RainerBoeing777
Topic Author
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:43 pm

Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:20 am

With five weekly frequencies with Airbus A330-200! excellent addition to its network of routes, with the arrival of the Dreamliners I see a potential in Los Angeles, Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires, Kuala Lumpur, Hong Kong, Johannesburg, without a doubt Air Italy comes with everything, I hope that in the future they will add Boeing 777-300ER to your fleet

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/279082/air-italy-adds-milan-delhi-link-from-oct-2018/
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
FatCat
Posts: 284
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:56 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
With five weekly frequencies with Airbus A330-200! excellent addition to its network of routes, with the arrival of the Dreamliners I see a potential in Los Angeles, Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires, Kuala Lumpur, Hong Kong, Johannesburg, without a doubt Air Italy comes with everything, I hope that in the future they will add Boeing 777-300ER to your fleet

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/279082/air-italy-adds-milan-delhi-link-from-oct-2018/

Nice!
Same route AI flies with B788.

No I don't see any 77W in IG fleet anytime soon.
I think 789 are too big, A332 and maybe A333 in two classes (or full economy) can be the right size.
May my post not hurt your feelings
 
Waterbomber
Posts: 585
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:38 am

Pointless. Why not go all the way to Tokyo?
I don't see how they can make money on this route. It's starting to look a lot like DY and their pointless CDG-DEN -like routes...

Plus this route competes against parent QR...
 
chonetsao
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:19 am

Waterbomber wrote:
Pointless. Why not go all the way to Tokyo?
I don't see how they can make money on this route. It's starting to look a lot like DY and their pointless CDG-DEN -like routes...

Plus this route competes against parent QR...


Maybe QR knows what the pax loading/demand is on this route and believe it is a safe bet, plus it can be used as a by pass of the QATAR-INDIA bilaterial restrictions so that QR can free up more traffic from other parts of Europe to India.
 
senatorflyer
Posts: 130
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:46 am

Waterbomber wrote:
Pointless. Why not go all the way to Tokyo?
I don't see how they can make money on this route. It's starting to look a lot like DY and their pointless CDG-DEN -like routes...

Plus this route competes against parent QR...


Is it pointless? Milan is big in fashion, India has lots of factories. Just a thought.
 
smi0006
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:02 pm

Exciting!! So excited to see IG grow, where is next? Hope we see some more expansion into Asia! NRT, SIN, HKG- capture some of the higher yield traffic ex-EU!

Shame to read they had their first strike recently, I thought being smaller and younger than AZ with lots of growth ahead those unions would have been a bit less militant!
 
Waterbomber
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:23 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Waterbomber wrote:
Pointless. Why not go all the way to Tokyo?
I don't see how they can make money on this route. It's starting to look a lot like DY and their pointless CDG-DEN -like routes...

Plus this route competes against parent QR...


Is it pointless? Milan is big in fashion, India has lots of factories. Just a thought.


Italian fashion is all about (hand)Made in Italy.
A Ferrari is not a Ferrari unless it's made in Modena.


IG always had strikes and tough unions.
They have been in restructuring for the past 15 years... Just google Meridiana cassa integrazione, you'll get the picture.

MXP-NRT or HND would work.
AZ has operated this route successfully as point to point with little feed at both ends.
IG could make it work with a little feed.

HKG and SIN also have potential.
DEL? No.
 
AZa346
Posts: 92
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:24 pm

Also, I hope they expand in North America: SFO, ORD, LAX(Although Norwegian is starting it next year), MEX,YYZ,BOS,SEA,DFW/PHL(especially if they join OW/codeshare with AA)... I mean they have 30 Dreamilners coming.. they better find somewhere to send them!
 
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Slash787
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:26 pm

Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.
 
Waterbomber
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:31 pm

Slash787 wrote:
Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.


IG have never been strong with connections.
To run a network, you need a reliable operation. IG didn't and probably still doesnt have that.

With all the options that you have for the route, why would you fly IG anyway? It's very unlikely that IG will be the highest value for money proposition.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:43 pm

Slash787 wrote:
Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.

Oh wow bless their heart. That's gonna be a long winter.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
AZa346
Posts: 92
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:54 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Oh wow bless their heart. That's gonna be a long winter.


What do you mean?
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:24 pm

For IG, the plan has been A332s until QR has more 789s in the fleet, then 788s will move over to Air Italy. IG seems to be an airline that could be positioned for oneworld down the line. That said, AZ is likely going to find out that yes, MXP can work as the major hub. I have to wonder if the next route will be MXP-DXB, which would really drive the GCC batty. Maybe with a 788, China could become realistic.
 
