swissgabe
Posts: 5147
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:57 am

Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:03 am

Please list down routes you think of where a start-up airline or an existing airline would have potential (pax) to fly and where they could make money as well.

Doesn't matter if it's a routes where no carrier operates yet, or one where you already have a carrier flying as long as there is still some potential/demand.
Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
 
ammunition
Posts: 875
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 6:25 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:18 am

I think LHR-ATQ could work, or BHX-ATQ. There is a lot of demand for direct flights to the state of punjab in northern india to serve the sikh community. If BA was to set up a flight, it would be guaranteed to be full. I dont, however, see BA operating this route, as it would attract mainly low yielding passangers, i.e. economy and maybe some business (which goes against BA's plans on cutting capacity and concentrating on the high end of the market).

The runway at ATQ may be restricted in its length, i think the largest aircraft that can fly into amritsar is A300, and the largest plane current operated to the airport is the 757-200.

I know that turkmenistan airlines operated direct flights from LHR/BHX to DEL/ATQ for some time, with a brief technical stop at their base in ashgabat, whether this is still the case with their flights, i am not sure.

Air india could start the route, currently they provide a connecting flight via DEL twice a week. An A310 could easily fly the ATQ-LHR/BHX route.

Probably not to everyones interest, but there u go  Smile.
Saint Augustine- 'The world is a book and those who do not travel, read only 1 page'
 
swissgabe
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Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:57 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 1:35 am

Thanks Ammunition, thats what I'm interested in. Anyone else, maybe flights within Africa, Asia?
Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
 
OO-VEG
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Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2000 5:31 pm

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 4:10 am

Maastricht-Munich
The route was operated by ERJ-145 3x daily but closed down due to 9-11, route wasn't doing bad at all so there is a potential to start it up again


 
flyyul
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Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:25 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 6:35 am

YUL-FCO or YUL-MXP. There are over 200,000 Italians that live in the Montreal area. Furthermore, Italy is a world-class destination that is served from virtually every major North America city. if Montreal can support services to Casablanca, Cairo, Athens and Prague... Milan and Rome are no-brainers.

Montreal-Beyrut... nearly 1/3 of OSs connex pax from Montreal are going to Bey. AF/LX and KL also pull in considerable numbers. There are something like 100,000 people of Lebanese descent in the Montreal area, MEA has expressed interest in serving the market.

Montreal-Edmonton .. the 2nd largest city in Canada and the 2nd economic power of the country matched with a crucial city in Canada..

Mark
 
boeing 747-311
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RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 7:31 am

here in phx, i think we need a flight across the atlantic, probably not every day, but like 3 times a week i think we could get a 744 filled, what do u think?
Come fly with US
 
gigneil
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Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 7:39 am

B747-311 are you joking or serious?

N


What? I can't tell sometimes.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 13646
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 7:39 am

Boeing-

BA currently offers daily nonstop PHX-LHR service with a B-777, and LH offers 6X weekly PHX-FRA service with an A-340.

Of course, there's always the rumor that AF is looking at PHX service, along with JL...  Smile
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Rai
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RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 8:02 am

YUL-YEG? No. This route existed about three years ago, but was axed even before 9/11. That says everything to me. And I'm talking as a former Edmontonian with Montreal links (my father is from Montreal and I have lots of relatives living there). There's just no business traffic between the two cities, although there are a lot of former Montrealers living in Edmonton.

To be honest, Edmonton is not the highest yield market and I don't think it's THAT crucial of a city. Edmonton is more of a government, university and blue collar city and Edmontonians really don’t travel all that often. Yes, YEG was the only Canadian airport to experience an increase in air traffic in 2001, but that’s only because of the World Track and Field Games.
 
flyyul
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RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 8:19 am

RAJ,

the route started in 2000. It was cut in a span of 6 months. The route had a load factor of 75+% according to the vocal mayor. Furthermore, Milty even told me to my face that he was surprised and pleased with YUL-YEG and contemplated an afternoon flight....... the whole thing was cut.

AC143 does YUL-YOW-YEG, where about 80% of the pax get on at YUL, 10% debark at YOW, and another 10-15% gets on at YOW.. that being said, it sure seems like YOW merits the non-stop.. Figure in the rest of pax that make connections in YYZ to get to YEG, you've got a full flight....

