MIA777
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 10:47 am

A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 10:12 am

1) What is Airborne express? What types of airplanes do they operate and why are there so many props of their located at FLL? (ok I know what it is but what do they do, what type of operations and primarily, where???)

2)Pretty much the same thing except for DHL...where is their hub? Is it European?

3) How sizable are the UPS and FedEx ops in Europe (and around the world)? Do they hire third-party contractors or do they fly there own aircraft? If so, where are their world hubs?

Thanks!

MIA777
MIA777
 
MxCtrlr
Posts: 2312
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2001 11:22 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 11:40 am

Not up to speed on #3 but I can answer #1 & #2...

Airborne Express is a freight operator based at a former US Air Force Base in Wilmington, Ohio, about 1 hour's drive from DAY. The YS-11 props that you see parked at FLL are retired aircraft that are sitting in storage. They fly primarily DC-8, DC-9 and B-767 aircraft. Formerly, they also used to fly Caravelle's. Most, if not all of their operations are US Domestic, with some transborder flights.

DHL is based at CVG and operates basically the same as ABX or BAX (our of TOL) with the exception that they also have subsidiaries that operate in Europe and South & Central America. They operate B-727's, B-757's and A-300's.

Hope this helps...

MxCtrlr  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
DAMN! This SUCKS! I just had to go to the next higher age bracket in my profile! :-(
 
seagull
Posts: 334
Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2001 5:58 pm

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 12:38 pm

FedEx operates its own aircraft to virtually all major cities worldwide, UPS operates its own aircraft to many major cities world wide. FedEx flight ops is about double what UPS is and has about triple the international route authority, perhaps more. Both companies utilize third parties for many smaller or less developed cities.
 
fly_yhm
Posts: 1647
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2000 1:12 pm

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 12:49 pm

ABX I can tell you does operate Transborder they fly into YHM(Hamilton Ontario) Not sure about any other canadian Cities.
UPS
United States:
Louisville, Ky. (Main US Air Hub)
Philadelphia, Pa.
Dallas, Texas
Ontario, Calif.
Rockford, Ill.
Columbia, S.C.
Hartford, Conn.

Europe: Cologne/Bonn, Germany

Asia Pacific:Taipei; Taiwan; Hong Kong; Singapore;

Latin America and Caribbean: Miami, Fla., USA

Canada: Hamilton, Ontario; Montreal, Quebec; Vancouver, British Columbia; Calgary, Alberta; Winnipeg, Manitoba
(taken from ups.com)
Where will you spend eternity? He,s more real then you think!!!!!
 
MIA777
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 10:47 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 12:51 pm

alright guys thanks for the speedy responses...but one question...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ronny Van Belleghem



by the looks of this picture, it looks like the DHL ops in Europe are not run under subsidaries and actually large of amounts of money are put into it (5 752s)...just wondering...

MIA777
MIA777
 
MIA777
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 10:47 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 12:53 pm

oh and I meant to ask if anyone knew any fleet numbers...once again thanks!
MIA777
 
fly_yhm
Posts: 1647
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2000 1:12 pm

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 12:58 pm

UPS Jet Aircraft:
51 727-100
10 727-200
11 747-100
4 747-200
75 757-200
32 767-300
23 DC-8-71
26 DC-8-73
22 Airbus A300F4-620R
257 Total

This is slightly outdayes as they have aquired MD-11s which aren't on here but it will give you some idea. Oh and yourwelcome.
Where will you spend eternity? He,s more real then you think!!!!!
 
QANTAS747-438
Posts: 1656
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2001 7:01 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 1:13 pm

I worked with both ABX and FedEx at LAX. For FE, they have a sweet operation going on. They are very efficient and when problems would arise, they were quick to act on it and solve it. I was quite impressed with FedEx.

Then there's ABX. I would work with ABX in the mornings for their 430am and 515am flights. I can truly say that I have never seen a worse operation than ABX. I think ABX only flies the 767 into LAX, both the -200 and -300 Package Freighters coming from Dayton and Wilmington. The planes were always late, and when they came in, they were in horrid shape. So many times, the flaps would be rusted and the aircraft was filthy. Inside, it smelled like cat urine and if I had a dollar for everytime ABX dropped a package off the belt, stepped on a package, or forgot about a package, then I'd be a rich rich man. Also, the equipment they used was so ancient, that I was suprised it worked. It was just a half-done operation. They were almost as bad as Kitty Hawk, who I'd say is the worst operator anywhere, ever. I'd like to say that this is at LAX, and possibly, ABX's ops are better elsewhere. But from my firsthand experience with them, it was an astonishing sight.

Some people may say that this is how all cargo airlines are at one point, but FedEx would never do anything like that. And if they did, they'd be fired. Also Polar Air and UPS were very good.

