edealinfo
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:55 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Seriously Jet/EY already went down the path of connecting many points in India to AUH to then send them on to the world. It FAILED. Btw what about the routing JFK-BOM-India is not a one stop connection for tier 2/3 cities? EY screwed up big time with Jet.


I desperately wanted to use Etihad-Jet connection to go from major US city to 2nd tier India city via AUH but found the cost materially higher compared to other options. The promise of connecting Tier 2 cities to the AUH hub won't work if they are SEEKING A PREMIUM for directly connecting "2nd tier Indian cityies" to the World via AUH.
 
vadodara
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:43 am

CaliguyNYC wrote:
. Btw what about the routing JFK-BOM-India is not a one stop connection for tier 2/3 cities? EY screwed up big time with Jet. They should have financed Jet to further grow their BOM hub when slots were available. d sake).


I thought the BOM hub idea failed; hence 9W running out of cash.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:03 am

edealinfo wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Seriously Jet/EY already went down the path of connecting many points in India to AUH to then send them on to the world. It FAILED. Btw what about the routing JFK-BOM-India is not a one stop connection for tier 2/3 cities? EY screwed up big time with Jet.


I desperately wanted to use Etihad-Jet connection to go from major US city to 2nd tier India city via AUH but found the cost materially higher compared to other options. The promise of connecting Tier 2 cities to the AUH hub won't work if they are SEEKING A PREMIUM for directly connecting "2nd tier Indian cityies" to the World via AUH.

Err.. that premium is just seeking a profit. If there are cheaper ways, consider them

Lightsaber
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alfa164
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:17 am

avier wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
If this is true, amazing. Yesterday the sky was falling, today they are flying. Jeez look at the damage all these "news" reports are doing to Jet.

And some a.net users on here using such hoax news to malign the airline even more. All those aircrafts had no common link to GECAS too. And the "lovely" reporting by the Indian press as usual.


If you didn't know better, you might think much of this thread was perpetrated by Jet's competitors. But we all know that wouldn't happen... don't we?

;)

9w748capt wrote:
Fascinating thread - especially the last few pages. What a fall for 9W - I remember flying through BRU on one of my India trips and being wowed by how good they were even in steerage. Given EY's own difficulties I'm really surprised they're stepping up with the cash. Do they really think 9W can return to profitability or is it just a backhanded way to maintain access to India?


They are still good; I fly the whenever I am in India, and I am always impressed with their superior service compared to their lesser rivals. They face a typical India problem: rumors play heavily in everything, and people respond to rumors in unreasonable ways. So some people use those rumors to try to create worries and undermine their competitors. Sadly, belief in rumors seems to stop critical thinking among too many people... and there will always be others who take advantage of that.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/mobs ... h-whatsapp
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/0 ... d-rumours/
.

unrave wrote:
Cheerleaders of Jet were claiming the airline was in the pink of health until very recently.


And vultures were saying the airline had no chance to survive. Guess who was the better prognosticator?
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vadodara
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:00 pm

alfa164 wrote:
unrave wrote:
Cheerleaders of Jet were claiming the airline was in the pink of health until very recently.


And vultures were saying the airline had no chance to survive. Guess who was the better prognosticator?


Umm, it may be Jet Airways only in name. It seems that the 20% share stake NG was given by the banks was pretty generous.

It may have more to do with avoiding any potential political fall-out in an election year.
 
edealinfo
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:21 pm

lightsaber wrote:
edealinfo wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

Err.. that premium is just seeking a profit. If there are cheaper ways, consider them

Lightsaber


Well, maybe that's why they aren't filling the plane? I was looking for a fare, 8 months in advance of travel, and while all other options had materially low prices at that point in time. It was like I was being penalized by Jet for having the convenience of flying to a 2nd tier Indian city via their AUB hub. But then, maybe it was Etihad's component of the fare, and not Jet, that caused the US-AUH-India 2nd tier city, to be so expensive
 
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:33 pm

vadodara wrote:
alfa164 wrote:
unrave wrote:
Cheerleaders of Jet were claiming the airline was in the pink of health until very recently.


And vultures were saying the airline had no chance to survive. Guess who was the better prognosticator?


Umm, it may be Jet Airways only in name. It seems that the 20% share stake NG was given by the banks was pretty generous.

It may have more to do with avoiding any potential political fall-out in an election year.


