chrismcqueen
Topic Author
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Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:51 am

I’m interested in pursuing a career as a pilot and saw that Envoy has a great student cadet program that I’d be interested in pursuing through one of the partnered flight schools. But before I move forward I wanted to find out if my record would prohibit me from becoming an airline pilot. My record consists of a speeding ticket from 2010, a speed contest/unsafe speed charges from 2012 (both of the 2012 charges were given on the same incident), and a misdemeanor charge from 2013 that included a charge for prowling and resisting arrest but I was only charged for prowling and the resisting arrest charge was dismissed.
All charges were received when I was at the age of 20 or below. Since my last charge in 2013 five years have passed and I have had a no additional criminal or driving charges against me.

Do I stand a chance?
 
WF2BNN
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:33 am

Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:15 am

No issue whatsoever. Be honest about what happened and what you learned - and don't let it happen again (at least not until you have your dream job)

Now, be sure you know what this job is. It's not glamorous. It's a lot of time alone, constantly new challenges and changes. That's what makes me love this lifestyle, but others hate it.

Of you put your mind to it and never give up it will happen!
What goes up, must come down.
 
Max Q
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 8:56 am

The speeding tickets don’t matter


Understand your resisting arrest charge was dismissed but what happened with
the ‘prowling’ charge ?


Were you adjudicated in that case, in other words what was the outcome?


Prowling looks like a pretty vague term
used to excuse police harassment but if
it wasn’t dismissed and is on your record (was there a penalty?) there could be an issue



Were you charged as a minor ? Is the record sealed ?

These details are important, you should look into an expungement and if it can be applied
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
77H
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:11 am

Max Q wrote:
The speeding tickets don’t matter


Understand your resisting arrest charge was dismissed but what happened with
the ‘prowling’ charge ?


Were you adjudicated in that case, in other words what was the outcome?


Prowling looks like a pretty vague term
used to excuse police harassment but if
it wasn’t dismissed and is on your record (was there a penalty?) there could be an issue



Were you charged as a minor ? Is the record sealed ?

These details are important, you should look into an expungement and if it can be applied


Expungement are pretty hard to come by. I agree with the first poster that the OP should be fine so long as they are open and honest about it and are prepared to explain the details and how they’ve grown from it.

I imagine the ever growing pilot shortage is causing airlines to look the other way on things they may not have a decade ago, within reason. People make mistakes, learning from them and not repeating them is the important thing.

77H
 
BravoOne
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:03 pm

Suggest you ask this same question over on a website that routinely has hiring information posted, Maybe Arline Pilot Central would be a good place to start. Under the current hiring practices I think you would have difficulty getting hired but I have seen stranger things happen.
 
Max Q
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Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 12:40 pm

Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:43 pm

77H wrote:
Max Q wrote:
The speeding tickets don’t matter


Understand your resisting arrest charge was dismissed but what happened with
the ‘prowling’ charge ?


Were you adjudicated in that case, in other words what was the outcome?


Prowling looks like a pretty vague term
used to excuse police harassment but if
it wasn’t dismissed and is on your record (was there a penalty?) there could be an issue



Were you charged as a minor ? Is the record sealed ?

These details are important, you should look into an expungement and if it can be applied


Expungement are pretty hard to come by. I agree with the first poster that the OP should be fine so long as they are open and honest about it and are prepared to explain the details and how they’ve grown from it.

I imagine the ever growing pilot shortage is causing airlines to look the other way on things they may not have a decade ago, within reason. People make mistakes, learning from them and not repeating them is the important thing.

77H



An expungement can be applied if the specific charge was dismissed / not processed/ thrown out for any reason


Otherwise the only recourse available to clear ones record is a pardon



If the poster does have a record, misdemeanor or not it could be an issue


You can’t dismiss it as being so minor it can be explained away without further research
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
johns624
Posts: 1714
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:09 pm

Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:54 pm

Max Q wrote:
[

An expungement can be applied if the specific charge was dismissed / not processed/ thrown out for any reason


Otherwise the only recourse available to clear ones record is a pardon

Incorrect. If he was never convicted of a charge, there is no record so no expungement is necessary. An expungement allows a judge to seal records so they are treated as never having occurred. It is only normally allowed where there is only one offense and there has been quite a time gap to the present time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expungement
 
BravoOne
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:14 pm

You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior. There are thousands of applicants with no previous behavioral problems along with excellent flight experience why should and employer not descriminate accordingly?
 