Im not going to get into a YUL debate with everybody on this board, but even the CEO of ADM is hearing AC's interest in re-starting YUL-YEG..

Mark


 
Rai
Posts: 1697
Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:12 pm

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 8:26 am

I could see Tango, Mark, but certainly not the Mainline. If Milton was pleased with the route, then why did he cut it?

BTW, I flew it once when transferring to a flight to LGA. It was pretty full in coach, but empty in business class.

And by "vocal mayor", do you mean Edmonton's mayor? Bill Smith is a tool.
 
westjet_8
Posts: 437
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RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 8:37 am

YVR-SAN I think this could do well. I know Canadaian had but when I flew there were 3-4 business and 50 econmy but this was on a Thursday. I think Tango might do well on this route. YYC-JFK. So many people connect though the US and Montreal/Toronto that is know. By the way how was the Northwest YYC-DTW doing before it got shut down.
Canadian. RIP 1999
 
Scott4AA
Posts: 319
Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2002 11:36 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 9:02 am

I always thought that w/ all the Latin America traffic AA has outta MIA, AUS-MIA and SAT-MIA would be good.
American Airlines - We Know Why You Fly
 
Trvlr
Posts: 4251
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2000 9:58 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:05 pm

SAN-YVR - Plenty of potential; Alaska or Air Canada should be able to do well with a daily flight or so.

SAN-MIA - Plenty of S. American connections to fill up this route, plus it would be the first nonstop flight to Florida; a good marketing opportunity.

SAN-NRT/Asia - Probably near 1000 people travel to and from San Diego and Asia daily. There's plenty of companies here and in Mexico with Pacific Rim connections. A nonstop flight would be full every day.

PHX-NRT/Asia - Same reasons as SAN, except maybe a bit smaller amount of daily traffic.

Aaron G.
 
Guest

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:17 pm

FRA is the number one destination from STL. I'm sure we could support at least a 4x weekly A330 to FRA. On average 1,000 people a week go to LGW. Double that end up at FRA....source is St. louis Post-Dispatch Travel section.
PHX-NRT, SAN-YVR, STL-YUL, PHX-NRT, PDX-NRT, MSP-FRA all come to mind as untapped potential.
Thx,
TWA4EVER
 
MEA
Posts: 585
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2001 8:30 pm

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:18 pm

Here is a list of potential routes I would like to see from Sydney & Melbourne:

Syd/Mel - Asia - Beirut
Syd/Mel - Asia - Cairo
Syd/Mel - Asia - India
Syd/Mel - Asia - Pakistan
Syd/Mel - Asia - Greece
Syd/Mel - Asia - Cyprus
Syd/Mel - Macau
Syd/Mel - India - UK
Syd/Mel - USA - UK
Syd/Mel - Perth - Europe


 
MAH4546
Posts: 24725
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:23 pm

SAN-MIA - Plenty of S. American connections to fill up this route, plus it would be the first nonstop flight to Florida; a good marketing opportunity.

It would not be a first since AA flew this route in the mid-1990s. However, given the fact that leisure markets are king in 2003, and that smaller planes like 738s are now being used very often on trans-con, I do think there is a off chance that MIA-SAN could become reality in AA's future with a daily 738.
a.
 
Dasa
Posts: 730
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2001 9:25 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 12:52 pm

Adding to MEA's ideas, I think MEL could do with a 5x weekly service to Taipei, and a Tokyo to Melbourne route from a Japanese airline, most likely ANA. Also, a service to Seoul on either Korean Air or Asiana could do well.

-Dasa
 
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coronado
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RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 1:47 pm

AA-STL?

MSP-FRA--used to be, but with the KLM-NWA partnership and 2 daily including 330pm 747 MSP-AMS, followed by a DC-10-30 5 hours later, what is the point? From AMS you can get to FRA and another dozen plus other cities in Germany via KLM in no time at all.

KLM-NWA have perfected the art of the partnership.

London demand from MSP far outweighs FRA--
The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
 
BA
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2000 11:06 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 2:35 pm

DEN-CDG is a potential route. Air France does plan on starting the route eventually. But I don't think we'll see it until 2004 since Air France will not be doing any expansion until they are privatized.

