atcboy73
Posts: 1084
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2001 10:09 am

BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 4:47 am

JustPlanes.com has reported that BA has cancelled half of thier order for A318s. Well, actually more than that.

From 12 firm to 6 firm and cancelled an additional 12 options.

Anyone know how many firm orderes and options they had before this.

And what do you think this means for the future of the A318.

p.s. Dont take offense to the title of this topic, please, its been a long and busy day and I really like Airbus aircraft.
 
Ivo
Posts: 312
Joined: Wed Sep 13, 2000 1:49 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 5:00 am

they ordered 4 A321-200 instead.

Ivo
 
aamd11
Posts: 863
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RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 5:22 am

They ordered A321s instead????
Interesting.

Thanks Ivo
 
Lekky-Man
Posts: 392
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 4:40 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 6:03 am

Why oh why have they ordered A321's instead?
And why only 4?
Do they feel they won't have enough work for approx 16 A318's, or what?

LM
 
dynkrisolo
Posts: 1825
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2001 12:12 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 6:16 am

Atcboy73:

One of the answers you wanted is in your own post. BA ordered 12 A318s with options on another 12.

What's the future of the A318? It's like the B736. Neither of them is very economical. It might make some sense for airlines with a large A319/320/321 fleet who need a plane with 100 seats. Otherwise, airlines are better off looking at the ERJ-190, CRJ900, 928Jet, that is if Fairchild Dornier survives, or even the B717.

Lekky-Man:

Why did BA order the A321? IMO, they made a wrong decision of ordering the A318 to replace some of BA's B757s which BA sold to DHL via Boeing when they ordered the A318. With the A318 delay, BA has the opportunity to correct that mistake. BA doesn't really need the B757 range. The A321 is probably a better fit for them. If the A321 works well in BA's fleet, they can always order more as they have quite a few options on the Airbus narrowbody.
 
David_itl
Posts: 5961
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2001 7:39 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 6:16 am


The A318s were intended to go to MAN & BHX but with the Future Size and Shape Report coming out, they reassessed their needs:

The RJ100s at LGW will now go to MAN & BHX
BHX A319s to LHR
MAN 737s to LGW

Theoretically, this should reduce operating costs by reducing the number of different aircraft types at MAN, BHX & LGW. Perhaps a beancounter may elaborate?

With the RJ100s being operated outside London, the personnel at MAN & BHX would have to introduce these into the schedules over 6 to 12 months and I doubt it would be worthwhile for them to introduce another new type within a couple of years.

I think the A321s may well see action on the domestic shuttle routes. I would imagine that this is the first order for the A321 from BA for operation by themselves, with the next order coming along in 2003/2004.

David/MAN
 
vfw614
Posts: 3168
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 12:34 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 6:26 am

The interesting thing is that SPEEDNEWS reports that BA switched orders for 6 A318s into 4 A321 and now has a total of 5(!) A321s on order.
 
ba777-236
Posts: 645
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2001 11:35 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 7:26 am

Why oh why have they ordered A321's instead?
And why only 4?

"Lekky-Man" To answer your question, I think that BA is ordering those A321's for their subsidaries like GB Airways which already has 2 321's in service.

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But I have to admit, the A321 looks good in Union Jack colors!
I like British Airways! I'm not sure why, but I do! ;-)
 
hkgspotter1
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Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:43 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 9:30 am

Airlines should be made to order the A318 because it looks so.......CUTE !!
 
aamd11
Posts: 863
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2001 11:54 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 11:29 am

I know that already 321s are on order for BMED and GB Airways... the BMED order is for 5 or so isnt it?? and the GB airways one is for another couple... so i think when they are all delievered there should be around 10-12 in service... and i can see them ordering more when Euro traffic demands it again... if it ever does...
 
TWAMD-80
Posts: 962
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 8:25 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 12:28 pm

I'm not sure of the future of the A318, but it looks as if it may end up like the Boeing 717.  Sad Hopefully both will get some firm orders.

TW
Two A-4's, left ten o'clock level continue left turn!
 
Rick767
Posts: 2613
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2000 8:11 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:02 pm

BMed are now operating two A321s in the Union Jack scheme (G-MEDF and DG I think).

They have returned 2 A320s to the lessor as a result. The fleet will become 4 A321s and 1 A320 by the year end I am (fairly reliably!) informed.

They can't get rid of the last A320 and swap it for an A321 as they want to, since it has 10 years to go on it's lease and the lessor won't take it back early without a severe penalty. That's what I heard anyway...
I used to love the smell of Jet-A in the morning...
 
Banco
Posts: 14343
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 11:56 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:46 pm

BA777236, Neither GB Airways nor BMed are subsidiaries of BA, they are independent franchises. As such, BA cannot order on their behalf. GB and BMed will make their own decisions on aircraft procurement.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
boeing767-300
Posts: 621
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 11:23 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:47 pm

It would appear from the lack of 736's A318s or Even 717s is that if Airline have fleets of 737s or A320s it may not be economical to go too small.

It would be more viable to go A319 or 737 700 and use the extra capacity. The diffrence in operating cost may be so little that the smaller 318 or 736 may save you little and cost potentional capacity (20 seats of revenue)

The Regional jet has better operating costs in relation to the number of passengers carried???? that is my guess. Its a bit like light rail vs heavy rail for urban transport. The construction of the A318/736 in more like the "heavy rail" and the RJs are of lighter construction and therefore lower operating costs.

In other words if your operating a 736 or A318 you may as well operate a 737 or 738 or A319 A320 or even A321

The larger models are not handicapped by short runways/performance like they used to.

 
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mighluss
Posts: 965
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2001 12:11 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:55 pm

TWAMD-80:

But as I know, the difference between 717 and 318 is that 717 is a single product line, and 318 is in the A32x family, with a lot of commonality with his big brothers, and can stand with very few orders.

Hopefully the 717 will stand, as is a great plane (doesn't had a recent order from ...Midwest?)

Anyway, who has ordered the A318 until today?

Miquel.
Miquel.
 
aerosol
Posts: 497
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2000 10:31 pm

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:55 pm

Will the A318 be allowed to fly to the London City Airport?

Thankx,

Kjell
 
717fan
Posts: 1975
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 10:51 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Thu Apr 25, 2002 1:56 am

Mighluss,
The A-318 has not received any order this year..
BA, Egypt Air, Air China, Frontier and America West plus some leasing companys has the 318 on order, I think.
Total 112 aircraft.
 
fly707
Posts: 340
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2001 9:43 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Thu Apr 25, 2002 6:14 am

I heared a rumour that Egypt Air converted their order of 5 Airbus 318 to Airbus 320s .
Can any one confirm !!
Without mistakes we will never learn
 
dynkrisolo
Posts: 1825
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2001 12:12 am

RE: BA Looking A Little Poo Poo At The A318

Thu Apr 25, 2002 9:24 am

Air France, ILFC, GECAS, and CIT Group have also ordered the A318. The total should be 108 not 112. I have not heard about EgyptAir's conversion.

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