caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:08 am

I thought we could start a thread on the big three regionals for 2019. I am not sure why they don't have a thread since they have over 1600 planes and make up about 25% of domestic U.S. flights...

Here was the last update in December.

UPDATED INFORMATION:

By Carrier

ZW (Air Wisconsin) - 65
100% UA 100% Bombardier 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 class
65 CRJ UA 50 seat 2 class

C5 (Commuter)- 61
100% UA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 class
61 ERJ UA 50 seat 2 class

CP (Compass)- 56
(35.7% AA 64.3% DL) 100% Embraer 100% 70+ Seat 100% 3 class
56 E75 (20 AA, 36 DL) 76 seat 3 class

9E (Endeavor)-154
100% DL 100% Bombardier (27.3% 50 Seat 1.9% 51-70 Seat 70.8% 70+Seat) (27.3% 2 Class 72.7% 3 class)
42 CRJ DL 50 seat 2class
03 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 class

MQ (Envoy)-207
100% AA (9.2% Bombardier 90.8% Embraer) (50.2% 0-50 Seat 9.2% 51-70 seat 40.6% 70+ seat) (50.2% 1 class 49.8% 3 class)
19 CR7 AA 63-65 Seat 3 class
19 ER4 AA 44 Seat 1 class
85 ERJ AA 50 Seat 1 class
84 E75 AA 76 Seat 3 class

EV (ExpressJet)-130
(3.8% AA 96.2% UA) (19.2% Bombardier 80.8% Embraer) (96.2% 50 Seat 3.8% 51-70 Seat) (15.4% 1 class 80.8% 2 class 3.8% 3 class)
105 ERJ UA 50 Seat 2 class
20 CRJ UA 50 Seat 1 Class
05 CR7 AA 65 Seat 3 Class

G7 (GoJet)- 154
(53.7% DL 46.3% UA) 100% Bombardier (87% 51-70 Seat 13% 70+ Seat) 100% 3 class
25 CR7 UA 70 Seat 3 class
22 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 class
07 CR9 DL 76 Seat 2 class

QX (Horizon)- 73
100% AS (54.8% Bombardier 45.2% Embraer) 100% 70+ Seat (54.8% 1 class 45.2% 3 class)
40 DH8 AS 76 Seat 1 Class
33 E75 AS 76 Seat 3 Class

YV (Mesa)- 144
(44.4% AA 55.6% UA) (58.3 % Bombardier 41.7% Embraer) (13.9% 51-70 Seat 86.1% 70+ Seat) (44.4% 2 class 55.6% 3 class)
20 CR7 UA 70 Seat 3 class
64 CR9 AA 76-79 Seat 2 class
60 E75 UA 76 Seat 3 class

PT (Piedmont)- 60
100% AA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 1 Class
56 ERJ AA 50 Seat 1 Class

OH (PSA)- 149
100% AA 100% Bombardier (23.5% 50 Seat 30.2% 51-70 seat 46.3% 70+ seat) (23.5% 1 class 76.5% 3 Class)
35 CRJ AA 50 Seat 1 Class
45 CR7 AA 63 Seat 3 Class
69 CR9 AA 76 Seat 3 Class

YX (Republic)- 188
(44.7% AA 20.2% DL 35.1% UA) 100% Embraer (31.9% 51-70 Seat 68.1% 70+ Seat) 100% 3 class
22 E70 DL 69 Seat 3 Class
38 E70 UA 70 Seat 3 Class
128 E75 (84 AA 16 DL 28 UA) 76 Seat 3 Class

OO (Skywest)- 472
(12% AA 7.4% AS 45.67.4% DL 35% UA) (68.4% Bombardier 31.6% Embraer) (35.6% 50 Seat 31.6% 51-70 Seat 32.8% 70+Seat) (17.2% 1 Class 18.4% 2 Class 64.4% 3 Class)
81 CRJ UA 50 Seat 1 Class
87 CRJ DL 50 Seat 2 Class
20 CR7 AA 65 Seat 3 Class
23 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 Class
56 CR7 (37 AA 19 UA) 70 Seat 3 Class
20 CR9 DL 70 Seat 3 Class
36 CR9 DL 76 Seat 3 Class
30 E75 DL 70 Seat 3 Class
119 E75 (35 AS 19DL 65 UA) 76 Seat 3 Class

AX (Trans States)- 38*
100% UA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 Class
38 ERJ UA 50 Seat 2 Class

* 15 ERJ 50 Seat 1 Class aircraft under contract to AA Not Included as contract is being dropped