Whatever said or done, the brand will survive. The predictions of Indian media have been proved wrong. All those who wanted to feed on their carcass will be disappointed.
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
Antarius
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:42 pm

binayak wrote:
vadodara wrote:
alfa164 wrote:

And vultures were saying the airline had no chance to survive. Guess who was the better prognosticator?


Umm, it may be Jet Airways only in name. It seems that the 20% share stake NG was given by the banks was pretty generous.

It may have more to do with avoiding any potential political fall-out in an election year.


Whatever said or done, the brand will survive. The predictions of Indian media have been proved wrong. All those who wanted to feed on their carcass will be disappointed.


The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned. 9W managing to come out of this on it's own was never a viable option, despite the litany of armchair experts saying so.

For all intensive purposes, 9W as we know it is over.
2018: AUA CLT IAH HOU DFW COS DEN CLL ORD PEK PVG PHX SFO SJC OAK PHL YYC STL DTW HNL OGG JFK LGA EWR GIG GRU IGU CWB SDU MDW BOS IAD DCA PBI FLL MIA
 
avier
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:56 pm

Antarius wrote:

The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned. 9W managing to come out of this on it's own was never a viable option, despite the litany of armchair experts saying so.

For all intensive purposes, 9W as we know it is over.


???
Change of ownership structure means the airline (as we knew it) is "over" (???). Going by that logic , SpiceJet as we knew it was "over" how many times? 10?
 
Antarius
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:01 pm

avier wrote:
Antarius wrote:

The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned. 9W managing to come out of this on it's own was never a viable option, despite the litany of armchair experts saying so.

For all intensive purposes, 9W as we know it is over.


???
Change of ownership structure means the airline (as we knew it) is "over" (???). Going by that logic , SpiceJet as we knew it was "over" how many times? 10?


Umm, yes. Its like American airlines. Same name, completely different company with different focuses, different priorities etc.

And yes, Spice is a different company. The old one was a mess, which is what prompted the need for an ownership change.

NG's Jet is done. It's not like the existing Jet somehow turned itself around.
Last edited by Antarius on Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2018: AUA CLT IAH HOU DFW COS DEN CLL ORD PEK PVG PHX SFO SJC OAK PHL YYC STL DTW HNL OGG JFK LGA EWR GIG GRU IGU CWB SDU MDW BOS IAD DCA PBI FLL MIA
 
binayak
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:01 pm

Antarius wrote:

The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned.

What half of the thread was trying to claim was that the name "jet airways" won't remain and all its assets be either repossessed( planes) or taken over by other airlines (slots) . There's a difference b/w that kind of taking over and the one which is happening .
They're not having a KFA like crash landing as against the theme of this thread .
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avier
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:07 pm

Antarius wrote:
avier wrote:
Antarius wrote:

The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned. 9W managing to come out of this on it's own was never a viable option, despite the litany of armchair experts saying so.

For all intensive purposes, 9W as we know it is over.


???
Change of ownership structure means the airline (as we knew it) is "over" (???). Going by that logic , SpiceJet as we knew it was "over" how many times? 10?


Umm, yes. Its like American airlines. Same name, completely different company with different focuses, different priorities etc.

And yes, Spice is a different company. The old one was a mess, which is what prompted the need for an ownership change.


That's the way you might look at it. The general public still looks at the brand they knew and associate with that, unless some major brand overhaul with a new image/name takes place. Old or new as per your logic , SpiceJet has remained same for the customers as an airline and 9W will too. Tweaking service levels to match changing market dynamics like BoB does not mean the airline died and took rebirth in a new avatar.

And going by that logic, all major airlines around the world have then been "over" and died a thousand times over.
 
Antarius
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:12 pm

binayak wrote:
Antarius wrote:

The brand survived but the entity ostensibly will not. 9W was either going to fail or be taken over, the latter happenned.

What half of the thread was trying to claim was that the name "jet airways" won't remain and all its assets be either repossessed( planes) or taken over by other airlines (slots) . There's a difference b/w that kind of taking over and the one which is happening .
They're not having a KFA like crash landing as against the theme of this thread .


Understand, however, IMO, it's not fair to act like that was not possible at all. Barring EY coming in, 9W would have collapsed. The other half of the thread was acting like 9W wasnt in trouble and it's only the Times group causing issues and everything was fine; this was more off base than a speculation of collapse.

