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NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:19 am

Lots of speculation always on this board about when and with what NWA will replace their 9s.

Many are hoping for the 717. My question is: Is the 717 large enough and does it have enough range to do the same job the 9s do for NWA now?
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:22 am

It's just like a DC-9 and mabye it could replace it but I doubt it. What about the A318? Could that replace them? This is just a guess and some wondering in it. It would be cool to see them have 717's just like in the Flight Sim world.
"He was right, it is a screaming metal deathtrap!"-Cosmo (from the Fairly Oddparents)
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:28 am

My guess is that the plan is to replace DC-9's with RJ's and more A319's.
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:54 am

A319s cover it. That's the replacement we're seeing more and more often here at KCLE. The 717 was ruled out relatively early, I think.

Up, up and away!
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 12:01 pm

NW is planning of flying the DC-9s up to about 100,000 cycles. A pilot friend of mine says that if NW keeps them around for that long the final 4 DC-9s will be around until 2027. I don't think that NW will keep them that long but they are looking to keep them around for at least another 8-10 years. They have plans to replace the first 75 DC-9s, scheduled for retirement, with A319s. Possibly by the time they are ready to replace them all the A319 will be the smallest aircaft NW will need. We'll just have to be patient and see.
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 12:48 pm

NW and Sas were both origional MD-95 (717)
both airlines bailed i expect to see more buses... but the 9 has 10 more years of good service
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 1:08 pm

Dandy_Don, I got to hand it to you, at least you asked this topic in a good way. You actually want to make it intelligent, instead of the usual. "When's NW gonna get those 717's" This topic is discussed weekly, but at least you are asking a valid question on whether it COULD work.

The thing about the DC-9 fleet is that it is so varied. NW operates the 10, 30, 40, and 50 versions.

Current DC-9 Fleet: 169
-10's 8 a/c 78 pax
-30's 114 a/c 100 pax
-40's 12 a/c 110 pax
-50's 35 a/c 125 pax

The replacement suitable for the -50's would be the A319, which holds 124 pax. However, the -50's are significantly newer, and less cycles than the older 10's, 30's, and 40's. The -50's are from the late 70's & early 80's. As stated before in early posts about the DC-9 retirement schedule has no set dates or anything like that. Around 100,000 cycles they will be pulled from service. Also, 75 A319 replacements.

I take warning when saying this, but yes, the 717 COULD work for SOME of the DC-9 replacement. I'm not saying it will or anything like that or it fits with their fleet or whatnot.....but from a purely factual basis, yes. Its range could cover the low end DC-9 routes and capacity-wise at the smaller end of the spectrum. With the addition of the A319's, the stage length of the DC-9's routes have been shortened. The A319's have the ability to fly both long and short. For the most part, they are flying the longer routes. One exception would be DTW-GRR (120 miles)..the DC-9's are left for the short hops such as DTW-LAN, DTW-FNT, DTW-CLE, however there are some -9's going to Florida from DTW and to the East Coast from MSP. This just goes to show that the DC-9's are all over the place.

As its been said before, the fellas up in MSP know what they are doing. Since they will have 75 A319's to replace the first of the DC-9's to be retired, they puts them in pretty good shape for a while. They will worry about the remainder when the time comes, and see what the market holds.
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Fri Apr 19, 2002 1:37 pm

The ARJ-85 was supposed to replace the DC-9-10 series and has replaced several of them, but there are still a few 10 series in the fleet.

The 717 would be good on the DTW-Flint and Lansing segments along with Cleveland and ORD. Being that I am a fan of variety I would like to see NW take both the A318 and 717, but we all know that airlines don't pick fleets to please spotters.
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:19 am

I don't the 717 idea has every truely been ruled out. As mentioned before NW has options for 75 319/320 a/c that will begin to replace the DC9 fleet. With the 319/320 and RJs flooding the fleet, they pretty much have the high and low capasity end DC9 markets covered (DC9-10 and DC9-50). The middle DC9 market (DC9-30/40) is where the 717 might fit best. The 318 would be good for cockpit/training commonality but presents a few issues airlines will have to deal with. Namely engines and gate ops. I would predict that NW will watch the 318 closely once it enters service to prove its reliability and cost effectiveness.

Until the dudes in MSP make announcements though, (besides the 75 319/320 to replace the first batch of DC9s) everything is speculation.

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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Sun Apr 21, 2002 3:56 am

NWA has looked at the operating costs between their DC-9s and AirTran's 717s, and found that their DC-9s operated at a slightly less cost as AirTran's 717s and had nearly an identical dispatch rate. Unless NWA is using some Enron fuzzy math, I really don't think those numbers add up.
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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Sun Apr 21, 2002 9:05 am

How does it not add up? Airtran has to take into consideration the monthly payments made on their planes. NW doesn't... they own them outright. It makes complete sense.

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RE: NWA, DC-9s And 717s

Sun Apr 21, 2002 10:47 am

Another week and another discussion on a replacement for NWA's -9s. I think this has been covered before, the -9 will reman for a long time, probably outlst production of the 717.

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