By Brand

American Eagle (AA)- 646
0 - 50 Seat - 199
Bombardier 35- OH
Embraer 164 - (104 MQ, 60 PT)
51-70 Seat - 126
Bombardier 126 - (19 MQ, 5 EV, 45 OH, 57 OO)
Embraer 0
70+ Seat - 321
Bombardier 133 - (64 YV, 69 MQ)
Embraer 188 - (20 CP, 84 MQ, 84 YX)

Alaska (AS) - 108
0 - 50 Seat - 0
51-70 Seat - 0
70+ Seat - 108
Bombardier - 40 - QX
Embraer - 68 - (33 QX, 35 OO)

Delta Connection (DL) - 472
0-50 Seat - 129
Bombardier - 129 - (42 9E, 87 OO)
Embraer - 0
51-70 Seat - 120
Bombardier - 68 - (3 9E, 22 G7, 43 OO)
Embraer - 52 - (22 YX, 30 OO)
70+ Seat - 223
Bombardier - 152 - (109 9E, 7 G7, 36 OO)
Embraer - 71 - (36 CP, 16 YX, 19 OO)

United Express (UA) - 625
0-50 Seat - 370
Bombardier - 166 - (65 ZW, 20 EV, 81 OO)
Embraer - 204 - (61 C5, 105 EV, 38 AX)
51 - 70 Seat - 102
Bombardier - 64 - (25 G7, 20 YV, 19 OO)
Embraer - 38 - YX
70+ Seat - 153
Bombardier - 0
Embraer - 153 - (60 YV, 28 YX, 65 OO)
 
Web
Posts: 338
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:56 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:45 pm

Under 9E I think you forgot 109 CR9 DL 76 seat 3 class.

Very good summary, although these numbers change regularly, especially on the AA side; lots of airframe shuffling among the AA wholly-owneds right now. Also, DL is in the process of consolidating its regional feed, and UA has some changes on the horizon as well. A YOY comparison would be especially interesting, but those numbers might be tough to come by.
 
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FLIHGH
Posts: 243
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:19 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:52 pm

Most of PSAs CR7s have 65 seats, not 63.
 
rsgolfpunk
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:46 pm

Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.
 
TXRoadMan
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:56 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 5:22 pm

How are AA's ERJs 1-class, yet UA's are 2-class? Both have similar seating arrangements. (Both sell exit row as Y+. UA sells bulkhead as Y+, AA does not.)
 
mtnwest1979
Posts: 2168
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2005 4:23 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 6:16 pm

1 and 2 class CRJ both with 50 seats? Do they just charge more for same seats??? :)
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:09 pm

Web wrote:
Under 9E I think you forgot 109 CR9 DL 76 seat 3 class.

Very good summary, although these numbers change regularly, especially on the AA side; lots of airframe shuffling among the AA wholly-owneds right now. Also, DL is in the process of consolidating its regional feed, and UA has some changes on the horizon as well. A YOY comparison would be especially interesting, but those numbers might be tough to come by.


Not sure how that happened, but your right. Pretty hard to misplace 109 aircraft. They fell off the list somehow.

I wanted to start the thread because the numbers change frequently like you mention. It can be hard to track. I'll look into the YOY, I agree, that would be interesting. Thanks for the feedback.
 
jb1087xna
Posts: 407
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 2:11 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:19 pm

Are the 9E/Endeavor numbers right? Only shows CR2s and CR7s, but they seem to be operating CR9s between XNA-ATL today and tomorrow.
| A319/20/21/33 | B717,722,733/5/7/8/9,744,752/3,762/3 | CR1/2/7/9 | D95 | E145/75 | M82/8/90 |
Next up: XNA-ATL-PWM-ATL-XNA
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm

TXRoadMan wrote:
How are AA's ERJs 1-class, yet UA's are 2-class? Both have similar seating arrangements. (Both sell exit row as Y+. UA sells bulkhead as Y+, AA does not.)


Looks like the listing is incorrect. They are listed as being 50 seats in Y only. These seem to be mostly the ERJ and ER4s at Endeavor. Not sure how old the data is on Wiki...
 
DiamondFlyer
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Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:22 pm

jb1087xna wrote:
Are the 9E/Endeavor numbers right? Only shows CR2s and CR7s, but they seem to be operating CR9s between XNA-ATL today and tomorrow.

It was already mentioned as wrong. 9E has 42 CR2, 3 CR7 and 109 CR9
From my cold, dead hands
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:24 pm

Updated with PSA seat Count and missing 109 Endeavor CR9s

caflyboy wrote:
I thought we could start a thread on the big three regionals for 2019. I am not sure why they don't have a thread since they have over 1600 planes and make up about 25% of domestic U.S. flights...

Here was the last update in December.

