DeltaBoy777
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Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 7:49 am

Hey everyone,
Take a look at this Delta.com Fleet Sheet. Under Aircraft Delivery Schedule as of December 31, 2001 it says that Delta will order Boeing 737-800, 737-700, & 737-600 in 2002 and 2003.

http://www.delta.com/inside/investors/corp_info/fleet/index.jsp#onorder

Is this true about the -700 and -600 planes?? I know they already operate -800 jets.
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
srbmod
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:03 am

At first, I thought they were just listing 737NG as one family, but I noticed that the 900 series wasn't mentioned. I would speculate that the rolling options they have for 737-800s cand be converted into any NG series. There has been talk of getting the 700 series for DLX, and the 600 to replace mainline 200 series service. By operating 600/700/and 800 series 737s, that would give them some operational flexibility in loads on routes. By ordering some of the 600 series, that would help that series out, since it has not been the popular member of the 737NG family. The 800s are the replacement aircraft for the 727 and to an extent, the 737-200. Delta will need the flexiblity that operating several different pax capacity 737s gives, so I think that they will start converting their options into orders for the 600 and 700 series once the last 727 leaves the fleet, and has been replaced by the 737-800.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:07 am

Delta will not buy 737-600's or 700's. They have all but said that the 600 is too costly and the 700 does not work in the Express operation because the payrates are too high. So it's only -800's for DAL. The purchase contract allows DAL to use rolling options in just about anyway it chooses.
 
DeltaBoy777
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:08 am

Personally, If this info is true, I think it would be smart for Delta to invest in some 600's and 700's. This is a widely used series and it would help Delta stay ahead of the curve, especially since airline novices don't know about any planes except maybe the 737 and 747. And it would be a good replacement for the aging -200's, and -300's.
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:15 am

Right now DAL has MD88s, 737-200's, 727's sitting is the desert in short term storage. Additionally, 777's, MD11's, 757/767's and 737-800's are not being flown any where near pre-Sept 11 levels. DAL is not going to buy any 737's that it has not already committed to. However the rumors are hot and heavy about a new 100 seat aircraft for the DAL family. One from Brazil or one from France, but not a 717.
 
DeltaBoy777
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:19 am

What aircraft manufacturer would be in Brazil or France?? Embraer??
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:21 am

Embraer is building a all new 100 seat aircraft. And DAL is also looking at the 318.
 
DeltaBoy777
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:23 am

That forsees the end of the rather unsuccesful 717. Although Delta will not touch the 318, because it is a Airbus. The Embraer maybe. I think the 717 would be smart, because alot of TWA 717 pilots are laid off now aren't they??
That would mean 0 to minimal training.
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
godbless
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:25 am

MD88Captain,

One from Brazil or one from France, but not a 717.

Which one is there from France? I know that it could be from Germany (FD 928 or A318=>not really) but I don't know of a French 100 seater. Or does Atr want to strech it's Atr-72....?

Max
 
srbmod
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:26 am

What, Delta's going to order the A318? The 737-600 would make more sense than anything else. Why would Delta go out and buy something unlike anything in their fleet? The 717 and the 737-600 would make sense in the 100 seat category for them. I had heard rumors of them ordering the 717, but logically, the 737-600 would make more sense for them.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:33 am

Management is telling pilots that a 737-600 costs about what a 737-800 costs. And that is too much. Also there are rumblings of DAL being less than thrilled with BA's customer support. (I have no examples of that.) Management has said that we are very serious about looking at the new Embraer and the Airbus 318 to do point to point flying. This would involve a pull away from hub and spoke reliance and resemble Southwest flying. One rumor is that the business plan is evolving post 9/11.

DAL is adament about not wanting the 717. Apparently the Embraer is significantly more efficent than the 717 and the Airbus 318 comes with some significant acquisition incentives. ie. They are giving them away.

 
0A340
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:46 am

Right now DAL has MD88s, 737-200's, 727's sitting is the desert in short term storage. Additionally, 777's, MD11's, 757/767's and 737-800's are not being flown any where near pre-Sept 11 levels. DAL is not going to buy any 737's that it has not already committed to. However the rumors are hot and heavy about a new 100 seat aircraft for the DAL family. One from Brazil or one from France, but not a 717.

Dear MD88Captain -

I find your crystal-ball rumors rather interesting... And I'm very, very curious to find an answer to your riddle...