LAX also has BAX fly in. They were up there with ABX in terms of ops. Their DC-8s from 1965 were grossly outdated. The cockpit had wires exposed the plane always looked like this was its last flight. The only reason I don't rank BAX with ABX and Kitty Hawk is because I didn't have as much experience with them, and I don't want to say anything I don't know for sure.
My posts/replies are strictly my opinion and not that of any company, organization, or Southwest Airlines.
 
crewchief32
Posts: 413
Joined: Wed Dec 20, 2000 3:16 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 4:55 pm

European Hub for DHL is Brussels.
The aircrafts have full DHL colours but are operated by either EAT-European Air Transport of Belgium (with Convair 580, 727-100/-200, 75F & A300), Swiftair of Spain (CV-580 & B722) or Air Contractors of Ireland with A300s in DHL c/s and B722s in Air Contractor c/s.

CC32
 
Guest

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Wed Nov 13, 2002 5:03 pm

Fedex probably has the "top" reputation for delivery - fast + on time...
UPS probably not far behind...
xxx
But when comes to overseas - anywhere in the world, DHL is the best...
International - when in doubt if is ok - use DHL...
(s) Skipper
 
Nightfly
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2000 6:24 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Thu Nov 14, 2002 3:01 am

in Europe, some DHL flights are operated by Atlantic Airlines, some UPS flights by Channel Express and WDL. Both airlines air painted in their own colours.

CGN is the european hub of UPS. All flights into Europe go to there by one 747 and some 767 (sometimes with stops in CDG or EMA). Nearly all of them come from USA (Philadelphia, Louisville).

Inside Europe UPS uses 7x B757 and some A300 and 727 of their own fleet. I don´t know the exact number of the last two mentioned but I believe there are about 8x 727 and 2x A300. In addition to that Channel Express operates up to 3 daily flights from UK to CGN using A300. Several destinations with lower demand are operated by some F27 of WDL.

Best regards,
nightfly
 
doug_or
Posts: 3119
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 9:55 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Thu Nov 14, 2002 5:12 am

OK heres how I understand it, as explained to me by a DHL pilot. DHL and DHL are two seperate corporate entities (neither is a subsidiary). Owning each other is not possible due to foreign ownership rules, however they have a large amount of legaly binding agreements to cooperate that sort of get around this. DHL uses a variety of smaller companies as subcontractors in the US like UPS or ABX, but also contract to Evergreen, who use dc-9s!

Doug
-former evergreen/eagle ramper employed loading Kittyhawk, UPS, and their subcontractor (Ameriflight)
PDX/LAF
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
UPS Pilot
Posts: 828
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RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Thu Nov 14, 2002 10:49 am

"FedEx operates its own aircraft to virtually all major cities worldwide, UPS operates its own aircraft to many major cities world wide. FedEx flight ops is about double what UPS is and has about triple the international route authority, perhaps more."

UPS was the first to reach every address in all 50 states. UPS flight ops are smaller than Fed Ex due to UPS being able to use a trucks to deliver in a lot of cases rather than a plane. That is why UPS' profit is higher. Fed Ex has more flights to the Pacific rim at the moment,but UPS was shipping internationally before Fed Ex was able to reach all 50 states. The Cologne Germany hub opened in 1976. UPS has more routes in Latin America and a stronger European operation.

UPS does ship bulk aircargo. There is more profit in parcels and documents but UPS fills space with cargo. UPS World Wide Logistics is one of the largest freight forwarders in the world. With the acquisition of Fritz, Fed Ex was even a customer of UPS.

UPS and FedEx have petitioned the federal government to review DHL's ownership structure, charging that DHL Airways is owned and controlled by Deutsche Post, the German postal monopoly that is 70 percent owned by the German government. UPS and FedEx say the ownership is disguised in a complex arrangement of subsidiaries.

Some of UPS' flights are operated with UPS aircraft but flown by Star Air.

 
teva
Posts: 1764
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 12:31 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Thu Nov 14, 2002 8:12 pm

IN Europe, FDX operates its own fleet of jet.
They also own Shorts 360, that are in FDX colors, but not operated by Fedex.
They also contract several operators such as Farnair Europe, for the Eurone network.
As far as I know, the planes are in the operators colors and include Hercules C130, ATR (42 and 72?), F27, Jetstream41, ...
Teva
Ecoute les orgues, Elles jouent pour toi...C'est le requiem pour un con
 
Lekky-Man
Posts: 392
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 4:40 am

RE: A Few Cargo Ops Questions...

Sat Nov 23, 2002 1:01 pm

And the Lockheed L188 Electra!!!

AAG have at least 2 of them running running for DHL constantly.

Cheers,
LM

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