kaitak
Posts: 8947
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Mon Dec 16, 2002 4:48 am

I was just noticing that CO uses 757s on the LIS-EWR routes and since quite a few twins fly to LIS, for example TP 310s and Air Transat 330s, I was wondering what route they would use, to keep within the 138/207 minute rules? I presume they'd route out towards the Azores and then across towards Newfoundland? Anyone know? Can anyone get their hands on a route/ flight plan?
 
Max Q
Posts: 5634
Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 12:40 pm

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Mon Dec 16, 2002 10:00 am

We usually use Lisbon, Santa Maria or Lajes and Gander or goose.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 3619
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Mon Dec 16, 2002 10:51 am

TP also uses the four engine A340 on the JFK/EWR-LIS runs. Twin engine flights to Lisbon are nothing new. TP has used the A310 for a long time and TWA used to fly the 757 as well.

ContinentalEWR
 
AA717driver
Posts: 1502
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2002 8:27 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Mon Dec 16, 2002 11:16 am

TWA always went near the Azores. It was pretty weird being out over the ocean and picking up the VOR off the northern edge of the Azores. Generally, that flight would go on to Barcelona. Great trip.TC
FL450, M.85
 
timz
Posts: 6100
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 1999 7:43 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Tue Dec 17, 2002 4:49 am

Remember 138-minute ETOPS? Supposedly that was invented to close the last gap in that existed in the North Atlantic under 120-minute rules. As long as Lajes, Gander and Keflavik are all available no point in the Atlantic north of latitude 35 degrees is more than 820 nm from an airport.
 
flyguy1
Posts: 1660
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 1999 9:45 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Tue Dec 17, 2002 8:33 am

Every so often, Transatlantic flights into JFK at least, approach the airport from the south. These generally route via the Azores, I assume based on winds, weather.
727, L1011, MD80, A300, 777-200, 737-300, 737-700, 747-400, 757-200, 737-800, A320. E190, E135, 767-200, CRJ9
 
timz
Posts: 6100
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 1999 7:43 am

Landing JFK From The South

Tue Dec 17, 2002 8:41 am

You mean they use the CAMRN arrival? Or you just mean they land runway 4?
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Tue Dec 17, 2002 11:12 am

I was wondering what route they would use, to keep within the 138/207 minute rules?

ETOPS207 is approved on a route-by-route basis over the north Pacific only.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
flyguy1
Posts: 1660
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 1999 9:45 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Tue Dec 17, 2002 11:37 am

Timz,
CAMRN arrival, landing on whatever runway was in use.
727, L1011, MD80, A300, 777-200, 737-300, 737-700, 747-400, 757-200, 737-800, A320. E190, E135, 767-200, CRJ9
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Tue Dec 17, 2002 2:17 pm

ConcordeBoy-

I believe its more than a route-by-route basis... I think its a flight-by-flight basis. May be wrong.

N
 
timz
Posts: 6100
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 1999 7:43 am

Just For The Record...

Wed Dec 18, 2002 2:59 am

I was wrong about that 35-deg-latitude line in the North Atlantic-- turns out that

lat 35.94848 lon 48.76233 is 820 nm from Gander and Bermuda, and
lat 37.45680 lon 44.35652 is 820 nm from Gander and Lajes.

Also: the 138-minute rule closed the last gap in the north North Atlantic. If we consider the North Atlantic to extend all the way down to Ponta do Calcahar, then there is a small triangle that may not be covered even by 180-minute rules. Lat 24.06236 lon 42.27743 is 1172.4 nm from Lajes, Antigua and Sal.

 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: LIS To NYC With Twinjets

Wed Dec 18, 2002 3:29 am

I believe its more than a route-by-route basis... I think its a flight-by-flight basis. May be wrong.

You're correct, I failed to be specific enough. Cheers!
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!

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