rj777
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Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 1:47 am

Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 1:05 pm

I just want opinions, not an A v. B war. Would US Be OK if they hadn't been the first US operator of the A330?
 
OO-AOG
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 1:20 pm

What do you mean?, that US Airways might be under chapter 11 because of operating the A330?! Don't really get it, give us some facts please...  Confused
Falcon....like a limo but with wings
 
DCA-ROCguy
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 1:24 pm

What do you mean by 'OK?' Do you mean financially OK? US Airways' financial problems are systemic and date back to decisions made over a 30-year period. Decisions which have nothing to do with the A330. Probably the biggest factor is the cowardice and/or complacency of CEO's Edwin Colodny and Seth Schofield. They failed to engage unions over excessively high-cost labor agreements, and failed to rationalize the fleet after the 1987 airline buying binge (PS and PI).

Indeed, sadly, the very existence of the airline could be called a financial problem. Its constituent parts (Allegheny, Mohawk, Empire-Piedmont) went un-bought by the network carriers over the years, because they didn't want medium-size Northeastern routes. Easier money was to be made elsewhere.

From what I have read, an aircraft of the A330's size was well-justified for certain transatlantic routes, when US made the decision to purchase them. Excatly how well the routes are doing with A330's now, I don't know, but I haven't read anything to suggest that the routes are failing badly. US has maintained the bulk of its European routes, and use of A330's, since 9/11.

Jim
Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
 
cloudy
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 1:24 pm

No. UsAir's problems are related to a lack of fleet comonality, an awkward and unprofitable route structure, labor issues, airport problems, bad management, etc.

Not having the A330 would have helped with commonality, but not by much. Fleet planning is important, but routing and labor issues are the big airline killers IMHO.
 
hkgspotter1
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 1:27 pm

How many more times do we have to hear ...

Would US Airways have been OK if they had not gone AIrbus !!

This is stupid.
 
aio86
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 5:21 pm

I think what he meant by this was... Did US Air really need the A330? Maybe they could have handled those trans-atlantic flights fine with 767s? Maybe it was an unnecesary aircraft to buy. They could have made use with the 767s they already had, or maybe opted to buy 764s (althought they'd still be buying an aircraft). I don't think the fleet comonality was an issue with the A330 since the A320 family planes have such similar cockpits.

-aio86
 
gkirk
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 6:55 pm

I think the question asked is similar to something like:
Would BA be better off financially if they had not chosen the 777.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
rabenschlag
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:17 pm

calm down folks,

what rj777 is pointing at is an obvious fact. so many airlines that ordered lotsa airbuses went down or nearly did. examples: sabena, swissair, LTU, air inter, AOM, USAir, united. and wait what is going to happen with SAS. what about LH? they soon will have an almost all airbus fleet. this is going to kill them. but wait... perhaps the airbus countries will not only continue to build aircraft with taxpayers money. why not subsidise airlines too?

rabenschwarz


 
Andreas
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Rabenschlag...

Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:27 pm

... I do believe your posting was meant as irony...but be careful how you put it, a lot of people won't understand this but instead might be willing to believe you actually mean what you said.
Maybe a little banner saying "Attention!! Irony!!!!!" would be a good choice...

regards

Andreas
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
rabenschlag
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:58 pm

ok, attention, some irony was involved.

but still. look how lufthansa is being in financial trouble because of all those nasty airbuses.

keep on smiling, r.
 
Guest

RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Wed Aug 21, 2002 8:11 pm

Guys,

What a load of cobblers.

The question should be, what if US Air had actually changed their entire fleet to Airbus family aircraft. Perhaps then fleet commonality would have not been an issue.

You have to remember that having a 737 / 767 fleet doesn't mean jack shite if you have a 737 / A330 fleet. Now if you have a A320 / A330 fleet then at least there are some synergies there.

Airbus has got it all over the place.

mb

A new * of - reality??
 
Andreas
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Thank You Rabenschlag...

Wed Aug 21, 2002 8:34 pm

...I thought so *ggg*, but let's not get into a discussion about the financial status of all-boeing carriers, that would be extremely hazardous to the mental health of so many members of this Forum...btw, that was meant ironically, too.

Regards
Andreas
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Udo
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 12:04 am

I think if US Airways had been the second US airline to take A330s, they would have made big profits with them. Only second and fourth carriers to take aircraft can make profits.
Look at the B777. UA had it first, BA had it third. Both are facing deep red losses...  Wink/being sarcastic


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
ual777contrail
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 12:09 am

just read in the paper how well delta is doing.they are a boeing operator,now that little theory is right out the window.

ual 777 contraIL
 
9V-SPF
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 12:39 am

Sure, and Pan Am as well as Eastern went bankrupt mainly because they operated a bunch of Scarebus aircraft!  Big thumbs up
 
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mariner
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 12:57 am

Rabenschlag:

"Lufthansa is in financial trouble..."

That's an odd statement to make on the day that Lufthansa has reported a profit of 332 million Euros - almost double the estimates.

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Guest

RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:10 am

C'mon guys, what a bunch of B.S, Us Airways has some of the highest costs in the industry, they are basically a huge regional carrier. A330s aren't the issue. Us Airways' A330s are one of the best ways to get across the pond, with great inflight entertainment.

The A330 is not a major reason for Us Airways' financial troubles. The new low fare carriers like Southwest and Airtran are a much bigger problem for US Airways.
 
Udo
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:11 am

Yeah, if an airline is in trouble, it's always caused by the Airbusses.
Look at SriLankan: their two A332s, the A340 and the A320 were blown up because they were Airbus aircraft. If SriLankan had had Boeings, the Tamil Tigers would have never attacked them. Anybody knows that...


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
rabenschlag
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Udito Beats Them All

Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:35 am

lol!

cheers, r.

"The message you were about to post is too short and probably not of any higher value to the topic at hand. You should think long and hard before posting a message in this forum and make it detailed and a valuable addition to the topic discussed."

this is true. it does not add anything but the appreciation of someone's humorous exaggerations. there must be room for that too as life outside this forum is serious enough, isn't it?


 
cmb320
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 2:04 am

I guess someone forgot about JetBlue?
 
USAirways737
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 2:52 am

Cuz everyone knows all those airbuses have ruined Jetblue...
 
rj777
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 3:40 am

What I meant to say was, would US have been better off if they didn't spend all that money on A330's or gotten a small number of them?

Just a little clarification. I knew this would happen.

RJ
 
N79969
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 4:45 am

RJ777,

If I understand correctly, your question is whether the investment in the new aircraft type and number of aircraft screwed up USAirways. Is this correct?

My opinion: no. It would not have mattered if they bought A330, B777, or no large widebody aircraft at all. US is bleeding because of high labor costs and low revenue and not onerous payments on their aircraft. Their capital costs probably are in line with those of other carriers.
 
blink182
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RE: Would US Airways Be OK Without The A330

Thu Aug 22, 2002 6:14 am

I don't think the fleet has much to do with it. USA Today or the Boston Globe(i forgot which one as both had similar articles) said that USAirways employees are some of the highest paid. I think if the employees were to take a mid-sized pay cut(including the top brass too), money could be invested back into the company and that could help stop the bleeding.

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...