UPDATED INFORMATION:

By Carrier

ZW (Air Wisconsin) - 65
100% UA 100% Bombardier 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 class
65 CRJ UA 50 seat 2 class

C5 (Commuter)- 61
100% UA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 class
61 ERJ UA 50 seat 2 class

CP (Compass)- 56
(35.7% AA 64.3% DL) 100% Embraer 100% 70+ Seat 100% 3 class
56 E75 (20 AA, 36 DL) 76 seat 3 class

9E (Endeavor)-154
100% DL 100% Bombardier (27.3% 50 Seat 1.9% 51-70 Seat 70.8% 70+Seat) (27.3% 2 Class 72.7% 3 class)
42 CRJ DL 50 seat 2class
03 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 class
109 CR9 76 Seat 3 class
MQ (Envoy)-207
100% AA (9.2% Bombardier 90.8% Embraer) (50.2% 0-50 Seat 9.2% 51-70 seat 40.6% 70+ seat) (50.2% 1 class 49.8% 3 class)
19 CR7 AA 63-65 Seat 3 class
19 ER4 AA 44 Seat 1 class
85 ERJ AA 50 Seat 1 class
84 E75 AA 76 Seat 3 class

EV (ExpressJet)-130
(3.8% AA 96.2% UA) (19.2% Bombardier 80.8% Embraer) (96.2% 50 Seat 3.8% 51-70 Seat) (15.4% 1 class 80.8% 2 class 3.8% 3 class)
105 ERJ UA 50 Seat 2 class
20 CRJ UA 50 Seat 1 Class
05 CR7 AA 65 Seat 3 Class

G7 (GoJet)- 154
(53.7% DL 46.3% UA) 100% Bombardier (87% 51-70 Seat 13% 70+ Seat) 100% 3 class
25 CR7 UA 70 Seat 3 class
22 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 class
07 CR9 DL 76 Seat 2 class

QX (Horizon)- 73
100% AS (54.8% Bombardier 45.2% Embraer) 100% 70+ Seat (54.8% 1 class 45.2% 3 class)
40 DH8 AS 76 Seat 1 Class
33 E75 AS 76 Seat 3 Class

YV (Mesa)- 144
(44.4% AA 55.6% UA) (58.3 % Bombardier 41.7% Embraer) (13.9% 51-70 Seat 86.1% 70+ Seat) (44.4% 2 class 55.6% 3 class)
20 CR7 UA 70 Seat 3 class
64 CR9 AA 76-79 Seat 2 class
60 E75 UA 76 Seat 3 class

PT (Piedmont)- 60
100% AA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 1 Class
56 ERJ AA 50 Seat 1 Class

OH (PSA)- 149
100% AA 100% Bombardier (23.5% 50 Seat 30.2% 51-70 seat 46.3% 70+ seat) (23.5% 1 class 76.5% 3 Class)
35 CRJ AA 50 Seat 1 Class
45 CR7 AA 65 Seat 3 Class
69 CR9 AA 76 Seat 3 Class

YX (Republic)- 188
(44.7% AA 20.2% DL 35.1% UA) 100% Embraer (31.9% 51-70 Seat 68.1% 70+ Seat) 100% 3 class
22 E70 DL 69 Seat 3 Class
38 E70 UA 70 Seat 3 Class
128 E75 (84 AA 16 DL 28 UA) 76 Seat 3 Class

OO (Skywest)- 472
(12% AA 7.4% AS 45.67.4% DL 35% UA) (68.4% Bombardier 31.6% Embraer) (35.6% 50 Seat 31.6% 51-70 Seat 32.8% 70+Seat) (17.2% 1 Class 18.4% 2 Class 64.4% 3 Class)
81 CRJ UA 50 Seat 1 Class
87 CRJ DL 50 Seat 2 Class
20 CR7 AA 65 Seat 3 Class
23 CR7 DL 69 Seat 3 Class
56 CR7 (37 AA 19 UA) 70 Seat 3 Class
20 CR9 DL 70 Seat 3 Class
36 CR9 DL 76 Seat 3 Class
30 E75 DL 70 Seat 3 Class
119 E75 (35 AS 19DL 65 UA) 76 Seat 3 Class

AX (Trans States)- 38*
100% UA 100% Embraer 100% 50 Seat 100% 2 Class
38 ERJ UA 50 Seat 2 Class

* 15 ERJ 50 Seat 1 Class aircraft under contract to AA Not Included as contract is being dropped