Woodreau
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:54 pm

I think he could easily gain employment with any regional airline. (One regional airline just cold calls people in the FAA database and offers the person who answers a class date just for answering their phone.) But at the present time I think any major/LCP carrier still have plenty enough applicants that don’t have issues like the OPs. The only way to know is to cast your lots and apply and see where the chips fall.
Bonus animus sit, ab experientia. Quod salvatum fuerit de malis usu venit judicium.
 
Max Q
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:58 am

johns624 wrote:
Max Q wrote:
[

An expungement can be applied if the specific charge was dismissed / not processed/ thrown out for any reason


Otherwise the only recourse available to clear ones record is a pardon

Incorrect. If he was never convicted of a charge, there is no record so no expungement is necessary. An expungement allows a judge to seal records so they are treated as never having occurred. It is only normally allowed where there is only one offense and there has been quite a time gap to the present time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expungement



There is always a record of the arrest, whether or not there was a conviction, expungement does not occur automatically
even if the case is dismissed


The poster has not clarified whether there was a conviction, if it was sealed due to age there shouldn’t be an issue but if there
was a conviction there may well be


Arrests can be expunged if found not guilty or the case was dismissed but they don’t just go off your record unless you have them expunged


An arrest or conviction may well be a problem
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
User avatar
zeke
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:26 am

Having s record can have problems getting a passport of being admitted into foreign countries.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
BravoOne
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:11 pm

zeke wrote:
Having s record can have problems getting a passport of being admitted into foreign countries.


Very true. A DUI conviction will stop you cold at the Canadian border.
 
Woodreau
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:16 pm

I was thinking about Canada as well. I remember for a time if you couldn't get into Canada (inadmissible) you couldn't get hired as a regional airline pilot. I imagine the policy is still in place for Canada.

Even though the minimum time has past since the conviction for the offense, you actually have to apply for rehabilitation before Canada will let you in even as a crewmember (you'd be watching your crew go off to the hotel and you would be placed on the next flight to the US)
Bonus animus sit, ab experientia. Quod salvatum fuerit de malis usu venit judicium.
 
User avatar
gunsontheroof
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 16, 2018 6:45 am

BravoOne wrote:
You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior. There are thousands of applicants with no previous behavioral problems along with excellent flight experience why should and employer not descriminate accordingly?


If the OP keeps their nose clean and also has excellent flight experience, why would they discriminate? Let's not forget that not having a record doesn't exactly guarantee flawless character--it just means you never got caught. IMHO, just getting to the point where an airline would bring you in for a pilot interview would be a pretty strong indicator of the OP having their act together.
Picked a hell of a week to quit sniffing glue.
 
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fr8mech
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 16, 2018 7:40 am

What country? State?

"Prowling" probably refers to "loitering with intent". As far as I know, that tends to be a misdemeanor.

I don't see any felonies. So, I don't thinks there's any automatic disqualification.

Really, I think it would come down to education, skill, experience, and the available applicant pool...and a little luck.

BravoOne wrote:
You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior.


I suspect quite a few folks flying for the majors, and the minors, and applying for those jobs, have had minor skirmishes with the law when they were younger. The only difference is, the op allowed himself to get caught. Maybe that should be dis-qualifier enough.
When seconds count...the authorities are minutes away.
Unless it's expressly prohibited, it's allowed.
 
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longhauler
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:40 pm

I am amazed at the people that are quick to judge this gentleman's character, when all he was asking was information/facts about working for an airline. We all have a past, some were caught, some weren't. I am grateful my past was before the days of social media and video phones!

But factually, the only issue is if one can attain the necessary documention to simply do the job. Namely airport security passes, passports and visas. If you look at job requirements posted by most airlines, you will see that mentioned. Also, some mention the ability to freely leave and re-enter the country.

Checking these issues would be best solved before flying in earnest.

That being said though, we do have "special cases" where the airline will do their best to accomodate. Things like Americans flying to Cuba, certain annomalies with regard to Arabian/Isreali travel, or simply those who are undergoing some legal issues where it is best to stay in the country until solved.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
PITingres
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 16, 2018 11:04 pm

BravoOne wrote:
You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior.


