Guest

Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:30 pm

The FAA downgraded Argentina's safety rating to Category 2 from Category 1 after a reassessment of the country's civil aviation authority found that it does not comply with international safety standards set by ICAO. Airlines from countries in Category 2 are allowed to continue operations at current levels under "heightened" FAA surveillance but changes and expansion in services to the US are not permitted. New services only will be accepted if operated using aircraft wet-leased from a duly authorized and properly supervised US carrier or a foreign carrier from a Category 1 country that is authorized to serve the US using its own aircraft. The Argentine government indicated its "desire" to correct the issues identified as a result of FAA's reassessment and FAA said it will remain "engaged" and will review the situation periodically.
 
ArgInMIA
Posts: 475
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 4:07 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 9:55 pm

This is sooooooo strange.. the security in Argentina's Airport after 9-11 whas changed radically.. its much much better than prior years... so.. whyit was cat1 during all those prior years.. and now its 2?? I smell political punishment because of the default or something like that...

my 2 cents
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
L-188
Posts: 29881
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 1999 11:27 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 9:57 pm

Knowing the FAA.

It probably took them a year to write the report.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Guest

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:02 pm

May have nothing to do with this, but I recently flew in to Buenos Aires' Int'l airport, Ezeiza, during the evening aboard an Iberia a/c.

I was struck by just how dim the r/w lights were-I've really never seen such a poorly lighted runway in my life.

This might also be the reason why Southern Winds, an Argentine domestic carrier wishing to start international services to the US and elsewhere, is using 767s wetleased from Air Atlanta. I've seen 1 of the 767s parked at Ezeiza, in Southern Winds colours.

Regards
 
ArgInMIA
Posts: 475
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 4:07 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:09 pm

Also they took Argentina out of the Visa Waiver program... this was back in february.. so what happends now with Southern Winds Plans? can they still start flights to the US? I'm not really shure about the wet lease.. couse it would be not very smart to have US crew paying US dollars.. its much cheaper to have Argentinian crew and pay in much devaluated Arg Peso, this is what Aerolineas Argentinas is taking advantage with at their MAD hub..
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
chepos
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RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:10 pm

By the way when is Southern Winds planing to launch flights to the MIA?
Chepos
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
ArgInMIA
Posts: 475
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 4:07 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:14 pm

They keep changing dates.. first it was supposed by early July.. now they are saying.. end of July.. or maybe August but I also read "...Before the end of the year".. I cant wait to see SW here at MIA it would be the first time ever to see 2 Argentinian Airlines on MIA, I just hope they park ARG and SW's airplanes together.. and that they get rid of the Varig that they put there  Big grin
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
hkgspotter1
Posts: 5750
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RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:16 pm

Let me guess, the USA is Cat 1 ?

We all know if the FAA say a country is bad it must be true !. I remember all the crap they gave the Philippines.
 
Guest

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Wed Jul 17, 2002 11:54 pm

ARG, I got the information from the weekly aviation magazine 'Flight International'.

The crews won't necessarily be American, as Air Atlanta, despite its name, is actually Icelandic (check their web address).

The article noted that there was no other way SW could operate to the US under Category 2; it has to wetlease, or the US will ban SW's ops (as they have yet to begin).

Regards
 
lanperu
Posts: 602
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2001 1:17 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 1:17 am

Wow, this is really sad indeed. This is gonna hurt them alot, so what about the MD-80s in Europe? Can they still continue their planned expansion?
 
Guest

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 2:35 am

LanPeru, I don't much understand how the FAA applies these rules, but from what I understand, placing a country under Category 2 status means that no new services between that country and the US may be started by airlines owned by the Category 2 country.

So I guess AR/SW ops outside the US are not affected.

Regards
 
747firstclass
Posts: 821
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 2:45 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 3:23 am

Wasnt there an on again, off again openskies agreement between the US and Argentina? I did not follow that one closely, but seems to me there was some controversy along those lines. Perhaps that enters into things too, albeit after the safety issues.
 
lima
Posts: 1090
Joined: Sun May 30, 1999 11:37 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 3:27 am

The radarization plan was another issue. Argentina commited to renew the radar system and US companies won the tender. But during the De la Rua government due to the increasing economic problems the plan was cancelled. This angered the US and the warnings of possible downgrade started to follow. The open skies proposal was also denied by Argentina, another thing that didin't please the USA.
 
Jj
Posts: 1189
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2001 7:40 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 3:40 am

... and now they punish us with the downgrade... Clever....

However, I'm pleased, as my favorite airline (AR) will now have a kind of monopoly from Argentina to the US routes flown by argentinian airlines.

Also, can US companies start new services to Argentina?

jj
 
RJ_Delta
Posts: 1391
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2000 4:17 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 3:47 am

The last month I read an article published in Avion Revue Magazine about the dangerous situation in the ILS and landing system in Aeroparque Jorge Newberry, and many problems in the maintenance of the planes.

RJ_Delta.
 
ArgInMIA
Posts: 475
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 4:07 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 4:49 am

Yes.. this is a punishment.. Also US airlines can do as they please with argentinian routes.. but argentinian's airlines cannot add services to US..
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
doug_or
Posts: 3118
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 4:58 am

"Yes.. this is a punishment.. Also US airlines can do as they please with argentinian routes.. but argentinian's
airlines cannot add services to US.."


welllllll...... no. In case anyone is not clear on this issue, this is a rating based on the country (not on any individual airlines) by the FAA. It affects air service only between the country in question and the us. The Cat 2 rating doesn't disallow US carriers to fly there, no, but I doubt argentina would let them, in light of being downgraded. (just want to make sure not to rub anyone the wrong way here, I don't know anyithng about the current politics in volved and don't intend to deny this was done as punishment)
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
Jj
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RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 7:45 am

What i mean is, not allowing more new flights from argie airlines to the US, means the US govt. won't allow more new flights from US Airlines to Argentina?
 
travelin man
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2000 10:04 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 7:54 am

Given Argentina's economy, I highly doubt ANY US airline wants to start new Argentinian service.
 
747firstclass
Posts: 821
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 2:45 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 7:57 am

UA has announced new nonstop serrvice from IAD-EZE starting late October, 2002. Will this service be affected?
 
Jj
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Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2001 7:40 am

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 8:05 am

And American is starting DFW-EZE soon...
 
trintocan
Posts: 2725
Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2000 6:02 pm

RE: Argentina Downgraded To Category 2

Thu Jul 18, 2002 9:28 am

No US carriers' services to Argentina or any other Cat 2 countries are affected by such a rating - indeed they can expand their services (provided that the affected country allows them to) but the restrictions on the home countries airline(s) can literally take the wind out of their sails and thus give the US carriers a major advantage.

This Categorisation thing has had a lot of political overtones in the past and countries seem to have been downgraded in the past whenever they upset the US in one way or another. Somehow Argentina's downgrade seems to smell of that...

Trintocan.
Hop to it, fly for life!