A few points:
About the DLX 732's. Certainly they cannot be flown for ever... The contract that captains and DL signed provides for 737-700 pay rates. Are they that expensive? In which case, why DL doesn't put together a 733 fleet (some are already under DL' colors)? A DL-xpress operation certainly does not need a brand-new fleet and ownership costs can be quite reasonable...

About the 150-seat mainland fleet to 50-seat connection fleet gap.
Excluding the very few CRJ-700, the connection jet fleet caps at 50 seats. Then we jump all the way up to the 100 seats. Is there a contact provision that taps connection carriers to any capacity? Has DL changed their often said position that 150-seat will be the min mainland capacity?

About the Boeing-exclusivity clause: although it may formally not exist, isn't a consideration of a competitor (318) almost out-of the question?

Just wondering aloud

George



 
Guest

RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 8:59 am

737-600/700 are rolling options.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 9:55 am

Here is all that I can tell you, George. And these are not my rumors. DAL is actively looking at a 100 seat airplane to fly more point to point routes. 717's are not wanted. DAL have sent people to look at the AB 318 and the new Embraer. And I think DAL would not hesitate to buy AB if the deal was right.

The entire DAL business plan is up for review and may include a move away from exclusive hub and spoke operation. The Business traveler is not flying and DAL may not wait for them to come back.

There has been much internal speculation about DAL closing down the Express operation. And it is very possible that will happen. Such a senario has the 737-200's going back into mainline operation.

The current contract only allows for 2 types of Express aircraft. 737-200 and -700's. Any other aircraft flown on Express must be flown with Mainline work rules.

The latest pilot contract allows for an arbitrator to set the payrate on any new aircraft, so DAL may be hopping for a cheaper rate on this new aircraft than the negotiated rates on the 737-600s et al.

DAL is also looking at 757's on Express. That would be a great 1 class aircraft for that market IMO.

The 737-200's are the last off the Boeing line and are still going strong. I'm told that they have any easy 10 years left flying the line, but I've never flown Express.

The Express rumors and the new aircraft rumor may not be connected. I've heard that the new aircraft is not for Express.

Interesting times are they not?
 
Gregg
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 10:07 am

about the A318.... If you were a stock holder in Delta, you would expect Delta to look at all options, even if the looking is only to scare boeing into a better deal on the smaller 737ngs.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 11:12 am

The A318 is heavier and less efficient than the 717. How could DL be not interested in the 717 but be considering A318?

The A318 has no commonality with the DL fleet, while the 717 would have some with the MD88.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
HlywdCatft
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 11:18 am

Ok, I should be open minded about this and I can't believe or take rumors seriously, but someone suggesting Delta would go after an A318 has me rolling on the floor.
 
The Coachman
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:06 pm

Yyz717, note what MD88Captain said...'point-to-point flying'. That probably means more long-range routes. The 717 just doesn't have that range capability that the 318 has. In any case, they could always bandy the A318 stick at Boeing if they want the B737-600's.
M88, 722, 732, 733, 734, 73G, 73H, 742, 743, 744, 752, 762, 763, 772, 773, 77W, 320, 332, 333, 345, 388, DH8, SF3 - want
 
brons2
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:24 pm

The 717 IGW has a range of ~2400nm, would this not be sufficient to get them to most places from Atlanta?

The A318 is too heavy for what it is. It needs a lighter fuselage to be successful at that capacity. The 737-600 hasn't really had much success either, for that matter.

It would boggle my mind if they ordered A318's. CRJ-900's or EMB-190's, I could see, but the A318? Doubt it.
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Leftypilot79
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:33 pm

I would love to see DL order the Airbus 318 just to see you guys with the "DEER CAUGHT IN HEADLIGHTS LOOK".....it would be priceless. Buy the time you come out of your daze and shock that they order the A318...they will have replaced it with the ERJ-190 and you can live happily ever after. LOL


aaron
 
brons2
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:43 pm

oops the IGW version is 2060nm, not 2400.
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 12:48 pm

I believe the attraction to the -318 is the acquistion costs compared to the 717. I told that Airbus would structure a deal that DAL "could not refuse". Rumor has it that DAL VERY recently was across the pond taking a hard look.

The 717 has very, very little in common with the MD88. The cockpit is a small MD11 cockpit and of course it has different engines. And it just isn't catching on is it. I think DAL learned its lesson with the MD90.

And apparently the Embraer 100 seater has impressed someone. I think it may be the leading candidate.




