727LOVER
Topic Author
Posts: 6794
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 2:57 am

I know they never operated it, but I could have sworn a few years ago, when all those new Japan routes were granted, that TWA was awarded this route. And I think US AIrways was awarded some routes as well? Am I smokin' dope??!!!
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
B747-437B
Posts: 8777
Joined: Thu May 30, 2002 6:54 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 3:01 am

TWA was indeed awarded STL-NRT rights, but never commenced the flight due to a lack of equipment suitable for the route.
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
727LOVER
Topic Author
Posts: 6794
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 3:03 am

If that isn't pathetic in this industry, then I don't know what is.
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
donder10
Posts: 6944
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2001 5:29 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 3:04 am

Would the demand have been there either?
 
PB737
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 1999 7:37 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 3:35 am

I know TWA had STL-NRT rights, but as was mentioned never flew the route for a number of reasons. I think it had to do mostly with a bad Asian market at the time, and TWA's lack of suitable equipment to fly the route.

Also I remember a story about TWA wanting the city of St.Louis to help build or expand the customs facilities at STL to better handle international flights. St.Louis did not want to foot the bill so the project never got off the ground.

Another thing to keep in mind is that STL is currently undergoing expansion to add an additional runway and lengthen the main runway at that airport. That may have been a factor in TWA deciding not to fly the route until the those projects were over. I believe they are scheduled to be done in 2006.

Keeping all this in mind does anyone think AA will fly the route between STL and NRT? With the current state of affairs I would think not. However could it be that STL is a large enough market for that flight to be profitable with the amount of connecting traffic that STL gets?

Thanks for any and all opinions!
 
blink182
Posts: 5280
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 5:05 am

i was about to ask oddly enough of AA would fly STL-NRT. I think they would if a 763 has the range. I know the 767-300 ER can fly ORD-NRT, but I think that is at the top of its range. Maybe a 3x or 4x weekly 777 could do it.

If TWA had lobbied for a bigger customs area, that might be a hint that there just isn't the customs capacity for it.

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
UAL747
Posts: 6725
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 1999 5:42 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 7:55 am

I doubt that AA would fly STL-NRT since it would cut heavily into rev. on the ORD-NRT flights, as well as the JFK-NRT.

UAL747
"Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy. Bangkok Tower, United 890 Heavy.....Okay, fine, we'll just turn 190 and Visual Our Way
 
SegmentKing
Posts: 3224
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2000 7:16 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 8:30 am

Plus the City of St. Louis knew for years that TWA wouldn't be around forever, so why waste money on capital projects FOR TWA if they won't be around to pay for it through PFCs or other means?

-n
~ ~ ~ ~ pRoFeSsIoNaL hUrRiCaNe DoDgEr ~ ~ ~ ~
 
747buff
Posts: 676
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2001 3:05 pm

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 11:52 am

A little off topic, but:

Welcome back B747-437B!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
At Eastern, we earn our wings every day!
 
CMK10
Posts: 1826
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2004 10:56 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 12:02 pm

Definetly great to have you back B747-437B, that was one great trip report you put together a while back.
DC-10's Forever
"Traveling light is the only way to fly" - Eric Clapton
 
aa61hvy
Posts: 13021
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 1999 9:21 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 pm

i doubt they will start it, they have alot of NRT flights, DFW,SJC,ORD,JFK, they used to have SEA but i think they dropped it when they dropped KIX..
Go big or go home
 
User avatar
OzarkD9S
Posts: 4787
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2001 2:31 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Fri May 31, 2002 12:07 pm

Living in STL I would love to see the route operated. No reason it couldn't work, especially with a JL code-share on the Tokyo/Asian end. We have a fairly decent business market here, plus connections throghout the US.
Next up: STL-CVG-MKE-MSP-STL.
 
blink182
Posts: 5280
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Sat Jun 01, 2002 12:21 am

AA61hvy- Just added, LAX. Service is supposed to start April 1, 2003.

As for STL, I think the gamble of it though is whether it will interfere with AA's DFW and ORD-NRT flights. It might be a fair guess that people who normally go through Dallas and Chicago to get to Tokyo might go through STL.

It's really a tough call. Yes, STL has a lot of connections, but so does ORD and DFW.

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Sat Jun 01, 2002 12:34 am

I remember hearing a while back that TWA was thinking about using a 767-200ER on the STL-NRT route in an all first class or mostly first class configuration. That's a long flight for a 767.


Steve in MSY
 
cba
Posts: 4228
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2000 2:02 pm

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Sat Jun 01, 2002 12:57 am

STL-NRT is 5534nm on Great Circle, and the 767-300ER has about a 6000nm range. The route is within its range, but barely.

I heard that TWA was considering ordering the A332 to operate this route.
 
clipper471
Crew
Posts: 610
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 6:44 am

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Sat Jun 01, 2002 10:40 am

TWA ordered 10 A332's during Carl Icahn's tenure in the late 1980's. These aircraft were never delivered as TWA tried to get out of the order because they later realized the cost of the extra aircraft type in the fleet. Eventually they transferred the order for A318's in the late 1990's. This order was cancelled after the AA buyout.
 
twa@fra
Posts: 150
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2000 8:10 pm

RE: Did TWA Have STL-Tokyo?

Sat Jun 01, 2002 7:23 pm

Didn`t TWA used it`s traffic rights with a DL Codeshare via PDX for a short time ?

twa@fra

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