FatCat
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:26 pm

Waterbomber wrote:
Italian fashion is all about (hand)Made in Italy.
A Ferrari is not a Ferrari unless it's made in Modena.


OFF TOPIC

You know that 99% of the high fashion dresses and accessories with italian high fashion brands are made in China, Bangladesh, Vietnam and India right?
Example: Prada buys the shoes (sole, upper, already assembled) from a third party subcontractor in China for about € 5,- a piece.
Then they put the insole inside, on the insole is printed "Made in Italy". It is made in Italy indeed, the insole.
That's the same for every other high fashion maker...
May my post not hurt your feelings
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 339
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:29 pm

With these new flights between BOM/DEL and the EU (even AI has increased frequencies to places like VIE), has demand finally caught up to supply? Meaning the ME3 has been capped for a few years now. So maybe BOM/DEL demand finally needs the capacity. Plus I think BOM/DEL/BLR pax really want nonstop flights. MXP/FCO were holes. I had thought 9W should launch FCO-BOM, but now I think BOM-MAD is probably better. I would guess by winter Air Italy will offer US-MXP-BOM/DEL connections. I still think one of the main draws for EU airlines to India is helping to fill their EU-US flights in winter.
 
SCQ83
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:43 pm

It seems to me that there are more and more Indian tourists in Europe. It looks like the Indians are the new Chinese. Maybe those flights are targeting Indian tourists to Italy + future connections to the US for QR?

FatCat wrote:
You know that 99% of the high fashion dresses and accessories with italian high fashion brands are made in China, Bangladesh, Vietnam and India right?
Example: Prada buys the shoes (sole, upper, already assembled) from a third party subcontractor in China for about € 5,- a piece.
Then they put the insole inside, on the insole is printed "Made in Italy". It is made in Italy indeed, the insole.
That's the same for every other high fashion maker...


They also use cheap factories in Romania and Eastern Europe, so it is easier for them to ship back to Italy (because of the EU, shipping costs and % of the product they can do outside Italy to keep the "made in Italy"). And then many of those made in Italy finishes are made by Chinese sweatshops located in Prato (near Florence) or other cities with heavy Chinese presence in Italy. Globalisation at its best.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:56 pm

I too see demand for this route. If anything, India company just gained an advantage selling to Italian fashion houses.


CaliguyNYC wrote:
With these new flights between BOM/DEL and the EU (even AI has increased frequencies to places like VIE), has demand finally caught up to supply? Meaning the ME3 has been capped for a few years now. So maybe BOM/DEL demand finally needs the capacity. Plus I think BOM/DEL/BLR pax really want nonstop flights. MXP/FCO were holes. I had thought 9W should launch FCO-BOM, but now I think BOM-MAD is probably better. I would guess by winter Air Italy will offer US-MXP-BOM/DEL connections. I still think one of the main draws for EU airlines to India is helping to fill their EU-US flights in winter.

I've stated for years the way to defeat the ME3 is to bypass them.

QR will know the demand. If limited bilaterals keep from meeting the demand in DOH... Bypass.

I still do not understand why the GoI doesn't enable better international to international hubbing in India. India could make the ME3 a footnote, combined with the new IST and expanding SAW, within 5 years.

Back fully on topic, but related:. It does look like Air Italy will use USA to MXP connections to make this flight much more profitable.

What is Italy's bilateral rights to India? I would like to know how many weekly unused rights are available for Air Italy. Please note I see this as multi-year growth.

As to supply vs. demand, that is a price curve. I believe fare will be driven to where the low cost airlines make a good profit a no one else.

Lightsaber
You only have the first amendment with the 2nd. If you're not going to offend someone with what you say, you don't have the 1st.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:26 pm

AZa346 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Oh wow bless their heart. That's gonna be a long winter.


What do you mean?

Winter is low season for MXPNYC, but high season for India-NYC...but that doesn't really matter if the two don't connect!
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:34 pm

Slash787 wrote:
Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.


If it is a vacation trip, why not self-connect to Emirates. MXP-JFK $399 is very common and at times EK offers companion free deals.
 
FatCat
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:48 pm

SCQ83 wrote:
located in Prato

That's where also I am located 8-) ;)
May my post not hurt your feelings
 
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Slash787
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:14 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Slash787 wrote:
Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.


