Flying Belgian
Topic Author
Posts: 1906
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Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 12:36 am

Hello !!!


It is now the 5th day in a row I am reading a Ryanair advertisement regarding a promotional fare offered in Belgium. For 10 Euros you fly CRL-STN one way.
I must admit so far: nothing special. The same ugly ads, like if they were selling potatoes bags.
But the trouble is that in each advertisement you can find 3 spelling mistakes. Both in french and dutch !! It seems they literally translate from english to one of those two languages without even checking if the word is existing...
I therefore wonder how such an arrogant carrier isn't ashamed to publish such rubbish in the Belgian newspapers ???

As I know FR has its own advertisement design department, will send an e-mail to them, asking the same question as above.

Down with Ryanair... The low fare flying stupidity.


FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
richardw
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 12:42 am

What is the most common spelling mistake with regard to no frills airlines?

It is probably the airport that they operate from Stanstead of course!

I'm actually more concerned about Ryanair's operational standards than poor spelling.
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 12:42 am

Mmmm, a supposed spelling mistake, and you call Ryanair 'stupid' and 'arrogant'.

FB, maybe you're the one who is being a little naive.

Go and look at the statistics of Ryanair, then come back and tell me if you still think Ryanair -or its many pax- are stupid and arrogant.

I think you will reach the answer 'no'.

The adverts work very well; obviously, many people have decided that flying isn't anything special, just another form of travel, so it shouldn't be unaffordable. So, yes, just like going and buying a sack of potatoes. Why should it be any different?

Come back with something more convincing please.
 
airblue
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 12:54 am

Also when they made some comparative ads against Alitalia on all the main Italian newspapers (I think I reported it a while ago in some topic here on A.net) they made a lot of spelling mistakes.
And also if you go on their web site (Italian version) you could find dozen of mistakes. Probably because in their advertisement design department they haven't native Italian.
But at the end I think some little grammatical mistakes don't affect their operations...
 
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Fly-K
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 1:42 am

About 90% of FR's German ads have at least one spelling mistake too.
It's the idea of how carefully they execute any of their operations that is being conveyed, and if they are careless in ads, it casts a shadow on them.

Konstantin
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
Flying Belgian
Topic Author
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 1:51 am

Moreover my opinion is that it is a complete lack of respect for the countries who host them.

Just my opinion.


FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
rw774477
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 1:53 am

I've seen English mistakes on Lufthansa and geographical mistakes on a PTV screen where SNN was placed in Galway county.

do I hear 'down with Lufthansa' ?

rw774477
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 1:59 am

If there are so many spelling errors in Ryanair's adverts, then I totally agree: there shouldn't be, and any spelling mistakes which are present, certainly don't convey a favourable impression to more sensitive travellers.

I also recall the time when Ryanair's online pilot application form prompted applicants to pay online the application fee, at the same time insisting this was the only method, but also that a secure link was not available.

This was plainly outrageous, and Mr. O'leary was rightly lambasted by a BBC journalist for such 'madness'.

However, this doesn't merit calling the airline 'so stupid' and 'arrogant'. Ryanair thankfully learnt its lesson from the latter case, and still continues to record fantastic growth in many areas including passenger numbers; some of those passengers will undoubtedly be repeat customers. Obviously they are satisfied with the Ryanair service, so I doubt they too are being stupid or arrogant. Today, I booked a flight to Dublin with 3 friends for 29 pounds.

I've flown with Ryanair many times, and I haven't once observed the crew acting suspiciously or illegally. In fact, Ryanair inflight service is quite good.
As for all the trash swimming around the web regarding Ryanair's supposed unsafe ops--mmmm, no hard evidence has emerged, this is what makes me think it is all just a smearing campaign, orchestrated by who knows......