By Brand

American Eagle (AA)- 646
0 - 50 Seat - 199
Bombardier 35- OH
Embraer 164 - (104 MQ, 60 PT)
51-70 Seat - 126
Bombardier 126 - (19 MQ, 5 EV, 45 OH, 57 OO)
Embraer 0
70+ Seat - 321
Bombardier 133 - (64 YV, 69 MQ)
Embraer 188 - (20 CP, 84 MQ, 84 YX)

Alaska (AS) - 108
0 - 50 Seat - 0
51-70 Seat - 0
70+ Seat - 108
Bombardier - 40 - QX
Embraer - 68 - (33 QX, 35 OO)

Delta Connection (DL) - 472
0-50 Seat - 129
Bombardier - 129 - (42 9E, 87 OO)
Embraer - 0
51-70 Seat - 120
Bombardier - 68 - (3 9E, 22 G7, 43 OO)
Embraer - 52 - (22 YX, 30 OO)
70+ Seat - 223
Bombardier - 152 - (109 9E, 7 G7, 36 OO)
Embraer - 71 - (36 CP, 16 YX, 19 OO)

United Express (UA) - 625
0-50 Seat - 370
Bombardier - 166 - (65 ZW, 20 EV, 81 OO)
Embraer - 204 - (61 C5, 105 EV, 38 AX)
51 - 70 Seat - 102
Bombardier - 64 - (25 G7, 20 YV, 19 OO)
Embraer - 38 - YX
70+ Seat - 153
Bombardier - 0
Embraer - 153 - (60 YV, 28 YX, 65 OO)
 
MLIAA
Posts: 95
Joined: Wed May 31, 2017 11:08 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:01 pm

Are you including outstanding orders in the count? Envoy does not yet have 84 E75s.
A319 A320 A321 B712 B722 B737 B738 B739 B744 B752 B763 B764 B772 B788 MD80 S340 E140 E145 E170 E175 CRJ2 CRJ7 CRJ9
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:15 pm

MLIAA wrote:
Are you including outstanding orders in the count? Envoy does not yet have 84 E75s.


Yes outstanding orders are included. As well as announced outstanding retirements.
 
apodino
Posts: 3357
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:11 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:13 pm

EV's contract with AA expires today and will not be renewed so going forward EV is no longer an AA feeder.
 
jmc1975
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 4:21 am

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.


It'll be interesting to see which will be the surviving American Eagle carriers in the next 12 to 24 months! Are all of the 44- & 50-seat ERJs eventually being transitioned from Envoy to Piedmont?
.......
 
ericm2031
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 5:14 am

jmc1975 wrote:
rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.


It'll be interesting to see which will be the surviving American Eagle carriers in the next 12 to 24 months! Are all of the 44- & 50-seat ERJs eventually being transitioned from Envoy to Piedmont?


Not sure but I know some are being transferred from AX to Envoy currently
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 5:37 am

I heard the ones from AX are going to MQ and MQ is transferring to PT. The reason they are not going direct is that MQ can do the required maintenance, at least that's what I heard elsewhere...not sure if that is fact or not.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:06 am

It's incredible that United still has such a small large RJ fleet, if you round the numbers it's roughly 250 70ish seaters for UA, 350 for DL, and 450 for AA. The flipside is the UA still has a massive 50 seater fleet.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:11 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:42 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
It's incredible that United still has such a small large RJ fleet, if you round the numbers it's roughly 250 70ish seaters for UA, 350 for DL, and 450 for AA. The flipside is the UA still has a massive 50 seater fleet.


United’s scope max for 70+ seaters is 253 (which is exactly what they have). Unless UA orders a new small narrow body for mainline, 253 is the maximum it will have.
 
B737900ER
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:18 pm

UAinAUS wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
It's incredible that United still has such a small large RJ fleet, if you round the numbers it's roughly 250 70ish seaters for UA, 350 for DL, and 450 for AA. The flipside is the UA still has a massive 50 seater fleet.


United’s scope max for 70+ seaters is 253 (which is exactly what they have). Unless UA orders a new small narrow body for mainline, 253 is the maximum it will have.

We all know why. What’s incredible is that UA hasn’t done anything about it.
 
airtran737
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:11 pm

caflyboy wrote:
I heard the ones from AX are going to MQ and MQ is transferring to PT. The reason they are not going direct is that MQ can do the required maintenance, at least that's what I heard elsewhere...not sure if that is fact or not.


PDT is planned to have around 60 airplanes and they are nearly there. They also have well documented training woes and are losing a lot of pilots to outside attrition. They are still on a turboprop contract and paid below the other two wholly owned carriers. Add low pay to the crappy schedules and it makes it difficult to recruit talent who will come to PDT and wait out an 8-9 year flow.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
 
Ionosphere
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:17 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.


