Guest

Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Mon May 27, 2002 3:08 pm


I've been at Heathrow airport for the first time this past weekend and I had a great time there.
I don't think I ever so that many airplanes at one place. Forget Amsterdam, Frankfurt, Atlanta and the likes. It's all Heathrow.

Right after landing I spotted 3(!) South African Airlines 747s on the apron. Are these regular flights or do they have their maintenance at Heathrow ?

There were tons of Air Canada, United, AA planes and many, many others.
I was very surprised about the big presence Iberia has at Heathrow.
Terminal 2 seems to be very dominated by Iberia.

The take-off line was impressive as well. At times I could spot up to 15 airplanes lining up at 27L. As it was raining it was even more fun to watch them taking-off.

I expected a bit more about the visitor's terrace. It's by no means comparable to Frankfurt or Zurich but therefore you get to see much more action.
And there really seem to be a lot of "registration catchers" up there.

The variety of airplanes is enormous as well.
Syrianair, Iran Air, AIr India, BWIA, Air China, Aeroflot, Varig, ...

And the morning they were using runway 27R for landings. I assume that must be a pretty long taxiing for BA planes to Terminal 4 right ?
Every once in a while there was also an airplane landing on 27L. Why is that please ?


Regards,
B737-700


 
Guest

RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Mon May 27, 2002 3:17 pm

Hey, glad you enjoyed Heathrow-it's a great airport, and shows just how much trade and other links Britain has with the rest of the world.

Concerning Iberia's presence at T2; well, it depends what time you are there...sometimes it can be "Air France" or "Alitalia" happy hour...  Big grin

As for T3, that is American and United's second hub, didn't you know  Big grin

Ok, I'll let the real enthusiasts answer your r/w questions......come back and visit soon  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Also, try Gatwick, that is also meant to be quite interesting.

Cheers
 
greenjet
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 2:42 am

The South African 747s at LHR are a prime example of poor aircraft utilisation. They come in early morning and depart late evening. During the day they sit idle on the ramp by the BA hangars. However SAA have no choice really as UK-South Africa (and vice versa) passengers prefer to travel overnight rather than during the day. SAA have experimented in the past on their UK routes but found that yields were low on day time flights.
 
Marco
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 2:51 am

That's interesting greenjet. It seems that quite a few airline do that. QF, SQ, MH and CX do that. However QF, MH and SQ do have one daily flight each that departs at noon.

How were the yields on Virgin's London-Cape Town day flights? (VS will be re-starting the route in October.)
Proud to be an Assyrian!
 
donder10
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 2:54 am

Every once in a while there was also an airplane landing on 27L. Why is that please ?
Usually a plane going to T4.
 
Guest

RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:01 am


Aha, but most of the BA planes were landing on 27R and thus had a long way to taxi to Terminal 4.

So I assumes South African has probably 2 flights to JNB and one to CPT ??

I somehow can't manager to get over this exciting airport. It was a fantastic experience and I still hear the sound of those roaring jets. One 747 turning to the left after take-off and the next one to the right a minute later. Wow !

 
blink182
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:24 am

I agree too, LHR is my favorite airport.

Yes, it is not surprising at times to see T3 filled with US- bound flights, but in the early mornings, it is quite diverse. In shorter T3 tier, it was pure AA while on the longer one, closer to the main part of the terminal, I saw Thai, Gulf Air, Singapore, Emirates, the list goes on and on. Eventually, I saw some Virgin Atlantic 747s as we were departing for the USA. This was late summer '01, so things might have changed.

Oh yes, for any Oneworld Emerald/ sapphire members: You must check out the AA Admirals club in T3, not only is it nice and spacious, but it offers one helluva view. It was from there that I saw all of those aircraft. I swear, we were about 50 feet away from a Singapore Airlines 747-400. It was then that I really appreciated the size of that plane.