If it is a vacation trip, why not self-connect to Emirates. MXP-JFK $399 is very common and at times EK offers companion free deals.


My main aim is for cheap tickets as I am a budget traveller, so I don't really care if its via Dubai or Milan, If Air Italy offers me $50 cheaper ticket to New York from Bombay via Milan than EK via Dubai then I would go with Air Italy and well this goes for any airline.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:19 pm

Slash787 wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
Slash787 wrote:
Why are they not offering onward flights? for example I want to book Bombay to New York via Milan through Air Italy, there is no option for that on their site. The only destination showing from Bombay is Milan.


If it is a vacation trip, why not self-connect to Emirates. MXP-JFK $399 is very common and at times EK offers companion free deals.


My main aim is for cheap tickets as I am a budget traveller, so I don't really care if its via Dubai or Milan, If Air Italy offers me $50 cheaper ticket to New York from Bombay via Milan than EK via Dubai then I would go with Air Italy and well this goes for any airline.


Not thru Dubai. EK's MXP-JFK fifth freedom flight.
 
sabby
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:32 pm

SCQ83 wrote:
It seems to me that there are more and more Indian tourists in Europe. It looks like the Indians are the new Chinese. Maybe those flights are targeting Indian tourists to Italy + future connections to the US for QR?


You are right. I am actually surprised that LH and AF are the two mainland European carrier to have a non-stop to BLR of a total 2 daily. The city is thriving with young people with significant disposable income compared to the rest of the country and I see a lot of young Indian travelling to Europe these days, especially Switzerland, France and Italy. I think a daily LX non-stop would be a massive success between Spring and Fall. I hear that apparently there's a growing student traffic as well to Germany, Sweden etc.
 
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Slash787
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:47 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Not thru Dubai. EK's MXP-JFK fifth freedom flight.


Yes I know what you are talking about, but the whole thing needs to be calculated.
 
binayak
Posts: 249
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:00 pm

Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:14 pm

Well I think these routes might work with strong O&D and little bit connections. India-MXP isn't a new market.
AZ served MXP BOM during early 2000s.
9W had targeted DEL MXP and even wanted to have a fifth freedom DEL-MXP-LAX.(Don't know how it would've worked).
QR's Indian partner is Go Air (G8) which is a simple low cost airline( with budget J too). So I think Air Italy might use that airline for connections at India end. Finally this is a wonderful opportunity to bring back our lost traffic to the ME3.
9W must be declared as India's national airline. They will indirectly fulfill JRD's vision!!
 
senatorflyer
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:57 am

Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:11 pm

FatCat wrote:
Waterbomber wrote:
Italian fashion is all about (hand)Made in Italy.
A Ferrari is not a Ferrari unless it's made in Modena.


OFF TOPIC

You know that 99% of the high fashion dresses and accessories with italian high fashion brands are made in China, Bangladesh, Vietnam and India right?
Example: Prada buys the shoes (sole, upper, already assembled) from a third party subcontractor in China for about € 5,- a piece.
Then they put the insole inside, on the insole is printed "Made in Italy". It is made in Italy indeed, the insole.
That's the same for every other high fashion maker...


That’s exactly how it’s done. Plus you only have to have a certain % of a product produced in one country to be able the stick ‘Made in Italy’ on it. The percentage is not even that high.
 
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FCOTSTW
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:16 pm

Waterbomber wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:
Waterbomber wrote:
A Ferrari is not a Ferrari unless it's made in Modena.


If you really want to be sharp, no one in Modena makes any Ferrari.
They are all being made in Maranello, a separate municipality.
 
senatorflyer
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:57 am

Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:17 pm

FCOTSTW wrote:
Waterbomber wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:


If you really want to be sharp, no one in Modena makes any Ferrari.
They are all being made in Maranello, a separate municipality.


Exactly. Apart from that there are plenty of non Italian parts in a Ferrari. Let alone the Fiat bits and pieces.
 
babastud
Posts: 165
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:27 pm

Let's see an SFO route begin, it would do well!
 
Vimanav
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Re: Air Italy launches Delhi

Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:56 pm

lightsaber wrote:
What is Italy's bilateral rights to India? I would like to know how many weekly unused rights are available for Air Italy. Please note I see this as multi-year growth.


Indian Civil Aviation policy permits countries that are 5000kms or beyond from DEL 'Open Sky'. So Air Italy should not find bilaterals a problem.

brgds//Vimanav
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