If that happens it'll be interesting to see what happens to Compass especially. I've heard that their AA flying is on shaky ground too.
 
rsgolfpunk
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:21 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:49 pm

How DL gets to three carriers is still unknown. There is a lot of speculation. But Ed’s timeline is likely correct. There will have to be a transition period similar to EV to 9E to avoid service disruption.
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:45 am

I think this year we are going to see some interesting moves in this space. As a side and pure speculation is the Compass advertising PHX on their website. I wonder if it is possible that there is a play with Mesa and Compass? It is an interesting year for the regionals.
 
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KGRB
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:54 am

caflyboy wrote:
I think this year we are going to see some interesting moves in this space. As a side and pure speculation is the Compass advertising PHX on their website. I wonder if it is possible that there is a play with Mesa and Compass? It is an interesting year for the regionals.

Compass has had a (pretty small) PHX base for a couple of years. As far as I know, they operate a handful of Eagle flights and the LAX flights for DL Connection.
Flown on: Air Wisconsin, America West, American, Compass, Delta, Endeavor Air, Envoy, ExpressJet, GoJet, KLM, Mesa, Mesaba, Midwest Express, Northwest, Piedmont, Pinnacle, PSA, Skyway, SkyWest, United, US Airways
 
rsgolfpunk
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Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:21 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:40 pm

What would be the impact on TransStates if DL drops Compass and GoJet? Positive because they would be smaller and more nimble or negative because of the loss of flying and revenue?
 
uadc8contrail
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Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:23 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:59 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
What would be the impact on TransStates if DL drops Compass and GoJet? Positive because they would be smaller and more nimble or negative because of the loss of flying and revenue?


I'm sure it would be negative too lose all delta flying, i read somewhere on a.net that gojet was going to lose united flying, not a fan at all in trans states llc and how they run those 3 airlines.
Bus Driver
 
rsgolfpunk
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Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:21 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:06 pm

I don’t know if UA explicitly stated that they are reducing the number of express carriers like DL and AA. Regardless, it appears that the regional landscape will change, perhaps dramatically, over the next few years.
 
jrkmsp
Posts: 99
Joined: Sun May 14, 2017 1:33 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:01 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.


Got a link to the video?
 
capitalflyer
Posts: 481
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 2:43 am

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:40 pm

Just like the parent airlines, regionals will go through consolidation. There are currently 14 on this list. I would think half a dozen could get eaten.

Regionals left standing
Endeavor, SkyWest, Republic, Horizon, Envoy, ExpressJet, GoJet, and Mesa.

Compass, Piedmont, PSA, Air Wisconsin, Trans States, and Commutair will be no more.

SkyWest will sell ExpressJet to UA as wholly owned subsidiary and switch focus to large RJ competition with Republic and Mesa. Compass and Trans States merge into larger GoJet which will diversify into 50 seater market. Commutair will also be bought by UA to compete with AA Eagle. Piedmont and PSA will be folded into Envoy.

Pure speculation, but if consolidation happens (and it seems likely with smaller regionals struggling) this might be one way it could happen.
 
KCaviator
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:00 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 5:54 pm

jrkmsp wrote:
rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ed just announced Endeavor, SkyWest and Republic as the surviving 3 DC carriers over the next 12 to 24 months. The vid is on YouTube. I’m not sure who the crowd represented.


Got a link to the video?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s8x65QfE0c&app=desktop

Sounds like GoJet and Compass are out...
 
KCaviator
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:00 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:07 pm

My prediction for regionals remaining in a few years is:

1) Endeavor
2) SkyWest
3) Republic
4) Horizon
5) Envoy
6) ExpressJet
7) Trans States

And possibly Mesa, but that situation is a little more complex to figure out.

Mergers:

1) CommutAir is merged with ExpressJet. ExpressJet brand survives.
2) Whatever is left of GoJet and Compass (i.e. pilots) after their AA/DL/UA contracts end would be merged with TSA.
3) Piedmont and PSA merge into Envoy for a single wholly-owned, much like Endeavor is to Delta.
4) Air Wisconsin either goes out of business or is picked up by UA and merged into CommutAir/ExpressJet.
5) A few scenarios could happen with Mesa. They could lose their UA 175 flying to ExpressJet, which would leave only AA flying. Since they are partially owned by AA, they could possibly be brought into the Envoy/Piedmont/PSA mix. Or they could lose both UA and AA flying, although I don't necessarily see that happening. Or they could continue flying for both. Not really sure on this one.
 
rsgolfpunk
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:16 pm

Another facet to the regional picture is that DL mentioned (I can't find the presser) that their regional seat departures would decline from the current 27% of total seat departures (mainline and connection) to 20% by 2023. That seems to make sense with the Mad Dog retirement/replacement, addition of the A220 and the reduction of 50-seaters.
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
Posts: 97
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:28 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Another facet to the regional picture is that DL mentioned (I can't find the presser) that their regional seat departures would decline from the current 27% of total seat departures (mainline and connection) to 20% by 2023. That seems to make sense with the Mad Dog retirement/replacement, addition of the A220 and the reduction of 50-seaters.


