User avatar
janders
Topic Author
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:27 pm

Updated, confirmed - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 1:58 am

PARIS, May 20 (Reuters) - Boeing Co has won a hard-fought contest to sell wide-body aircraft to Air New Zealand Ltd, beating a challenge from Europe’s Airbus, industry sources said on Monday.

The carrier, which currently operates only Boeing wide-body jets on long-haul routes and Airbus single-aisle jets on shorter ones, has been weighing a purchase of new wide-body jets to replace eight Boeing 777-200ER aircraft. Air New Zealand, Boeing and Airbus did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The airline previously has said it is examining the Airbus A350 and the Boeing 777X or 787 models, with the aim of launching longer routes like Auckland-New York and Auckland-Brazil.


https://www.reuters.com/article/air-new ... SL4N22W0HV

Suppose make senses. Stick with the family of planes you already operate.
"We make war that we may live in peace." -- Aristotle
 
x1234
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:10 am

So 777X!? Definitely enough range for AKL-EWR & AKL-GRU. Should they launch GRU they should keep EZE as EZE & GRU are the largest premium markets in South America. For GRU EK is a large driver of traffic to East Asia with the largest being Tokyo (HND & NRT) with Brazil having the largest population of ethnic Japanese outside of Japan. Maybe NZ can capture this traffic but going via AKL is the longest: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=GRU-NRT;+G ... -NRT&DU=km
 
Lufthansa
Posts: 2526
Joined: Thu May 20, 1999 6:04 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:12 am

If they do that they'll do particularly well ex Australia unless QF also gets in on that act.
 
FlyHappy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:17 am

Interesting! I smell 778... I'm thinking cargo is a deal here....
 
behramjee
Posts: 4898
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:26 am

AKL-GRU is 15 hours flying time so it’s do able using their B789 or B77W.

Commercially speaking its way better replacing their 8 B772ERs with 8-10 B789s of which they already operate 13 examples.

NYC-AKL isnt a big market to begin with ie 17,000 annual pax in 2018. There is no point ordering a B778X just to serve this route.
 
Antarius
Posts: 1410
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:34 am

The 777X in New Zealand livery will look amazing.
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD MEL DEN BLR MAA DEL KTM YYZ MEX
 
FlyHappy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:42 am

behramjee wrote:

NYC-AKL isnt a big market to begin with ie 17,000 annual pax in 2018. There is no point ordering a B778X just to serve this route.



really, seriously? that's a tiny number, kinda hard to believe. I woulda thought "Flight of the Conchords" would have enticed greater numbers ;)
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 13611
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:44 am

I would assume 787-8/9/10 ?
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
x1234
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:49 am

behramjee, the winds over the South Pacific are brutal and NZ31 (EZE-AKL west-bound) frequent becomes 13.5 hours (while only 11.5 east-bound):
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flig ... 1#208dc713

Add another 3.5 hours with reserve to GRU (2.5 hours flying time) and it becomes 16.5 hours at the edge of the 789's range though the 789 can make it but NZ's 789's have RR engines which currently have problems (they probably wish they had GE and launch GRU right now).
 
x1234
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 2:52 am

I forgot to mention the AUS/NZ to South America crossing is ETOPS 330 which requires even further fuel reserves.
 
Ellofiend
Posts: 112
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:13 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:05 am

x1234 wrote:
I forgot to mention the AUS/NZ to South America crossing is ETOPS 330 which requires even further fuel reserves.

So 747-8 then obviously :lol:
 
tealnz
Posts: 493
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:47 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:13 am

zeke wrote:
I would assume 787-8/9/10 ?

If it is indeed a win for Boeing then it seems set to be some combination of 787s - on the NZ thread there's a link to a new interview with the CFO who says it's between the 787 and the A350.
 
xxcr
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:16 am

tealnz wrote:
zeke wrote:
I would assume 787-8/9/10 ?

If it is indeed a win for Boeing then it seems set to be some combination of 787s - on the NZ thread there's a link to a new interview with the CFO who says it's between the 787 and the A350.