Regards
 
TriStar500
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:03 am

If they can save a pile of cash by not hiring external PR agencies and doing the advertisement design themselves, they can get all the publicity they need through lower fares.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
764
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:08 am

Well, that fits just into the general picture that Ryanair creates in the public. "Cheap,cheap,cheap, who the heck cares about the others". I personally hope that Ryanair will be forced to step up aircraft maintenance or have their fleet grounded, because spelling mistakes are not all there is. It is not a secret that Ryanair has had trouble with safety before. They do not offer any service - that is sad, but fine with me - but worse, they don't even offer safety and that is what has to be an airlines first priority. Also for no frills carriers.
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:17 am

'they don't even offer safety'

'Also for no frills carriers'

Proof please.
 
travelin man
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:19 am

They don't offer safety? Has a RyanAir plane ever crashed due to maintenance issues or pilot error? "Not offering safety" seems like a sweeping generalization about an airline when I've seen little evidence of this.

764, do you know something we don't?
 
philb
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:26 am

764,

Flying Belgian's rubbish about Ryanair is bad enough but you publish an absolute libel in your post.

I was going to forward your libel to Ryanair and let Mr O'Leary's lawyers contact you through your ISP but, of course, you aren't man enough to publish your email address - you are just a whimpering idiot with no knowledge who makes stupid allegations and hasn't the brains to realise what he publishes leaves him wide open to not only being thought a fool by all but to action for libel.

I challenge you now to defend your rubbish by:

1. Giving full details (including dates, times, flight numbers, information of IAA reports or any other credible evidence) to back up your statement that Ryanair do not offer safety.

2. Stating when you have flown on Ryanair (dates, flight numbers, sectors).

3. Stating any other sources you may have.

If you have real evidence of safety breaches publish them here by all means and I'll pass to the IAA for you so they can comment and investigate.

Of course, to be credible, you will need to include your contact details.

If you can't do any of the above, if - as indeed I suspect - you are a nerd with nothing better to do but fill what tries to be an informed forum with rubbish, I suggest you crawl back into your hole and leave this forum to those who wish to live in the real world.
 
LJ
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:33 am

Since when does FR has an advertising department?

BTW the stupidest mistake so far is a comparison Ryanair made in the press release they made when they announced the EIN-STN route. They compared Ryanair with those of BA. There was only one problem. BA had cancelled Eindhoven to London one year prior to the launch (this means they can't even work with a CRS).

Regards
Laurens
 
go canada!
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:42 am

Ryanair are stupid if they cant spell correcty but you will find mistakes with any large business, they cant always get things right.

i dont see ryanair as being an unsafe airline...i see it for what it is..

a cheap airline, offering cheap service that doesnt apologise.
It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
 
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yyz717
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:46 am

Ryanair is providing jobs and services to the Belgian public. Ryanair is creating economic wealth in Belgium. Ryanair is hardly arrogant & stupid.

The former management & unions of SN are the ones who are arrogant & stupid. SN was the world's most consistently unprofitable airline in history, and was constantly being bailed out by the Belgian taxpayer, whether Belgians flew with SN or not.

I'll take a profitable carrier with no spellchecking over a bloated, bureaucratic pseudo-government national carrier any time!



I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
philb
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:56 am

Go Canada,

You are right about businesses and the errors they make. Even Coca Cola, Hoover, and VW, using the best ad agencies in the world have, over the years, made errors resulting in either unintentionally funny or even offensive ads appearing from time to time in different countries.

Even Rolls Royce had to spend thousands of UK Pounds in the 1960s scrapping badges, a massive ad campaign and supporting merchandising material when someone pointed out that, in Germany, their new prestige model, the Silver Mist, might just give the wrong impression.

As to Ryanair offering a cheap service, why can't people get a grip on the fact that short haul flying is nothing more than a fast, convenient, airborne bus service. You don't expect frills on a bus, nor do you expect to pay over the odds.

From the late 1950s, airlines have been doing everything they can to fly cheaply ("Vickers Vanguard, the 2d per passenger mile Turboprop" ran the Vickers ad in 1959 - "BAC 1-11 the "Bus Stop Jet" - offering jet service on short sectors at low operating costs" was the BAC publicity in 1964).

The difference now is that the savings are passed to the passenger - making it easier for more to fly, and what is wrong with that?
 
