krisworldB777
Posts: 556
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SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 12:43 am

This afternoon it has been reported that Boeing 777-200 9V-SQF made an emergency landing after takeoff from Taipei's Chiang Kai Shek Airport with problems with the Number 2 engine. As of 2345 TPE time, the aircraft has not departed and is without status.

Any more info would be appreciated.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:20 am

Unfortunately, an SIA 772 has been involved in an incident at TPE Chiang Kai Shek Airport.

SQ983 returned to TPE thankfully due to the skill of the pilot and the fault was discovered.

Singapore Airlines is making arrangements for the unfortunate passengers at TPE airport.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
baec777
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:27 am

What kind of fault was there to be found wrong with SIA 772......??

baec
 
ammunition
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:31 am

China Airlines Pilot Syndrome? CAPS?
Saint Augustine- 'The world is a book and those who do not travel, read only 1 page'
 
spk
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:49 am

So, this question will come up again. Will this jeopardize SIA's ETOPS? Will they ever get ETOPS 180?
 
9V-SVE
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:50 am

The third SQ 777 emergancy landing! I doubt they will ever get ETOPS 207. I now Tesna will be so happy about this.
 
hkgspotter1
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:58 am

"SQ983 returned to TPE thankfully due to the skill of the pilot and the fault was discovered"

The skill of the pilot !!, what for he landed the plane.
 
tsentsan
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 2:03 am

Looks like SIA's ETOPS 180 is gone~!!!!
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Guest

RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 3:03 am

2 emergency landing in Taiwan on the same day...
 
CX829
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 3:11 am

Antmore details about this emergency landing, pls post thanks.
 
jhooper
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 7:42 am

Is it possible that ETOPS for the 777 could be revoked alltogether if we have more problems with the engines?
Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
 
krisworldB777
Posts: 556
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 7:21 pm

Right now would be a very good time for Singapore Airlines to investigate the feasibility of engine changes on the fleet of 777s as these In-flight shutdowns have become something of a recurrence for them and other airlines, namely Emirates who is also battling and to a lesser extent Thai and Cathay who have also had their fair share of problems relative to the fleet size. Before any of you question SIA’s maintenance, you should be aware of the rarity of problems with the airline’s fleet of A310, B744 and A343s which especially for the 747-400 is an extraordinary performance considering the 39 passenger variants in service currently. Perhaps the time has come for airlines to demand RR do something to fix this recurring problem or simply take their business elsewhere to GE or PW.
 
boeing767-300
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 7:35 pm

"Perhaps the time has come for airlines to demand RR do something to fix this recurring problem or simply take their business elsewhere to GE or PW. "

KrisworldB777 I could not agree more. What with the RR problem for Delta in South Africa and The Malaysia problem in Perth and now this.

It makes me wonder why Singapore who have such a fine record with Pratt and Whitney on the 744s went to Rolls Royce in the first place.

In this day an age engine reliability should not be an issue and it appears RR is letting down Boeing PW and GE on the ETOPs issues.

I would still fly the twin anyday and the aforementioned problem is more procedural rather than "an emergencey"

My 2 cents worth
 
tsentsan
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 8:26 pm

FYI SIA are having lots of problems with their PWs on the 744s... the PWs seem to dislike flying...cos they refuse to startup almost too often.
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krisworldB777
Posts: 556
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 8:48 pm

Tsentsan, I’m most intrigued to learn of the unreliability of the Pratts on SIA’s 744s. Has this long been the case or simply a factor of the graceful aging process? I know that the Fokker 50 is a difficult engine to start and has been a problem since its introduction to service during the eighties, perhaps the PW suffers the same problem? The one time I flew on SIA’s 747-300 BIGTOP in 1998 I remember the engines were started whilst boarding was still in early precession and wondered whether there was difficulty getting them started during her last days of service. When you compare the ages of the 747 to the 777 there is no doubt the 747 has had a far superior track record with very few emergency landings and when you look at the causes, they are mostly caused by faulty pressurisation, avionics or hydraulic problems, not the fault of the engine itself. I’d be hard pressed to remember any incident where the 777 as an airframe has had mechanical defects, instead the RR Trent is causing the trouble. Perhaps SIA should put the RR Trent on the 744 and have the 4 PW 4056 on the wings of the 777!  Big thumbs up
 
Skystar
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 9:37 pm

The JT9Ds on the 743 were apparently a real pain to startup in hot weather & were quite tempremental.