 
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yyz717
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 1:07 pm

I wonder why Boeing can't structure a favourable deal with the 717 if AI can offer a similar package with the A318?
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
brons2
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 1:24 pm

[quote]The 717 has very, very little in common with the MD88. The cockpit is a small MD11 cockpit and of course it has different engines. And it just isn't catching on is it. I think DAL learned its lesson with the MD90.[/quote]

The cockpit is the standard Boeing EFIS cockpit, according to Boeing's website...

(ot)What's wrong with the MD-90?

I wouldn't exactly say the A318 is catching on like hotcakes either.

And what is up with Airbus selling planes at a loss to achieve market share? Boeing is listing the 717 at around $31million, last time i looked at their list prices, how cheap can Airbus be selling the 318 for? Must be REAL cheap...
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Delta737
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 1:25 pm

Yup, he's right and I've got a lot of "crow" to eat because the rumors are hotter than a packed 727 in PHX with a pack inop.

It's looking like either a 318 or the new embraerjet.

They're rumors, Leo's publically admitted to wanting something in the 100-seat range, but NOT a 737-600 or -700.

I've always said that DAL wouldn't buy Airbus, and if they do, I've got a lot of folks to apologize to.

But new planes ANY additional planes would be sweet.

Doug Taylor
jetcareers.com
 
cba
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 2:13 pm

I really don't see why Delta is opposed to the 737-700. This plane is extremely profitable and efficient. The A318 makes absouletely no sense at all. The ERJ-90 makes little sense too. I can see DL ordering CRJ-900's and more CRJ-700's. Now can they work with a 60 seat gap between the 738 and CRJ? Maybe, but the 737-700 would be the perfect choice.
 
Leftypilot79
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 2:19 pm

Personally...I would love to see the Embraer. Something other than Boeing and Airbus would be nice. Now its gonna be A vs B vs E wars. LOL


aaron
 
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 2:24 pm

They better stick with Boeing.

I doubt they will order the B 717/A 318. If they want something in the 100 seat range, why not choose the B 737-600? Provided that they already have the B 737-800.

But new planes ANY additional planes would be sweet.

I agree. I would be interested to see Delta ordering new aircraft.  Smile

Just my 2 cents.

 
A320FO
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 4:02 pm

Sounds a little like all those "exclusive" deals some US airlines made with Boeing are starting to cause some heartburn. Boeing doesn't have to fight for those customers as they are bound to them, so support efforts will be redirected to those that are not exclusively bound to Boeing.....
 
cba
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 4:08 pm

Somehow I wouldn't be surprised if Airbus simply gave DL the A318 for free.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Thu Jun 27, 2002 9:01 pm

>Somehow I wouldn't be surprised if Airbus simply gave DL the A318 for free.<

I think that is the main selling point for the 318. I'm told that DAL would receive such a great financing deal that it would be hard not to take -318's. At least one of the rumors says that the payments can be deferred for years allowing essentially "free" airplanes for awhile.

>The cockpit is the standard Boeing EFIS cockpit, according to Boeing's website...<

The 717 cockpit was designed by MD of course and it has "grey" box logic (not "brown" box). And it is set up exactly like the MD11 with 6 CRT's providing all the instruments. It has little in common with the Boeing products or the MD80 series except 2 seats, 2 throttles, Stby compass, etc.

>Sounds a little like all those "exclusive" deals some US airlines made with Boeing are starting to cause some heartburn.<

As covered before. None of the exclusive deals made by Boeing are in effect. Many years ago BA recinded them due to EU objections.

> I really don't see why Delta is opposed to the 737-700.<

DAL wants a plane to fill the gap at the 100 seat level. DAL has 120 MD88's, 15 or 16 MD90s, a dozen or so 737-300's and another 9 737-300G's, 727's also. They are covered up in aircraft that fit that market size.

Doug. Have you read that we are keeping 12 727's through the end of 2003 now? I love the airplane and apparently DAL is having a hard time weaning itself off of it. I was told by a training dept jumpseater that they want them around for awhile to fly charters. Doesn't make sense and the jumpseater agreed. Nontheless, that's what they were telling him.


 
DeltaBoy777
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 1:45 am

I don't think Delta would take the A318, even if they gave it to them on a golden platter.

Remember when Delta was given a A300 from Pan-Am way back when... They hated it they didn't even paint in DL colors before they got rid of it.

Personally the 717 is the best choice, DL has always been a strong Boeing customer, and if boeing would consider a 717 with a longer range capacity, I think they would go for it.
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
cba
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 2:09 am

Funny how the EU gets upset when Boeing has exclusivity deals with airlines, but Airbus is allowed to basically give away airplanes.
 
jrlander
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 2:11 am

Remember when Delta was given a A300 from Pan-Am way back when... They hated it they didn't even paint in DL colors before they got rid of it.