Maybe they'll order the 788/789 with GE engines and sell the RR ones lol
 
Ruscoe
Posts: 1733
Joined: Sun Aug 22, 1999 5:41 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:16 am

I predict a 789 with 4T increase in MTOW.
Ruscoe
 
FlyHappy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:23 am

x1234 wrote:
behramjee, the winds over the South Pacific are brutal and NZ31 (EZE-AKL west-bound) frequent becomes 13.5 hours (while only 11.5 east-bound):
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flig ... 1#208dc713

Add another 3.5 hours with reserve to GRU (2.5 hours flying time) and it becomes 16.5 hours at the edge of the 789's range though the 789 can make it but NZ's 789's have RR engines which currently have problems (they probably wish they had GE and launch GRU right now).


I smell 778! The Brazilians want Abalone!

seriously, I have no idea what this order will be, but somehow, an entire widebody fleet of only 789 seems unlikely (to me), and if they wanted to start GRU or NYC with the 789, I would think they've already done so. Given this out-the-ass assumption, I'm hard pressed to imagine what other Boeing product will make sense as they phase out the 772ER, unless the idea is to shift 789 to the extreme routes and take 78J for Asia flying.

778!
 
tealnz
Posts: 493
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:47 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:25 am

There was earlier reporting of a 1% increase in MTOW, taking advantage of the stronger wing-body join required for the 787-10. That would work out to 2.5t. Have you heard how they might achieve a 4t increase? We've heard no whispers from other sources as far as I'm aware.
 
behramjee
Posts: 4898
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 3:41 am

x1234 wrote:
behramjee, the winds over the South Pacific are brutal and NZ31 (EZE-AKL west-bound) frequent becomes 13.5 hours (while only 11.5 east-bound):
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flig ... 1#208dc713

Add another 3.5 hours with reserve to GRU (2.5 hours flying time) and it becomes 16.5 hours at the edge of the 789's range though the 789 can make it but NZ's 789's have RR engines which currently have problems (they probably wish they had GE and launch GRU right now).


Thank you for this insight.

Even if the B789 can’t make it with a full payload as you have stated, flying to GRU would be suicidal for NZ as they would be heavily reliant to feed Australia only which does not have that big demand from the city. SYD-GRU was 36,000 pax whilst MEL was 12,000 only.

Also GRU-AKL last year was only 14,000 pax so very low p2p demand to justify operating a ULH nonstop flight that would be reliant on lower yielding transfer traffic.
 
Jefford717
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:36 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 4:17 am

I can see them ordering 787-9/10 and/or 777-9. I wouldn’t be surprise if they order 787 with GE, since GEnx has slight margin in fuel burn than RR and even more on longer missions. I don’t think 777-8 makes sense (hopefully I’m wrong) since AKL-NYC market isn’t really that big. lower density 789 with about 250 seats might make better sense for AKL-NYC. AKL-GRU is doable with their current 787 seating configuration but they have RR.
 
NZ321
Posts: 1048
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 4:56 am

I doubt we will see a decision about 778 or 9 in this order. Just a top up for 787s with flexible options is my guess. But the clues have been numerous over the past months that NZ wants smaller aircraft and greater frequency is key. So I doubt the 777-9 is on the list. We shall see shortly.
Plane mad!
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 6144
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:19 am

This is great if it’s true. Boeing needs some good news lately.
 
bgm
Posts: 1973
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:28 am

BoeingGuy wrote:
This is great if it’s true. Boeing needs some good news lately.


It's hardly a surprise. All Air NZ's WB planes are Boeing, so it would make sense for fleet commonality.

However, if they had ordered some 737MAX planes and ditched their Airbus NB fleet, that would've been some seriously good news for Boeing. ;)
Sweet Home Talibama. Home of Y’all Qaeda
 
FlyHappy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:29 am

NZ321 wrote:
But the clues have been numerous over the past months that NZ wants smaller aircraft and greater frequency is key.


okay... smaller than what?
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3552
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:39 am

FlyHappy wrote:
NZ321 wrote:
But the clues have been numerous over the past months that NZ wants smaller aircraft and greater frequency is key.


okay... smaller than what?


Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.
come visit the south pacific
 
User avatar
afterburner
Posts: 1297
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 11:38 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:40 am

FlyHappy wrote:
NZ321 wrote:
But the clues have been numerous over the past months that NZ wants smaller aircraft and greater frequency is key.


okay... smaller than what?

