f.pier
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Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sat May 04, 2002 10:03 pm

In another topic there is the question if the 380 will replace the 747.

What about the SC.

Despite it's not as fast as Concorde, I think the Concorde is "THE PLANE".

I don't think the SC will replace it in the hearts.
 
airsicknessbag
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sat May 04, 2002 10:06 pm

LOL, let´s wait and see whether the Pacific Fragmenter will be ever built (which I doubt).

Daniel Smile
 
dragogoalie
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sat May 04, 2002 10:09 pm

Yes and no. They are really two very different aircraft. The one thing I really like about the SC is that it will be more economical then the concorde allowing people other than millionares to fly it. But the sC will not come anywhere close to matching the concorde when it comes to speed.

--dragogoalie-#88--
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hkgspotter1
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sat May 04, 2002 10:26 pm

Daniel,

Thats what I wanted to say !
 
Eddy Cheuk
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Concorde Forever!

Sat May 04, 2002 10:33 pm

Concorde is the classic supersonic civil jet. how can they replaced by the others? Even Concorde is old now, but I still love these speedbirds, esp the British Airways Concorde. Long life the Concorde !!!
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sat May 04, 2002 10:38 pm

Nothing will replace the Concorde, it's a prestigous and unique plane, a symbol of style,wealth,speed and power. But i hope the sonic cruiser becomes a reality, the speed of sound looks exciting to me!

Arsenal@LHR
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transswede
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 12:01 am

First, lets see if the SC ever becomes reality. I want to see specs, a launch customer, and a launch date before that questions can even be considered.
 
mika
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 4:12 am

I hope it doesn't become reality.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 4:34 am

Not in the slightest! No!
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
voodoo
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 6:40 am

.... Fuhgettaboutit! ....
____--------------____
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Klaus
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 6:42 am

The only thing the SC has in common with Concorde is a (very) superficial similarity in shape. I don´t see how they relate otherwise...
 
gordonroxburgh
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 8:08 am

Probably not:

Being British what really make Concorde Special is what the UK and France managed to achieve against all the odds, both technically and poiltically.

Concorde no matter how knocked it is always bounces back - A "Technological Icarus" as many have been heard to say.

Yes the SC may have similar stunning looks but what makes Concorde Special is not just the physical appearence of the aircraft but the Human story behind it: Be it the people that created it, worked on it, travelled on it, operate it today or just turn up to see it; for all of them it is really something special, something to be proud of.

Gordon
(Webmaster - www.concordesst.com)
 
Klaus
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 9:00 am

Gordonroxburgh: Concorde no matter how knocked it is always bounces back - A "Technological Icarus" as many have been heard to say.

Didn´t you mean phoenix? Icarus burnt, crashed and died, if I remember correctly...  Wink/being sarcastic

Gordonroxburgh: Yes the SC may have similar stunning looks but what makes Concorde Special is not just the physical appearence of the aircraft but the Human story behind it: Be it the people that created it, worked on it, travelled on it, operate it today or just turn up to see it; for all of them it is really something special, something to be proud of.

Definitely! Even if the SC will be a fantastic achievement on its own if they actually manage to pull it off.

Gordonroxburgh: Gordon (Webmaster - www.concordesst.com)

Oh, that´s you! Excellent work!  Big thumbs up
 
ual777contrail
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 10:02 am

well hell yes it will, i dont think the concorde is all that great.i dont live in NYC or CHICAGO WE dont get to see the concorde and when i have? not that awesome. it was cool, even when the SC comes out it wont be as cool as a 777 or a 747.IMO




ual 777 contrail
 
j.mo
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 10:30 am

I really don't understand how a person can be an aviation enthusiast and NOT want a whole new airframe to become reality. They can't keep stretching 737's and A340's forever!  Yeah sure
How exciting it will be to get away from the design we have had for 50 years. As far as the Concorde goes, it is a really neat airplane, I will never fly on it. Nobody wanted it so the French and British had to eat it. Sorry,

Jeremy
 
IMissPiedmont
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 11:05 am

Might I point the naysayers to the Barrons issue from May, 1? Looks more and more likely that the CS will become reality.
As for the original question. The Concorde,as well as the 747, will be the most recognized aircraft for most of our lives. I intentinally avoid mentinoning it having a place in my heart. Besides the obvious technical aspects, I really don't care much for it.
The day you stop learning is the day you should die.
 