However, BAA needs to refurbish the airside part of terminal 3. Up until right past security, it is nice, but after that, it could use some refurbishing.

Also, the other terminal I have been in is T1. I thought it was pretty nice and modern and offered a good view of the action.

LHR is a great airport, and I cannot wait for T5 to open.

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
donder10
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:26 am

So I assumes South African has probably 2 flights to JNB and one to CPT ??

Yep!And they land within about 40 mins or so of each other too
 
Guest

RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:34 am


Ok, that's cool.
Does Heathrow have any plans about a new runway ? It seems like they could need one more.
 
avion
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:36 am

Nice to hear u had a good time. I told you so! Are u on ICQ right now?

Tom
 
janne
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:48 am

Yeah. Heathrow is a fantastic airport (and so is Gatwick).
I guess Heathrow is still the worlds "biggest" airport when it comes
to international flights.
 
donder10
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 3:54 am

Does Heathrow have any plans about a new runway ? It seems like they could need one more.
They've had enough crap from opponents just getting T5 to get the go-ahead!There are probabrly plans for a 3rd runway but I'm not sure if they will come to fruitation.
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 5:30 am

After all, LHR is the "aviation hub of the world" as BAA like to call it. But i wouldn't discount FRA aswell, more US airlines at FRA than LHR, but LHR will catch up when Bermuda is scrapped and Delta,Northwest,Continental come in and raid LHR. How many airlines are there altogether at FRA anyway?

Arsenal@LHR
In Arsene we trust!!
 
foghorn
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 5:34 am

There are plans for a third runway to the north of the existing ones. The problem is that LHR is hemmed in on three sides by London suburbs and on the fourth by the M25 orbital motorway, so there is not much room to expand. The third runway will require some major tunnelling work for the A4 road if it is to be connected by taxiways to the rest of the airport (which it doesn't necessarily have to be), plus several thousand houses along BA's brand new HQ 'Waterside' will have to be demolished.

The Government and BAA are currently studying the options for London airports for the next 20 years. On the cards are a second runway at Gatwick (which currently has just the one in normal operations - the most heavily utilised major airport runway in the world), a second runway at Stansted (Europe's fastest growing airport), and a brand new four runway 24 hour airport on reclaimed land in the Thames estuary east of London.

Significantly, there is a ban in force on new building development in the area that would be occupied by a second runway at LGW - so maybe that will be the first area of development, however some properties will have to be demolished to make way for this. The land for STN's second runway is currently farmland so would be fairly easy to develop. The civil engineering for the new Thames airport would be so massively complex that I expect that to be well in the future, if it is ever built.

Finally, the historic WW2 fighter airfield Biggin Hill (BQH) is pushing to become London's second commuter airport after City (LCY), however there is strong local opposition to this, and it would need a major infrastructure upgrade as the road and public transport links are poor. It is currently a busy GA field.
 
janne
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 5:40 am

If I might float away a bit from the subject of this discussion group I must
say that I was very impressed when I went to Gatwick last year. I know
that it's one of the big airports in the world but didn't know it had just
one runway. And still beeing so big in terms of aircraft movements.
Personally I think Gatwick was more interesting than Heathrow since I am
a big fan of older aircraft.
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 6:30 am

This picture clearly shows how dominant UA is at T3:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Frank Schaefer



Arsenal@LHR
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Leezyjet
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 8:29 am

I must say that working at LHR I take it all for granted, and get sick to death of seeing the same old stuff day in, day out. Most interesting thing I've seen for a while was the new QR A330 yesterday, that parked right opposite my office, and also LH seem to be operating alot of their new CRJ's into LHR now, ooh also saw the BMi Star alliance Embraer 145 the other day too, think it must have been operating the LBA service.
I much prefered working at MAN for variety, there you never knew what was going to drop in to visit one of the many mantainence facilities, and I also liked the comination of chater and scheduled services that you don't get at LHR, thats why I also enjoy a visit to LGW from time to time.