9W staved off collapse thanks to there being an airline that has historically had a lot of money and no common sense. Without them, a crash would be the other option.
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VTORD
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:49 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Seriously Jet/EY already went down the path of connecting many points in India to AUH to then send them on to the world. It FAILED. Btw what about the routing JFK-BOM-India is not a one stop connection for tier 2/3 cities? EY screwed up big time with Jet. They should have financed Jet to further grow their BOM hub when slots were available. Instead the brilliant strategy was to have EY fly BOM-AUH at 4am and Jet fly BOM-AUH at 4:15am. Great for consumers right? Look at DL and AF/KL.


Yeah sure no one is denying that EY screwed up. And they are paying the price for that. As far as the timing is concerned how is that any different from this:
BOM-CDG 9W 2:50 AM; AF 1:45 AM Or
BOM-AMS 9W 2:55 AM; KL 4:05 AM

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Finally, India needs a strong hub. This would bring economic growth and jobs to India.

No one's denying that. Too bad 9W wasn't up to the task. Now they have to pay the price of being beholden to a master who controls the purse strings.


CaliguyNYC wrote:
When you say “fascination” of the nonstop, I say what is the fascination of being connected to AUH of DXB or KWI etc? Plus India is already super well connected to the ME. It is pretty clear to me that pax flying to/from India are also looking for other options. Yes some people like flying the ME3 but there is a huge crowd who likes flight times, pax service, etc tailored for India. Hence why AI does well with heir DEL hub (and that is AI for god sake).

No fascination. Just the way cookie crumbles. Do you realistically think EY is going to invest in 9W and let 9W-DL get all the rewards while they remain a small airline and sit back and reflect on their ROI? They want to get back into their US network and 9W is that ticket. And are you suggesting that EK, QR, EY don't understand pax service tailored to India? If anything it's much more tailored to Indian expectations than most.
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dtw2hyd
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:05 pm

I think EY wanted complete control of 9W is just an Indian media concocted story. This fiasco may have been just an act to force Indian PSBs to eat the crow and normalize the ownership structure.

EY didn't care 9W, SkyTeam relationship. If they did they would have stopped long back. Also, why would EY allow exDelta management in 9W.

The way I see it, 9W-SkyTeam is an eyesore for EK.and 9W holding Mumbai slots is a nightmare for 6E, hence the wishful thinking of 9W shutting down.

Too bad, now this saga is over, go back to shutting down AI theory.
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:19 pm

The saga will be over Jet's employees get paid and Jet's shiny new jets are dusted off from storage
India: World's fastest growing major economy. World's fastest growing aviation market.
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:11 pm

VTORD wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Seriously Jet/EY already went down the path of connecting many points in India to AUH to then send them on to the world. It FAILED. Btw what about the routing JFK-BOM-India is not a one stop connection for tier 2/3 cities? EY screwed up big time with Jet. They should have financed Jet to further grow their BOM hub when slots were available. Instead the brilliant strategy was to have EY fly BOM-AUH at 4am and Jet fly BOM-AUH at 4:15am. Great for consumers right? Look at DL and AF/KL.


Yeah sure no one is denying that EY screwed up. And they are paying the price for that. As far as the timing is concerned how is that any different from this:
BOM-CDG 9W 2:50 AM; AF 1:45 AM Or
BOM-AMS 9W 2:55 AM; KL 4:05 AM

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Finally, India needs a strong hub. This would bring economic growth and jobs to India.

No one's denying that. Too bad 9W wasn't up to the task. Now they have to pay the price of being beholden to a master who controls the purse strings.


CaliguyNYC wrote:
When you say “fascination” of the nonstop, I say what is the fascination of being connected to AUH of DXB or KWI etc? Plus India is already super well connected to the ME. It is pretty clear to me that pax flying to/from India are also looking for other options. Yes some people like flying the ME3 but there is a huge crowd who likes flight times, pax service, etc tailored for India. Hence why AI does well with heir DEL hub (and that is AI for god sake).

No fascination. Just the way cookie crumbles. Do you realistically think EY is going to invest in 9W and let 9W-DL get all the rewards while they remain a small airline and sit back and reflect on their ROI? They want to get back into their US network and 9W is that ticket. And are you suggesting that EK, QR, EY don't understand pax service tailored to India? If anything it's much more tailored to Indian expectations than most.