Actually- Delta operated Pan Am's A310's for several years. They even ordered 9 themselves. But the type didn't fit in well the rest of the fleet. If you search on this web site, you will find pictures of A310's in the Delta color scheme.
 
Greg
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 2:18 am

These eclusivity deals were judged to be illlegal by the EU..hence, the actual contract agreements were never signed. HOWEVER, in order for the incentive pricing from Boeing to be received over the next 20 years, Boeing did require Delta, AA, and CO to sign letter of intent agreements ratified by the airline's Board which have some pretty stiff cancellation clauses including back penalties for aircraft all ready in service should other aircraft in the scope specified by purchased.

It's unlikely they would risk those penalty payments.

Is the scope 100 seats plus? Or is it higher?
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 2:42 am

Scope at DAL is set at the 50 seat level and 70 seat level. Basically all flying at over 70 seats must be done by DAL seniority list pilots. Connection carriers are allowed around 60-70 (from memory so hurl no stones) 70 seat airplanes and an almost unlimited number of 50 seaters (the actual number set by some type of formula tied to Mainline flight hours).

DAL fully intends to take all the Boeing aircraft it has contracted for so there is no question of penalties for a breach of contract. Boeing's contract is very flexible for DAL.

In all the rumors that are running around the one thing that is consistent is that DAL hates the 717. They keeps saying that they have looked it up and down on many occasions and they do not want it. AMR doesn't want theirs and nobody else seems to either. (No large carriers excluding TWA who was trying to stave off bankruptcy). Also I do not think that range is the problem. I think DAL is looking at SWA type legs.
 
Guest

RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 2:51 am

717/318 is unlikely. They could just simply send their pax to Delta Connection.

By the way, both 717/318 are not good-selling planes. I think.

717 needs time to hear up, but I doubted about 318.
 
flashmeister
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 5:00 am

I would and wouldn't be at all surprised to see an A318 in Delta colors. Airbus really needs a high-profile customer for A318...

Right now, the A318 orders are:
Air China: 8
Air France: 15
America West: 15
British Airways: 6
CIT: 4
Egyptair: 5
Frontier: 5
GECAS: 30
ILFC: 20
Total: 108

None of them are from a high-profile American carrier, and almost half are from leasing companies which signals that no one is really willing to sign on to A318 wholesale... Frontier's A318 orders are rumored to be vulnerable to switching to A320 instead.

TWA did have an order for (50?) A318 that was killed in the AA acquisition... so they need a big name. Now how much is Airbus willing to give away to get that name?
 
AC340
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 5:18 am

I just want to add me two cents here. First and foremost, Boeing and Airbus operate in an Oligopoly market. Though the bottom line is important, Oligopoly firms are much more interested in market share than actual bottom line profits. Airbus and Boeing are about equal in terms of market share now. By selling their planes at huge discount, they are improving their market share and acting like a good oligopoly firm. But I feel compelled to ask, why do we care how much either Boeing or Airbus sell their planes for?

Now about the topic directly. From what I've been hearing, it doesn't matter that the A318 doesn't fit nicely into DAL fleet. If they can get the a/c at favourable rate, all the power to them; take them. The Embraer wouldn't fit into their fleet any better than the A318, and the acquisition costs of the A318 would probably make up for any significant price differences. In the end, Delta will make the best decision for them, it doesn't matter what aircraft that is, as long as Delta is happy with it and it fits into their strategy. If that means they order the A318, good for them. If they opt for Boeing, all the power to them. But I think we need to learn to trust them to make the best decision for their needs. All this petty bickering about whether Boeing or Airbus makes better planes doesn't help anyone, and just makes us angry.
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 5:23 am

To add to the rumors, DAL has a sheduled board meeting in July (3rd week?) and supposedly some decisions will be made then.
 
srbmod
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 6:56 am

It would be ironic in a way, if Delta went out and ordered the CRJ-900 for mainline operations. With the aircraft sharing commonality with the other members of the CRJ family, Delta pilots will be more than likely learning along side their Delta Connection colleagues learning how to fly the CRJ-100/200/700. If they were to order the 900, do you think you will see a flood of CRJ pilots for various airlines trying to get on at Delta. The Embraer 190/195 would fit very well in the niche already, and I think they have the chance to really rule the niche in between 70-100 seat jets. Airbus is highly unlikely, even if a great deal is reached, it is nothing like anything else in the Delta fleet, at least the CRJ and Embraer has convental flight yokes (No MS Flight Simulator style sidestick here folks). The CRJ-900 has similar engines to the CRJ-700, so that would be a plus for Delta. The 737-600/700 honestly would make the most sense because of commonality reasons, but if the CRJ-900 or EMB-190/195 has lower operating costs than the 737NG, then more power to the beancounters at Delta in making the key decision.
 
