AsianaAirlines
Topic Author
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Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Wed Jul 24, 2002 4:42 pm

I was thinking about Asiana. I'm sure everybody knows that Asiana's fleet of 747 combis are getting kinda raggety and old. But does anybody know what would be better?... Asiana replacing the whole 747 fleet with 772ER's and the upcoming 773ER's? or Asiana just replacing the 747 fleet with more combi's?
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Wed Jul 24, 2002 7:18 pm

Ah I don't get it!

All those Combi's are 744's the oldest is around 12-13 years old, last time I heard there are still 30 year old 741's and 742's flying!

A 777 though is cheaper and more economical in nowa days than a 747!
I haven't heard anything about Asiana replacing it's 744M's so they will be in the fleet for a few more years yet! Asiana are an airline that seems to like the extra cargo capacity in it's pax planes!! I spose in the future we may see Asiana replace it's 744M's with 772ER's and 773ER's due to the 777's great cargo capacity.
 
Mr.BA
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Wed Jul 24, 2002 8:08 pm

The B777s burns relatively less fuel than the B747s but it carries less passengers. I guess it depends on the airline? If the airline uses the B747s on high density longhaul routes I don't think the B777 would be much of a good replacement.

Cheers
Boeing747 万岁!
 
LMP737
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 1:20 am

IMHO it's a good idea replacing 747-100/200 with 777-300. The operating costs are 40% cheaper on the 777 when compared to older 747. In those dense Asian markets you can cram a lot of seats onto a 777-300 so it's not like your losing any passengers.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
United Airline
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 9:21 am

How many B 747-400s do they have? And how many of them are combis?

Are they replacing the entire B 747-400 Fleet?

Personally, I haven't heard anything about Asianna Replacing its B 747-400 Combis in the NEAR future. To be frank, they still very new.
 
AsianaAirlines
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 2:45 pm

They have 8 747's. 6 of them combi's and 2 of them just PAX. They arent replacing the 747's in the near future, but I'm just supposing what they would do. I would really like to see they're old 747's out of the picture. I think that replacing the 747's with the 777 is a pretty decent idea.
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 2:45 pm

I count 13 744's including
5 400F's
6 400M's
2 400 full pax
 
United Airline
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 4:19 pm

So will they replace the ENTIRE B 747-400 Fleet with B 777s? Or with newer B 744s?
 
na
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 77

Thu Jul 25, 2002 6:21 pm

If an airline can fill a 744 its smarter to stay with the Jumbo Jet. Boeing claims it still offers the lowest seat-mile costs, even compared to the 777!
 
airsicknessbag
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 6:26 pm

These are the maximum number of passengers for the three respective planes:

747-400: 624
747-200: 550
777-300: 550

So, not regarding cargo space (how´s that in a 773 compared to 747s?), a 777-300 can only replace a 747-200 without a reduction in capacity.

Daniel Smile
 
hkg82
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 10:14 pm

It's bound to happen eventually, 747s are great but they are old & newer planes can out-perform them in most ways.

Hkg82.
 
RickB
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Thu Jul 25, 2002 10:22 pm

In terms of daily economics, the 777 is clearly the winner, however, most of these 747's are paid for, or leased on very low payments, before replacing a fleet because they cost more to fly, you have to consider how long its going to take before they recoup the initial investment in new hardware.

The 30% saving on fuel is relatively small compared to a $130,000,000+ investment in a new aircraft - it will take a while for that 30% to pay back the initial investment - although maintenance costs have to be factored in too.

The other point as already made, is a lot of Asian routes are very high density, in which case, if you lose a substantial number of seats 70+ that's going to hurt, it might even mean the 30% loss is worthwhile at least in the short term.
 
ual777contrail
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Fri Jul 26, 2002 7:47 am

airsicknessbag,
who on this planet operates the 747-400 configured to 624 pax?
who has posted this info? boeing?

i dont beleive that 624



ual 777 contrail
 
United777
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Fri Jul 26, 2002 11:04 am

I just flew on a Asiana Airlines 777-200 and it was one of the best flight I've been on. I think Asiana should take more 777-200's. It is good for it's routes right now.
 
airsicknessbag
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Fri Jul 26, 2002 6:08 pm

Ual777contrail,

no airline is operating a 624 seat all economy 747-400 - and no airline is operating a 550 seat 777-300 either. But keep in mind the 747-400 Domestic JL and NH use (568 seats) are two-class: there are 24 (!) F seats on board - the number of seats in theory in an all economy configuration could be 624.

Now, where did I get this number - hmm, good question. I guess I didn´t bother remembering the source when I first heard it, sorry.

The thing is, when comparing planes´ capacities, I like to calculate with the highest possible number. Because otherwise, you get "standard three class configurations", and then you don´t know what exactly is meant by that.

Daniel Smile
 
ual777contrail
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Sat Jul 27, 2002 2:08 am

airsicknessbag,
i wasnt trying to queston you i guess i was in awe at how many seats that it could hold.
i just wondered if there was in fact an airline that had that many seats on one givin plane.

i remember UNITED use to have 2 class 747's to hawaii didnt they?

i wonder how many seats on that one.


ual 777 contrail
 
Marcus
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Sat Jul 27, 2002 3:54 am

Just flew OZ from LA to Seoul on a 744Combi and came back on full pax 744, they keep those planes in top condition.............from a purely passenger point of view I saw no need to replace them in the short term.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
AvObserver
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Sat Jul 27, 2002 8:41 am

Boeing must think that it is; they targeted the 777-300 to do just that. Similar in capacity to the 747-100 and 200, it burns about a third less fuel and has 40% lower maintenance costs according to sources I've seen. Then again, Airbus would want you to look at their A340-600 which probably can't produce quite the same cost savings but gives you that 4 engine feel of security on long flights (if, indeed, that matters to you).
 
kaitakfan
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Sat Jul 27, 2002 12:54 pm

777Contrail to answer your question of the 747-100 United used to Hawaii the configuration was 42 in first class with 16 first class seats on the upper deck 26 seats in the nose. Economy was 408 seats. The grand total is 450 seats. Can you say Cattle Cart?!?
 
747-451
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RE: Is It Smarter To Replace Old 747's With New 777's?

Sat Jul 27, 2002 4:03 pm

Asiana started in 1988, so how "old" can their 747-400's be? (since they only use the 400 model). There are still some 747's flying from 1970 (UPS operates a few 747-121SF's). The last Asiana 747 I saw looked beautiful and certainly well maintained.

Many airlines are replacing 747-100/200 with the 777 since they offer more or less the same amount of passengers and operate more economically (and newer planes are easier to maintain that old ones). Asiana uses combi's on some routes and that would be a mitigating factor in determining a replacement.