GOTbound
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No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 12:30 pm

This topic might be discussed before,

Some US ( I don't want disrespect out the US airliners, but that the only once I know that have started with this recently) airlines have started to charge for alcohol in Economy on international flights ( AA, CO if I remember correctly ), I know that a lot of European charter airlines ( and no-frills ) charge for alcohol and other beverages, does this going to " spread " to all airlines or will this be a competition thing with airlines to offer free alcohol in Y ? I don't see why more airlines shouldn't follow AA and CO on this. Face it, no more free alcohol would probably stop a lot of the "air- rage " !?

rgs.GOTbound
 
artsyman
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 12:36 pm

I don't see why more airlines shouldn't follow AA and CO on this

Delta charges also, as does US airways

Jeremy
 
jaysit
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 1:42 pm

I doubt if the Asian and premium European carriers will follow this practice of charging for drinks across the Atlantic.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
tullamarine
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 2:06 pm

QF has gone the other way and has introduced free wine and beer on late afternoon and evening domestic Cityflyer services. They also continue to serve free alcohol on int'l services.
717,721/2,732/3/4/5/7/8/9,742/3/4,752/3,762/3,772,W,310,320/1,332/3,388,DC9,DC10,F28,F100,142,143,E90,CR2,D82/3/4,SF3,AT
 
gigneil
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 2:40 pm

Horizon Air offers free wine and beer on their regional flights too.

Both the DL shuttle and US shuttle offer it on flights after 4p.

N
 
docpepz
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 4:44 pm

And to think I was bitching when SQ removed free flow of champagne from Economy Class.
 
Andreas
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 5:17 pm

On long distance you need alcohol in order to get passengers sleepy and occupied, even if a few get nasty after a few drinks too much. Besides, in France, for example, red wine is considered to be regular food&beverage, afaik, AF pilots are even allowed to drink one glass to go with their meal (btw: Is that a legend?? Anyone to confirm??).
And a last thought: Regular carriers need some things that make at least a little visible difference to the low cost carriers.
Regards
Andreas
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Treg
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 7:45 pm

SAS still has full selection on all their flights (wine or bear with a meal and strong alcohol with coffee), domestic and international. But I discovered recently that Skyways (Scandinavian domestic carrier) has nowadays only beer and wine available. Has happened to me twice.  Sad
 
Rick767
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 8:06 pm

"AF pilots are even allowed to drink one glass to go with their meal (btw: Is that a legend?? Anyone to confirm??)"

It used to be the case with both Air France and Sabena until quite recently that their pilots would have a glass of wine with dinner as a matter of course, particularly on longhaul flights, but the practice has since been discontinued.
I used to love the smell of Jet-A in the morning...
 
flyboy36y
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 9:29 pm

Who needs free alcohol. Alcohon dehyrates people and puts them in the wrong mindset. An airplane is not a bar.
 
Andreas
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Thank You Rick767..I Found It A Bit Hard To...

Wed Dec 18, 2002 9:29 pm

believe, actually!

Regards

Andreas
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
Rafabozzolla
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Wed Dec 18, 2002 9:54 pm

To Flyboy36y

This might seem strange since I notice you are Jewish, but isn't your opinion a bit puritane?
 
vermeer
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 1:19 am

to Flyboy36y


you wrote such a harsh statement and it sounds quite judgmental!
who are you to decide what is good for all the people on board?
Don't you think that people can decide for themselves if they want a drink or not?
Drinking, believe it or not, in not meant for intoxication. It is a social and cultural activity, among other things.
Drinking is part of the experience of travelling, and travelling by air too. It is a part of what was called service, a concept that has been all but forgotten by almost all the US based carriers. And it should stay there. How pathetic is to charge for alcohol? The super large quantities bought by airlines make it a very cheap bargain for them and let's be honest, you don't save an airline budget charging 4 bucks a pop.

Last, if airplanes are not bars neither are football stadiums, parking lots, picnic grounds, home parties etc....
Please.
 