In their Investor Day presentation they talk about up gauging the flying to reduce 50 seaters and replace 76 seaters with A220. I think they mention like 2% per year. That would be in line with an overall shift out of 50s to 70, out of 70s to scope limit, and out of scope limit into a220.

There was also a good article about the A220 and its replacing large regionals. I'll see if I can find it. The Investor Presentation is on the IR portion of Delta's website.
 
caflyboy
Topic Author
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:44 pm

Now there is a top off order for more A220s at DL. This seems to fit with the strategy as expressed on their presentation and in the video (thanks of the link).

When looking at the ownership of the regionals, I think it shows it is going to be an active 12-24 months in this space (continuing to be active):

ZW - Independent. All 50seat flying. Now growth in aircraft for several years.
C5 - Transition to all 50 seat ERJs, partially owned by UA
CP - Large regional division of TS. Independent and part of TS Holdings. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
9E - Largest CR9 operator. 100% owned by DL. Probably impacted by a220 and will move CR9s to other spaces by other regionals.
MQ - 100% owned by AA Taking on more large Embraers., OH is 100% bombardier
EV- Transitioning out of OO ownership to partial ownership by UA
G7 - Independent, part of TS Holdings. Middle size RJs. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
QX - 100% owned by AS
YV - partially owned by AA. Wanted to try IPO last year. Slower growth all larger RJs
PT - Transitioned to 100% ERJs (like C5) 100% owned by AA
OH - 100% owned by AA. All Bombardier
YX - 100% owned by the three majors (UA,DL,AA)
OO - Independent. Spun off EV Largest Fleet of regional carriers
AX - Independent. Part of TS Holdings. Will be 100% UA flying in 2019

So by owner we have:

AA
MQ - 100% Mostly Embraer. growing fleet of larger jets
OH - 100% Mostly Bombardier in all three sizes
PT - 100% owned all smaller ERJs
YV - Partial owner
YX - Partial owner with other Majors

AS
QX - 100% owner

DL
9E - 100% owner
YX - Partial owner with other 2 majors

UA
C5 - Partial owner - all 50 seat ERJs
EV - Partial owner - Huge ERJ fleet

Independents
ZW - 100% AA Flying
AX - part of TSH 100% UA flying in 2019 all smaller ERJs
G7 - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. Created for mid and larger Bombardier RJs
CP - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. All larger Embraer jets
OO - largest fleet of aircraft in regionals, flying for all 4 Majors.

If there is consolidation of carriers, and with up gauging, will number of aircraft at regionals increase or decrease?
 
flyguy84
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:15 pm

capitalflyer wrote:
Just like the parent airlines, regionals will go through consolidation. There are currently 14 on this list. I would think half a dozen could get eaten.

Regionals left standing
Endeavor, SkyWest, Republic, Horizon, Envoy, ExpressJet, GoJet, and Mesa.

Compass, Piedmont, PSA, Air Wisconsin, Trans States, and Commutair will be no more.

SkyWest will sell ExpressJet to UA as wholly owned subsidiary and switch focus to large RJ competition with Republic and Mesa. Compass and Trans States merge into larger GoJet which will diversify into 50 seater market. Commutair will also be bought by UA to compete with AA Eagle. Piedmont and PSA will be folded into Envoy.

Pure speculation, but if consolidation happens (and it seems likely with smaller regionals struggling) this might be one way it could happen.

What? ExpressJet was already sold before the end of the year and United is a minority owner of CommutAir. Lol you’re a bit late on that.
SFO
 
flyguy84
Posts: 770
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:20 pm

caflyboy wrote:
Now there is a top off order for more A220s at DL. This seems to fit with the strategy as expressed on their presentation and in the video (thanks of the link).