As many of you know, Lufthansa has expressed interest in starting DEN-MUC in the future.

As odd as it sounds that Lufthansa is interested in DEN-MUC, it really isn't all that surprising. Denver (along with the rest of Colorado) has an extremely large Bavarian population which is where Munich is located. While it does not mean a DEN-MUC route would be successful, this is why Lufthansa has expressed interest in DEN-MUC. The demographics look good.

I don't think we'll be seeing DEN-MUC in the near future. Just thought I'd clarify a bit after that post a while ago about potential MUC routes. I see MUC-PEK coming....

FLYYUL,

Air Canada has also expressed interest in YUL-BEY. It'll be difficult for MEA to do YUL-BEY. With there current financial problems and lack of aircraft, I don't see how they would be able to pull it off. They only have 9 aircraft, 3 A320s, 2 A321s, 3 A310-200s, and 1 A300-600R. All 9 of there aircraft are leased.

To cut costs, MEA recently ordered 6 A321s, and will be leasing 3 A330-200s to replace it's entire fleet. This way MEA will own most of there fleet and would only have to pay monthly lease fees on the A330s.

However, the A330s will be used on CDG, LHR, some Middle East and African routes.

I don't see how they'd do YUL-BEY. At least not in the near future. I could see a code-share happening soon. Air France and MEA have a code-share agreement on CDG-BEY.

Check out there website for more info:
http://www.mea.com.lb

//// United Will Stand

Fly The Friendly Skies
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 2:58 pm

I've been curious as to demand from DEN to Asian destinations.

The new 16k ft runway certainly makes that very feasible.

I'm sure BA probably has something to add on this...  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

N
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 5011
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 4:54 pm

Another AKL-LHR service with same plane to go with NZ's current daily 744 via LAX!

I'm sure BA or VS could make money on this route! BA could do a 744 3x weekly or VS a 343 4x weekly, most likely via Asia.

Maybe even another carrier on the AKL-LAX route to join NZ's doble daily 744, QF's daily 744 and UA's daily 772ER, perhaps NW, demand is strong on this route!

Well i'm sure JAL could make money flying to AKL or CHC from almost anywhere in Japan!
 
Guest

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 5:05 pm

For EL AL:
TLV-MIA nonstop
TLV-FLL seasonal

For JetBlue:
Upstate NY-Florida nonstop like:

SYR-FLL and SYR-MCO
BUF-FLL and BUF-MCO
ROC-FLL and ROC-MCO

For JetBlue:
ROC-LGB

Airtran:
SYR-ATL

For anyone:
New York to Africa and Mideast:
Lagos, Addis Ababa, Nairobi, Dubai

For CO:
ITH-CLE
ITH-EWR

TNNH
 
swissgabe
Posts: 5147
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:57 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Fri Dec 13, 2002 5:13 pm

Anyone with some short-haul flight ideas?
Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
 
Guest

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Sat Dec 14, 2002 5:30 am

Coronado, LH has been trying to get into MSP for awhile now. But for the time being NW prolly wouldnt let them in. So I was meaning LH MSP-FRA. And yes london demand may outweigh FRA demand but that doesn't mean there couldnt be a flight.
 
BA
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2000 11:06 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Sat Dec 14, 2002 8:33 am

Gigneil,

You can count on a passenger flight to NRT, and an all cargo flight to somewhere in Asia (most likely HKG).

Due to the current economy, we won't be seeing an NRT flight until at least 2004/2005 timeframe.

We could see a cargo flight before passenger service to NRT.

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
blink182
Posts: 5282
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: Potential Routes With (more) Demand ...

Sat Dec 14, 2002 9:09 am

DFW-AMS. I think an AA 767 or KLM A330(when they arrive) could fit this market nicely.

DFW-HEL. A 3x-4x weekly flight with an AA 767 wouldn't hurt. There are several Scandinavian companies with offices in the DFW area, and there's Finnair too on the the HEL side as well.

ORD-SYD. Chicago and Sydney have to be connected, this gap should be filled if QF does fly to Chicago.

SYD-MIA. There is no aircraft with such range, but an A342 sized aircraft could fit this nicely on a daily flight.

MEX-HKG. Two of the world's largest cities, I am shocked that there is no such route, there must be atleast some demand.

blink
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...

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