I think that is the question. What will EY do if they have more control. I don’t think it is as simple as they won’t let 9W grow its relationship with Delta. As people have said, EY could have stopped it before. Also AF/KL already have a partnership with EY so not clear what EYwill do (or how much actual control they will have). Will be interesting to see and debate. That said, I feel like the negativity by some about the proposed DL nonstop to BOM is less driven by their view of EY and more that they just don’t want it. Some people here just feel like India shouldn’t be connected nonstop to the world, but rather just connect through ME or Singapore. As a consumer I am glad these options exist, but I also want the option of paying a bit more and flying nonstop and/or with flight timings that do not involve a 4am departure at BOM. Whatever we all think about AI, they did prove that afternoon departures from the US and connecting in DEL would work with pax.
 
devmapper
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:14 pm

unrave wrote:
The saga will be over Jet's employees get paid and Jet's shiny new jets are dusted off from storage

Until NG screws 9W up again in 5 years?

Not being snarky, genuine question.
 
VTORD
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:19 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:

I don’t think it is as simple as they won’t let 9W grow its relationship with Delta.


CaliguyNYC wrote:
I feel like the negativity by some about the proposed DL nonstop to BOM is less driven by their view of EY and more that they just don’t want it. Some people here just feel like India shouldn’t be connected nonstop to the world, but rather just connect through ME or Singapore. As a consumer I am glad these options exist, but I also want the option of paying a bit more and flying nonstop and/or with flight timings that do not involve a 4am departure at BOM.


Oh I certainly hope EY has more sense than that. And I don't want Delta to not start a non-stop but I sometimes think more importance is given to Delta on these threads than is warranted. I mean announce the route already or just carry on with your business. But no, they'll tease about it and complain about everything from fifth freedom flights to state sponsored subsidies. And yet here we are discussing the same thing every few weeks. By contrast UA announced the route with specifics, we talked about it for a week and now everyone's moved on.
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:05 pm

Jet has terminated their relationship with Amadeus.
https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/ec ... 5.ece/amp/


This is a good cost cutting move. The Indian airlines missed many cost cutting opportunities, this is a sign they aren't anymore.

Lightsaber
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blrsea
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:20 am

lightsaber wrote:
Jet has terminated their relationship with Amadeus.
https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/ec ... 5.ece/amp/


This is a good cost cutting move. The Indian airlines missed many cost cutting opportunities, this is a sign they aren't anymore.

Lightsaber


After AI, 9W is the 2nd FSC in India to cut ties to Amadeus. That leaves Amadeus with pretty little coverage in India now. Indigo is also on Travelport exclusively.
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:19 am

SBI Chairman has just confirmed that the Jet rescue deal is yet to be finalised
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:25 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
I think EY wanted complete control of 9W is just an Indian media concocted story. This fiasco may have been just an act to force Indian PSBs to eat the crow and normalize the ownership structure.

EY didn't care 9W, SkyTeam relationship. If they did they would have stopped long back. Also, why would EY allow exDelta management in 9W.

The way I see it, 9W-SkyTeam is an eyesore for EK.and 9W holding Mumbai slots is a nightmare for 6E, hence the wishful thinking of 9W shutting down.

Too bad, now this saga is over, go back to shutting down AI theory.


In INDIAN corporate law, an entity with only 24% stake cannot do anything significant. Even if EY wanted complete control or if EY was iffy about Jet-ST relationship or uncomfortable with exDL management, they couldn't have done much about it. Things change when the threshold crosses 26%, which EY is near certain to hold post the restructuring.

Holding BOM slots is one thing, and making money out of it is a whole different thing. On the evidence of its financial performance since forever it is quite clear that Jet has been making a lousy job of it.
India: World's fastest growing major economy. World's fastest growing aviation market.
 
lutfi
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:12 am

blrsea wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Jet has terminated their relationship with Amadeus.
https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/ec ... 5.ece/amp/


This is a good cost cutting move. The Indian airlines missed many cost cutting opportunities, this is a sign they aren't anymore.

Lightsaber


After AI, 9W is the 2nd FSC in India to cut ties to Amadeus. That leaves Amadeus with pretty little coverage in India now. Indigo is also on Travelport exclusively.