Smaller than the ones that NZ wants to replace. 787-9 is slightly smaller than 777-200ER. It's flexible aircraft in terms of size and range.
 
Ruscoe
Posts: 1733
Joined: Sun Aug 22, 1999 5:41 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:47 am

tealnz wrote:
There was earlier reporting of a 1% increase in MTOW, taking advantage of the stronger wing-body join required for the 787-10. That would work out to 2.5t. Have you heard how they might achieve a 4t increase? We've heard no whispers from other sources as far as I'm aware.


No I heard of a 2T increase in MTOW, the 4T is pub gossip. However it makes a bit of sense, to me.
As far as I have heard, the wing is not the problem, it is the undercarriage, and the structure to support it, so if changes are to be made one would think more than the 2T would be desirable. This would also help the 10. I have no access to anything official.
As an aside but to emphasize what a difference a small increase in MTOW could mean to the 787, I have it reliably, ie from a 787 captain, who has no reason to lead me astray, that fuel flow whilst still in cruise, getting towards the end, is under 5T/hr.

Ruscoe
 
EChid
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:00 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:50 am

Well, that's disappointing. I'm surprised they'll go for the 777X. Seems contrary to their 'it's a time of constraint and capacity control' mantra of late.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
aviationaware
Posts: 2706
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 5:55 am

Everyone here expecting them to go for the 777X will be direly disappointed when they find out that all this means is that they are consolidating their long haul fleet around the 787-9.
 
User avatar
afterburner
Posts: 1297
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 11:38 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 6:12 am

bgm wrote:
However, if they had ordered some 737MAX planes and ditched their Airbus NB fleet, that would've been some seriously good news for Boeing. ;)

Which is unlikely, since the the airline ordered the Neos and is receiving them.
 
lifecomm
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:29 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 6:47 am

zeke wrote:
I would assume 787-8/9/10 ?


I would, too. Cost over additional capacity...
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6720
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 6:51 am

Motorhussy wrote:
FlyHappy wrote:
NZ321 wrote:
But the clues have been numerous over the past months that NZ wants smaller aircraft and greater frequency is key.


okay... smaller than what?


Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.


I’ll wait for firm confirmation but I won’t be surprised at all by this decision.

What do you mean they want the A359?

EChid wrote:
Well, that's disappointing. I'm surprised they'll go for the 777X. Seems contrary to their 'it's a time of constraint and capacity control' mantra of late.


What do you mean? They won’t go for the 777X, atleast not now and I doubt as a 77W replacement either myself. They will get a similar sized A359 or 78X, or the slightly smaller 789.
 
marcelh
Posts: 548
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:43 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 6:58 am

Motorhussy wrote:
Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.

Considering their relatively small WB-fleet and the replacement for only the 77E, the choice for Boeing is a no-brainer.
 
User avatar
OA940
Posts: 1707
Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 6:18 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 7:18 am

Honestly a 777X order for NZ will actually shock me. I don't see many markets they can dump a plane with its capacity on.
A350/CSeries = bae
 
smi0006
Posts: 2177
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:45 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 7:25 am

So nothing actually new here - just a rumour?
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6720
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 7:41 am

OA940 wrote:
Honestly a 777X order for NZ will actually shock me. I don't see many markets they can dump a plane with its capacity on.


Well they had 747s for 33 years and replaced them with 77Ws, granted they only fly to LAX/LHR/SFO regularly long haul and IAH seasonally sometimes.

But yes the trend is more P2P with smaller aircraft IAH/ORD/NYC where as everything used to funnel through LAX:SFO.

I do think the 77W replacement will be something smaller 787s likely imo.
 
pabloeing
Posts: 567
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:00 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 8:06 am

Fantastic order for Boeing ¡¡¡¡.....
 
TaniTaniwha
Posts: 49
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 12:04 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 8:09 am

The oldest 77W is 9 years, the youngest 4 years. Is now the time to make a decision on replacing them? I thought this latest fleet update is to replace the 77E's. which range in age from 17 years to 12 years (still not that old relative to some fleets)... with some expansion.
[photoid][/photoid][photoid][/photoid]
 
User avatar
keesje
Posts: 12773
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 8:18 am

.
Is this just more 787-9's, but it has to be celebrated at something bigger, an unexpected victory ?