When looking at the ownership of the regionals, I think it shows it is going to be an active 12-24 months in this space (continuing to be active):

ZW - Independent. All 50seat flying. Now growth in aircraft for several years.
C5 - Transition to all 50 seat ERJs, partially owned by UA
CP - Large regional division of TS. Independent and part of TS Holdings. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
9E - Largest CR9 operator. 100% owned by DL. Probably impacted by a220 and will move CR9s to other spaces by other regionals.
MQ - 100% owned by AA Taking on more large Embraers., OH is 100% bombardier
EV- Transitioning out of OO ownership to partial ownership by UA
G7 - Independent, part of TS Holdings. Middle size RJs. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
QX - 100% owned by AS
YV - partially owned by AA. Wanted to try IPO last year. Slower growth all larger RJs
PT - Transitioned to 100% ERJs (like C5) 100% owned by AA
OH - 100% owned by AA. All Bombardier
YX - 100% owned by the three majors (UA,DL,AA)
OO - Independent. Spun off EV Largest Fleet of regional carriers
AX - Independent. Part of TS Holdings. Will be 100% UA flying in 2019

So by owner we have:

AA
MQ - 100% Mostly Embraer. growing fleet of larger jets
OH - 100% Mostly Bombardier in all three sizes
PT - 100% owned all smaller ERJs
YV - Partial owner
YX - Partial owner with other Majors

AS
QX - 100% owner

DL
9E - 100% owner
YX - Partial owner with other 2 majors

UA
C5 - Partial owner - all 50 seat ERJs
EV - Partial owner - Huge ERJ fleet

Independents
ZW - 100% AA Flying
AX - part of TSH 100% UA flying in 2019 all smaller ERJs
G7 - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. Created for mid and larger Bombardier RJs
CP - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. All larger Embraer jets
OO - largest fleet of aircraft in regionals, flying for all 4 Majors.

If there is consolidation of carriers, and with up gauging, will number of aircraft at regionals increase or decrease?

ZW is 100% UA flying not AA.
SFO
 
alasizon
Posts: 1560
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:30 pm

KGRB wrote:
caflyboy wrote:
I think this year we are going to see some interesting moves in this space. As a side and pure speculation is the Compass advertising PHX on their website. I wonder if it is possible that there is a play with Mesa and Compass? It is an interesting year for the regionals.

Compass has had a (pretty small) PHX base for a couple of years. As far as I know, they operate a handful of Eagle flights and the LAX flights for DL Connection.


They do not staff any Eagle flights out of PHX. PHX doesn't see the 175 other than charters and diversions.
Manager on Duty & Tower Planner
 
KCaviator
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:00 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:25 pm

caflyboy wrote:
Now there is a top off order for more A220s at DL. This seems to fit with the strategy as expressed on their presentation and in the video (thanks of the link).

When looking at the ownership of the regionals, I think it shows it is going to be an active 12-24 months in this space (continuing to be active):

ZW - Independent. All 50seat flying. Now growth in aircraft for several years.
C5 - Transition to all 50 seat ERJs, partially owned by UA
CP - Large regional division of TS. Independent and part of TS Holdings. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
9E - Largest CR9 operator. 100% owned by DL. Probably impacted by a220 and will move CR9s to other spaces by other regionals.
MQ - 100% owned by AA Taking on more large Embraers., OH is 100% bombardier
EV- Transitioning out of OO ownership to partial ownership by UA
G7 - Independent, part of TS Holdings. Middle size RJs. Sounds like transitioning out of DL
QX - 100% owned by AS
YV - partially owned by AA. Wanted to try IPO last year. Slower growth all larger RJs
PT - Transitioned to 100% ERJs (like C5) 100% owned by AA
OH - 100% owned by AA. All Bombardier
YX - 100% owned by the three majors (UA,DL,AA)
OO - Independent. Spun off EV Largest Fleet of regional carriers
AX - Independent. Part of TS Holdings. Will be 100% UA flying in 2019

So by owner we have:

AA
MQ - 100% Mostly Embraer. growing fleet of larger jets
OH - 100% Mostly Bombardier in all three sizes
PT - 100% owned all smaller ERJs
YV - Partial owner
YX - Partial owner with other Majors

AS
QX - 100% owner

DL
9E - 100% owner
YX - Partial owner with other 2 majors

UA
C5 - Partial owner - all 50 seat ERJs
EV - Partial owner - Huge ERJ fleet

Independents
ZW - 100% AA Flying
AX - part of TSH 100% UA flying in 2019 all smaller ERJs
G7 - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. Created for mid and larger Bombardier RJs
CP - part of TSH sounds like transitioning out of Delta. All larger Embraer jets
OO - largest fleet of aircraft in regionals, flying for all 4 Majors.

If there is consolidation of carriers, and with up gauging, will number of aircraft at regionals increase or decrease?


For what it’s worth, YX is not 100% owned by AA, DL, and UA. Embraer and GE own a sizable portion as well, along with other smaller creditors.
 
KCaviator
Posts: 125
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:27 pm

Does anyone know if the DL order for additional A220s makes room under scope for additional 76-seat flying?