When I flew on the AN744, the crew said that the PW4056 was reliable. It did its job on our flight.

How are the GE90s behaving on 777s these days?

Cheers,

Justin
 
Mr.BA
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 9:42 pm

I do think it's the maintenance that's at fault. No reason to blame RR here. Malaysia's incident at Perth I reckon was a pretty rare case. I believe MAS utilises their B777s heavily on international routes and they are getting one fine with it. Cathay and British Airways are doing fine with the RR trents on the B777s. Don't really see why anyone would think RR should shoulder the blame here.

alvin
Boeing747 万岁!
 
Mr.BA
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 9:44 pm

By the way, would appreciate any information on what's the problem on that trent on SQF.

Thanks!

alvin
Boeing747 万岁!
 
krisworldB777
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 31, 2002 10:19 pm

Mr.BA, I beg to differ that this is a maintenance woe. Thai, Singapore, Malaysia and Emirates have all endured multiple IFSDs on their 777s but I am unaware of those regarding CX, AA and DL although I do know that there have been several examples from each. SIA now has one of the largest fleets of 777s with around 30 in service now but there appears only to be problems with the older variant, the Trent 884. So perhaps RR have considered and acted upon the older engine’s shortcomings with the introduction of the Trent 892 but this still leaves airlines in the lurch with the older models. I think that the problems are far too common for it to be the fault only of SIA maintenance. In actual fact, SIA has been lucky so far compared with Emirates and Malaysia Airlines which have both suffered severe engine failures / explosions. Maintenance is out of the question here. These are new aircraft playing up, as demonstrated by 9V-SRG’s failure last year whilst under 6 months old. I don’t think any airline could have muffed maintenance to such a level in such a short period of time.

On a sidenote, I haven’t heard anything in regards to SQF but I believe it was due to arrive into Singapore 24 hours late in the early evening. Perhaps someone would like to check its schedule.

Cheers all, KRISWORLD
 
Mr.BA
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 12:02 am

If that's the case what's the deal of CAAS refusing to allow SIA of 180 ETOPS?

Cheers!

alvin
Boeing747 万岁!
 
tsentsan
Posts: 1921
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 2:29 am

I guess all engines are bound for failures. Look at today's Qantas 63 SYD-JNB.. had to divert to PER due engine oil leak. I guess they shut number 1 down in flight, heard on the airband they requesting engine runs for no. 1 at gate.
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rmm
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 11:40 am

First I must state that SQ is my preffered carrier and this post is in no way dregrading there maintenance.

After Ansett collapsed SQ advertised for engineers in several different fields, one of these was for inspectors in there engine shop. A friend of mine was interviewed for one of these positions (unsuccessful). He said he was told during the interview that they were experiencing a quality control problem in there engine shop. They didn't mention a specific engine type. Don't know if this ties in with there present problems on the Trent.

As for the PW4000, they had some severe stalling problems during the mid 90's and an AD put out against this issue.

How are AA's Trent powered 777 going? Never hear much about any problems there.

Rmm
 
aviasian
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 1:53 pm

Are we all putting the cart in front of the horse?

We do not know the nature of the engine problem . . . yet there is a great debate on everything from the reliability of the RR Trent engines, the airline's maintenance . . . and some argue with great authority too!

I have flown on SIA's B744s so many times I have lost count, but I have NEVER known of one single instance when engine-start is a problem. 9V-SMA and 9V-SMB had lots of software problems in the first months of service . . . does anyone have some kind of comprehensive log showing such engine-start problems, and then match it with the very high number of flights operated by the B744s . . . and then show us how this amount to being branded such a significant problem?

KC Sim
Bangkok

 
carmy
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 1:57 pm

Good point raised by KC, and I share his sentiments. Everyone seems to be so fervently discussing how SQ seems to have much problems maintaining their engines, even though most, if not all of us don't even know the nature of the problem because we are not privy to the SQ's maintenence records. I'm just wondering if anyone has access to the confidential engine maintenence records that show that SQ is indeed having much problems with their RR Trent or any other engines?
 
tsentsan
Posts: 1921
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 2:58 pm

I fairly suspect SIA's maintenance having problems with the RR Trents on ONLY their -200s. Its became a suspicion ever since SIA's been having so much engine problems.