Commander Data
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 2:01 pm

Since I hate Boeing I hate the Sonic Crusier. I cannot stand the way it looks. It sucks the whole look, and feel out of an airplane. I personally I love the Concorde, not as much as the DC-9, or MD-80, but its pretty high up there.
 
OO-AOG
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 2:06 pm

Of course not, Concorde is the greatest airliner ever buildt!
Falcon....like a limo but with wings
 
GDB
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 4:31 pm

Lets see, Mach 0.98 or Mach 2.02?
Gordon's right, the Concorde story is an aviation soap-opera classic.
It was probably the last major airliner designed without substantial computer aids.
It could have sold better, but bad luck in timing (the 1970's oil crisis), and an element of 'Not Invented Here' from across the Atlantic, (after the B2707 got axed), very nearly made it a stillborn project, along with the usual British habit of cancelling projects.
In that respect Concorde showed the way forward, European collaboration was the only way for the UK to still be a player in airliner construction-even that lesson took some time to sink in.
Every time the aircraft roars into the air, to me it's like giving all those who tried to stop it the finger.
The SC is coming into a very different political and economic enviroment.
I just hope those who board it don't expect a 3.5 hour trip across the Atlantic!
(Boeing will probably call it the world's fastest airliner!)
Of course the SC will be a much more versatile, flexible aircraft.
It will be interesting to see if later versions will be capable of Mach 1.2 or thereabouts.



 
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VapourTrails
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 5:07 pm

No - never!

Mach 0.98 or Mach 2.02? Well, that says it all! Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Concorde is special, and a Mach 0.98 SC is not that much of a big deal to me. I may feel differently in the future, but nothing will replace the unique qualities of Concorde for many, many years - if ever.

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backfire
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 5:52 pm

IMHO the romanticism that surrounds Concorde just disguises the fact that it was a commercial failure, built simply to avoid political fall-out, written off at considerable expense to the taxpayer, with design flaws that were ignored despite repeated warnings.

Sure, it looks pretty. But there are other aircraft which, for my money, have earned their success.
 
jmc757
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 9:59 pm

"The one thing I really like about the SC is that it will be more economical....."

Don't get me wrong i repesct your viewpoint, but come on. These aircraft are nearly 40 years apart! of course the SC will be a lot more economic, look at the technological advances since concorde was designed!!

It'll always be concorde for me  Smile

"...and an element of 'Not Invented Here' from across the Atlantic, (after the B2707 got axed), ..."

Well said.. couldn't agree more.

jmc757

 
f.pier
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 10:28 pm

If Boeing wants to make something special, why doesn't it study a new Concorde, which flies at more than 2.0 Mach and with the 2002 technology?

I think that it should be a good idea.

I am an Airbus fan, but sincerely I wouldn't like to fly the SC, it looks like an ugly Concorde, but the speed performance is quite depressive.

I'd like to see a 2002-2005 technology Concorde.
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 11:04 pm

IMHO the romanticism that surrounds Concorde just disguises the fact that it was a commercial failure, built simply to avoid political fall-out, written off at considerable expense to the taxpayer, with design flaws that were ignored despite repeated warnings.

Yes, but which other airliner flies at Mach 2 at 60,000 feet?

Arsenal@LHR
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Shamrock_747
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 11:14 pm

I think Concorde is a very special plane. If 27L/R is being used for landings at LHR I go into my back garden at around 5pm and watch BA002 fly over - I never get bored of seeing her! I find it amazing that the plane I'm looking at was in New York 3 hours ago. I think the SC will be a very exciting aircraft, but nothing could ever replace Concorde in my heart.

Shamrock_747
 
donder10
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 11:18 pm

Wouldn't a more apprioate question be:Will the SC replace the 767-300ER in your heart? Big grin
 
j.mo
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Sun May 05, 2002 11:43 pm

It sounds as if people hate the SC just for the fact it may take attention away from their beloved Concorde. It's ok, you don't have to hate it just because us Yanks are making something futuristic too, over here in the colonies. Big grin I am sure the SC haters here will look to the sky in fascination, like I will, when it lands at their airport.  Big thumbs up

Jeremy
 
GDB
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 12:10 am

What serious design flaws, (the grounding reeked of politics, modifications had to be made, name me an aircraft that hasn't happened to), but usually they are done to aircraft while they are still operational, along with any changes to procedures-which BA incoprated immediately after the accident.
The project itself was not profitable, far from it, but it pioneered much new technology for European industry.
Some of which Airbus made good use of.
With the SC, Boeing are building the next best thing to an SST, as building an enviromentally acceptable Mach 2.0 aircraft carrying 200-300 pax at least 6000 miles seems to be beyond current technology and/or what is financially possible.
But it does mark a change to current design practice, so while the SC is not as bold a project as Concorde, it is still a bit of a return to more adventurous days, in the same way as it's not as fast as Concorde, but is still a break from the normal in this respect.


 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 1:19 am

It sounds as if people hate the SC just for the fact it may take attention away from their beloved Concorde. It's ok, you don't have to hate it just because us Yanks are making something futuristic too, over here in the colonies. I am sure the SC haters here will look to the sky in fascination, like I will, when it lands at their airport

No, not really. People don't hate the SC, most people want it to happen, but tha reality is, there's only one Concorde!!!


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Arsenal@LHR
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j.mo
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 2:17 am

I agree there is only one Concorde only because nobody bought it. If there were 1000 Concordes around it would not be that special. The only real comparison between the two is they both stray from the "normal" design of airliners. It's not like the SC is being promoted to take the place of the Concorde. Hopefully when the SC is built there won't only be one SC.

Jeremy
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 2:20 am

Just like the fact that there will only be only one 747, no matter how good the A380 is.

In Arsene we trust!!
 
j.mo
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 3:30 am

Arsenal@LHR,
I guess I am agreeing with you but I am also trying to point how "special" the SC will be in it's own right. My main focus is on the people who say they hope it is never made. As far as the topic of this thread goes, the SC will not replace anything to me, it will be added.

Jeremy
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Mon May 06, 2002 4:26 am

Ofcourse, the SC will be a plane in it's own right, a unique plane with a unique design. It's not too constructive to compare SC to the Concorde, in a way, SC will be a different plane. A 250-300 seater capable of Mach 1 almost, whereas Concorde is the ultimate luxury, for the wealthy i suppose.

Arsenal@LHR
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Leezyjet
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Tue May 07, 2002 2:30 am

I've always wondered why, when the Concorde design so oviously works, it has never occurred to Airbus to upgrade/update it. The max seating capacity for Concorde is 144, but both BA and AF only have 100 seats. Why not take the design and stretch it a little just to bump it up to that 200 seater mark and with the technology availiable today, add some more fuel efficient engines and a digital flight deck to make it a more attractive purchase.....

But the main problem for Concorde is the sonic boom, which is why it is restricted to supersonic flight over water only. The sonic cruiser won't have this problem as it won't actually be breaking the sound barrier - so no sonic boom = more route possibilities = more passengers = more money for the potential customer, thus making it a more attractive prospect than the Concorde was. Based on this, if Boeing do build it and do sell some, then I'm sure were going to get the postings on this site from the yanks about how sucessful it is and how much of a failure Concorde was as they just can't resist blowing their own 'We're the best in the world' trumpet !!

Just a final thought, One Concorde on it's own has flown MORE hours supersonically than ALL the worlds military a/c put together !!!, and Concorde brings in about a quarter of all BA's revenue alone as it only needs about 20 pax to make a profit on the LHR-JFK route- so how unsuccessful is that ??

leezyjet.
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
N79969
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RE: Will SC Replace Concorde In Your Heart?

Tue May 07, 2002 2:47 am

The Concorde is distinct, special aircraft. It is cool looking and a landmark achievement in aviation. The SC will be economical but cannot call itself a supersonic airliner.

However, the Concorde is an unequivocal economic disaster. The European taxpayer subsidizes every ticket because the development costs were never amortized on sales to BA and AF. I think the subsidy works out to several thousand per pax. I read $5,000 at one time once you factor in the time value of money and so forth.