brons2
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 7:14 am

MD88Captain:

But why do they hate the 717 so much? You said they've looked it up and down and they hate it, why is it so much worse than the MD-80 that they have a ton of?
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Spacepope
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 7:25 am

Flashmeister-

A few weeks ago America West stated that they have deferred delivery on all 15 of their A318's, along with several other orders. Take that as you will, but IMO, some of that order may be in jeopardy.

T.J.
The last of the famous international playboys
 
MD88Captain
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 9:49 am

Brons2. All I can say is what has been said before. They say it just will not work at DAL. There are probably a million variables in this equation. Everyone says that it is a great plane. Of course the guys flying it love it. It is a tenant of aviation that every pilot loves the plane he is flying at the time. But if it is so great WHY doesn't anyone want it? Why the lukewarm support from Boeing? I don't know, but I'm reading between the lines. I think it may not be as great as people say.

And speaking of variables, the bean counters could care less how harmonized the flight controls are or how consistently the aircraft lands. Accountants, MBA's, marketing gurus, maintenance experts look at things like cargo capacity, available simulator time, ease of maintenance, schedule of maintenance, do we have the capacity to do the maintenance? do we have to buy specialized tools? how much will we be charged for the performance numbers? what's the overhead baggage space? how does the insurance industry price/look at this airframe? will the aisles accept the standard beverage cart or do we have to buy a cart that works on only that aircraft? fuel burn? range? time to altitude? parts support? parts availability? manual/tech support? segment length? does the standard ground support equipment work on this model or do we have to buy more specialized ground equipment? how many can we get at one time? how many do we want at one time? short field capability? high altitude airport capability? how many do we want? what's the lead time? where do the pilots/mechanics go to train? and all the other little and big things that I do not know about. They looked at the 717 and they do not like it. Why specifically? It probably doesn't measure up to the competition.

And MD88's just are not anything like the 717's. Different cockpit, different engines, very different. 2 class vs 1 class. 100pax vs 142pax. I guess there may be some common parts, but I'm not sure what. All the expensive stuff (engines & avionics) is different. The wings are different so you can't interchange the stuff on the wings except the lightbulbs. The gears looks smaller on the 717. I just don't think the commonality argument supports the 717.
 
brons2
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 4:30 pm

Hum.

I don't meant to seem like I'm some 717 lover, because I'm not. Perhaps Boeing made a mistake by going to a very uncommon engine, or the 100pax size just doesn't work too well with the airframe (from the direction of the market it looks like 100 seat planes may become the domain of the RJ manufacturers). Maybe Boeing shouldn't have tried to make an airframe that most people use as an airliner, into a regional jet. Maybe people don't have confidence that Boeing won't drop the program. Who knows.

Now that I got you talking, why didn't DAL like the MD-90?
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Dalmd88
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 9:19 pm

Why didn't DL like the MD-90? It had a very bad start. It quickly was nicknamed MinDelay-90min. Too many systems were changed from the MD-80. I have been told the plane had a ton of electric distribution problems as well as a bunch of engine problems when the plane first came in to service. I truly believe Delta killed McDonnell-Douglas. The MD-90 was to be the 727 replacement aircraft. The MD-11 was to be the premier international aircraft for us. Delta's dissatisfaction of these planes put MD out of business.

As for MD88 to 717 commonality I've never been up close to a 717 so I'm only speculating. The Avionics are likely different, obviously the engines have no commons. Structures wise I bet it's about 90% the same. I think the gear is different though. I know the only place to buy a MD-80 gear set is from a desert plane. There are none in Long Beach.

I think the Airbus is the front runner. It all comes down to cost. AB is going to give them away. Why did we dislike the A310? Poor product support was the biggest reason. I wish we would go with the 717 or the 737. I wonder what the Airbus and the Brakillya jet will look like after 15 years of service.
 
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RE: Delta To Order Boeing 737-600/700 Aircraft?

Fri Jun 28, 2002 11:01 pm

I think Delta should order 737-700s and 717s to replace their aging 737-200s. The 737-600 is not a very good seller compared to the 717.