FLYING MACHINE
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 1:35 am

Flying from Chicago to Seattle in November 2001 I found that you had to pay in AA the headphones ! Worst than alcohol .
 
keesje
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 1:43 am

Don't you think that people can decide for themselves if they want a drink or not?

hmmm, well now that you ask  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

now and then alcohol happens to cause a less pleasant atmosphere for other passengers (to put it modestly) .

Search the a.net on keywords like alcohol, flight attendant, abuse, arrest, yellow card etc.. and you might find some examples of passengers that can not decide for themselves,

specially when alcoholics are free .....

"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
ToFlyToServe
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 1:52 am

Let's face it an airline will decide what it can and cannot do about serving alcohol until the FAA or the carriers aviation goverment steps in and adds to regulations regarding alcohol. I personally agree that in this day of air rage and the high incidences of people not complying with regulations on board an aircraft that it should be discontinued or least charge for it so it will cut down on the BAR drinking binge that does go on. I do belief in giving the highest level of customer service so that is why I would like to see it discontinued. I have the rest of my passengers to think and if I am having to worry about the drunk bothering them it is not a good flight for any of us. The cabin is a controlled environment and alcohol only interferes with this. Just my opinion andthinks for letting me share it.
 
Sean-SAN-
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 2:04 am

Dedicated drinkers will just start bring their own booze on board anyways...

 
ToFlyToServe
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 2:47 am

Adult beverages (LOL) cannot be brought on board and consumed unless it is given to the F/A and they serve the drink to them. This is a FAR. Passengers who sneak drinks on board can be escorted off. It depends if they comply with this FAR.
 
artsyman
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 3:47 am

It is a part of what was called service, a concept that has been all but forgotten by almost all the US based carriers. ....and let's be honest, you don't save an airline budget charging 4 bucks a pop.

How does Losing alcohol equal service is lost by almost all US carriers, I know at Continental service is still extremely important, but what you and some others seem to not understand is that the carriers are doing what it takes to keep their planes in the air. Charging for alcohol is just one of many changes being implemented, some affect the passengers, some don't. As far as the 4 dollars saving the airline, liquor revenue at Continental is up 46% since they started charging on the Longhauls, and it is really helping CO to balance the books. If the market were different none of the carriers would be charging for alcohol, but things are tight and I would rather stay flying and annoy 2% of passengers than go belly up.
 
vermeer
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 3:54 am

dear toflytoserve

you are right. Although I recently brought on board a small bottle of champagne ( the famous POP by Pommery) and I had it on my table together with my self-catered sushi.
when the flight attendant saw it she was laughing and asked me to show it to her purser with the motto "this is a guy who knows how to fly in style"!.
I dod not request the attention and I was at the end of the plane all by myself in a row of 3.
what happneded next was that the F/A asked if I wanted some ice to chill it and - to my surprise- she came with a full bucket and stuck my bottle in the middle.
Incredibly nice, for once. And this on a US based carrier that I won't mention.
Maybe they judge from the "attitude" of the passenger? ( ah ah ah little did they know!!!!! LOL)
 
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Crosswind
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 5:45 am

As I understand it a large proportion of "air-rage" incidents are as a result of passengers drinking in the airport bars before boarding the aircraft, or from consuming their own alcohol.

Once on-board the quantities of alcohol served in economy are fairly restricted anyway. Anecdotal evidence would suggest most of the air-rage incidents involving those who become intoxicated from alcohol served by the crew are travelling in the premium cabins, where alcohol is still free on almost all airlines.

Regards
CROSSSWIND
 
vermeer
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 5:59 am

artsyman,

thanks for sharing the info on CO.

You say "liquor revenue at Continental is up 46% since they started charging on the Longhauls"
based on what?
If before the alcohol was for free, how did the measure the increased revenue on the longhauls?