Not holding youthful offenses against someone *for life* hardly qualifies as supporting bad behavior. That's why we don't simply execute teens and young adults who screw up - as long as the offenses were reasonably minor, and the perpetrator learned to behave like a responsible grown-up, there's no reason to not let him get on with life.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
Max Q
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 16, 2018 11:11 pm

longhauler wrote:
I am amazed at the people that are quick to judge this gentleman's character, when all he was asking was information/facts about working for an airline. We all have a past, some were caught, some weren't. I am grateful my past was before the days of social media and video phones!

But factually, the only issue is if one can attain the necessary documention to simply do the job. Namely airport security passes, passports and visas. If you look at job requirements posted by most airlines, you will see that mentioned. Also, some mention the ability to freely leave and re-enter the country.

Checking these issues would be best solved before flying in earnest.

That being said though, we do have "special cases" where the airline will do their best to accomodate. Things like Americans flying to Cuba, certain annomalies with regard to Arabian/Isreali travel, or simply those who are undergoing some legal issues where it is best to stay in the country until solved.




No judgment here


The poster wanted to know if having a ‘record’ would be an issue in getting hired
by a major airline


Some of the responses, while encouraging
May well be misleading, that doesn’t help


Even if you are not convicted of a crime, an arrest record remains, in that case however it can certainly be expunged


But it doesn’t happen automatically, the individual in question has to apply for the program and pay the cost of an attorney to file the forms and go through the process


It’s very unfair that a record of an arrest remains even if you’re not convicted but that’s the way it is


The poster also didn’t clarify as to whether there even was a conviction so there’s important information missing there


If an expungement is available I couldn’t recommend it enough, if there’s a conviction the poster should seek further advice,(anonymously if possible) it may or may not be an issue, vital to check out before committing your life and piles of cash to this career though
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
geologyrocks
Posts: 112
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:50 pm

I'm going to start by saying I am not a pilot or a recruiter.

With that being said, the first response to being open and honest is good advice. I don't know what kind of background investigation you go through but I will say, from the the ATC side, that during your security clearance -- it doesn't matter if anything has been sealed or expunged. You have to report it and you would have to report your arrest even for the charge that was dismissed. They're going to find out about it, one way or another, so you should just come clean because it will obviously go much better for you than if they find out on their own.

I suggest you ignore any advice on here, though -- mine included, except for this main part: whatever you do, go get advice from someone who you know will have credibility. Ask the flight school you want to go to...surely, they at the very least, know a lot of recruiters that could give you more solid advice. Keep in mind, your thing was already 5 years ago. You're what...at least 3 years before you become an actual candidate, so 8 years total for a misdemeanor?

Again, get some insight from people you can verify that they actually know what they are talking about. Good luck!
 
BravoOne
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:01 pm

I'll say it agin, check out Airline Pilot Central as this exact question been posted many times and you see the answers from those who have gone before you.
 
johns624
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:52 pm

Arrests don't mean anything. It's just convictions. Expungements are for convictions.
 
DigitalSea
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:57 pm

BravoOne wrote:
You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior. There are thousands of applicants with no previous behavioral problems along with excellent flight experience why should and employer not descriminate accordingly?


Poor form!
 
BravoOne
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Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:27 pm

Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 22, 2018 12:10 am

DigitalSea wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
You gotta love all the posts supporting this guys bad admitted bad behavior. There are thousands of applicants with no previous behavioral problems along with excellent flight experience why should and employer not descriminate accordingly?


Poor form!


Says who? To many outstanding people looking for air;ine pilot jobs without making special exemptions for those unable control their juvenile behavior.
You strike me as the type that give out awards for just showing up.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:57 am

I don't work in the industry, but if the OP's post is truthful and that's the extent, it depends on what prowling would be considered.
 
buzzard302
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Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 12:06 pm

Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:00 am

Every person I knew in college participated in some partying or activity that technically could have led to an arrest. Obviously most people are not doing anything too extreme to result in a criminal record, but occasionally someone finds themselves in hot water. The late teens and early 20's are a time period many people make small mistakes. I am nowhere near the same person in my 40's compared to what I was at 20. Different maturity, a family, and greater understanding of life and consequences. There will be someone willing to hire you with a blip on your background. You need to be honest during an interview and set personal expectations that some may decide to deny employment regardless.
 
Max Q
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:11 am

johns624 wrote:
Arrests don't mean anything. It's just convictions. Expungements are for convictions.



Arrests can be an issue with some employers


If you’re not convicted though arrests can
definitely be expunged as can SOME convictions
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
geologyrocks
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Re: Becoming An Airline pilot With A Record

Sat Jun 23, 2018 7:10 pm

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