Enjoy!

Image
http://www.aviationwa.org.au/aircraft-p ... mber-2014/
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
mrkerr7474
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2009 7:55 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 8:23 am

TaniTaniwha wrote:
The oldest 77W is 9 years, the youngest 4 years. Is now the time to make a decision on replacing them? I thought this latest fleet update is to replace the 77E's. which range in age from 17 years to 12 years (still not that old relative to some fleets)... with some expansion.


These new aircraft orders (whatever they will be) are to replace the 77E and NOT the 77W
 
GW54
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:05 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 8:37 am

This isn't about replacing the entire wide body fleet. It's about replacing initially some but eventually all 772's. The 778 or 779 may be a contender at a later time but not at present. This will be more 787's - 9 or 10's or possibly both.
 
AirwayBill
Posts: 76
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:37 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 9:15 am

ANZ will probably go all 787 soon. No need for several widebody aircraft types within such a "moderate-sized" airline.

Chances for an A350 order are still possible although getting slimmer, but despite the cheering, the 777X is highly unlikely, it would be total overkill in terms of capacity, would be too much dead weight and unflexible on most of their routes.
 
User avatar
keesje
Posts: 12773
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 10:13 am

It seems 777X or A350 would be only on the table if the 77W's need to be replaced.
They already have 13 787-9's, keep it simple..
If they didn't order 787's, that would be news.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6720
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 10:31 am

keesje wrote:
It seems 777X or A350 would be only on the table if the 77W's need to be replaced.
They already have 13 787-9's, keep it simple..
If they didn't order 787's, that would be news.


Well all 787/77X/A350 were on the table although the 77X dropped out.

You are right though that keeping it simple with a small fleet by world standards. If indeed it is 787s I’m not at all surprised. Mainly 78Xs is my pick.
 
StudiodeKadent
Posts: 366
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:43 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 10:43 am

I'm surprised given that the A350 was a better capacity match for the 777-200ERs and also had the A350-1000 version to replace the 77Ws down the road... BUT if NZ want to do more fragmentation and want more frequency, then in theory the 787-9 could give them all they need at least with a PIP/MTOW-increase or two. And perhaps a premium-heavy cabin if they want to fly AKL - EWR.
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3552
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 11:43 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Motorhussy wrote:
FlyHappy wrote:

okay... smaller than what?


Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.


I’ll wait for firm confirmation but I won’t be surprised at all by this decision.

What do you mean they want the A359?


I mean they want a plane that can fly AKL-EWR/GRU/ORD without having to block off seats and without compromising revenue by leaving the belly mostly empty.
come visit the south pacific
 
User avatar
frigatebird
Posts: 1617
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:02 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:25 pm

Motorhussy wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Motorhussy wrote:

Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.


I’ll wait for firm confirmation but I won’t be surprised at all by this decision.

What do you mean they want the A359?


I mean they want a plane that can fly AKL-EWR/GRU/ORD without having to block off seats and without compromising revenue by leaving the belly mostly empty.

I'm not so sure the 787-9 is that much worse payload/range wise compared to the A359. If the A359 would generate additional revenue outweighing the cost of having a small subfleet of Airbus WB's, Airbus would have got the order, simple as that. It's not that NZ is averse to buying Airbus aircraft, on the contrary.

StudiodeKadent wrote:
I'm surprised given that the A350 was a better capacity match for the 777-200ERs and also had the A350-1000 version to replace the 77Ws down the road... BUT if NZ want to do more fragmentation and want more frequency, then in theory the 787-9 could give them all they need at least with a PIP/MTOW-increase or two. And perhaps a premium-heavy cabin if they want to fly AKL - EWR.

The A350-1000 did seem a perfect future 77W replacement, I agree. But I bet NZ has secured purchase rights for the 777-9 too ;)
146,318/19/20/21, AB6,332,333,343,345,388, 722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9, 742,74E,744,752,762,763, 772,77E,773,77W,788 AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E75/90,F50/70
 
tealnz
Posts: 493
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:47 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:45 pm

Choice of 787 as their 77E replacement, if Reuters is correct, really only makes sense as part of a strategy of tight restraint in capital spending over the next few years. The 789 doesn't give them the payload/range they could have got from the 359. (Might we see one or two additional 77Ws in the mix for cheap lift?) Then we stand by for a 77W replacement contest in the mid-2020s in which it will be A350-1000neo against 77X. If demand has grown sufficiently by then to allow a fleet of reasonable size the A350 would be the one to beat.
 