I'm probably going to get slated now, but c'est la vie.....
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
Guest

RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 2:34 pm


Wow, if the other US Airlines were allowed at Heathrow it would really be a "zoo".

Arsenal@LHR: FRA is nice, but they have far less of those really big jets and the take-off lines are not half as impressive as they are at Heathrow. But they do have a really nice observation deck.

As for the BAA calling it the "aviation hub of the world" that pretty much illustrates the impression I had. It seemed like this was the only airport in the world.
 
David_itl
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Tue May 28, 2002 5:36 pm


Leezyjet, the ERJ145 is now scheduled to operate 1 service on Saturday on the MAN-LHR route (think it's the 591 southbound).

David/MAN
 
Leezyjet
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 2:24 am

Cheers David,

When I worked at Bmi at LHR, the odd time it did come in was because the LBA 737 was tech, so they stuck that on. I rem first time it came in, 'bout 2 weeks after they got 'em, it took 2.5 hours to turn it round !!!.

Do u work for Bmi 2 ?? I've seen a few of your posts on here seem to relate to them...
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
David_itl
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 3:06 am


Leezyjet

I work in the city centre though the 5 miles I travel in the morning I wish were in the other direction! I keep posting bmi stuff as they've gone from a virtual non-operation here to being their 2nd most important hub in the UK (with apologies to EMA!) inside 5 years, and they seem to offer up more newsworthy stories than other incumbent airlines.


David
 
Leezyjet
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 3:16 am

Oh David,

I'm sorry  Crying , I guess we all can't get paid for doing our 'hobby'  Wink/being sarcastic .
Your right tho' Bmi are creating/have created alot of news up at Man.
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
GDB
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 5:56 am

Forget a new runway at LHR, the Hayes bypass took decades and they only had to demolish 6 houses!
I think the next new runway will be off the Essex coast or even on the Thames Estuary.

 
donder10
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 6:01 am

I heard the talk about a runway in that area,but it will cost tons I would have thought.LGW want a new runway and local business backs it.Manston also wants one but has no decent infastructure links to serve the airport-perfect for Ryanair expansion  Smile
 
blink182
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 6:39 am

I've got a question.

Why go through all of this fighting and let the BAA try to find enough land somewhat close to london and build a giant airport with several runways and lots and lots of gates with room for expansion??

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
donder10
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 6:41 am

In other words a ATL-esque airport.I can't think of anywhere in the London region where there is enough room.Perhaps Bucks somewhere?
 
trintocan
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 7:33 am

Why not Manston? Certainly they have one of the longest and widest runways in SE England, as featured in a recent edition of "Airliner World". Without a doubt it could be expanded to serve as one of the needed aerodrome facilities in that part of the country.

Trintocan.
Hop to it, fly for life!
 
Arsenal@LHR
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 8:26 am

The thought of a brand new international airport in or around London is frightening to say the least, the skies above london and southeast England is choked to put it mildly. Although i must say, a complete new airport or a new runway is a must for the government, air travel around the world will triple in the next 20 years and London will take a lions share of that traffic.

Arsenal@LHR
In Arsene we trust!!
 
Leezyjet
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RE: Some Thoughts And Questions About Heathrow

Thu May 30, 2002 9:07 am

I think as others have said in other threads, if the flights were dispersed to other airports such as Man/Bhx/Stn etc., it would help out, but it seems that everyone wants to fly thru LHR/LGW for some reason. Also the more l/haul flights that went into the regional airports would then encourage other airlines to offer more connecting flights, thus increasing the choices for passengers and relieving some congestion over the south-east. I know this probably wouldn't happen, as it's like one of those concentric circles - like the chicken/egg scenario, but it's an idea and now that Man has 2 runways, they could be utilised a whole lot more.

I'm sure developing an already existing airport such as Manston would have a less damaging effect than creating a whole new one from nothing, and would probably be cheaper too.
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"