Flying Belgian
Topic Author
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 3:37 am

Don't worry PhilB, facts will be published very soon...

BTW, I really dislike your threatening behaviour with 764. Are you American to threaten people that way with rubbish about f*** lawyers ???


FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
Sabena332
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 3:51 am

I was going to forward your libel to Ryanair and let Mr O'Leary's lawyers contact you through your ISP

Mr O`Leary has lawyer`s? That is new for me! Big grin

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
airblue
Posts: 1785
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 3:55 am

facts will be published very soon...

These "facts" are the same of the report we read here on A.net a while ago or there are something new??

 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:00 am

'facts will be published very soon...'

Oooh, the suspense! Please, enlighten us Flying Belgium, or is this some more rubbish for our amusement!?

Please, do tell!

764 deserves to get the boll****** Philb dished out to him for making such an idiotic comment! (Basically accusing ALL LCC's of operating unsafely).

Sometimes I wonder whether it is just better to allow such stupid threads to die....but then I worry about those who live outside Europe getting totally false impressions of an airline, due to the idiocy and ignorance of a few airliners.net people who have something against a new airline which gives people what they want, to the apparent detriment of their 'favourite' BAs, Lufthansas etc.......very depressing.

 
manni
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:07 am

PhilB,

If your idea of contributing to airliners.net is threathening other members than you aren't better than those posting misleading information.
SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
 
luzezito
Posts: 250
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:10 am

PERHAPS THOSE MISTAKES ARE PART OF THE CATCH!!!!!
THINK ABOUT IT
Quoniam Vita Brevis Est, Propera!
 
philb
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:12 am

Flying Belgian,

The British Courts recently ruled that Internet sites operating in the UK can be sued for carrying libellous material, even where that material is posted by persons other than the owner/operator of the site (e.g. in forums) unless the operator immediately removes that libel. Most other EU countries have indicated that they will follow suit.

That apart, ANYTHING that can be construed as libel is ACTIONABLE across borders, if the plaintiff has a mind and the money to persue the action.

If you didn't know that, I've done you a great favour. The Internet IS NOT a free fire zone for every idiot to spout off against his favourite target with rumour, innuendo and lies.

Believe me, O'Leary has the money, the lawyers and the will to drop on anyone libelling his company if he so wishes.
 
philb
Posts: 2645
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:27 am

Manni and Flying Belgian.

Just to let you know, I'm not threatening anyone, I'm pointing out the facts of life regarding what happens to people who libel others.

BTW, I understood the "facts" were being put to the European Commission today by the "pilots" concerned - if previous threads were to be believed.

So far the news wires, aviation info sites and other media seem to have "overlooked" the startling revelations.

Surely, a group of pilots, accusing there employers of gross negligence, illegal practices and flight safety breaches and presenting a document to the EC regarding same would have had EVERY station in Europe and the US out in force today.

Then again, perhaps the facts are so shocking, the EC has decided no publicity should be allowed and Ryanair will be eliminated quietly, without anyone being allowed to know how, why and when they ceased trading the SABENA can rise from the ashes, the Belgian tax payer can be ripped off all over again and Flying Belgian and his mates can turn their attention to VG Airlines and dream up lies, innuendo etc. to drive them routes that only SABENA have the right to operate - in your dreams.
 
caravelle
Posts: 656
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2000 4:33 am

Threats :-((

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:41 am

I don't very much like the way people here are treating other members of this forum.
We may agree, we may disagree, but here (and it's not the first time I have seen it) members are telling members they would forward their private e-mail addresses to in this case Ryanair, but I've seen other examples, for further legal action!
What is it with you guys? Are you trying to kill this great site?
This is a place where people meet to talk, exchange views and opinions, and in my case learn, more than teach.
Some of us know a lot. Some of us not so much. Some of us are young and inexperienced. Others quite the opposite: Perhaps too old, approaching stale.
But for heavens sake: Let's sort out our differences between ourselves! This is where we meet, so keep goddamn legal threats out!  Sad

And cudos to Johan and the moderators for flying the flag of free speech!