Treu - though Indigo access onn Travelport is so painful to use that going direct/ to one of the big aggregators is a better option (LCC tend not to encourage GDS)
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:24 am

lutfi wrote:
Treu - though Indigo access onn Travelport is so painful to use that going direct/ to one of the big aggregators is a better option (LCC tend not to encourage GDS)

What is the difference between GDS and aggregators? I have no idea how GDS works
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lutfi
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:36 am

Many small travel agents don't buy tickets from the airlines/ GDS, but from consolidators/ middlemen/ aggregators (because of deposits/ bank guarantees needed to be on the platforms) but can book on the GDS

6E insists for example for cash up front if you want to sell their flights direct (via their API). So the aggregators/ consolidators will offer small agents a system that allows the agent to sell content from GDS and 6E, and also offer hotels etc
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:56 am

Jet Airways pilots union seems to be running out of patience with salary delays. They will take a call on further action in March
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 855567.cms
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:36 am

lutfi wrote:
Many small travel agents don't buy tickets from the airlines/ GDS, but from consolidators/ middlemen/ aggregators (because of deposits/ bank guarantees needed to be on the platforms) but can book on the GDS

6E insists for example for cash up front if you want to sell their flights direct (via their API). So the aggregators/ consolidators will offer small agents a system that allows the agent to sell content from GDS and 6E, and also offer hotels etc

Jet has an app:
https://www.jetairways.com/en/in/jetexp ... e-app.aspx

Why the fuss? That is how airlines sell tickets today. So people leave an over priced distributor behind.

Lightsaber
You only have the first amendment with the 2nd. If you're not going to offend someone with what you say, you don't have the 1st.
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:15 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Jet has an app:
https://www.jetairways.com/en/in/jetexp ... e-app.aspx

Why the fuss? That is how airlines sell tickets today. So people leave an over priced distributor behind.

Lightsaber

Unfortunately bulk of airline ticket bookings in India still happen though travel agents
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Exeiowa
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:46 pm

Now the debt problem is dealt with (for now) its time to deal with their cash flow problem. Good luck!
 
trinidadeG
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:39 am

Etihad infuses Rs 252 crore in Jet Airways
Etihad Airways has pre-purchased Jet Airways’ tickets worth $35 million (Rs 252 crore) through its loyalty programme company Jet Privilege, infusing some funds into the airline, said two people aware of the developments.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ma ... 877674.cms
 
lutfi
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:43 am

unrave wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Jet has an app:
https://www.jetairways.com/en/in/jetexp ... e-app.aspx

Why the fuss? That is how airlines sell tickets today. So people leave an over priced distributor behind.

Lightsaber

Unfortunately bulk of airline ticket bookings in India still happen though travel agents


Even in other markets, travel agents are still very important - it is just that they are now Priceline/ Expedia/ Kayak/ MakeMyTrip (in India) Still a lot of passengers want to comparison shop, rather than buy direct form airline
 
Asiaflyer
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:21 pm

unrave wrote:
The saga will be over Jet's employees get paid and Jet's shiny new jets are dusted off from storage

The cash infusion will only give short term relief.
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CaliguyNYC
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:02 pm

Asiaflyer wrote:
unrave wrote:
The saga will be over Jet's employees get paid and Jet's shiny new jets are dusted off from storage

The cash infusion will only give short term relief.


Well EY should hopefully have some type of plan. They wanted "control" of Jet. Now they have it. EY dropped SF and their afternoon flight to JFK. I wonder if they can work with DL and figure something out. Now with EY in control will HYD-EU, BLR-LHR, BLR-HKG every get launched?
 
hohd
Posts: 685
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 1:03 am

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:18 pm

For domestic travel within India, pure store front travel agencies sell much less tickets. Most of the tickets are sold by online travel agencies Cleartrip, MakeMy Trip, Kayak India, Expedia India, etc. apart from the airline website.
 
Asiaflyer
Posts: 800
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:24 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Asiaflyer wrote:
unrave wrote:
The saga will be over Jet's employees get paid and Jet's shiny new jets are dusted off from storage

The cash infusion will only give short term relief.


Well EY should hopefully have some type of plan. They wanted "control" of Jet. Now they have it. EY dropped SF and their afternoon flight to JFK. I wonder if they can work with DL and figure something out. Now with EY in control will HYD-EU, BLR-LHR, BLR-HKG every get launched?