I understand that cutting corners is so important, but frankly you cannot cut everything to the passengers.
they should start serving free food/drinks to passengers who pay a lot for their coach seats.
I believe it is unfair to pay 1000 dollars and not being able to get anything, and that is not respectful of the passenger business....
 
artsyman
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 6:35 am

You say "liquor revenue at Continental is up 46% since they started charging on the Longhauls" based on what?

Based on the fact that if you look at the total revenue from all the months prior to when they started charging for Alcohol, and then look at the months since, revenue is up 46%. So if Continental hypothetically was earning a dollar per person before the changes, they are now earning 1.46 per person.

There is a lot of talk within Continental at the moment on the point you raised about getting what you pay for, and how the person who paid 1000 for their coach seat should get free drinks while the person who paid 99 shouldnt.

There is talk about different cabins, for example Businessfirst, then premium fair coach, then mid fare coach and leisure coach, this putting the people in the cabin that they pay for. If you pay premium, then you get service, if you are only willing to pay the extremely low fair, then you don't get anything. I am not saying that Continental has plans to implement this sort of plan, just these are the sort of things that have been discussed.

Jeremy
 
AA767400
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 6:44 am

When you pay $199 r/t across the Atlantic, what do you expect?
all I hear is, "give me, give me" you get what you pay for.
"The low fares airline."
 
vermeer
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 6:54 am

AA 767400

I don't think here we were talking about 199 r/t across the atlantic.

of course there is little to expect for that ( although we all know that especially during low season you find those losing-money fares just to fill the seats AND you get free drinks and hot meals, mind you....) amount of money but as artsyman correctly points out I am sure airlines are considering the option of giving food/drinks to higher paying customers in coach.
The hard part would be find the ratio between yield management per each flight ( but I believe it would go through booking classes) and thanks to the manifest on board it would be easy to understand who the "premium" fare passengers are/
the downturn on this is " how the person sitting close to you will react seeing you eating and drinking"? again, maybe the premium passengers will be sitting all together in the front?
 
artsyman
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 6:59 am

There has also been talk of charging for everything extra, you want a bulkhead, that'll be 50 dollars, you want a sandwich, that'll be 5 dollars... and maybe doing it in a front to back charging. The closer you are to the front, the more you pay, so they load on the cattle based on the prices, and then people are only sitting beside like paying customers....

Moooooooo....

Jeremy
 
AA767400
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 7:16 am

Vermeer

That is the price people are paying. And I don't think
it is a big deal to charge, especially if most of the passengers
paid that price.
"The low fares airline."
 
GOTbound
Topic Author
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 8:18 am

>>> Treg,

SK still charges for the alcohol on domestic routes.

>>> Artsyman,

I totally agree with you, you get what your pay for. If you want premium, pay premium, it's that simple.

rgs.GOTbound
 
vermeer
Posts: 433
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 9:07 am

dear aa767400

please help me find those 199 rt fares!
I believe you are exaggerating. those fares show up once in a blue moon, they have a very limited number of seats available and have so many restrictions that really few people use them.
I think that a more reasonable and still dirt cheap comparison is fares that go from 300 up.
still, all but the US based carrier don't charge for alcohol!
 
flpuck6
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Thu Dec 19, 2002 11:55 am

aa767400 may be exaggerating but it's not that far from the truth.

These days, customers expect to things, which do not go hand in hand:

-Lowest possible fare
-Best service

People really shouldn't be expecting much when they pay $300 for a transatlantic ticket. I just paid $170 for PVD-EWR-FLL. All I expected was to get to my destination safely, on time, and with professionalism.

As for the alcohol, I'm not a big drinker anyway. I'd rather save the $4. Though, on a Skywest commuter flight last year from SLC-JAC (Jackson Hole, WY), I got to savor a Heineken for free Big grin

-Chris
Bonjour Chef!
 
flyboy36y
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RE: No More Free Drinks In Economy?

Mon Dec 23, 2002 3:36 am

Folks,

I too dring alcohol and enjoy it. But who cares if you cant get a free drink on your flight? Too many times I have seen people deplane VERY drunk. Either way, if you wanna drink, pay.

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