- caravelle

Trains and boats and planes....
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:53 am

If these 'pilots' were so concerned about the practices of their employer, why didn't they resign? And why did they join FR in the first place? I imagine that they are probably ex SN types that thought they could fly under 50 hours a month for lots of money ... and had a rude awakening when they actually had to work for their pay!  Big grin
 
philb
Posts: 2645
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RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:54 am

Caravelle,

I don't know if you are deliberately missing the point, or have a lack of understanding of libel.

There have been many posts on a number of threads recently about Ryanair. Many of these have been supporting an anonymous document purporting to be in circulation on the Net and prepared by "Ryanair Pilots".

In this thread, we have accusations of Ryanair having unsafe practices.

None of the safety accusations has been supported by any evidence, the posters always either claim they are "reposting an anonymous document" for discussion or they are people who do not give their details.

THis forum is not the school yard, posts like this are not silly gossip. This site can be accessed by anyone.

Any unsubstantiated talk of unsafe practices, which cannot be later backed up by FACTS is libel. If the people who wish to post such rubbish here - which directly trashes the good name of Ryanair - want to continue as they are doing, they are in danger of being pursued for damages and having this site closed down.

But hey, what do I know about law and the way companies operate?

If they wish to carry on in their ignorance that's up to them, but don't attack someone who is pointing out the realities of life and who cares about his adopted country's second (but more successful) carrier,
 
caravelle
Posts: 656
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2000 4:33 am

PhilB:

Wed Jul 17, 2002 5:11 am

PhilB,
I didn't miss the point. And I'm a regular here, though I don't post all that much. So I know the discussions, and the name of the game. But I mean what I just said. Threats never did anyone any good. Sometimes, they're downright stupid.
Now sue.

- caravelle
Trains and boats and planes....
 
SK A330-300
Posts: 69
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2001 7:45 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 5:12 am

I’m not accusing Ryanair or any other low cost carrier for not being safe. I’m just sharing what I’ve read and heard in media lately.

In a Swedish news program on TV last night they referred to an originally secret report from British air traffic controllers that have been available to the public by mistake. In the report the controllers say that they are concerned about the safety of the low cost carriers. An article in Swedish can be found on http://www.aftonbladet.se/vss/nyheter/story/0,2789,184807,00.html

Translation from part of the article referring to the report: "The pilots are put under such stress by their companies and their tight timetables that they approaches the airports too fast and too low. They are putting us under stress and they call for priority to land. They say it in a very aggressive and abrupt way. This is causing a situation where the safety could be at risk."

Maybe we will hear more about this in the days to come.

SK A330-300
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 6:23 am

Caravelle,

I'm not taking action against anyone, I'm simply pointing out that there are posts on here that are unsubstantiated and, in fact, libelous.

If you and others can't/won't see that, that's your/their problem and it could become a problem for the forum.

We are not talking here about matters of opinion about cabin service, which seat is better, who has the best colour scheme, or even having sustantiated FACTS discussed.

There is a very vicious and nasty smear campaign being conducted by a handful of disgruntled Belgians who can't understand that Ryanair's success out of Charleroi had very little to do with the downfall of SABENA.

Every time they are challenged for substantiated FACTS, they back off then come back with more rubbish.

Others then join in for reasons of their own, mostly trivial.

For the record, I'm fed up with Ryanair because I use them to connect with international flights over the UK, where I need to take two cases for my trips. I now find I have to pay EURO 7 per kilo for each kilo, or part thereof, over 15 kgs. That sucks, and it hurts my pocket.

I was also pleased to see that Ryanair lost when a woman, to whom they promised free flights for life was given a hard time and repeatedly obstructed when she tried to book, brought an action against them in Dublin.

O'Leary got what he deserved, but he/Ryanair DO NOT deserve repeated slurs against their safety and operating practices which are monitored and licensed by one of the most intrusive and critical Aviation Authorities on earth.

SKA330-300

The report you mention hit the headlines in the UK over 2 weeks ago. It DID NOT come from a "secret report" but from a CHIRP report (which is an anonymous system of safety concern reporting set up by the UK CAA for aviation professionals) which can be accessed by any interested party.