EYs history of taking over airlines in trouble is disturbingly poor, both in terms of performace and also their ethical behaviour. Air Berlin and Alitalia are examples of the fact that cash infusion is not enough to turn loss making business profitable. There does not seem to be capability within EY to remake and turn lossmaking airlines around, not historically and I highly doubt going forward as well. If EY was good at running busniess they would have been in a much better position with their own operations.
I predict 9W soon to be in even worse shape and operations to be significantly reduced.
EYs way of getting their money back from its investments is also borderline to be criminal. As an example, Five of Alitalias LHR slots was aquired by EY at $ 13 Mio per slot which far below market value. Top price paid has been $ 75Mio. I am suprised there has not been any legal actions taken after that.
SQ,MI,MH,CX,KA,CA,CZ,MU,KE,OZ,QF,NZ,FD,JQ,3K,5J,IT,AI,IC,QR,SK,LF,KL,AF,LH,LX,OS,SR,BA,SN,FR,WF,1I,5T,VZ,VX,AC,NW,UA,US,
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:40 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Well EY should hopefully have some type of plan. They wanted "control" of Jet. Now they have it. EY dropped SF and their afternoon flight to JFK. I wonder if they can work with DL and figure something out. Now with EY in control will HYD-EU, BLR-LHR, BLR-HKG every get launched?


Keep in mind even during the worst days of US3 (vs) ME3, EY was AA's partner. This lovefest was questioned during a CAPA Americas summit. EY is not a bully, it doesn't create hurdles.
 
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unrave
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:45 pm

Asiaflyer wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Asiaflyer wrote:
The cash infusion will only give short term relief.


Well EY should hopefully have some type of plan. They wanted "control" of Jet. Now they have it. EY dropped SF and their afternoon flight to JFK. I wonder if they can work with DL and figure something out. Now with EY in control will HYD-EU, BLR-LHR, BLR-HKG every get launched?

EYs history of taking over airlines in trouble is disturbingly poor, both in terms of performace and also their ethical behaviour. Air Berlin and Alitalia are examples of the fact that cash infusion is not enough to turn loss making business profitable. There does not seem to be capability within EY to remake and turn lossmaking airlines around, not historically and I highly doubt going forward as well. If EY was good at running busniess they would have been in a much better position with their own operations.
I predict 9W soon to be in even worse shape and operations to be significantly reduced.
EYs way of getting their money back from its investments is also borderline to be criminal. As an example, Five of Alitalias LHR slots was aquired by EY at $ 13 Mio per slot which far below market value. Top price paid has been $ 75Mio. I am suprised there has not been any legal actions taken after that.

EY did something similar with Jet's LHR slots
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CaliguyNYC
Posts: 571
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:39 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Well EY should hopefully have some type of plan. They wanted "control" of Jet. Now they have it. EY dropped SF and their afternoon flight to JFK. I wonder if they can work with DL and figure something out. Now with EY in control will HYD-EU, BLR-LHR, BLR-HKG every get launched?


Keep in mind even during the worst days of US3 (vs) ME3, EY was AA's partner. This lovefest was questioned during a CAPA Americas summit. EY is not a bully, it doesn't create hurdles.


I am referring to the articles around the last EY big cash infusion where EY supposedly said that Jet had to funnel all traffic going west (other than LHR and their existing BRU flights) through AUH. I know some here that think that is all 9W needs to do, just fly from 20 Indian cities to AUH on a 737 and call it a day. But I think that was EY's big mistake. A strong Jet with a good BOM hub + EY & AUH has the best chance of seeing success for both of them. Plus Jet is now EY's back door into DL. Hopefully they don't screw that up.
 
dtw2hyd
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Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:53 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
I am referring to the articles around the last EY big cash infusion where EY supposedly said that Jet had to funnel all traffic going west (other than LHR and their existing BRU flights) through AUH. I know some here that think that is all 9W needs to do, just fly from 20 Indian cities to AUH on a 737 and call it a day. But I think that was EY's big mistake. A strong Jet with a good BOM hub + EY & AUH has the best chance of seeing success for both of them. Plus Jet is now EY's back door into DL. Hopefully they don't screw that up.


That is predicated on the theory NG has gone rogue and started a relationship with ST. The most likely scenario is 9W-ST relationship has EY's approval. So no question of going back on that. No other partnership can achieve maximum US-India one-stops like 9W-ST, EY is not going to lose that opportunity.

There is only one proven fact, the majority opinion on a.net is always wrong.
 
JoeCanuck
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:41 pm

Jet may very well still fail under Etihad's guidance, but the simple fact is, nobody else was willing to step up. It was either Etihad or bankruptcy. Those were the only choices.

Without EY, Jet was absolutely going under. Perhaps they would have gotten some bank and/or the government to kick in more cash to slow the bleeding, but that would have just been putting off the inevitable.

With EY on board, (and maybe more importantly Goyal not in control), Jet has some chance of a turnaround.
What the...?
 
binayak
Posts: 799
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:52 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
I am referring to the articles around the last EY big cash infusion where EY supposedly said that Jet had to funnel all traffic going west (other than LHR and their existing BRU flights) through AUH. I know some here that think that is all 9W needs to do, just fly from 20 Indian cities to AUH on a 737 and call it a day. But I think that was EY's big mistake. A strong Jet with a good BOM hub + EY & AUH has the best chance of seeing success for both of them. Plus Jet is now EY's back door into DL. Hopefully they don't screw that up.


That is predicated on the theory NG has gone rogue and started a relationship with ST. The most likely scenario is 9W-ST relationship has EY's approval. So no question of going back on that. No other partnership can achieve maximum US-India one-stops like 9W-ST, EY is not going to lose that opportunity.

There is only one proven fact, the majority opinion on a.net is always wrong.


That theory of 9W ditching EY for skyteam is given by the ME hub lovers .
Well if their memory is perfect, then they must know that jet had left partnership with LH after EY investment. Prior to that, they'd planned a partnership with LH group just like they have with AF KL today.
The reason for choosing AF KL as partners was a mutual decision by 9W and EY.
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dtw2hyd
Posts: 6595
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:56 pm

Rumor has it Mueller is leaving EK for EY. In one hypothetical scenario, he can lead 9W restructuring first and go back to fixing EY. Depends on which one is in deeper ...
 
jetero
Posts: 4457
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:57 pm

Just got notification of cancellation of a DEL-COK segment on Feb 16, without any rebooking.

Another segment (GOI-BOM) has rescheduled 3 times in the past month.
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 16280
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Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:54 pm

Jet has 4 (new report) aircraft grounded for non-payment.

https://www.bing.com/amp/s/www.moneycon ... 1.html/amp

Hopefully they approve the transaction or this will spiral.

The 3 that were misreported as lease grounding but rather engine adjustment are flying. But how do you so mismanage to ground for that?!? Cest la vie

Sadly, the saga isn't over. With QR having EU open skies with a possible 6E code share, Jet just became less valuable.

Lightsaber
You only have the first amendment with the 2nd. If you're not going to offend someone with what you say, you don't have the 1st.
 
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unrave
Posts: 1817
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:51 pm

Sad sight of a grounded A330-200 harvested of its engines
Image
India: World's fastest growing major economy. World's fastest growing aviation market.
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 16280
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 09, 2019 1:55 pm

Banks have approved 4,000 crore debt swap for equity. Now for stockholders to accept reality.

https://www.financialexpress.com/indust ... 1895/lite/

I find it interesting Jet is pre-selling so many tickets to EY. Cest la vie

Lightsaber
You only have the first amendment with the 2nd. If you're not going to offend someone with what you say, you don't have the 1st.
 
vadodara
Topic Author
Posts: 754
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:45 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 09, 2019 2:07 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Banks have approved 4,000 crore debt swap for equity. Now for stockholders to accept reality.

https://www.financialexpress.com/indust ... 1895/lite/

I find it interesting Jet is pre-selling so many tickets to EY. Cest la vie

Lightsaber


Either way, this is good. NG's charade of running an airline that did not pay salaries, lessors, oil-companies and such had gone on for far too long.
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 571
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 09, 2019 5:25 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Banks have approved 4,000 crore debt swap for equity. Now for stockholders to accept reality.

https://www.financialexpress.com/indust ... 1895/lite/

I find it interesting Jet is pre-selling so many tickets to EY. Cest la vie

Lightsaber


Why - IMHO it is just a work around of the stupid working capital laws in India. I bet DL/AF also provided Jet super cheap EU-US seats to also boost Jet. Would be easier if they could just give them a 0% interest loan. But no...oh well. India is a free market economy that runs like a communist state.China is communist but some how unleashes it comrporations to dominate many areas (including China-to the world aviation. Chest la vie...
 
edealinfo
Posts: 179
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Jet Airways: reports cash running out

Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:26 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Rumor has it Mueller is leaving EK for EY.


This deserves its own thread

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