StudiodeKadent
Posts: 366
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:43 am

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:55 pm

frigatebird wrote:

StudiodeKadent wrote:
I'm surprised given that the A350 was a better capacity match for the 777-200ERs and also had the A350-1000 version to replace the 77Ws down the road... BUT if NZ want to do more fragmentation and want more frequency, then in theory the 787-9 could give them all they need at least with a PIP/MTOW-increase or two. And perhaps a premium-heavy cabin if they want to fly AKL - EWR.

The A350-1000 did seem a perfect future 77W replacement, I agree. But I bet NZ has secured purchase rights for the 777-9 too ;)


Problem is that the 777-9 is almost certainly too big for NZ, except perhaps on the AKL-LAX-LHR route (which apparently is very high-yield by NZ standards).

If NZ want something bigger than the 787-9 and it needs long range capability (thus ruling out the 787-10), the alternatives are the A359, A35K and 777-8. Probably the only one of these that can really increase NZ's capabilities range-wise is the 777-8, but even if Qantas get a souped up 777-8 for Project Sunrise that doesn't mean NZ will be able to use the same jet for AKL-LHR.

Perhaps, and this is just speculating, NZ may prefer to start using smaller jets to more cities at higher frequencies. As a longer-term model. We may see them look into the 788 (apparently a new version with much more commonality etc. will be made soon) and perhaps not buy any jets in the 360+ size category at all. And IIRC, Auckland is getting a second runway soon so they probably aren't going to have to worry about slot restrictions for a while.

That said, who knows? Maybe a low-density 787-10 could theoretically reach LA (and from there it could absolutely do London). Longer-range 787s do everything else.
Last edited by StudiodeKadent on Mon May 20, 2019 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 4254
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:55 pm

We're really only talking about EWR and GRU for the ULH plane being needed. But, what if NZ has a strategy to deal with that, which doesn't require getting a dedicated ULH sub-fleet? Think NZ's JVs. Could they get UA to fly their more premium 789s on EWR - AKL, and maybe SQ, CA, CX or someone else to fly AKL - GRU on a 359, as an extension from Asia? Highly unlikely - I know - but perhaps CA could replace their MAD stop with an AKL one, for their PEK - GRU service?

:hyper:

Cheers,

C.
 
FlyHappy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 1:06 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:55 pm

Motorhussy wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Motorhussy wrote:

Smaller than then the 778. They don't want all that extra weight. They want the A359 but don't want to diversify the fleet.


I’ll wait for firm confirmation but I won’t be surprised at all by this decision.

What do you mean they want the A359?


I mean they want a plane that can fly AKL-EWR/GRU/ORD without having to block off seats and without compromising revenue by leaving the belly mostly empty.


ummmmm.... isn't the name of that aircraft 777-8 ?

at least for AKL-EWR (7655nm):

B789 - empty belly, maybe blocked seat?
A359 - empty belly, maybe blocked seat?
B778 - not an empty belly, well-sardine'd pax

so, what exactly am I missing here?

Oh, right - others in this thread have stated there's no traffic between NYC-AKL . So why does Air NZ want to fly this ULH folly? (I'm serious)

Everyone says "fleet too small for multiple types".... errrrrr... aside from having a split fleet now (does NZ share pilot pool 787/777 ?), being a remote, but wealthy island with significant import/export needs, strong tourism, and aspirations to grow its TPAC connector , it seems to me they have unique fleet requirements. I can't think of another nation with similar aviation needs and opportunities; I'm not sure that they have to be held in the same box of rules as others.
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 4254
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: Report - Air NZ picks Boeing for wide-body order

Mon May 20, 2019 12:58 pm

StudiodeKadent wrote:
NZ may prefer to start using smaller jets to more cities at higher frequencies. As a longer-term model.

That may not work work longer term, as many of the ports are more and more slot restricted - HKG, PVG, HND - LAX also isn't easy to optimise. They can mitigate some of this by using JV partners, as with CX and HKG, I guess.

Cheers,

C.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos