Rick
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Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 10:10 pm

US Air might have to shut down if it does not get the Government loan to stay afloat. If that happens, Delta Air Lines would have a golden opportunity to take over all shuttle flights to NY and Boston out of National in DC. Wow, they would have a monopoly out of there. I bet they are salivating right now. Any other thoughts on this?
 
prosa
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 10:18 pm

Shuttle flights, maybe, although there would be possible anti-trust issues (though less so now with Acela's success) and at least in my opinion a low-fare carrier such as WN or B6 probably would grab the routes.
Other than the shuttle, I can't imagine that DL would want to touch any of US's routes with the proverbial ten-foot pole.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
jrlander
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 10:46 pm

I also don't see Delta wanting significant parts of USAirways. I can see them buying facilities, such as the USAirways terminal at LGA, giving Delta the opportunity to consolidate all operations there. I can also see them taking over some shorter routes from DCA and LGA, and upgrading them to regional jets, but that is about it.
 
globaldude
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 10:56 pm

IF the shuttle routes become available, they are going to cost a huge amount of money. Only very deep pockets will prevail. Delta has shuttles already, for competitive reasons, they will not get them. WN will not enter LGA.

The U LGA terminal is leased from Continental. It will not be available to sell off.

U has a chance still. Lets not rush them and wish them well.
 
artsyman
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 11:06 pm

Delta will also not get into the mess with fleet commonality problems that U would bring.

Jeremy
 
N79969
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 11:21 pm

As it exists, USAirways is not a viable business. No airline would want to assume their labor contracts, debts, and other liabilities. Better to wait and let it fold before going after any assets. I doubt the the USDOJ would let DL buy the shuttle outright. I think AA would have trouble as well. My guess is that CO or NW will try and buy the shuttle routes and facilities. I'm sure UA would want a some of the action, but they have no money right now for a big purchase.

It's sad to see USAirways in this kind of shape.
 
Greg
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Tue May 14, 2002 11:35 pm

If they go under..AA will get the prize they have been trying to get for over 20 years..the Corridor Shuttle.

 
N757ST
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:21 am

Delta will probably not buy the whole of USair, but I can see them buying the BOS,LGA, and PHL operations, and a lot of the regional feed.
 
N79969
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:22 am

How will AA get the corridor shuttle? I really think USDOJ will not let them have it.
 
padcrasher
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:29 am

Delta could take everything except CLT,PIT, and the exit LGA Shuttle. Everything else would pass muster with the Government. DCA-BOS, LGA slots and terminal, PHL hub, some DCA slots, sweeeeeeeeet!
 
GRZ-AIR
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:45 am

Why do you all actually think that US AIRWAYS will go under ?
When I joined A.net it was still free, haha ;).
 
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chrisnh
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:50 am

well, if you think DL is 'salivating,' be sure that the Justice Department is too.
 
padcrasher
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:52 am

It's costs are too high and route system too small.
The markets that U operates in are rapidly seeing permanent declines in yield as low cost carriers move in.
They're getting competition thrown at them from not only low cost carriers, but large Majors as well. No alliance partners. It's a situation that's beyond repair.
 
redraider
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:53 am

Why wouldn't the DOJ allow AA to have the shuttle? Are there any anti-trust issues with this? None that appear on the surface. What is your reasoning?
My wife can't wrestle, but you should see her box.
 
padcrasher
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 2:01 am

IMO that could go either way. It is true AA does not currently operate mainline on Shuttle routes and changing carriers would not reduce competion on this route per se but the Government could take AA's market share of LGA and JFK into consideration. As you know LGA is slot restricted. AA just purchased control of TW slots, would the government allow more slots for a Shuttle service? Northwest would be a nice candidate.
 
mf3864
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 2:06 am

I thought I read during the failed UA/US merger that the DOJ stipulated that AA get the shuttle operations. AA commented that they would fly the existing routes with F100 aircraft in a shuttle configuration. Why wouldnt they get it now? They didnt get any corridor stuff with the TWA purchase.
 
ord
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 2:35 am

With regard to UA/US, the government did not stipulate anything. UA knew the merger would not pass the way it was structured as UA would become too big. So, to alleviate the government's concerns they willingly went to AA and asked them to operate half the shuttle as a joint venture (and take over the DCA routes).

The shuttle would have been marketed as "one" airline, with UA and AA alternating hourly flights.

Right now, the government seems leary of making big carriers bigger. And AA is the biggest. So, it's hard to say whether or not the government would let AA have the shuttle.











 
elwood64151
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 2:36 am

IMHO, USAirways does need the loan to stay afloat. I don't know of any airline that could sustain $3 Billion in losses for long.

On the other hand, I don't see any one airline getting a major piece of USAir. United wanted to merge, but they no longer have the financial means to do so. American just bought TWA, so the DOJ would be reluctant, and besides, fleet commonality would be a mess. Delta might buy the shuttle, so might American. Northwest and Continental are roughly the same size as US, so they might make the best candidates for a fourth mega-carrier, but they don't have quite a deep pockets as I believe would be necessary.

All in all, NW looks to me like the best candidate simply because the fleets are similar enough (with a few exceptions) and the DOJ wouldn't be worried about anti-trust issues.

Even then, NW has a different customer base and lower operating costs (at least as I understand it).

I see US going bankrupt and the other carriers participating in a bankrupcy auction.
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it in summer school.
 
picarus
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 3:00 am

Hellloooo???? Um, if US does declare bankruptcy, it will most certainly be a Chapter 11 filing....One that allows a business to continue operating while reorganizing and restructuring. Any asset sales would require approval of bankruptcy court, and that's not going to happen as long as US provides a viable business plan to the court. Nothing going to be "auctioned" off unless there is voluntary/forced Chapter 7.

US has a strong and relatively new fleet, good hubs, and solid brand equity. It just needs to figure out what kind of carrier it's going to be.

God, just look at CO and HP if you need to see how it's done.

That said, there is still no certainty that it will even declare bankruptcy. Let's just hope it's able to get the pieces in place to prevent this, and continue providing the same great service to its passengers that is has for 60 years.
 
Cody
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 3:01 am

Just wait until next week and let's see what will really happen. Unless you have a crystal ball you really can't say for sure USAirways is done.
 
N79969
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 3:09 am

I think the DOJ would have a lot of concerns if AA attempted to buy the corridor shuttle because of the changed competitive landscape since 9/11 and the further reduction in competition if USAirways folds. AA is the number #1 carrier by a lot. I have not actually sat down and considered what would be considered the relevant markets in a potential DOJ anti-trust analysis but I suspect there would be several problems. First, LGA, BOS, and DCA would all become AA quasi-hubs. Considering the existing level of AA service at those airports today, the addition of the shuttle would make those airports look like mini-DFWs. I don't if any of the carriers could effectively constrain them. I speculate that if you start breaking it down by city pairs nationwide, AA would become so dominant that eventually DL could be squeezed out of the eastern seaboard. AAs dominance would spread to NY-Florida and transcon due to network effects. Market entry would become really difficult if AA got that big. I think DOJ would try to stop them.

My guess is that CO or NW will try to grab it and one of them will succeed.
 
Ryefly
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 3:33 am

I am guessing American Airlines or Jet Blue would be the prime targets to take the shuttle. More so American Airlines because it would create more competition between itself and Delta for frequent flyer members. There is always a wild card though, US Airways could spawn the Shuttle into more markets and just go by US Airways Shuttle or something, and eliminate everything else including it's hubs and carry a fleet of regional jets and a few Airbuses to feed the Shuttle from major cities only. This would create small hubs for itself in DCA, LGA, BOS, PHL and perhaps a new shuttle market like FLL, JAX, TPA, MCO. That would suck wouldn't it?

As for Delta buying all of US Airways, I would think that would be very doubtful. How full is ATL? I just don't think it would make sense to split some of ATL to mix it with CLT. The two hubs are only about 300 miles apart.

Someone has to take up the slack in CLT. Currently there is over 500 departures a day out of there from US Airways and US Airways Express alone. That is unless it went from the current hub structure type of airport to a more generalized airport with a strong mix of airlines like RDU.

With a large maintenance facility, parallel runways, large modern terminals for domestic, International, and regional jet traffic, a baggage system to handle a massive amount of traffic from one airline, and being positioned smack in the middle of the east coast with limited weather problems, it's got to be a valuable asset for a major airline to continue using CLT as a hub. With Delta's and Air Tran's hub so close in ATL, and Northwest just over the mountains in MEM they are unlikely carriers to be interested in taking over the CLT hub. That leaves us with United, Continental, Southwest, and American. Southwest doesn't believe in hubs, and are doing well in RDU, so they are very unlikely. Would American abandon it's new efforts at RDU for CLT? What about eliminating a current hub to get CLT such as STL? Reduce traffic in MIA and mix it with CLT? To me, that would be a unnecessary effort. So that leaves just United and Continental. Is United in a position to take on more aircraft, and a entire new hub. I know they expressed strong interest in CLT during the merger talks with US Airways. After September 11th however, they are not far behind US Airways financially. I am sure they would take it if they could, but can they, and what about Washington Dulles? So that just leaves Continental. They have a strong hub in the Northeast, EWR. They have a strong hub in Texas, but nothing on the southeast. They tried with Continental Lite in GSO and failed, but that was Continental Lite, and still a different Continental all together. I think a Southeast hub would fit them nicely, although it's a toss up between the two in my opinion. Continental would most likely need more planes, to handle another major hub, and I don't think they would like all those Airbus. So maybe United does have the advantage, but I am sure they are pulling for US Airways to last a little longer so United can recover themselves.
 
travelin man
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 4:02 am

Picarus -- While there's certainly no guarantee that US will go bankrupt, judging from recent stories the writing seems to be on the wall.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/752090.asp?0dm=C15RB

Yes, they'd still be able to operate under Chapter 11 but that does not preclude a sale of assets to gain cash (Pan Am and TWA both did the same thing). I don't think speculating on who might buy some of the assets is premature at this point.
 
Lindy
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 4:17 am

Is US in very bad shape??? Well, I am more than sure that US Government will give them that loan. Why? Because they stopped UAL-US merger last year to not create any monopoly in Mid-Atlantic region.
+ US Airways is reorganizing its operations and will cut uprofitable routes.
I don't know if anybody mentioned earlier, but US Airways got nice big check from salles over 70 aircrafts.
B732s, DC-9s and MD80s that were stored in Mohave and Victorville are sold. Right now they are in the middle of talk with customers regarding F100s.

Anyway, if US Airways goes belly up, US Shuttle operations will stay untouchable.
Shuttle will be the only operation left for US Airways. I'm not sure if they will keep the current name but Shuttle will stay to pay off debt to creditors that US Airways will have when they "end" operations.
Thats gonna be more reasonable to keep Shuttle alive than selling it for almost nothing.

Rafal
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deltairlines
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 4:41 am

I would doubt that the DOJ would allow DL to pick up the Shuttle. I could see Continental or American coming into the Shuttle operations, as each have strong name recognition in the Northeast Corridor (people only fly NW from this region if they are doing east-west travel, north-south travel tends to go through ATL, IAD, or CLT, not MEM). Delta would also not touch the PIT and CLT hubs because of the proximity of ATL (control over 80% of the airport and the airport is getting a new runway and terminal) and CVG (over 92% of the airport, with a new runway and I believe room for airside expansion). I myself have spent some time thinking about the PHL hub, and that is a toss-up, possibly going to the highest bidder. PHL is by no means a small market, having 6 million people in the metro area. This airport also has proven itself a strong connection airport (and in my opinion, a better one than NYC). I could see Northwest or Delta taking this hub, as DTW is 453 miles away (1.5 hrs away) and CVG is 506 miles away (1.75 hours away). In regards to CLT, if United can afford it, then I expect United to grab it. The major thing that United wanted out of the US-UA merger was the CLT hub, as it would give them a gateway to Latin America without competing with AA at Miami. In regards to BOS/LGA/DCA (not the Shuttle, but slots/facilities/etc.), I can see an intense battle between DL and AA at Boston and DCA and adding Continental to the mix at LGA. US Airways has new facilities at BOS and LGA (don't know about DCA), and AA and DL are in major expansion mode at BOS. I think Delta would love to get their hands on US Airways' gates at BOS (all 18 of them, including the new pier) and start cranking up its expansion now (they will be back in black ink in Q3, and possibly Q2), instead of 2005. At LGA, there are several factors. Does Delta/American want to move into the US Airways terminal? They have both grown significantly there, and both airlines might like to consolidate (I know that AA is in the Central Terminal, but is on Piers C and D). It will be interesting to see how the situation plays out, with first US Airways needing to collapse or sell off assets (which might not happen), and then which airline has money. The airlines are playing conservative right now, so it will be interesting.

Jeff
 
SESGDL
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 5:21 am

Delta's main market is the U.S. East Coast. Delta is the south eastern and eastern dominate carrier. Delta would most definitely be interested in the Philadelphia hub, but Pittsburgh is too close to Cincinnati and Charlotte is too close to Atlanta. Shuttle routes and BOS, DCA, and LGA operations are also a big possibility.
 
Delta737
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 5:46 am

Delta isn't buying USAir.

I think the big joke got started when the new recurrent simulator profiles included Philadelphia and Charlotte.

Philadelphia because there's an interesting VOR approach and CHarlotte because they have a published ILS PRM approach.

Someone joked one day, "Hey, two USAir hubs in the sim profile? maybe we're buying USAir! yuk yuk yuk".

And then the rumor took off.

The discussion is interesting, but I think there isn't a snowballs chance in heck of Delta acquiring anyone in the near term.

Doug Taylor
jetcareers.com
 
scottysair
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 5:58 am

What?!?!? Do you y'all think about Delta will takeover as for US Airways or not? I have a simple questions as for about with Delta & US Airways. Do I think about will goes out of business with US Airways and it was not granted with loan from federal government. Will think that about all aircraft go repaint to Delta from US Airways or not. Please let me know about hear anything to do. Thanks!
 
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lindy field
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 6:04 am

Delta is going to pass on US Airways and wait for its chance to buy UAL.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
Delta737
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 6:13 am

I think Delta is much too conservative to buy anyone.

I'm afraid that Delta is more than happy being a south eastern feeder to the northeast and Florida with a few flights to the midwest.

Remember, we were for a short time the biggest airline in LAX, had a big SLC operation, bigger than AA at DFW back in the day, and had a good presence in ORD.

Now we're more or less an entirely based ATL airline, with small ops at DFW, an ok-sized ops at CVG, international at JFK and a small presence at LAX (cheaper than laying crews over) and a decreasing (if not disappearing) presence at SLC.

We've got the airframes to re-enter any of those markets, including USAirs markets but I doubt if Delta will buy anyone at all.

It would be exciting, but it aint gonna happen.

Doug Taylor
jetcareers.com
 
ouboy79
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 6:42 am

As some have tried to say, US is not done with yet. This carrier has been written off about 47 times over the course of the last 20 years, yet she always manages to survive. Things are very grimm right now, but don't look for this place to close shop.

As someone mentioned early...regarding shuttle continuing to fly to repay creditors if Chap 7 comes next year would be a fairly decent prediction. One part of the reorganization may be to spin Shuttle back off from mainline -- creating US Airways Shuttle, Inc -- another WO subsidiary. Right now it is all together -- one list with ALPA, etc.

Later this week details of the new biz plan will trickle out. I have a feeling we will see a lot of fleet rearrangements. Perhaps a complete elimination of the 737 flying in favor of aquiring RJs. Then move the 319/320/321 to longer hauls and trans cons. The international network will stay in tack. They are marking money with it -- so why touch it? We may see the early retirement of the 767 fleet and aquire more 330s. I know a struggling airline buying more planes -- it isn't that far fetched. We may even see the 767s go to trans con flights as well...but it may be best to dump them since they are old. The 757s will be here for awhile...likely going to the low yeilds sunshine spots -- a la Plan B.

Other areas where they might look...the complete elimination of in house reservations and customer service. There are many companies such as Sykes or Convergys which can do the same job (sometimes better) for a lot less.

Employee reallocation is another one too. There should be a move to make a lot of the out stations that the majority of their flights are express, Express stations. Why pay someone $25/hr to work a Dash 8 when you have other people doing it for $8? Example here would be TOL. They have mainly all Express except for 2 F-100s last year. They pulled out mainline and have it Op by PSA now. They brought costs way down, and now it is thriving...pulling pax loads higher than what it was with mainline. In return I would expect the hubs to go mainly mainline employees and less express. However, the establishment of a lower pay scale would be required.

Early outs, ESOP, less paid vacation time...if there is sick time -- eliminate it and merge it with Vacation (e.g....2 weeks vacation and 2 weeks sick per year = 3 weeks vacation and thats it), eliminate single role employees at out stations -- no need to have one work counter and one ramp...when they can both do both.

My hands are tired now...more later. LOL
 
padcrasher
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 6:43 am

Doug, I hear you. DL is way too "ATLcentric". I very big fault Delta has had for many years.

But give DL it's due. After the down sizing of DFW,LAX, and SLC, Delta went on to make more profits than any other airline. And calling them a feeder is a little much. They were the biggest domestic airline in terms of RPMs, until AA/TW, and no other airline has a route system as balanced as Delta's.

Leo has made attempts to purchase other airlines. CO, HP, etc. If he could get in a situation to purchase PHL, LGA and DCA slots he would do it. Even taking on U employees to get it done.
 
usairways85
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 7:00 am

nobody is buying anybody. usairways will not be bought as a whole but will be bought in pieces. and although delta will overlook clt and pit, if the chance that some US northeast operations will be auctioned off, dont tell me delta will just sit there and let the other airlines grab them and become fierce competitors with delta in the NE. I would think delta would look at PHL and the shuttle operation, along with slots at bos, dca, and lga. although phl may not seem like a major NE city, it deffinately is and could be a strong NE hub, whether it be delta nwa or any other airline.
 
ord
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 7:03 am

I just want to comment on some of your info:

1. Delta was never the largest airline at LAX. At their peak, after acquring Western, they had right around 100 flights per day. United was above that level and has always had a bigger slice of the LAX pie.

2. The operation in SLC has gone from a peak of about 160 flights to its current 125 +/-.

3. Delta was never bigger than AA at DFW. When deregulation began, AA had about 140 flights vs. Delta's 50. By 1987 Delta would grow to about 200 flights. By that time AA was over 300. And at Delta's peak of 250 flights in the early 90s AA was at about 500.

4. Yes, Delta had a good presence in Chicago prior to deregulation and into the early 80s (about 75 flights). But so did many other carriers, including TWA and Northwest. By the early 80s Delta realized Chicago was United/AA turf and moved most operations to Cincinnati.

I will say that after the Western merger I thought Delta was in the best position of any airline. They were poised for growth. But, as you said, it seems everything took a back seat to Atlanta. I still love Delta though.

As an aside, I did read recently that Delta had approached Alaska last year about a merger but Alaska was not interested.
 
Delta737
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 8:27 am

Actually, Delta never approached Alaska. Alaska has no desire to be merged, purchased, etc. That's why Leo was so eager about saying that he'd like to purchase Alaska, but they wouldn't even bother returning the telephone call.

Delta, according to a lot of captains I fly with was the #1 airline in LAX for about 30 seconds.

It's a good airline, but only truly balanced for passengers living in the southeast, Florida and parts of the Northeast.

Doug Taylor
jetcareers.com
 
pshifrin
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 8:31 am

Here's a question, what happens to USAirway's small rural routes if the airline goes under? They are the only airline that flies into some of the really small airports on the east coast.

I've got quite a number of these flights booked for this summer. I hope everything stays operational.
 
baec777
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 9:00 am

Will Delta keep any Airbus fleet US Airways currently has right now and also their Boeing 737-400s..??
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Delta already has few other Aircrafts like B737-300, B757-200, B767-200, etc(mixture).

List of Delta current fleet.
http://www.delta.com/inside/investors/corp_info/fleet/index.jsp

List of US Airways current fleet.
http://www.usairways.com/about/aircraft/index.htm

baec
 
Delta737
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 9:23 am

BAEC-

Well, Delta's not buying USAir!  Smile

Moot point!

Doug Taylor
jetcareers.com
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 10:22 am

One thing to keep in mind, U might be able to sell their slots and Shuttle at LGA but not their Terminal. They have a lease, CO owns the terminal. Texas Air leased it on a long term basis to U, should U file for bankruptcy CO can revoke the lease.

U cannot not sell their lease or sub lease the gates to another carrier.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
2cn
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 10:33 am

Baec777- if Delta did buy US Airways, or parts of it, they wouldn't keep the Airbus planes for long, if any ammount of time. Their plan is to go to an all Boeing fleet, still is and will still be in any merger, except for the regional jets.
 
FrequentFlier
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 11:02 am

A couple of questions.

1) Regarding the US Air terminal at LGA, how is it that CO owns it but leases it to them? Why would CO ignore that beautiful terminal for part of a pier in the Central Terminal?

2) Also, I have strong doubts about AA or jetBlue picking up the shuttle should US Air go under. While AA does have a strong presence at LGA, it is currently shifting its focus to JFK, where it is building a new hub and terminal.

jetBlue is a JFK airline, and will always be a JFK airline. Unless the shuttle routes could be shifted to JFK-DCA and JFK-BOS, don't look for jetBlue to buy up any shuttle spots anytime soon!
 
IMissPiedmont
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 11:29 am

The only truly valuable asset that US has is the shuttle. Oh yes, I know that they have slots at DCA, LGA, BOS etc, they just aren't worth spending billions on. If they had any sense they would scale back operations right away. Time to return to what makes money if it's not too late. Of course they are stuck with a whole bunch of new Airbus that really are worthless. I do not mean that the A320 family is a bad aircraft. I just point out that for the next few years, US is way behind the curve on them.

The clock is ticking on USAirways I'm afraid. And to think that I said, fifteen years ago, that US would do well to buy America West.

I Miss Piedmont.
The day you stop learning is the day you should die.
 
nwa man
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 11:47 am

Doug, I hear you. DL is way too "ATLcentric". I very big fault Delta has had for many years.


Padcrasher, this may be a fault for spotters who want to see more DL aircraft in SLC, LAX, etc., but ATL has been very, very profitable for Delta. They deserve tremendous credit for how well they do at ATL, considering that it's not the best geographic location for a hub, yet they have thousands of passengers making connections there each day.

Delta wouldn't be so ATL-centric (great term, BTW) if there were no fiscal incentive.


NWA Man
Create your own luck.
 
AluminumShower
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 12:20 pm

As business travel (high yield traffic) has slacked off substantially, why would anyone (especially AA) consider buying the shuttle as the odds are that it would never make the type of money it once did?
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 12:52 pm

It's a deal Texas Air struck during bankruptcy, the slots are sold but not the Terminal. Texas Air built and paid for the Terminal which was to house Eastern and CO, Eastern folded CO which operated lots of LGA flights for a short time then sold the slots and "leased" the unopened Terminal to U.

Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
Ezra
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 12:54 pm


Would CO want the terminal back to increase its own LGA operations, or would it be willing to continue leasing it, to another carrier?

Thanks, E.
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 1:32 pm

No way would they just lease it to someone, they would want to trade gates for slots. Since there's almost no room at the Main Terminal building, an airline like NW, UAL or AA could do little or nothing with more slots without gates to park the planes.

Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
padcrasher
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Wed May 15, 2002 11:31 pm

NWA MAN

Totally, agree. But this fixation on ATL may have hampered what DL could have been. Today, Delta finds itself the odd man out in all these major business markets. NYC,ORD,LAX,SFO,DFW.

They have given up on JFK. I don't know if most folks realize this but NYC is the king in premium business travel. It dwarfs ATL in revenue. How is AA able to fight for LAX, ORD, and NYC. While DL can't seem to put up a fight in the World's most important business center?
 
FlyPNS1
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Thu May 16, 2002 2:51 am

I think DL has at least in part come to the reality that they cannot attract as many business pax and that they have to find money elsewhere.

As for LAX and SFO, they're aren't as great as people make them out. If they were so, why is UA doing so poorly? SFO has good yields but miserable congestion and growth constraints...plus OAK is really gaining with lots of low-fare traffic.

LAX has tons of low-fare service and the only reason UA survives in LAX is the big transpac routes.

AA has tried to make SJC work and it has struggled at best.

As for NYC, it is high margin but right now there are simply too many airlines fighting for too few passengers.

As for US, the only interest DL would have is to buy slots at LGA and DCA and get as much BOS traffic as possible.
 
srbmod
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RE: Delta To Take Over US Air?

Thu May 16, 2002 3:51 am

Delta once considered buying U.S. Airways (it was still USAir then) during the 90s, but backed off. It probably had something to do with the economy and the lingering effects of the Pan Am saga. I think that USAir had asked for too much money in order to be bought out, and also maybe Delta was concerned with any anti-trust implications that would have arisen.

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