One controller raised concerns HE had. They do not seem to be general in the ATC community.
 
manni
Posts: 4049
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:48 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 6:33 am

Yes I'm Belgian, and no I did not made the link Ryanair vs Sabena when I replied to you. I'm certainly not disgrunteld and I'm very pleased with the current rebirth of Belgian aviation (TCB, SNBA, VG, Birdy). BTW, I just noticed that 764 is American, so he isn't a disgrundeld Belgian either.

Ooh and dont get to personal about Belgian citizens, if the Belgian secret service read this they might sue you...  Laugh out loud  Laugh out loud  Laugh out loud
SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 6:39 am

Manni,

When you have a reasonable point to make and can contribute constructively to the discussion, I'd be happy to debate with you.

If you had UNDERSTOOD my post you would have realised that the phrase "others then join in for reasons of their own" referred to 764 and other non-Belgians but, in fairness, I suppose you make a better job of English than I do of Flemish
 
ZRH
Posts: 4371
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 1999 11:32 pm

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 6:46 am

I don't really care about the spelling mistakes but 10 Euro for a flight is ridiculous and not honest. No airline, even not low-cost, can fly for such a price. I only hope their safety standards are not like their spelling.
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 6:53 am

ZRH,

Ever heard of a loss leader? You have to be very quick to get the low prices.

BTW, easyJet state that profitability across all their services is achieved when 48% of seats are filled on a flight. Whilst most of their base prices are not as low as Ryanair, they are still very cheap.

BTW, why the query re safety? As I keep stating the Irish Aviation Authority is just about the most stringent, intrusive and careful AOC issuing body on earth.
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 7:09 am

ZRH, Ryanair make huge profits, so obviously they don't need your advice on what fare levels they should set.

In addition, many other airlines have now offered similar deals, including flyDBA. So I think we can be sure the system works fine.
 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 7:55 am

You may all be interested to read the reports on this website:

http://www.carsurvey.org/air/airline_Ryanair.html

I have no idea who this guy is, or whether the reports are in fact 'real', I found the website simply by typing in 'Ryanair' on yahoo.

Although there is no way of my checking the accuracy of what is written on this website, as a person who flies with FR quite frequently, it seems a lot more convincing and closer to the truth than the rubbish spouted on this thread, and others.

They seem to be a list of annonymous Ryanair trip reports, some favourable, some not.

 
Guest

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 8:15 am

I am flying them PIK-BVA tomorrow; and back again on Friday; and PIK-DUB next Tuesday, returning on Friday. If I didn't believe that they were safe, then I wouldn't fly them ... it's as simple as that.
 
Snoopy
Posts: 355
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2001 9:14 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 11:45 am

Oh boy! I got a real chuckle out of this thread. Having lived in Japan for over two years now I am totally immune to spelling mistakes in English language adverts. In many cases the Japanese write English as they pronounce it, that is replacing the "l" with an "r"...so much for "Have a good fright". They also use a turn of phrase which is so far-fetched that it is hilarious. Adverts for 4x4 SUV's talking about nature, greenery, bubbling streams and the like...all of course will be destroyed by the many 4x4 vehlicles they are selling. I've seen spelling mistakes in many places that should be exempt from them: The Times, bestseller novels, etc... The conclusion is: We're all human and we all make mistakes and the only way not to make mistakes is not to do anything at all. I'll take the mistakes....
 
swake
Posts: 227
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2001 4:47 am

RE: Ryanair : So Arrogant But Also So Stupid!

Wed Jul 17, 2002 5:54 pm

Geeee! What a miserable, plain idiotic thread.
So far nothing more than rumours, anonymous notes, and, oh yes, a few, God forgive, spelling errors. Amazing how people can get carried away.

Manni,
'If your idea of contributing to airliners.net is threathening other members than you aren't better than those posting misleading information. '

There is no justification for having someone's reputation or business ruined on rumours or not in any way proven facts.

Swake