Not sure if this is true, but one 777-200IGW had a problem with a Trent inflight, what were the crew instructed to do? Throttle back the engine to idle, and fly on the remaining engine. Now that occured whilst they were in the vicinity of DPS, and they flew all the way back to SIN, instead of diverting to DPS.

The records are of course confidential. I havent spoken to a reservist friend of mine who happened to be an SIA engineer, but he works on the Pratts, doesnt really know those Rollerblades...

But I dare say, not one SIA 777 flight I have taken has there been engine problem. Cant say the same for the 747-400 though... been on 9V-SPL.. and it was declared U/S after landing in Per due to a cracked cargo door. Imagine it was cracked before it left SIN, and gee, i wouldnt want to be on it when it blew.....

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9V-SVA
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 6:10 pm

I have never experienced an engine problem on the four 773s I've been on.(SYA,C,D,F)

9V-SVA
9V-SVA | B772ER
 
aviasian
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 8:08 pm

If the B777 could fly all the way back to SIN on one good engine instead of going the little bit more to Denpasar (DPS), then it could not have been such a serious problem.

SIA could have decided to bring the plane back to SIN due to better engineering backup at Changi. It is better than having an AOG in a place where there is a shortage of ground engineers and equipment for an engine removal.

Just my uneducated guess.

KC Sim
Bangkok
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 8:28 pm

Any comments intended to undermine the Trent 800's proven record of solid reliability and/or Singapore Airlines maintenance are totally ignorant and baseless.

These things happen from time to time, and that is why Boeing designed the 777 the way they did. The aircraft returned to TPE, landed safely, and that was that. What's the problem?
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
CX Flyboy
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 9:58 pm

Aviasian,

A single engine failure on a twin jet is classified as an emergency, and the aircraft must divert into the nearest suitable airfield. This phrase itself has been in debate, especially in Cathay, when one of our 777s diverted into Kunming following an engine failure a while back, being the closest airfield. Management then argued that it was not suitable because they did not have the engineering facilities there!! How ridiculous is that!!
 
krisworldB777
Posts: 556
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2000 10:28 pm

RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 10:08 pm

DeltaSFO I beg to differ. I genuinely believe that the RR Trent is a fine engine on an equally fine airframe and is most definitely the most modern jet engine available due to its multiple spool design, patented by Rolls Royce. This enforces the Trent 800’s superb sales and efficiency and has undoubtedly become the most popular amongst the world’s finest airlines such as Singapore Airlines, British Airways, Cathay Pacific and Delta Airlines. While I’m most certainly not a pilot or engineer, I do have an uncle who is a former Cathay Pacific 777 training captain. When the 777 was initially released and in subsequent months he noted that the engine was superb on paper however had been released too soon, preventing proper and thorough testing which would in turn have allowed RR to develop and refine their new engine further. RR was aware of this and have done their best to rectify the problems I would imagine and you hear of very few 777s with Trent 892s enduring engine failures so perhaps it was fixable and has been fixed. But at the same time, you also need to look at the number of 773s flying. For memory, I think only Japan Airlines, All Nippon Airways, Korean Air, Cathay Pacific, Thai Airways, Singapore Airlines and Emirates operate them. Questioning the maintenance of particular airlines is fruitless however there is a problem here and it needs to be rectified. A 5-month old aircraft should not endure a potentially catastrophic engine failure so soon into its life. In regards to ETOPS, which airlines actually use it? Delta, American, British Airways, Korean Air and Singapore Airlines are the only which come to mind and who operates the most of the type on the most routes doing the most cycles? Singapore Airlines. ETOPS 180 will not be revoked but if it is, all hell will break loose and RR will be the ones left red-faced.
 
9V-SVE
Posts: 1953
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RE: SIA 777 Makes Emergency Landing

Mon Apr 01, 2002 10:23 pm

I think EK had an engine blow on one of their 773s?

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