner in many people's opinion, and their delta L2000 design looked less risky, even allowing for the Mach 2.7 speed.
They were proved right, the VG 2707 proved an impractical design, the weight of the huge swing-wing mechanism was excessive, and early tests with models indicated the wings would need strengthening.
The second 2707 VG design moved the huge GE4 turbojets to the massive horizontal stabiliser, a bitter Lockheed engineer commented 'I guess they had to put 'em there to prevent them from burning the tail off!'
With the swing wings, the complex triple slotted trailing-edge flaps, leading edge flaps, all the other flight controls plus the complex droop nose, the 2707 had 59 moving surfaces, concerning to some potential pilots.
In 1969, Boeing changed the 2707 design to the -300 tailed delta.
Much more conventional, but the Mach 2.7 speed required extensive use of titainium, and those GE4's, each with some 60,000lbs of reheated thrust, would have been much noisier then even Concorde's engines.
As we all know, aircraft noise and pollution had become serious issues by 1970, the 2707 had enemies, though some were more concerned with 90% of the 2707 development coming from tax $.
Must have been quite a sight to see right-wing republicans allied with enviromentalists!
Finally, in March 1971, Congress voted by a majority of one to stop funding 2707 development, the wrong-headed initial designs had lost too much time and money.
Lockheed's design probably would have flown, though whether it would ever had entered service is another matter, the Boeing SST, though much bigger than Concorde, (230 pax), had about the same range.
I think the L2000 would have been similar.
Apart from the remains discussed previously, there was a legacy from the 2707 programme still with us, late in the project, Boeing were looking at cathode-ray tube displays for the 2707, though a flight engineer would still be required, along with plenty of conventional instuments for the Capt. and F/O.
 
4holer
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Sun Mar 10, 2002 1:22 pm

GDB,
Thanks so much for the info!!! I do wonder if the funding was cut off when the Boeing design became more impractical and expensive. Had the more realistic Lockheed design gotten that last vote to OK the funding, I wonder if the environmentalist complaints would have mattered. We'll never know.
BTW, I remember having a toy Boeing SST when I was a kid. It was steel and had the variable geometry wings. I'd love to have that today!

jim
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
Mik
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Mon Mar 11, 2002 10:19 pm

Thanks for all that feedback...

I wonder why Lockeed and Boeing made the plane so "big" for more then 200 pax.
Why they didnt try to design a Concorde-like plane. Perhaps then they hadnt spend
so much money!

Peace

Mik

 Wow!
 
GDB
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Tue Mar 12, 2002 2:13 am

The FAA directed the SST programme in the US, following a Presidential order from JFK, after the Concorde programme was launched. Kennedy feared that in 10 years his successors would be flying around in 707's, while his foreign counterparts would be on Concordes. Intelligence on the Soviet TU-144, launched a few months after Concorde would have strenghened this position.
This was after the US had failed to persuade the UK to pull-out of the Concorde project, offering scraps from a US SST's contracts.
The FAA directed US Aerospace companies to build a SST bigger and faster than Concorde.
I don't know if that was parroting JFK, or their own thinking.
Soon 3 main bidders emerged, North American, Lockheed and Boeing.
NAA had based their SST on the XB-70 Valkerie bomber.
And then there were two.
Then Boeing won, Lockheed got the CX USAF transport, which became the C5 Galaxy. Boeing had been tipped to get the CX contract, so what happened was a reversal of expectations.
Ironically Boeing used their CX knowlegde on the 747, the aircraft which did a lot to kill the SST's mass sales prospects.
Funny old world isn't it?
 
Mik
Topic Author
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RE: Boeing SST Mock-Up

Tue Mar 12, 2002 4:38 pm

GDB

u are right!!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Peace

Mik  Wow!