I’m not that familiar with their scope, but I thought large RJ flying was a percentage of their fleet size? Could be wrong.
 
DiamondFlyer
Posts: 2972
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:27 pm

KCaviator wrote:
Does anyone know if the DL order for additional A220s makes room under scope for additional 76-seat flying?

I’m not that familiar with their scope, but I thought large RJ flying was a percentage of their fleet size? Could be wrong.


It does not. Delta is scoped out, the only changes at DCI, as discussed, will be moving airplanes to fewer operators or replacing older RJ's with newer ones.
From my cold, dead hands
 
rsgolfpunk
Posts: 17
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:54 pm

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe DL can add about 30 70 seaters to scope out, not including the 20 new 70 seat 900s that Skywest is getting. Or maybe they have to have 69 seats. Or maybe it’s only 10 jets after the Skywest order. DL is scoped out on 76 seaters. I don’t believe there is a scope limit on 50 seaters, but that is moot relative to their plans. DL scope is a fixed number, not a percentage like AA.
 
rsgolfpunk
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:21 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:19 pm

Ok so a follow up. Apparently, DL's scope is 102 70-seates and 153 76 seaters. Per the table in this thread, DL currently flies 120 70 seaters and 223 76 seaters. Comments? Corrections?
 
DiamondFlyer
Posts: 2972
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:40 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe DL can add about 30 70 seaters to scope out, not including the 20 new 70 seat 900s that Skywest is getting. Or maybe they have to have 69 seats. Or maybe it’s only 10 jets after the Skywest order. DL is scoped out on 76 seaters. I don’t believe there is a scope limit on 50 seaters, but that is moot relative to their plans. DL scope is a fixed number, not a percentage like AA.


No, Delta is 100% scoped out (other than 50 seat flying). The new 70 seat CR9's are replacing older CR7's 1:1, so no net growth in fleet. 50 seat scope is 125 lines of flying.

I think the numbers in this thread are questionable, at least for Delta Connection. For 70 seaters I show 46 CR7's, 5 CR9 (70 seat), 22 170's and 30 175 (70 seat). For 76 I show 152 CR9, 71 E175. So probably 1 of those CR9 70 seaters isn't in service yet, would be my guess.
From my cold, dead hands
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 4447
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:53 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ok so a follow up. Apparently, DL's scope is 102 70-seates and 153 76 seaters. Per the table in this thread, DL currently flies 120 70 seaters and 223 76 seaters. Comments? Corrections?


102+153 was the cap before DL added the 91 717s.
 
DiamondFlyer
Posts: 2972
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:12 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
rsgolfpunk wrote:
Ok so a follow up. Apparently, DL's scope is 102 70-seates and 153 76 seaters. Per the table in this thread, DL currently flies 120 70 seaters and 223 76 seaters. Comments? Corrections?


102+153 was the cap before DL added the 91 717s.


Correct, the 76 seat limit is now 223 large RJ's.
From my cold, dead hands
 
FSDan
Posts: 2079
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:44 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
I think the numbers in this thread are questionable, at least for Delta Connection. For 70 seaters I show 46 CR7's, 5 CR9 (70 seat), 22 170's and 30 175 (70 seat). For 76 I show 152 CR9, 71 E175. So probably 1 of those CR9 70 seaters isn't in service yet, would be my guess.


Where are the new 70-seat CR9s being flown? I know the 70-seat E75s are pretty much all in the East (LGA, JFK, BOS etc.).
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
oosnowrat
Posts: 152
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:25 pm

FSDan wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
I think the numbers in this thread are questionable, at least for Delta Connection. For 70 seaters I show 46 CR7's, 5 CR9 (70 seat), 22 170's and 30 175 (70 seat). For 76 I show 152 CR9, 71 E175. So probably 1 of those CR9 70 seaters isn't in service yet, would be my guess.


Where are the new 70-seat CR9s being flown? I know the 70-seat E75s are pretty much all in the East (LGA, JFK, BOS etc.).


They are flying out of MSP and DTW.
 
evank516
Posts: 1823
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Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:47 pm

Does Delta's consolidation mean their regional fleet is going to shrink? If so could that be related to the A220 starting soon?
 
DiamondFlyer
Posts: 2972
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Big 3 (AA,DL,UA) Regional Airlines -2019

Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:37 pm

evank516 wrote:
Does Delta's consolidation mean their regional fleet is going to shrink? If so could that be related to the A220 starting soon?


It does not, it simply means there will be fewer carriers operating the airplanes. Of the 2 carriers rumored to be going away, they own none of the airplanes, as they're either DL owned or leased. They will simply have a different logo and a different d/b/a on the ticket.
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